anyone else not care about penmanship? - Page 2 - Mothering Forums
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#31 of 52 Old 09-23-2006, 10:34 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Will your child ever work with anyone other than you - as in a mentor, teacher, coach, tutor, etc. Will you find it uncomfortable to talk to those people or get their advice about how to support your kids' learning?
They already have. My oldest child decided to begin college part time at 14 and now at 18 is close to finishing her degree, plus she volunteered at various places such as the library, the nursing home, the YMCA & others from about the age of 8 till now. In all of those cases she & I talked often about her experiences & what she was learning. I never had to have any professional guidance or evaluatory meetings with any of the other adults she was working with. These adults and I often spoke informally, but it was as equals, rather than as one adult evaulating my child or my parenting.

My next oldest volunteers as well....same experiences so far.

And yes, I would find it uncomfortable to have another adult giving me advice about how to support my children's learning.

What I would and do love however, is talking with all sorts of people about fun things to do, ideas, and learning in general. The world is our classroom & there IS much to be learned from others in that sense.

Sorry to get so far off topic!

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#32 of 52 Old 09-23-2006, 11:12 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I was laughing to myself about something relating to penmanship a few weeks ago. I had cause to be at the ER & the doctor's penmanship on the prescription note was illegible! And I mean really, really bad! You couldn't even make out actual letters. Didn't seem to affect his success any. He seemed quite happy with it too.

I can't speak for the pharmacist though.

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#33 of 52 Old 09-23-2006, 11:38 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Stevie View Post
My now nearly 30 yr old son had horrific penmanship; he did fine when it was just printing, but they made it a deal breaker at school! Didn't matter that he aced his tests; he got Fs because he couldn't or wouldn't write in cursive. He is a strong leftie and there were NO left handed desks...

Ummm ok I will bite, what do left handed desks have to do with anything? You learn to adapt becuase it is a right handed world, and they don't care or understand that everything is backwards for you.

Once I got past the 6th grade, you were no longer required to write in cursive. Personally I think the cursive is antiquated. I don't know anyone other than my MIL who writes in it and honestly it hurts my eyes to read it!!!
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#34 of 52 Old 09-24-2006, 02:50 AM
 
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And yes, I would find it uncomfortable to have another adult giving me advice about how to support my children's learning.
Oh, maybe it's the approach and tone then. My dd1 homeschools, but takes various classes. I like it when the teachers take the time to talk with me about how she's doing in the class. I guess so far it's just been more about us all connecting, and not so much with the advice.
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#35 of 52 Old 09-24-2006, 09:58 AM
 
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I'm not that bothered about penmanship. I have messy handwriting and such a huge issue was made of it to the extent that it affected my self-esteem. Every single quarter, in elementary school, I would either get a "U" in penmanship or receive some disparaging remark about how I needed to practice penmanship. I also hold my pen (and my fork) in an unconventional way but it is truly the most comfortable way for me to do it. The penmanship issue just made me feel bad about myself. I was never going to write in that flowery, bubbly style that girls tend to write in. *shrug*. I hated cursive for some reason, so as soon as they stopped requiring it, I stopped doing it. I print and use a lot of block letters. My writing is messy but legible.

It has never hindered me in life. I used to keep lengthy hand-written diaries. I went to college and had a successful career. My handwriting has never gotten in the way of anything. Most things are typed anyway.

Penmanship is not an issue to me, probably because it was completely overblown when I was in school. It eroded my self-esteem and it turned out to be a non-issue.
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#36 of 52 Old 09-24-2006, 11:59 AM
 
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The point of writing is communication. If it is working, the reader can understand it, no problem. My mother has major learning disabilities, undiagnosed due to the era she grew up in (she is 87), and got permission to bring a portable typewriter in to take tests in college. She has 2 Master's degrees. She cannot write well enough to read (herself) an address or phone number she has written. No ammount of practice or criticism changed that.

ElderSon has handwriting that is almost as perfect as typing. YoungSon can barely write at all (learning disabilities again) and we are concentrating on typing. Dd is somewhere in between. I write case notes in my work, and have no problem making them legible, if not pretty. We all use writing to the extent that it is an effective tool. It can be handy, but there are other tools available if this is not the best choice. Just not worth getting upset over.

We homeschool, but if we were in school, I would be ticked with a teacher that focused on penmanship so negatively, especially if it started to leak into other areas of learning. If this focus takes the fun out of learning history or science, for example, I would say it is actively harmful.

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#37 of 52 Old 09-24-2006, 12:50 PM
 
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if penship is so important then why don't DR have good handwriting skills

They have to have some of the worst writing and some it leads to medical mistakes.
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#38 of 52 Old 09-24-2006, 01:52 PM
 
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if penship is so important then why don't DR have good handwriting skills

They have to have some of the worst writing and some it leads to medical mistakes.
I read somewhere that some state was trying to pass a law that scripts had to be typed.
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#39 of 52 Old 09-24-2006, 01:56 PM
 
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My kids' doctor has a fun computer thingy which sends scripts directly to the pharmacy-- no handwriting involved. It's also got access to all of the charts, so while information can be "written" into the computer with a stylus, everything ends up being typed anyway. A high-tech solution to the "doctors with crappy handwriting" problem.

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#40 of 52 Old 09-24-2006, 11:25 PM
 
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Ummm ok I will bite, what do left handed desks have to do with anything? You learn to adapt becuase it is a right handed world, and they don't care or understand that everything is backwards for you.
!!!
well, I know it was much much nicer to have the support for my writing elbow while I learned; can't imagine it makes things easier to have that elbow hanging in the air. The point is that he got no support of any kind from the ps system. If I had homeschooled, my kitchen table offered the same physical support for right OR left handers
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#41 of 52 Old 09-25-2006, 01:08 AM
 
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My penmanship came with practice and age, not from being forced to write at a young age. I did have a "penmanship & spelling" book, but I couldn't read the cursive in it so I misspelled everything, got frustrated and quit. I learned to spell by reading books and typing online, not by some schoolbook. I learned to write sometime when I was older, I can't pin down the exact time.
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#42 of 52 Old 09-25-2006, 01:18 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Stevie View Post
well, I know it was much much nicer to have the support for my writing elbow while I learned; can't imagine it makes things easier to have that elbow hanging in the air. The point is that he got no support of any kind from the ps system. If I had homeschooled, my kitchen table offered the same physical support for right OR left handers


I never had problems. You just turn into the desk a bit and walla, your arm is on the desk.
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#43 of 52 Old 09-25-2006, 01:21 AM
 
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Originally Posted by mama in the forest View Post
I was talking with a friend the other day. Her children attend public school, and while at a parent teacher conference (just the idea of having a conference where another woman tells me how my little darling is doing is outrageous) the teacher really reams her out about her child's penmanship. I guess her child is not making her letters "properly" and the teacher has been having such problems with this child!

Does anyone else think this is silly? I mean, I want all of my children to eventually be able to write, but I really care nothing about their penmanship. My daughter makes these beautiful curvy lines on some of her letters.....and no, it's not the standard way of writing, but it's darn beautiful! And I spend absoluely zero time trying to force my kids to write a certain way.
I haven't read through all the responses because I am super tired but the title of this thread really caught my eye. My oldest DS is in the 5th grade in public school and his teacher is an absolute beast about penmanship.. on SPELLING tests no less. I had a nice little rant about this in a different thread because it really irked me. I feel that if the writing is mostly legible and the child knows what letter they wrote it shouldn't be an issue. I mean realistically by the time our children are grown (and most of us) the computer will be used for anything that needs to look neat and tidy. KWIM? My son worked very hard to make his handwriting legible and for his teacher to harp on him about it hasn't really boosted his confidence much. But that's ok because her and I are going to share a few words during our parent/teacher conference.

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#44 of 52 Old 09-25-2006, 01:34 AM
 
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I never had problems. You just turn into the desk a bit and walla, your arm is on the desk.
That only works if you don't have those skinny, one-piece desk chair combos. With those, it's absolutely impossible to write comfortably (or at all, depending on size) left-handed unless you have a left-handed desk. If you manage to get your elbow onto it, the rest of your body is squished into the back of the chair and your notebook is hanging off of the skinny part of the desk. It just plain sucks.

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#45 of 52 Old 09-25-2006, 01:42 AM
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When my dad was in school (Catholic school, if that makes a difference), the teachers would draw a line on your report card to show the level they thought you sould be performing at in each subject, if you were doing your best. My dad's line went straught across at "A+" until it got to "Penmanship", when it dipped down to a "C". He was lefty, too (and he became a doctor). My handwriting looked a lot like his for years, and then about 5 years ago I noticed that my handwriting now looked more like my mom's.

I had crappy handwriting all through school - I even got extra handwriting assignments in 6th grade, long after the other kids were done with that - but at some point it just got better. Rain's is readable but looks awkward to me... but it doesn't bother her enough that she wants to do anything to change it. And if she doesn't care, I certainly don't...

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#46 of 52 Old 09-25-2006, 02:53 AM
 
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I never had problems. You just turn into the desk a bit and walla, your arm is on the desk.
I don't think those kinds of desks are even used anymore. I hope not...at least I haven't seen any. They don't lend themselves to the warm 'n' fuzzy group placements or seminar-style seating, for sure...

But more importantly, what is a walla?
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#47 of 52 Old 09-25-2006, 07:45 AM
 
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I h/s'd up until my oldest was in 4th and I never cared about penmanship. Now that he's in private school that's an area that he scores the lowest on each quarter He doesn't get a letter grade in it yet but he is trying to improve. It's just something I never really pushed when we were h/s'ing (still don't ) as long as he was writing each day.

I think his teacher is silly for giving him a low point on his penmanship when he misspells words at times and she doesn't say anything about that. I've seen his papers when they come home and that really bothers me. IMO spelling correctly is more important than how neat the writing is. My DH is 43 and can't write worth crap, hehe, he is very sloppy, but he can spell every single word correctly though.

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#48 of 52 Old 09-25-2006, 01:04 PM
 
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But more importantly, what is a walla?
It is supposed to be wa'la since i dont know how to spell it that is the best I can come up with. :P
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#49 of 52 Old 09-25-2006, 01:08 PM
 
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That only works if you don't have those skinny, one-piece desk chair combos. With those, it's absolutely impossible to write comfortably (or at all, depending on size) left-handed unless you have a left-handed desk. If you manage to get your elbow onto it, the rest of your body is squished into the back of the chair and your notebook is hanging off of the skinny part of the desk. It just plain sucks.
I never had a problem with this, I just learned to deal with it. Of course I don't write with my hand upside down like most left handed people I know either. I have had people comment that they cant tell I am left handed because my letters are straight up and down instead of slanted.
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#50 of 52 Old 09-25-2006, 02:03 PM
 
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I never had a problem with this, I just learned to deal with it. Of course I don't write with my hand upside down like most left handed people I know either. I have had people comment that they cant tell I am left handed because my letters are straight up and down instead of slanted.
Hm. I've always had a problem with that, and I don't write with a claw-grip either when I write with my left hand.

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#51 of 52 Old 09-25-2006, 04:08 PM
 
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walla = voila, n'est pas?

Sorry couldn't resist...back to your regularly scheduled thread...
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#52 of 52 Old 09-25-2006, 07:01 PM - Thread Starter
 
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As I thought about my friend & her daughter....I just felt so sad that something that I felt was so insignificant to growing, learning, & loving life could be made out to be such a big deal, AND what a shame it was that it was affecting this young girl's self image.

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