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#31 of 52 Old 07-03-2005, 08:40 AM
 
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What has given you this impression?

And, do you think that children who go to school are happier about their educational situation than homeschooled children are?

Namaste!
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#32 of 52 Old 07-03-2005, 03:24 PM
 
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Well, without infringing on anyone's privacy, I guess I got my first impression from some of you on this forum. I don't know too me it sounded like the parents want to do this more than the kids.

As far as being happier in school, that is totally up to the child and what they think.
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#33 of 52 Old 07-03-2005, 03:54 PM
 
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Sounds like we need to take a survey of public schooled vs homeschooled kids. For me, one of the many things that contributed to my decision to homeschool was how unhappy the kids I babysat were with going to school. And these were kids who went to "good," high-rated schools.

Also, the homeschooled kids I've met at support groups and conferences are generally comfortable with themselves and other people, happy, eager to learn, etc. They seem to know who they are and what they want. Whereas, if you talk to a group of public school attending high schoolers, a lot of them will be able to tell you that they're going to go to college, but not what they want to study or what they want to do after that. It's like they have to get out of school to figure out who they are or what they're interested in.

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#34 of 52 Old 07-03-2005, 05:06 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snyderjoint
Well, without infringing on anyone's privacy, I guess I got my first impression from some of you on this forum. I don't know too me it sounded like the parents want to do this more than the kids.
I don't know how to say this without sounding snarky, which I don't mean to, but maybe you should go hang out on the Learning at School boards and see what your impression is there. My impression is that you think homeschooling is a bad idea and that you are here to find reasons to support that argument. Please correct me if I am wrong!

Also, I don't think it's terribly unusual for homeschooled kids (especially younger ones) not to be bubbling over with excitement for homeschool. For most of them, that's just life, no reason to get all enthused about it. The same way I doubt many kids who go to school regularly tell their parents, "Gee, Mom and Dad, I know you were very excited to send me to school, and I just wanted to say, 'Thanks for sending me to school! I love school!'" School is just a normal part of life for many schooled kids, just the way homeschool is for homeschooled kids, and both have their ups and downs.

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#35 of 52 Old 07-03-2005, 08:02 PM
 
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You didn't sound snarky to me. And I didn't want to sound mean to anybody, but I really belive in what I posted. I'm not against the way anybody schools their kids, but I'm not a fan of hs. I've been to both forums, you're right some kids don't get excited about school, but I think it should be a good experience for them. That is why I think that we should do whatever works for them and not neccessarily us.
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#36 of 52 Old 07-03-2005, 09:10 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by snyderjoint
Well, without infringing on anyone's privacy, I guess I got my first impression from some of you on this forum. I don't know too me it sounded like the parents want to do this more than the kids.
.
there are a lot of very good reasons why a parent would choose to homeschool instead of sending their kids off to public school. kids usually (always?) don't have the knowledge background to be able to see WHY homeschooling is better.

i personally believe in it for a lot of reasons ~ which this thread really isn't about. suffice it to say that i honestly don't agree with the idea of public schooling as it is being executed here in America currently.

i would, however, be interested in hearing your reasons for, as you put it, not being a fan of homeschooling ~ if you want to PM me...... (i'm just curious and i don't want to derail the thread.)
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#37 of 52 Old 07-03-2005, 09:27 PM
 
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Just out of curiousity, if you're not a fan of homeschooling, why are you posting on a homeschooling board? I know you are researching for a paper or something, but I don't quite understand why you would come here and say, "I'm not a fan of homeschooling"? It seems kind-of like going to the vax board here and telling the posters that you aren't a fan of not vaxing their kids. What's the point? Most of the people here have already decided to homeschool, so I see this as more of a place for us to come and talk about the joys and, yes, the trials and tribulations of homeschooling, than a place to debate whether we've made the right choice. I support your right to be here, don't get me wrong, I'm just curious why you have chosen to post your negative impressions of homeschooling here and not just observe.

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#38 of 52 Old 07-03-2005, 09:35 PM
 
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I wasn't here trying to be negative, although for people that do hs I can see where you'd get the impression that I'm being negative. But, honestly, someone posted this originally and I just thought I'd give them my honest opinion on what I'd do.
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#39 of 52 Old 07-03-2005, 10:28 PM
 
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Brisen had a great idea... I'm going to keep it in mind for myself if the situation arrises. I was also going to suggest explaining that because most homeschoolers don't actually spend all their time at home, the larger community (and beyond!) is really their school... bigger than any one building that's for sure!!

Since DS was a tot, I have gotten to know and spend time with a few homeschoolers. This year, I'm planning to become more involved with our local homeschool community. I do concern myself with his buddies who will be going off to school fall after next and want him to know and be comfortable with those of us who are choosing a different route. Different strokes for different folks and we're all just doing what we feel is best for our kids. I'm incredibly passionate about homeschooling, and its a decision that will include DS's input for sure, but in the end, I have to act in his best interests.

So I don't want to pull your post off topic, but I'm currently reading Hold On To Your Kids (Neufeld), and it talks at length about "counterwill." I am finding more and more with my four year old, that the more I try to *talk up* something he has concerns about, the more he resists it. Not on principle or via being informed, but simply a psychological impulse to resist any sort of "pushing" on my part and that includes setting up a particular situation to be "better" such as in this case, homeschooling.

I imagine if this same situation arises for us, I will give DS a forum to air his thoughts, concerns, ask questions, etc., keep an open dialog going for awhile. Aside from answering questions, I'll probably keep my comments minimal and see if he doesn't arrive at the place where DH and I are, on his own.

We have some unschooling friends (our mentors I guess you could say), who set out to homeschool, but gave their son an option to choose at age 7 or 8 I believe. By the time that age rolled around they'd been doing the unschool thing awhile and their son had gotten to know both unschoolers and schooled children... he'd gathered enough information to know which of the two felt right to him. He's 10 now, and STILL happily unschooling.

The best,
Em

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#40 of 52 Old 07-04-2005, 09:33 AM
 
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I went to a pretty decent public elementary school. Small, but not struggling. Nice teachers. Nice playground. Nice gym, with equipment. Well-stocked library. School choir, which I was in. Sports teams. Field trips. The school funded a trip for grade 8 students each year, 4 days in Niagara Falls. They built a new wing in my last few years there, including a big "tech" room and a home ec room. Yada yada yada. Kids still hated going there. Even when we were in first grade, after the first blush of excitement faded, no one said they liked going to school. No one wanted to come in from recess. Everyone was hyped as the school year came closer to an end. Maybe we might miss one or two teachers of whom we became particularly fond, but no one would have chosen to go to school through the summer just to be around them. When September approached, sure it might be nice to go out and get new clothes, maybe a backpack or pencil case, but they were *consolation* for having to go back to school and have your time stolen day after day. I did very well in school, wasn't terribly popular but wasn't routinely humiliated, either. I enjoyed seeing my friends in school. I lived out in the country, but I still prefered staying home and seeing my friends sometimes to going to school and seeing them every day. Everyone I knew would take every opportunity they could to get away from school. Faking sick. Cutting class. Once I was 18 and could legally sign myself out of class, I did it all the time, being careful that I didn't miss so many classes that I failed the course (they still had grade 13 when I was in high school). I honestly don't know anyone who enjoyed going to school after a very young age. There are plenty of people who now, as adults, say they didn't mind it. But back then, everyone hated it, or enough of it that they didn't want to be there.

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#41 of 52 Old 07-04-2005, 10:29 AM
 
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Brisen

~Joan, Happy mom to 2 beautiful kiddos, one new puppy and 2 lovely felines
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#42 of 52 Old 07-04-2005, 11:09 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snyderjoint
....it just seems to me that alot of parents are more excited to homeschool than their kids.
The same thing could be said about schoolchildren; in fact, every fall and winter the two general education boards I frequent are filled with parental angst over kids who cry about being left at school and have to be physically torn from their parents at the classroom door.

My own eldest told me when she was 5 that she wanted to go to school. It turned out that well-meaning adults had been indoctrinating her. She'd been read a "Molly Goes to Big-Girl School" book at a family friend's (isn't it funny that there is such a market for these books? no one feels compelled to write "Molly Gets Ice Cream" or "Molly Goes to the Playground" books -- maybe because they don't need to 'sell' kids on those ideas, hmmm?). And a couple of people had said to her "How great that your grandma lives right across from the school. Maybe you'll be able to go there for lunch when you go to school!"

Five years later, she had the opportunity to actually try school. She went off optimistically, very curious and I think quite open-minded about it. It was actually my suggestion that she check it out. She came home after a couple of days saying she would keep homeschooling, thank you very much, that "school was a nice place to visit, but I wouldn't want to have to go there every day -- it would be way too limiting." At age 10 she could see what she had gained, and stood to continue to gain, by not being in school. At 5, she wanted lunch at grandma's, and to be a "Big Girl" by the definition of that silly book.

Small children make decisions based on shallow and immediate considerations. I wouldn't let my 5yo child join a church with values that I knew were contrary to my own, because I'd be pretty sure his desire to go to that church had more to do with the look of the building and the fact that he knew someone who went to Sunday School there and got to make a cool silver-streamer star one week, than with his desire to absorb those values. Young children's desires to go to school are generally based on similarly shallow considerations and have little to do with the big picture of educational values and style. Our society is so imbued with Ra!Ra! messages about starting school that parents who intend to homeschool are working at a distinct disadvantage. In this cultural environment it's pretty hard to get a 5yo excited enough about "not doing anything different in September" to overcome those messages.

Miranda

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#43 of 52 Old 07-04-2005, 02:31 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snyderjoint
I personally wouldn't want my kid to be soured on education, I want it to be fun for them.
There is a much better chance of that happening in a school environment than at home. The homeschooled kids I know are much more interested in learning than the kids I know who go to school.

Quote:
I don't care how much I want to hs, if my kid doesn't want to I will not make them.
Would you also make the statement, "I don't care how much I want my kids to go to school, if my kids doesn't want to I will not make them." If not, why not? What is the difference? Do you go to school boards and tell the moms if their kids are unhappy at school that they should homeschool?

I've had so many people IRL ask me if I would send my kids to school if they wanted to, and I've taken to simply asking them what they would do if their child declared that they no long want to go to school. They have trouble seeing that IT IS THE SAME QUESTION.

My kids are old enough now to understand the pros and cons, and if they wanted to try school I would let them. They have absolutly no interest in school. Based on what their friends who attend school have told them, they think it sounds like a horrid place. The also find it very strange that kids who spend so much of their time at school and then bring homework have so little interest in science, history, and literature, and have so little knowledge of basic geography.

but everything has pros and cons  shrug.gif

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#44 of 52 Old 07-04-2005, 04:05 PM
 
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Originally Posted by moominmamma
Small children make decisions based on shallow and immediate considerations.
: YES, they certainly do.

My 4yo was fascinated by the idea of school after Steve (Blue's Clues show) sang a silly song about how fulfilling it was to ride a school-bus. In the episode, their "school exp" consisted of free-style painting. Of course, as I pointed out, Blue is homeschooled in that episode (she's at home). We told ds that, in school, he couldn't draw whenever he felt like it, he'd have to put his activity away before he was done b/c the teacher said so, he couldn't snack when he felt like it and he'd have to do what they told him. You should have seen the shocked look on his face. We unschool and he's a free spirit who has no sense of time; he gets totally immersed in what he's working on. He likes to do his own thing and so he sort of saw the distinct down-side of "school". Then, we hooked up with local homeschoolers, so he wouldn't feel left out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by moominmamma
Our society is so imbued with Ra!Ra! messages about starting school that parents who intend to homeschool are working at a distinct disadvantage.
Again, this is so incredibly true. If school is so great, then why is there such a huge emphasis on convincing preschoolers how thrilling it is? They sure do try hard to sell the idea to kids.
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#45 of 52 Old 07-04-2005, 06:47 PM
 
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I possibly have the the stereotypical and ignorant views of homeschooling. I'm not a person thought that says it should be illegal or people shouldn't do it. I don't necessarily agree with it though. Maybe that's ignorance on my part, but, I guess the same positives and negatives can be said for school and homeschool alike.

No kids need to go to some type school for their education, but lwhether it be regular school or not I'm going to try my hardest to see that my kid gets their education and has a good experience with it.
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#46 of 52 Old 07-04-2005, 08:20 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moominmamma
Small children make decisions based on shallow and immediate considerations. I wouldn't let my 5yo child join a church with values that I knew were contrary to my own, because I'd be pretty sure his desire to go to that church had more to do with the look of the building and the fact that he knew someone who went to Sunday School there and got to make a cool silver-streamer star one week, than with his desire to absorb those values.
Miranda
OT: at age 3, I found myself talking to a judge about which church I wanted to go to (there was a "church custody" battle between grandparents and my mother). My grandparents (father's parents) Catholic church, or my mother's pentecostal church. I chose my mother's church. why??? because the benches were cushioned and it was easier to sleep on them. :LOL

Children deserve the respect of puzzling it out.
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#47 of 52 Old 07-08-2005, 01:58 AM
 
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Well, let me introduce myself - I'm a retired homeschooler. My baby is 22 and my other two are 25 and 26. They homeschooler right up until college BUT my daughter (the oldest) went to Kindergarten. All along I intended to homeschool but we lived on a cul de sac with two kids her age who were going to school (and my there was a lot of pressure too from the public at large - in those days we didn't know any homeschoolers). So, two days before K started, she announced that she wanted to go. I put her in the public school that her two friends were going to (they were so shocked that we got a space as they had been on a waiting list for several years). My baby and I spent a couple hours in the classroom each week helping out. And, when I said okay she could go - I let her know that it was totally her decision and that as far as I was concerned she never had to go to school. (Believe me, most kids don't get that kind of an entry into school). When she would complain about getting up or something, I just reminded her occasionally that it was her choice....

About 2/3 of the way through the school year, she came home one day and said - I don't need to go to school anymore. She never ever wanted to go and to this day is appreciative of her homeschooling. (And she's in grad school now and loving it). I just kept on doing what we did while she was in school. Sometimes we even went out and did something while she was in school - she didn't hate school, just didn't seem like the right choice once she realized what it was. The novelty wore off.

My middle child never wanted to go - my youngest said he wanted to go to K and I knew there was some kind of misunderstanding since he was my clinger. So one day I just said, you know I won't be in K with you and that was that. He just figured we'd both go, just like we did everything else.

People who ask me - didn't they ever want to go? Did you make them stay home? I just say, they always had the option to go. We had a lovely and exciting 20 years of homeschooling.
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#48 of 52 Old 07-08-2005, 03:10 PM
 
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Sounds like you have a wonderful family! I always am inspired by veteran/retired homeschoolers. Thanks for sharing!
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#49 of 52 Old 07-09-2005, 02:06 PM
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Well We decided last year to let dd1 go to Kindergarten. It was a half day program. it was the only public school around and we felt that if she wanted to go to school, she should get in while all the other kids were starting, right? Well it turns out that she had 2 friends move away in the middle of the year and 2 join near the end... so it seems that the time of year really didn't matter ariound here much. Oh and most of the kids had gone to the same preschool which my dd did not, so that already made it cliquey.

Anyway we respected her choice - but she started acting out, getting bored (she could read and only 1 other kid could), going to detention, etc. They said she had anger management and discipline problems. This from my previously happy child.

Anyway after a lot of thought we gave the school the full year to try and challenge her, etc. It was a long year. She loved recess and her friends but otherwise took many "emotionally sick" days and got many a detention.

As a family we have now decided to homeschool her. She is glad to have had the experience of kindergarten. It helped her realize that it wasn't at all like she thought it would be. She still has to see things to understand them.

Do I regret the lost year? Do I regret having put her into that stress, etc. Yeah - But We were going on the assumption that she was going to be schooled and this is what it took. We now know better. But she is still happy that we respected her choice of wanting to try it. (her brain works more like an older child anyway, it is her body and emotions that are younger)

Plus we were also trying not to have our past experiences of school affect the present school situation. We thought that just because our school years sucked, and we spent more time tutoring others or reading by ourselves, that perhaps maybe things had changed.

As for my youngest dd - she could have handled kindy this past year and fit in great - except that she was only 3. LOL So i don't think we will give her the choice when she is 5. i think we will then have to deal with her desires in more creative ways. Like extra classes outside the home, etc. Which we do now anyway.
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#50 of 52 Old 07-13-2005, 01:26 AM
 
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Read your child Calvin and Hobbs. That did it for my kids. Calvin's always got this way of making one realize just how much freedom he is missing out on being in school.

It's important to make sure your child is engaged in something interesting. If they are bored, school will seem more desirable. If you are surrounding their lives with wonderful activities, books, art materials and mostly your attention, they will forget they ever wanted to go to school. It takes work but that's the commitment we make by homeschooling our kids. Find a good resource book like The Complete Home Learning Resource Book by Rebecca Rupp. That has so many ideas that you will never feel at a loss for something to do.

It helps to find yourself a group of homeschoolers so they don't think they are the only ones on earth homeschooling. I hated this part but I had no choice but to cool off of my playgroup in which every child was going to public school except for us. I wrote a letter to all the mom's saying I needed to take a break for a while just until the buzz of kindergarten went away. I explained that with us homeschooling, it was getting really hard for my daughter to get excited when kindergarten seem to be the main topic of conversation. Some understood, some didn't but I had to do it.

Be careful how you talk to friends and family in front of your child when in comes to homeschooling issues. Your child listens to everything you say and may be picking up on your fears.

Anyway, we've been unschooling for 8 years now. They have good friends both schooled and not and life is good. Every once in a while I still get the I want to try school out. When I see they are adamant, I will honor their requests but it usually last until I wake them up at 7:00 the next morning and say OK, let practice getting up early for school. "No thanks!" is what I always seem to hear from them.

One last thing. I don't go overboard on the " Aren't you glad we are homeschooling because...." thing. I just feel that they are smart enough to know that is a manipulative ploy to keep them at home. Kids are really smart and can figure us out pretty early. I would rather have them come to that conclusion on their own.

Mom to two very free children.
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#51 of 52 Old 07-13-2005, 01:40 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Linda on the move
Would you also make the statement, "I don't care how much I want my kids to go to school, if my kids doesn't want to I will not make them." If not, why not? What is the difference? Do you go to school boards and tell the moms if their kids are unhappy at school that they should homeschool?

I've had so many people IRL ask me if I would send my kids to school if they wanted to, and I've taken to simply asking them what they would do if their child declared that they no long want to go to school. They have trouble seeing that IT IS THE SAME QUESTION.
.
Oh I just love that! Why have I never seen it that way?!

Marilyn,psych RN. Homeschooling mom to Taylor (12) and Lauryn (8)
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#52 of 52 Old 07-13-2005, 01:50 AM
 
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I wanted to add that when we first started homeschooling my oldest dd (who is now 7) was quite confused why she was the only child she knew (at the time) who would not be going off to kindergarden. She desperatly wanted to go, talked about it all the time. of course she wanted to go, that was what her friends were doing.

A couple of years later she talks to me all the time about how much she enjoys homeschooling and has no desire at all at this point to go to school. She is starting to understand (she has a LOT of friends that go to school...public, private) what homeschooling really is.

I think it is just a very common things for kids to want to do what their friends are doing, what they see on tv that shows school as so much fun, most books promote or talk about kids in school.

It is not easy to be different at times.

I don't give my children the option of a lot of things I don't belive in...vaccinations, eating junk food, school (which is not the same thing as learning), where we live, violent movies, I mean the list as parents is endless if you really think about it.

Marilyn,psych RN. Homeschooling mom to Taylor (12) and Lauryn (8)
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