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#241 of 267 Old 08-20-2007, 10:38 AM
 
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?

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#242 of 267 Old 08-20-2007, 10:57 AM
 
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One of my dearest friends is very mainstream and thinks that I need to do a lot more "assertive" parenting with ds. She seems to catch him when we've been on the road for six hours with a crying baby and grumpy dh, so of course, he's frazzled and lets it out in a kid's way ... being crabby and honest "I am hungry. NOW"
I've had similar experiences with some of my own friends and family. And with some children, it doesn't even have to be a 6-hour road-trip: it can just be the presence of these critical people that brings out the worst, ya know?

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#243 of 267 Old 08-20-2007, 01:45 PM
 
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I think I have to start over and reread the thread. I am getting confused! :

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#244 of 267 Old 08-24-2007, 03:17 PM
 
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And I killed the thread :

Mama to 9 so far:Mother of Joey (20), Dominick (13), Abigail (11), Angelo (8), Mylee (6), Delainey (3), Colton (2) and Baby 8 and Baby 9 coming sometime in July 2013.   If evolution were true, mothers would have three arms!

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#245 of 267 Old 08-24-2007, 03:19 PM
 
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It livesss....:

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#246 of 267 Old 08-24-2007, 03:30 PM
 
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It livesss....:
Thanks for breathing some life back in

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#247 of 267 Old 08-24-2007, 04:54 PM
 
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It livesss....


Interesting - I just googled 'radical unschooling' and turns out there is quite a bit of controversy between those who choose to talk about how it's defined. I'm betting this isn't news to everyone but it was to me. Some strong emotions out there!

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#248 of 267 Old 08-24-2007, 05:44 PM
 
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now you have me curious. Off to google....

Mama to 9 so far:Mother of Joey (20), Dominick (13), Abigail (11), Angelo (8), Mylee (6), Delainey (3), Colton (2) and Baby 8 and Baby 9 coming sometime in July 2013.   If evolution were true, mothers would have three arms!

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#249 of 267 Old 08-24-2007, 06:39 PM
 
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Interesting - I just googled 'radical unschooling' and turns out there is quite a bit of controversy between those who choose to talk about how it's defined. I'm betting this isn't news to everyone but it was to me. Some strong emotions out there!
Well, judging by the huge controversy over how "unschooling" is defined, I'm not surprised that defining "radical unschooling" would cause a stir.

Sometimes I like to debate definitions because it causes me to examine what I'm doing and why. And those discussions sometimes lead me to change things that aren't quite in alignment with the life I want to live, kwim?

But, other times, I just want to chat with people who "get it" without having to explain WHY I don't force a bedtime, or make my kids take math tests, or tell them they can't watch tv because they did something I didn't like, etc.

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#250 of 267 Old 08-24-2007, 07:58 PM
 
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Forgive me if I am not posting in the correct place. I am relatively new to this forum.

We are an unschooling family with two boys, 5 & 1 yo. I would love to connect with others who are also unschooling with a 'radical' twist. For those who do not know what this means, it is applying the unschooling philosophy to all areas of life- for example, no bed time, no food restrictions, etc. Kids self-regulate themselves (as we adults wish we could do better..."don't have that extra piece of cake...but I want it...ahhh! why can't you listen to me, self?"). KWIM?

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jenn
I daydream about things like this! I am subbing! I assume that if ds was tired he would just go to bed but I have found again and again that is not the case! (He thinks he is missing out on all the fun.) :-)

SUB!

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#251 of 267 Old 08-24-2007, 09:44 PM
 
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Dh says that dd is going to school next year! I totally don't want her too, but it's his kid too. At least he is still going to screen the school and teachers and pick a decent one. She will probably really like it, as she loves other kids and they keep her busier than I can. He says just elementary, she can go back to Unschooling for the rest of the time and for the next 13 months.

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#252 of 267 Old 08-24-2007, 10:14 PM
 
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I daydream about things like this! I am subbing! I assume that if ds was tired he would just go to bed but I have found again and again that is not the case!
Do you do anything to sort of "create an atmosphere conducive to sleep"?

Esp when my son was younger, if it seemed that he was tired or it was "time" for bed, i would lay down with him(when he was nursing, of course, at that time we'd nurse to sleep)but usually this involved turning out the big light and putting on the little reading light, me reading several chapters from the book we were reading, rubbing his back, maybe singing to him. I'd do this guided imagery thing that really helped, just paint a scene with words ("You're lying on a beach...the sun is warm on your face...you can hear the crashing of the waves...the crashing...the crashing...the sun is so warm...and you're so sleepy, so sleepy")using a rhythmic, repetitive voice....if he was truly tired at that time he'd drift off to sleep.

If he wasnt tired, no amount of doing this would get him to go to sleep, so he would just get back up and do some sort of quiet activity til he felt like going to sleep. Sometimes that was lying in bed with me watching a DVD on the laptop while *I* went to sleep, sometimes it was me creating a 'nest' on the living room floor with a dvd so he could lay there with something to do until sleep came.

But this usually occurred at his naturally occuring "bedtime", not some arbitrary time i picked, where i would send him off to bed at 8pm and i would go to bed hours later. Now that he is almost 11, i don't really need to do alot of that sleep prep, he just goes to bed when he feels like it.

How old is your son?


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#253 of 267 Old 08-24-2007, 10:17 PM
 
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my son is 4. we have a "bedtime routine" , We started it when he stopped nursing to sleep at age 2 1/2 and for the most part it works well-but-latley he has been wanting to "hang out with us" rather than go to sleep at this time. I love my little guy but I will go nuts if I dont have my alone time with dh to vent and talk and reconnect-we dont see that much of eachother.
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#254 of 267 Old 08-24-2007, 10:19 PM
 
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I have a question for everyone. Who here is a radical unschooler with a totally straight lined, traditional husband? My dh pretty much wants me to do a "public school" type of thing at home. I would rather unschool completley.
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#255 of 267 Old 08-24-2007, 10:32 PM
 
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I'm very AP, vegetarian, non-vaxing, so on and so on. My Dh is a wonderful man and over all has been very accommodating to my growing crunchiness. He alone would not likely have done so many of the things that I do. He rarely asks me to take dd to the Dr and didn't mind the Unschooling when I started learning about it. We aren't Radical Unschoolers, but I think we are pretty different than the average family. So it's not his thing, but mine.

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#256 of 267 Old 08-25-2007, 02:06 AM
 
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I have successfully influenced dh towards radical unschooling--he was into it for the school stuff, but the parenting parts were more of a stretch. But now that he sees how great it's worked out--dd happily announcing that she's off to bed of her own accord, etc--he is grateful to me (and I'm just a bit smug about it I admit lol!).
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#257 of 267 Old 08-25-2007, 07:09 AM
 
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My Dh was terrified of unschooling. Well, less terrified and more wierded out by how "against the norm" it was. He has really come around, but he still has freak outs occasionally. They get less and less as the kids get older though. He can see that unschooling is really good stuff.

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#258 of 267 Old 08-25-2007, 08:42 AM
 
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I have a question for everyone. Who here is a radical unschooler with a totally straight lined, traditional husband?

I've always had the "out there" ideas, while ds has been very traditional and likely to counter with a "this is the way it's always been done" argument. I know I sort of freak him out sometimes.

Some things are "deal breakers" and some things aren't. To me, being respectful of our kids and them having freedom to control their own lives is a biggie.

Dh is at work long hours, so honestly, most stuff is worked out between me and the kids. There have been some bumpy times when he HAS been home more often and had to sort of assimilate back into the way we do things. I remember one time in particular where he asked the kids to do something and they asked "why?" (Not in a mean or challenging way, just curious.) He told them, "Because I'm your father and I said so." And the kids just sort of looked at him like he was from another planet. We laughed about it later, but I think, because he's not here all the time, it's easier for him to fall back into the way he was parented.

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#259 of 267 Old 08-25-2007, 12:52 PM
 
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My dh is partly, but not yet completely, on board with radical unschooling. He's definitely supportive of homeschooling, though, and sees how much our daughters are teaching themselves.

It's been an interesting journey for me. I started out as an unschooler who strictly limited tv and computer time. Now I realize that I was saying I wanted my children to direct their own learning, when really I wanted to make sure their only available choices were within the range of what I'd choose for them.

I felt so smug and superior when "other people's kids" wanted to spend hours watching tv and playing computer games. I felt good about "making" my kids be more "resourceful" than that; I felt my kids were more creative than everyone else's.

I thought critically of one of my friends who, when their computer was down, took her kids to the library every day so they could get on the computers and get their "game-fix." Now I see that lady as very much in-tune with her children, and committed to meeting their needs.

Of course, now that I've quit limiting, I get that smug feeling for the reverse reasons. I guess feeling smug and superior is just my personal bogeyman I'll always have to deal with .

What helped me realize I that needed to start learning to trust my children completely, was lots and lots of online reading -- here, the radical unschooling site called "Joyfully Rejoicing," the TCS site. I like reading and conversations that turn my brain upside down and make me rethink everything on a pretty regular basis.

I don't think my dh gets the same enjoyment of this. But he is glad I stopped limiting the tv and computer games. He's a visual media kinda guy.

Susan -- married unschoolin' WAHMomma to two lovely girls (born 2000 and 2005).
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#260 of 267 Old 08-25-2007, 02:01 PM
 
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Well, judging by the huge controversy over how "unschooling" is defined, I'm not surprised that defining "radical unschooling" would cause a stir.

Sometimes I like to debate definitions because it causes me to examine what I'm doing and why. And those discussions sometimes lead me to change things that aren't quite in alignment with the life I want to live, kwim?

But, other times, I just want to chat with people who "get it" without having to explain WHY I don't force a bedtime, or make my kids take math tests, or tell them they can't watch tv because they did something I didn't like, etc.
Me too.
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#261 of 267 Old 08-28-2007, 01:39 AM
 
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Even if the TV's on all day, free-range toddlers will be getting up to climb on the furniture, bang on the pots and pans, and so on.
Are we all friendly-feeling enough to bring up the tv thing again? : I tend to think (and no, I've never gone totally limitless with tv/computer) that different personalities react differently to visual media -- some people are not that interested, or are interested only when the content is interesting to them and then they're done, and some people just gog out on flashing colors. My kids seem to have inherited this from my dh, who gets that "Cletus the slack jawed yokel" look in the presence of any kind of tv images. I'm not saying they aren't getting anything out of this watching, but it's just such *easy* entertainment, that my kids always gravitate towards *watching* and not *doing* whenever given the choice. When we last moved, we gave away our tv (haven't had cable for years anyway, only used it for movies), but still have DVD's and computer access, which is my 6 (today is his birthday!) year old son's primary obsession -- computer games. My almost 8 year old dd used to be also obsessed with movies (and gets a lot out of them!) but now that she can read, and has learned to do a lot of other fun things, she seems less interested in visual media. She will sit and listen to stories on CD literally all day long, though, which is fine by me.

Again, wrapping up , I know that when I engage my son in other activities, he chooses that over computer games, but his automatic choice of activity when we're home is to play games on the computer. If I don't limit this (by suggesting another activity), he would sit at the computer all day long. Ok, not ALL DAY LONG, but longer than what I think is healthy -- and I do think that "too much" tv/movies/edutainment/video games does inhibit their ability to entertain themselves... or rather, if they pull away from their electronic drug of choice to do something else, they have trouble (in my experience) figuring out anything else to do, if the electronic drug option is still sitting there so easy to get at... I hear "I'm so bored" waaaaaaaaay more often now that he has figured out computer games, whenever he isn't playing them or engaged in something else that is easily super fun. Am I making any sense?

So, do RU'ers just try to engage their kids when they do this? SAy "hey, lets go for a walk!" or whatever? What about those days when you are busy with life, and the kids are somewhat left to their own devices -- would you ever say "it seems like you've been on the computer a lot today, is there anything else you'd like to do?" and help them find something else to do? I won't pretend that it doesn't bother me when he plays for so long that his eyes turn red -- does this not bother you RU'ers?

I guess I'm advocating helping kids discover their own limits, when they are the type of kid who is totally content to sit and watch, or sit and play a video game all day long, rather than saying "one hour of screen time per day" because life ebbs and flows, and some days we need more than an hour, sometimes a week goes by that we're so busy that none of us touch the computer -- is this middle ground, or is it (not that I care if I fit the mold ) in line with RU?

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If so, I'm sorry. But if something is one thing, but we twist it to be something else, is it anything?
To me, this is the same thing as people saying "I had a natural childbirth except for the epidural"....it leaves me but I don't generally call them on it -- I don't care what they call it, but I don't really need to have ownership of specific labels. AP is a vast umbrella of parenting techniques that for some people involves BF'ing, co-sleeping, babywearing, GD, not vax'ing, homelearning, etc, etc, etc, but for other people, if they receive a baby bjorn for their baby shower, they consider themselves AP. Unschooling (and radical unschooling) are similar to this, IMO, though there are people who are protective of the label, and I respect their desire to defend its' honor!!

Which is why I try not to apply labels to our family, we're way too wishy washy! But I am really loving learning from everyone here!!

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my son is 4. we have a "bedtime routine" , We started it when he stopped nursing to sleep at age 2 1/2 and for the most part it works well-but-latley he has been wanting to "hang out with us" rather than go to sleep at this time. I love my little guy but I will go nuts if I dont have my alone time with dh to vent and talk and reconnect-we dont see that much of eachother.
Our kids are night owls, and if we lay down with them, we're asleep for the night too. I would love for them to announce their own bedtime at 8 pm and scoot off to bed on their own, but that's just not our reality. What we do is to just find our moments alone when the kids are occupied doing whatever they do -- in the wise words of John Leguizamo: "whoever invented cartoons was a horny dad" : We usually have time to chat in the evenings when the kids get involved in their own thing, and we absolutely use movies as a babysitter for "special time" when the kids are not as involved in something as "special time" would require -- we don't suggest movies for that purpose, but if they're watching a movie, and we're not otherwise occupied...:

But if your bedtime routine works, and he goes to sleep when you want him too, all the power to you! My kids like to have us lay down with them to go to sleep, and if we do that early enough for us to have "grownup time" in the evenings, they just lie there awake, don't get as much time with dad, and usually, we fall asleep too.

Ok, back at it!

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#262 of 267 Old 08-28-2007, 08:27 AM
 
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If I don't limit this (by suggesting another activity), he would sit at the computer all day long. Ok, not ALL DAY LONG, but longer than what I think is healthy --
My kids sometimes do things longer than *I* ever would, but that doesn't mean to me that it's unhealthy. What I've seen with my ds and computer games is that his interest goes in bursts. This weekend, some new preview of GuildWars came out, and ds was on a lot, but I know that his interest will run out eventually and he'll move on to something else.

Everyone at my house gets engrossed in activities though--sometimes it's a book, sometimes a video series, sometimes writing, sometimes games or crafts...it's just natural for us to go through these cycles.

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So, do RU'ers just try to engage their kids when they do this? SAy "hey, lets go for a walk!" or whatever?
I don't this specifically for game usage. But I've surely said, "You've been at that a while, want to take a break and go for a walk or.... whatever?" I do it for myself too, when I've been sewing so long that my eyes are getting bleary. Sometimes, the kids don't realize how long they've been at something and my suggestion makes them take notice and realize they need a break. Other times, they're on a roll and don't want to stop, so I don't force it.

I don't think it's "bad" to spend a lot of time at one activity, but I do know that my kids have other things they want to do, or places to go, so we talk about how to fit everything in. So, I don't limit any particular activity, but we do talk about managing their time so they can do what they want to do.

Sometimes, they DO spend much of the day on one activity. Other times, they plan their days around a variety of things.

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#263 of 267 Old 08-28-2007, 10:22 AM
 
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Oh, no! Not the TV thang!

OK. I am not comfortable with free range TV for toddlers. There I said it.
Again.
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#264 of 267 Old 08-28-2007, 10:25 AM
 
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Tiffani -- sure, I sometimes suggest something my children and I can do together. Like SagMom, I don't specifically do this with video games. And it's not always that I'm concerned about my child's activity. Sometimes I just see an opportunity for my older dd and I to do something we enjoy, something that's harder to do when my younger dd is awake.

I'll say, "Hey, your sister's asleep. This'd be a good time for us to read that book, or play that game, if you want." She may want a few minutes to finish up what she's doing, but then she's usually thrilled to have some one-on-one time with just me. And she may suggest a whole different activity than the one I thought of.

I'll also give my input about nutrition. I might say, "Hey, you've been eating a whole lot of candy (or drinking a whole lot of pop) today. How about something with protein?"

To me, RU doesn't mean we never express concerns about our children's choices and their impact on health and well-being. It just means our input is something additional for them to consider, as they make their own choices about how to live their lives. And believe me, our input is very important to them.

Susan -- married unschoolin' WAHMomma to two lovely girls (born 2000 and 2005).
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#265 of 267 Old 08-28-2007, 11:26 AM
 
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Also, I'm learning how special it is to my girls whenever I drop what I'm doing, and just hang out and watch TV with them.

Susan -- married unschoolin' WAHMomma to two lovely girls (born 2000 and 2005).
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#266 of 267 Old 08-28-2007, 03:18 PM
 
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RA mamas.....I would love your input on this thread.

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=738366

Mama to 9 so far:Mother of Joey (20), Dominick (13), Abigail (11), Angelo (8), Mylee (6), Delainey (3), Colton (2) and Baby 8 and Baby 9 coming sometime in July 2013.   If evolution were true, mothers would have three arms!

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#267 of 267 Old 08-28-2007, 08:59 PM
 
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Also, I'm learning how special it is to my girls whenever I drop what I'm doing, and just hang out and watch TV with them.
My dd loves this too. She wants my company and to laugh and enjoy the same thing together.

Mama to Hailey Rose '02 Pro- crunchy
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