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#181 of 211 Old 10-05-2010, 08:40 PM
 
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I love the book rescuers title! : I like to buy ex-library books from Amazon, so I guess I'm a book rescuer, too.
i did not knov that option exsisted. tell me more

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#182 of 211 Old 10-05-2010, 10:25 PM
 
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MLW, I cannot WAIT to get into grammar. I guess I should wait until they are actually reading though...

I wish we had the cold and rainy. Wait. I wish we get it in about 4 days. I do need to start fall-ifying the house. I've got to get the worm bin cleaned out for winter or they will overflow it. But we get so much mroe school done when the weather is yucky. We have such long winters. I just want the kids getting every last breath of fresh air they can.

Aimee, for a lot of books that are old and out of print, Amazon doesn't have new ones in stock but the button on the right hand side changes to offer what they've got used. My policy is that if I can buy from a site that is linked to a library, I pick that one as long as the book is in good condition and reasonably priced.

That reminds me, I've got to go search for The Winged Cat...

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#183 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 09:15 AM
 
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I enjoyed the WSJ article as well. We are not perfect in that regards- the kids do get to watch some videos here and there and ds gets to play on the comp some but we can go days without either. We don't have any game station here although he loves that stuff. I think boys are attracted to those things more. The kids are also attracted to the twaddle books at the library, although they don't hold their attention while I'm reading. What he seems to love the most is Magic Tree House(which certainly isn't classical but has some redeeming value- dh reads those for bedtime) but he also adores Aesop's Fables- gets ticked off when I stop reading them! I hate that at the library all the readers(which are mostly the crap books) are right at the kid's level. Yesterday I spent a good amt of time picking out some nice picture books. We haven't been reading picture books as much and I so miss them- I would rather read a good picture book any day over a reader.

We didn't do a ton of school yesterday but had done so much the day before it evens out I think. We visited the orchard and I think will do some of the apple experiments today and fill out our notebook pages.

No grammar and spelling here either as we aren't reading yet either. Although I do have WWE1. I might pull it out again and see he has really taken off with writing lately. He is currently filling out a crossword puzzle for fun and had me buy him a journal to write in as well.

Today we start our history study, poetry, learning 10 facts, SSL(starting today!) and I cannot remember what else!

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#184 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 10:35 AM
 
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MLW, I cannot WAIT to get into grammar. I guess I should wait until they are actually reading though...

I wish we had the cold and rainy. Wait. I wish we get it in about 4 days. I do need to start fall-ifying the house. I've got to get the worm bin cleaned out for winter or they will overflow it. But we get so much mroe school done when the weather is yucky. We have such long winters. I just want the kids getting every last breath of fresh air they can.

Aimee, for a lot of books that are old and out of print, Amazon doesn't have new ones in stock but the button on the right hand side changes to offer what they've got used. My policy is that if I can buy from a site that is linked to a library, I pick that one as long as the book is in good condition and reasonably priced.

That reminds me, I've got to go search for The Winged Cat...
I will have to look for that !!

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#185 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 11:23 AM
 
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So the book I was looking for was $156 on Amazon last night. Which is a little pricey for 84 pages...
But I found it at a used online book store for $8 shipped. I love when that happens!! And I really hate the sellers who are pricing stuff out of the market just because it's out of print and some mom somewhere will be desperate enough to pay it.

Crunchy, my kids have 5 or 6 notebooks each, filled with random words and some pictures. Their writing really took off when I just allowed them to write whatever they wanted. I do get a teensy bit tired of the, "Mom! How do you spell r-a-b-b-i-t?!?"" at midnight though.
If they are writing, they have to be doing some reading, right???
I'm still hitting some back to school sales and getting spiral bound notebooks for $1 a piece.

It's history day here. Chicken soup stock is reducing on the stove and I have a living room to get ready for an invasion!!

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#186 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 12:18 PM
 
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I keep hearing about the file crate system, can someone tell me what this is, or pint me in the right direction? I need to get my homeschooling smoothed out. I am having a hard time getting my thoughts organized, lol
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#187 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 12:59 PM - Thread Starter
 
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No grammar and spelling here either as we aren't reading yet either. Although I do have WWE1. I might pull it out again and see he has really taken off with writing lately. He is currently filling out a crossword puzzle for fun and had me buy him a journal to write in as well.
We kind of went against the idea of not introducing other L/A skills/subjects until after kids were reading - for one, we had one late reader (probably would have been an earlier reader had I just stuck with phonics instruction, but that's water under the bridge now), and one willing Kindergartner. But, we had both ds#1 and ds#2 doing spelling (AAS), writing (WWE), and grammar (FLL) before they were reading anything remotely independent. FLL was just levels 1 & 2, so it was done all orally, but for writing, spelling, and reading, I feel they all work together to help them become strong readers (and writers).

Not saying that it's the only way to do things; just that for us, waiting on introducing the other "branches" of language arts instruction until my boys were reading was not something dh nor I thought was right. (I did hold off on WWE until they could print all their letters - upper case and lower case; ds#1 had done that already; ds#2 was working through HWOT 1st grade book in the beginning of K and so by mid- to late-K, he was ready for copywork and the very brief dictation phrases from AAS. Now both boys are reading very well (ds#1 is almost at what I'd consider grade level after being at a K level in reading just over 1 1/2 years ago, and ds#2 is reading at a 3rd grade level as a young 2nd grader), and they are doing very well with writing and spelling. So for them, it has worked and I plan on following the same plan for ds#3 and Little Bean in the future.)

Anyway, just our experience - I don't mean to single you out Crunchy - it was just your comment that made me think about our experience, so that is why I quoted it. :
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I keep hearing about the file crate system, can someone tell me what this is, or pint me in the right direction? I need to get my homeschooling smoothed out. I am having a hard time getting my thoughts organized, lol
Here is the blog on the file crate system that I believe has inspired many a file-crate-filer.

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#188 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 04:21 PM
 
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MLW, I never thought of language arts that way. Hmmm... I need to ponder that.

I just got the kitchen and living room cleaned up from lunch. My friend is out in the backyard with all the kids around her on the ground doing a plot study. As it turns out, a science curriculum may have been the right thing to do.
They look so cute out there!!!

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#189 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 04:23 PM
 
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MLW, I'm still thinking... we do word lists off the internet and they have vocab from both history and science - words they have to print and hopefully retain.
What is FLL for grammar?

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#190 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 05:15 PM
 
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We're doing American History as a 3-year cycle and as a separate subject. For the logic and rhetoric stages we'll use that extra year to study government and economics.
I would to see your rotation for US History. I have brainstormed doing this as well, but have yet to figure out exactly "how" to do it.

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#191 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 05:44 PM
 
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We kind of went against the idea of not introducing other L/A skills/subjects until after kids were reading - for one, we had one late reader (probably would have been an earlier reader had I just stuck with phonics instruction, but that's water under the bridge now), and one willing Kindergartner. But, we had both ds#1 and ds#2 doing spelling (AAS), writing (WWE), and grammar (FLL) before they were reading anything remotely independent. FLL was just levels 1 & 2, so it was done all orally, but for writing, spelling, and reading, I feel they all work together to help them become strong readers (and writers).
I have looked into doing it both ways but feel this is the right choice as of now. I feel right now that his brain is working pretty intensely on the phonics. However, we do narration(tons) and also he gets lots of great exposure to good classic literature in many forms. I did buy WWE last year but then realized that it was way ahead of him at the moment.

I didn't realize FLL was more basic than WWE though. I will keep my eyes and ears peeled about this more. There seems to be 2 camps on grammar as to whether it is better to start young or wait- as I have been reading every thread that comes up about this at WTM. (He is between k/1st on his work- finishing up his k-Hwot w/out tears book in a couple weeks but still working on very, very basic reading- We are in the first set of I See Sam Readers and he isn't even currently able to identify all the letters or sounds)

However, all of that said he is progressing well right now. I do anticipate that sometime this year he will be going into a spelling program- when exactly I am not sure and the same w/ grammar. I am also looking at things from the perspective that he seems to have dyslexic tendencies and so look hard at the programs and schedules from those coming from that similar perspective. Info I have read thus far is to wait until he hits the 3rd set of readers for spelling. However, I was also just reading that it is a good way to teach reading. So, many options and methods that work for so many different people! I will say though he is thriving amazingly well right now so I hesitate to change things a ton.

It is one day at a time here though (both for his learning and my teaching).

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#192 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 05:56 PM
 
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Oh, and FLL is First Language Lessons by SWB

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#193 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 06:17 PM - Thread Starter
 
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MLW, I'm still thinking... we do word lists off the internet and they have vocab from both history and science - words they have to print and hopefully retain.
What is FLL for grammar?
FLL is grammar - levels 1 and 2 are mostly all oral (there are copywork exercises in level 2, but we usually do it orally). It can be very repetitive (you can spend a month or two on nouns, but it's also very gentle in its introduction to parts of speech. It also has short stories for oral narration (and a couple narration exercises based on pictures instead of short stories).
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I have looked into doing it both ways but for us I feel this is the right choice now. I feel right now it is enough for his brain to work on intensely focusing on the phonics. I bought WWE bought then when I got it realized that it was not where he was at at the moment. I didn't realize FLL was more basic than WWE though. I will keep my eyes and ears peeled about this more. There seems to be 2 camps on grammar as to whether it is better to start young or wait- as I have been reading every thread that comes up about this at WTM.

However, all of that said he is progressing well right now. I do anticipate that sometime this year he will be going into a spelling program- when exactly I am not sure and the same w/ grammar. It is one day at a time here! (both for his learning and my teaching).
And honestly, in the long run, that is what matters. There are definitely two camps about it all, even among classical hs'ers (which I find interesting; I would expect different ideas among different hsers of various methods/philosophies, but sometimes I am surprised by how much variation is found within one subgroup, if that makes sense). I think if I had stuck with phonics back when ds#1 was 5 (he was ready for it but balked at anything that resembled school because his younger brother didn't have to do any school - he was 2 1/2!), I probably would have spent his whole K year doing only phonics and read-alouds before moving onto grammar and writing (other than doing HWOT). By the time we were really knee-deep into reading instruction, he was already in 2nd grade, so we were doing it all ... spelling, grammar, writing, and reading. And between it all, it clicked for him. Ds#2 was interested in doing school, so I just did the same with him ... he did AAS using only the tiles until he finished learning his letters (writing wise). Ultimately it comes down to what works, and at least for me, it is very calming to finally find what works.

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#194 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 06:50 PM
 
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FLL came out as one big book originally, didn't it? It's downstairs in my bookscase. It was so daunting!!!
But huh. Now it's broken down and it's cheap. I might have to look at that.

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#195 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 06:56 PM
 
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Oh, and FLL is First Language Lessons by SWB
: All day I have been trying to figure that out! :

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#196 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 07:12 PM
 
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Well, I chose our "supplemental" Language Arts stuff to help her learn to become an independent reader.

I think that certain spelling and writing programs (like AAS and Cursive First or similar) can reinforce the phonics work.

However, I think that if I had focused more on the phonics last year, like MLW said, we would not need to be working so hard at the literacy stuff right now.

Sheesh, I can't wait til she's fluently reading . . . then we will have more time for other subjects and she'll be able to read some of her own lessons.

DD made it through the entire 1st Grade Spectrum reading workbook in 4 weeks I am really proud of her. We are going do the AAS What Am I? reader for a few weeks and then tackle the 2nd G Spectrum book. The daily phonics is getting easier. She was so resistant to it last year and the beginning of this year that I let it go by the wayside, but I'm really glad that I helped her push through the wall. Now she doesn't seem to mind it so much, and at one page a day, we should be done by the end of this school year

Oh, and about AAS, we have been ding about a step a day. Lv 1 seems really easy for her. I've been having her write the words instead of spell with the tiles 'coz she likes it and it's faster that way. Glad we started at 1 though so she will have more confidence when she gets to the challenging levels. nak!

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#197 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 07:15 PM
 
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There are definitely two camps about it all, even among classical hs'ers (which I find interesting; I would expect different ideas among different hsers of various methods/philosophies, but sometimes I am surprised by how much variation is found within one subgroup, if that makes sense).
I find this interesting too. Although I describe myself as classical I tend to take a delayed academics approach, and I really think that is in the spirit of classical learning. So since dd is only five, our main academic project this year is learning to read, and then handwriting as a secondary goal. Other than that, we are doing a lot of work on the body, like ballet, and music. We read good fiction and any non-fiction that interests us - we read about totem poles last week since dd had taken notice of the one at the local duck pond and was interested.

My view on formal grammar is that it requires a level of abstraction and that one needs to get there before it is really effective to spend time learning parts, constructions, and rules.

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#198 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 07:26 PM
 
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Just wanted to throw this out there . . . in Montessori, kids are diagramming sentences with 3D manipulatives as they are learning to read, and they learn the parts of speech through activities and short explanations waaay before independent reading. So for instance, the teacher will define an adverb and then say, "Janey, tip-toe QUIETLY", "Tommy, run across the room QUICKLY" etc. There are some really great M Language presentations (free online MOTEACO and more) dealing with introducing grammar that are definitely worth checking out if you are interested in teaching grammar to a pre-reader or very young child.

I don't think it's necessary to learn grammar very early, but I don't think it hurts either.

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#199 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 07:33 PM
 
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I find this interesting too. Although I describe myself as classical I tend to take a delayed academics approach, and I really think that is in the spirit of classical learning. So since dd is only five, our main academic project this year is learning to read, and then handwriting as a secondary goal.
Just a funny thought that hit me while reading what you wrote:

My son (will be 6 Oct 22) can not read at all but is quite good at handwriting and has expressed an interest in learning cursive. :

That is what I love about homeschooling. I am not forced to make any of the children fit into any certain mold. :

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#200 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 07:35 PM
 
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Just wanted to throw this out there . . . in Montessori, kids are diagramming sentences with 3D manipulatives as they are learning to read, and they learn the parts of speech through activities and short explanations waaay before independent reading. So for instance, the teacher will define an adverb and then say, "Janey, tip-toe QUIETLY", "Tommy, run across the room QUICKLY" etc. There are some really great M Language presentations (free online MOTEACO and more) dealing with introducing grammar that are definitely worth checking out if you are interested in teaching grammar to a pre-reader or very young child.

I don't think it's necessary to learn grammar very early, but I don't think it hurts either.
That is really interesting. Off to google site....

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#201 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 07:58 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Just wanted to throw this out there . . . in Montessori, kids are diagramming sentences with 3D manipulatives as they are learning to read, and they learn the parts of speech through activities and short explanations waaay before independent reading. So for instance, the teacher will define an adverb and then say, "Janey, tip-toe QUIETLY", "Tommy, run across the room QUICKLY" etc. There are some really great M Language presentations (free online MOTEACO and more) dealing with introducing grammar that are definitely worth checking out if you are interested in teaching grammar to a pre-reader or very young child.

I don't think it's necessary to learn grammar very early, but I don't think it hurts either.
That sounds so awesome! I'm off to google too!

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#202 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 08:30 PM
 
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That sounds so awesome! I'm off to google too!
Ok, this didn't quote the original post about using manips for diagramming--oops. I was going to ask is this like using Cuisenaire rods to diagram sentences? I saw a blog about that, but since we are still a ways from that [or at least I am, I didn't pay too much attention.



So I was planning to start FLL after Christmas or so. We've been doing OPGTR, and I gotta be honest, I don't like it. It's so DULL! Thank goo the lessons are so short, or we might BOTH be in tears. I'm thinking of following the sequence, but just teaching the sounds my own way, or just through a quickie lesson before I hand him a phonics practice reader. I haven't actually ordered it yet: Is FLL better?
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#203 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 08:35 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I didn't like OPGTR. We had a lot of success with Hooked on Phonics (I love the readers) but my favorite is Phonics Pathways - same basic concept as OPGTR, but something about it makes it not dull and dry. (It's not scripted for one.) FLL would work for grammar, but you would still need something for phonics. FLL is kind of dry and is scripted, but it does lay a great foundation. We are taking a bit of a break from FLL and using Growing with Grammar, but I couldn't see having started with GWG without the background from FLL (and ds#1 is still doing FLL 3 on Fridays, and ds#2 will do FLL 2 with dh when I'm on maternity "leave"). I just needed a break from the teacher-intensiveness of it.

I haven't heard of using Cuisenaire rods for diagramming ... I'll have to google that too. Ds#1 is learning traditional diagramming this year; ds#2 will learn next year, but we all do sentence analysis through Michael Clay Thompson Island materials, and it would be cool to introduce a visual/manipulative especially for the more complex sentences.

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#204 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 08:51 PM
 
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Originally Posted by AngelBee View Post
I would to see your rotation for US History. I have brainstormed doing this as well, but have yet to figure out exactly "how" to do it.
I'm still trying to figure out exactly how I'll do it, but my plan so far is to divide it up like this:
Year 1: Early America through the end of the War of 1812
Year 2: Westward expansion through 1913
Year 3: World War I through present

I don't know how it will work, though. There is a lot of material to cover! Since SOTW4 covers not only both World Wars but the Civil War as well, I think we'll be ok.

I'll PM you the link to my website and you can see what I have planned for this year. I don't have the other two years' worth planned specifically yet, but as soon as I do I will add them to the website.

Jessica, wife of Marc and Momma to Nikolai (10) and Nathaniel (9) and Olivia (3).
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#205 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 09:03 PM - Thread Starter
 
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BTW, should we start an October Thread since it's already the 6th?

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#206 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 09:15 PM
 
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Originally Posted by AngelBee View Post
Just a funny thought that hit me while reading what you wrote:

My son (will be 6 Oct 22) can not read at all but is quite good at handwriting and has expressed an interest in learning cursive. :

That is what I love about homeschooling. I am not forced to make any of the children fit into any certain mold. :
I think it is nice too. DD has just recently begun to really have the coordination to make handwriting anything but a penance. We've been doing quite a lot of physical activities because of this, and because her posture isn't great, and either that, or just time, seems to be helping out.

 I like the mind to be a dustbin of scraps of brilliant fabric, odd gems, worthless but fascinating curiosities, tinsel, quaint bits of carving, and a reasonable amount of healthy dirt.
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#207 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 09:59 PM
 
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Wait. It's October???

secular classical-ish mama to an incredible 5 year old DS and an amazing 6 year old DD.
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#208 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 10:37 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Jennifer3141 View Post
Wait. It's October???

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#209 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 10:38 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Wait. It's October???
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Originally Posted by MyLittleWonders View Post
As much as I'm getting ready to not be pregnant anymore, the thought of the December getting here any faster is a little . But, in spirit of keeping with the title of this thread, I'll go ahead and start a belated October thread and link here.

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#210 of 211 Old 10-06-2010, 10:48 PM - Thread Starter
 
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October CM/Classical thread is now up and running. But, we can pretend it's not quite yet October if we want, at least for a little while.

 Me + dh = heartbeat.gif ds (7/01), ds (11/03), ds (6/06)
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