DTaP and preventing transmission - Mothering Forums

Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
Old 09-11-2008, 05:46 PM - Thread Starter
 
ema-adama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,333
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Hi all,

I know that there is a study done on DTP in Israel that concludes that DTP does not prevent transmission of Pertussis.

I am inclined to think this applies to the DTaP. But have not seen any studies on this. I read about the bacteria toxin link as to why it does not prevent transmission.

I emailed a prominent doctor on Child Vaccination my question and got the weirdest response... basically that he believes that it does prevent transmissions, and the vacine works for both the bacteria and the toxin - end of story.

So, does anyone have any links to this?

Thanks

Megan, mama to her little boy (Feb2008) and introducing our little girl (Dec 2010)
ema-adama is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 09-12-2008, 01:50 AM
 
Sileree's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: SE Michigan
Posts: 1,011
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Pertussis Infection in Fully Vaccinated Children in Day-Care Centers, Israel. Emerging Infectious Diseases. Pgs 526-529.

http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/eid/vol6no5/srugo.htm

Is that it?

intactivist.gif  ribbonpb.gif RN student, bellycast.gif birth doula since 2006
Sileree is offline  
Old 09-12-2008, 02:50 AM - Thread Starter
 
ema-adama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,333
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Yup, that is the DTP study.... any others that have been done that you know of?

This could just be totally naive, but I really really hope that doctors are not working on the assumption that the DTaP prevents transmission (from parent to child for instance) if this is patently not the case..... my point? How the hell can men and women of science promote a mass campaign based on a hunch or an assumption which has no basis in fact?

After my little exchange with a prominent doctor in Child Vaccination I am begining to think this might be the case. I know many people here would no longer be horrified by this. But if the doctors have actually read the study and had their curiosity piqued, how can they ignore it? (granted, the chances that any doctor has read this study are VERY slim, even if it is on the cdc - but I sent it to a prominent doctor on Child Vaccination and he just stopped communication once I had highlighted the conclusion)

Anyway, perhaps no straight answer exists?

Megan, mama to her little boy (Feb2008) and introducing our little girl (Dec 2010)
ema-adama is offline  
Old 09-12-2008, 01:08 PM
 
spero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: the back of beyond
Posts: 9,488
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by ema-adama View Post
How the hell can men and women of science promote a mass campaign based on a hunch or an assumption which has no basis in fact?

$$$

Every baptized Christian is, or should be, someone with an actual (disturbing) experience, ... a close encounter, with God; someone who, as a result, becomes a disturbing presence to others. - Fr. Anthony J. Gittins, A Presence That Disturbs
spero is offline  
Old 09-12-2008, 04:18 PM
 
mamakay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: in la la land, or so they say...
Posts: 8,332
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
http://insidevaccines.com/wordpress/...-transmission/


Some of those are about the acellular vaccine.

Ask the doc for evidence that the DTaP prevents transmission and see what he can come up with.
mamakay is offline  
Old 09-12-2008, 04:40 PM
 
mamakay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: in la la land, or so they say...
Posts: 8,332
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by ema-adama View Post
Yup, that is the DTP study.... any others that have been done that you know of?

This could just be totally naive, but I really really hope that doctors are not working on the assumption that the DTaP prevents transmission (from parent to child for instance) if this is patently not the case..... my point? How the hell can men and women of science promote a mass campaign based on a hunch or an assumption which has no basis in fact?

After my little exchange with a prominent doctor in Child Vaccination I am begining to think this might be the case. I know many people here would no longer be horrified by this. But if the doctors have actually read the study and had their curiosity piqued, how can they ignore it? (granted, the chances that any doctor has read this study are VERY slim, even if it is on the cdc - but I sent it to a prominent doctor on Child Vaccination and he just stopped communication once I had highlighted the conclusion)

Anyway, perhaps no straight answer exists?
I think doctors who have been giving the shot for a long time want to believe they're doing as much good as possible. Sort of like, mamas who breastfeed are biased towards wanting to believe that breastfeeding does more than it does.
Doctors are not immune to bias and groupthink. They're human, just like the rest of us. And they rely on the public health authorities to tell them what's going on with this stuff, and that's where the problem really gets complex, because the CDC is really quite dishonest in how they present information to the public and physicians.
Read this.

Now read thier MMWR on vaxing adults for pertussis:
(this is what they tell physicians)

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/rr5517a1.htm

Read it carefully, looking for a reference to any evidence that vaxing adults will prevent transmission. See how it's worded? They never come right out and say "...but the evidence indicates that vaccination is unlikely to prevent transmission". They just say "vaccinating adults could reduce the burden of pertussis in infants" and give no reference. It's just a guess...a wish...
mamakay is offline  
Old 09-12-2008, 07:00 PM
 
2boyzmama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Dayton, Oh WPAFB
Posts: 5,911
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
This is exactly what I was going to search for today, I know it's been discussed previously. I had Connor at the dr today for a WBV (I have to do WBV for him because of his special needs, developmental delays, failure to thrive, etc etc) The dr and I have discussed vaccines previously and I signed a highly-edited refusal form that I initial at each visit. Of course there's always "just one" that he wants me to consider again. Today it was pertussis.

He accepted my arguments against not vaxxing Connor, but then "strongly" recommended that myself and my husband get vaxed to prevent transmission to Connor. I said "my research has revealed to me that the vaccine does not prevent transmission." It's something about how the vaccine protects against the toxoid, not the bacteria, right??? That just because the exposed person does not appear sick does not mean they can't pass the bacteria on... ??

I didn't expect to have to have facts and arguments against not vaxxing myself and hubby, you know? So I fumbled a bit. Not that it matters, he wouldn't be providing the vax to us anyway, he told us to talk to our doctor (which we just won't), but I hate not having an educated response ready.

Mommy to BigBoy Ian (3-17-05) ; LittleBoy Connor (3-3-07) (DiGeorge/VCFS):; BabyBoy Gavin (10-3-09) x3 AngelBaby (1-7-06)
2boyzmama is offline  
Old 09-12-2008, 10:12 PM
 
mamakay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: in la la land, or so they say...
Posts: 8,332
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Quote:
It's something about how the vaccine protects against the toxoid, not the bacteria, right??? That just because the exposed person does not appear sick does not mean they can't pass the bacteria on... ??
Probably.
mamakay is offline  
 
User Tag List

Thread Tools


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off