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#1 of 40 Old 01-15-2010, 03:33 PM - Thread Starter
 
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We live in a town that is right outside a city where there are a few professional sports teams. Dd attends a private school in that city and happens to go to school with some of the players' kids.

Right now the whole city is abuzz with football playoffs. I guess our team is really good and have a chance to do well. At school, instead of uniforms, the kids could wear supportive clothes for the local team today. They were NOT allowed to wear clothes to support the other teams. They made it sound almost like it was required to wear supportive clothing, but they did say, "or uniform".

We have 0 interest in sports. Could NOT care less about what happens and never watch, support, or buy things related to sports.

Dd came home crying yesterday from school because the school counselor told her that she HAD to wear a jersey tomorrow (today) and she didn't want to be the ONLY one who didn't fit in. To say the least I AM STEAMED about this. This is supposed to be the school counselor... what is she doing telling dd that she won't "fit in". Dd was really frantic to go get a jersey last night. I tried to talk to her calmly about it, but I refused to go buy a jersey. It simply goes against every single grain of my beliefs. I cannot understand this fascination with supporting professional sports and I'm trying to help dd understand that it's really not something that we, as a family, participate in.

I know part of the problem is that one of the MAJOR stars of the football team is one of the school parents (and I'm sure he gives a ton of money to the school), but I also don't think that they should be pressuring SO MUCH that they make a kid CRY and coerce them into supporting something they don't even understand.

I don't think I did a very good job of explaining things to dd. I didn't want to use my mom's miserable excuse of "if everyone jumped off a cliff...". I think it's fine to have a "spirit day", but not when they make those kids not participating feel like pariahs.

So, my question is, first of all, when something like this happens, how would you handle explaining to your child? My second question is if you would write a letter to the principal about this and if so, what would you say? TIA.
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#2 of 40 Old 01-15-2010, 05:45 PM - Thread Starter
 
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20 views and not even a suggestion? I guess we're weird this way. I'm still going to write a letter to the principal. There's no need to make a child feel like they have to participate is something like supporting a local professional team to the point of tears. That's just asinine, IMHO.
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#3 of 40 Old 01-15-2010, 06:59 PM
 
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I would bring it up with the school - the poor kid was crying, and that's not right.

What I would do in bringing it up is to assume that their intention was, as stated in the original note home, to allow kids to wear 'team' clothes as a fun alternative to their uniform on the spirit day, but otherwise to wear the uniform. I would also assume, in bringing it up, that the counsellor's remark was not seriously intended to have the effect it did or to make your daughter think she would be excluded or not belong if she failed to wear team clothes. Assume these things, then point out the actual effect...

I'd say or write something like "I just wanted to let you know that dd had a very difficult time with the hoopla surrounding spirit day. I understand that the intention was to allow kids who wished to do so to wear team jerseys as an alternative to their uniform on the one day, but that doing so was not required. We do not have any team jerseys in the home, and were not in a position to purchase one for her, nor did she want one initially. However, she wound up in tears the night before spirit day, and was very worried that she would be excluded at school for not wearing a jersey. She understood the counsellor to have warned her that she 'had' to wear one or that she would not "fit in" the next day, and this caused her enormous anxiety. We believed it was important not to reinforce her sense that she had to conform or risk exclusion by racing out at the last minute to buy her a jersey.

One of the things we value about the school is the fact that the uniform policy generally removes pressure on the students to "fit in" by wearing the "right thing." I wanted to draw this issue to your attention so that the school can be careful about how it communicates with students about any future spirit days, in order to ensure that the right message gets through."
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#4 of 40 Old 01-15-2010, 08:23 PM
 
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We have 0 interest in sports. Could NOT care less about what happens and never watch, support, or buy things related to sports. ..... I'm trying to help dd understand that it's really not something that we, as a family, participate in.
when you say "we," whom do you mean? You and your DH, or your entire family? What if the kids want something different than you do on this issue? Is this an issue that each member of the family can decide how they feel about, or is it something so deeply fundemental that they are not allowed to own team wear until they are no longer under your roof? It's not a religion, it's a T shirt (that you can most likely pick up at Walmart).

Because if it were me and my kid wanted a team shirt, I'd go buy it.

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I also don't think that they should be pressuring SO MUCH that they make a kid CRY and coerce them into supporting something they don't even understand.
I'm totally with you there. I'd be writing a letter! I also wonder what sort of qualifications your school counselor has. Not only did she screw this up, but your child will most likely not trust her in future.

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So, my question is, first of all, when something like this happens, how would you handle explaining to your child?
I'd talk to my child and find out what they wanted to do, and I'd do my best to do it. I don't know that would be the best thing to do, but it's just how I am.

If my child didn't want one or was still super upset, I might let them stay home for the day and vent to the principal about the fact that they made a school day more about what the kids wore than what they were going to learn.

but everything has pros and cons  shrug.gif

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#5 of 40 Old 01-15-2010, 08:43 PM
 
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I really like what mammastar2 wrote.

What would irk me beyond the wearing a jersey would be that it had to be a specific team jersey. That's just really, really over the top for me.

I'm watching on how others would handle it with the child, because I have no idea what I would do. What did you do?

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#6 of 40 Old 01-16-2010, 02:48 AM
 
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I wouldn't write a letter, I'd go in & talk to the counsellor. The principal would have no idea that this happened & the issue is with the counsellor. What your dd is saying happened may not be what really happened. Kids easily get things mixed up.

If my child wanted to participate in this I"d let her. If the jersey is the official ones that cost $50-$100+ no I wouldn't go out & buy one but I'd see if we had any clothes in the colours of the team & let her wear those.

I see nothing wrong with showing of support of a team.
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#7 of 40 Old 01-16-2010, 05:57 AM
 
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Sorry this is a bit late velochic, but thought I'd throw my two cents in anyway.

I grew up in Ohio & wearing clothes to support a team at certain times of the year was common at my public school (especially for OSU vs. Michigan State college football games!) & we were never, ever coerced into supporting Ohio State. In fact, I always wore Michigan State gear just to be a bit of a shit stirrer. It's very sad that your little one was so upset over a school spirit day that she cried, & I think what the counselor said to her was wrong. I do think the principal needs to know about it, because she/he is responsible for the school staff, but it might be worthwhile having a chat with the counselor first to make sure that there wasn't a mixed or misunderstood message between your DD & the counselor. (I say this because I have gone guns a' blazing to my kids school over something I thought a teacher said to my child, only to find out that my child didn't correctly relay all the details to me. Which my child then remembered after further gentle probing from me. oops. )

I now live in a town where we have multiple professional sport teams, & whilst we do occasionally go to some soccer games, that really is the extent of our support. And there is no way i would pay $100 plus for an official jersey unless the kids really, really desperately wanted one to wear to a game. But not just for a school day, no way!! My DD now goes to a private school with kids of a famous english soccer player & there is never any pressure to support the local team. Dad might be legend in UEFA circles, but his kids aren't & they just get along like the rest of us.

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#8 of 40 Old 01-16-2010, 12:08 PM - Thread Starter
 
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when you say "we," whom do you mean? You and your DH, or your entire family? What if the kids want something different than you do on this issue? Is this an issue that each member of the family can decide how they feel about, or is it something so deeply fundemental that they are not allowed to own team wear until they are no longer under your roof? It's not a religion, it's a T shirt (that you can most likely pick up at Walmart).
"WE" is dh and me. We have an only child, so there isn't a lot of discussion about sports in the house among other people.

Dd didn't even have a clue about the game, the team or anything else until it was brought up at the gym assembly. Nobody watches sports here and we don't follow any sports.

She can decide how she feels about it when she's old enough to understand. At 7, almost 8, a child isn't going to know enough about team loyalty to do anything but parrot their parents.


And she could not just skip school that day... she was receiving an award in front of the whole school yesterday... for being a LEADER. There's something to be said about teaching your kid to not be a sheeple.
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#9 of 40 Old 01-16-2010, 12:38 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Mamstar, I like the letter that you suggest. I think I'll just send an email and mention that the whole spirit day seemed a bit over the top and upset dd and may have upset other kids as well.

I do know that one of the mothers I was talking to at the assembly yesterday (when dd received her award), said that they are from another city and as a family are great fans and support another team playing this weekend (not against the local team). Her ds and husband watch all of the games and even subscribe to some satellite service to watch them. Major football fans in the house. Her son was not allowed to support "their" team. I feel that they were equally slighted in this incident as we were.

The thing is, they have "other" spirit days at the school... wear pajamas, wear a hat, wear two different shoes. Just fun things. They have never pressured kids to participate in THOSE spirit days. Why now because they think this local team is going to win the superbowl? It's just all very ridiculous and divisive.
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#10 of 40 Old 01-17-2010, 05:01 PM
 
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Did you ever talk to the counselor? It does seem silly that a school can only support one team. Our elem school had a day to wear blue and gold (HS colors) on the day they played their arch rival but some kids still wore red and black (rival's colors) and nobody really cared. Other than that, they have generic sports days where you can wear whatever. Kids wear pro sports team jerseys, their Little League shirt, their swim team sweatshirt, etc.

I do have to agree with JL83 that it doesn't hurt for your child to have some sports awareness. Well, at least if you live in the midwest US! I remember when one of my friend's sons was in 4th grade, a lot of kids made fun of him one day because he didn't know who LeBron James was. It's not like kids have to be fanatics or wear a $100 jersey, just know the team names and have an overall idea of how they are doing, some of the major players, etc.
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#11 of 40 Old 01-18-2010, 09:03 AM
 
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It's perfectly okay to pay no attention to (ignore) aspects of a culture that are meaningless to you. Gracious peace, I would think that we all do that to some extent every day! I know we certainly do in our family, particularly when it comes to foods, tv shows & certain 'cultural' activities that everyone else in town seems to go to- like the V8 races, the military airshow or the city council christmas carols. Kids just adapt & accept that their particular family isn't into that activity- no biggie.

But it's not okay for a school to coerce a child into supporting a particular activity or event. It's even worse when the child is upset by this coercion. Velo, I hope your little one accepted her leadership award with pride!

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#12 of 40 Old 01-18-2010, 09:13 AM
 
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And I have to add that I personally think that it's good for most kids to be involved in some sort of sporting activity. We prefer the ones that are not so competitive, but instead focus on the individual child achieving his or her personal best. This means all children are able to participate, including non-athletic children & those with significant disabilities. But we are a 'sporty' kind of family, so that is my bias of course!

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#13 of 40 Old 01-18-2010, 01:56 PM
 
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Velochic, what did you end up doing? I would have been ticked. Your daughter shouldn't have had any pressure put on her.
Linda on the Move, I agree about keeping an open mind about it and finding out what my child really wants. Making a well-thought out decision to do something in order to join in with others is legitimate as far as I'm concerned. It's not about being a sheep and following blindly, it's more about the camaraderie that's involved.

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What would irk me beyond the wearing a jersey would be that it had to be a specific team jersey. That's just really, really over the top for me.
Well it was because the local team has a shot at the Superbowl. When I was in 5th grade our teacher said if the Tigers won that night (which they did, winning the World Series, a game I was lucky enough to attend) then the next day we could wear Tigers caps to school (normally no caps or hats were allowed). It had to be a Tigers cap or nothing since it was to celebrate the local baseball team's win. So it makes sense that it was a day for supporting the local team only, but in that case there should have been zero pressure on anyone to do so.




Not caring about the NFL does not mean you are culturally ignorant. I don't know the players or even which teams might be headed to the Superbowl (I can't even guess at where the OP lives!) I have no interest and if that means there are discussions I can't participate in, I'm OK with that. I have heard of LeBron James but could not tell you if he plays basketball or football. I don't care enough to google his name to find out. It doesn't mean I am out of touch with pop culture.

Since my son is 8 and doesn't have parents who watch sports on tv or attend much in the way of sporting events (though I plan to take him to a baseball game the next time we're in the US in the summer) he doesn't know the teams and players either in the US or in Europe. If someone made fun of him because he didn't know who someone was, we could look that person up together and find out. If he wanted to learn more about a team to have more in common with other kids then he can learn whatever he wants and I would help him in any way he wanted me to.
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#14 of 40 Old 01-18-2010, 04:19 PM
 
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If he wanted to learn more about a team to have more in common with other kids then he can learn whatever he wants and I would help him in any way he wanted me to.
I think the bolded part is the key. Pop culture is a big thing, and knowing which parts we enjoy and which parts we just skip is one thing. Deciding that our children are foribidden to participate in pop culture is another thing. Pro sports is small potatoes compared to movies, books and music.

I never want to set my kids up to feel like they need to choose whether they are like mommy and daddy or if they enjoy the larger world. They should get to do both. I'm not into sports, but I see them as harmless fun. I see my kids knowing what is going on in sports as part of their cultural literacy to talk to their peers (though our team is out of the running so pop culture here is back to Avatar and New Moon and Lady Ga Ga).

I agree that the counselor was in the wrong and what she said was out of line. I'm still curious what her credentials are for her job. I honestly believe that this wouldn't happen at a public school.

but everything has pros and cons  shrug.gif

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#15 of 40 Old 01-18-2010, 06:05 PM
 
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Well it was because the local team has a shot at the Superbowl. When I was in 5th grade our teacher said if the Tigers won that night (which they did, winning the World Series, a game I was lucky enough to attend) then the next day we could wear Tigers caps to school (normally no caps or hats were allowed). It had to be a Tigers cap or nothing since it was to celebrate the local baseball team's win. So it makes sense that it was a day for supporting the local team only, but in that case there should have been zero pressure on anyone to do so.
Yeah, I get *why* the school wanted to do this, I just don't agree with it. The message is to conform to what the school thinks is the important pro sports team without regards to individual preference. Telling the students that they can wear the local team jersey or no jersey really is.......yuck, IMO. I would have been more comfortable if the counselor said to pick any sports team's jersey. I'm likely missing something since this is a private school with uniforms, so they already have a pretty defined dress code. It just seems that if they are going to make an exception day for dress code, it could have been widened a bit.

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#16 of 40 Old 01-18-2010, 08:14 PM
 
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We also have zero interest in professional sports, and this would irritate me to no end. I'd be talking to both the counselor and the principal. I would never go out and buy a jersey.

I see no value at all to professional team sports. I think they are, in general, a negative thing, and no, I'm not going to make my kids watch them so that they will know more about them for the sake of other people.
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#17 of 40 Old 01-18-2010, 08:39 PM
 
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I have heard of LeBron James but could not tell you if he plays basketball or football. I don't care enough to google his name to find out. It doesn't mean I am out of touch with pop culture.
It does if you live in OH. But seriously, you can't even pick up a paper here without seeing something about the Cavs (that's the basketball team LeBron plays for) on the front page the day after a game. And you just hear news stories about him doing this or that all the time, even on NPR. So you'd almost have to be trying to not know who he is.
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#18 of 40 Old 01-18-2010, 08:44 PM
 
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There's a difference between being a fan or even just interested in sports and being aware of the world around you.

I don't see anything to be proud of in intentionally choosing to remain in the dark about something which is clearly important to the area around you. I'm not suggesting spending alot of time watching sports or even following it. But at some point it becomes almost perverse to go out of your way to avoid knowing about large segments of social culture.
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#19 of 40 Old 01-19-2010, 01:47 PM
 
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Yeah, I get *why* the school wanted to do this, I just don't agree with it. The message is to conform to what the school thinks is the important pro sports team without regards to individual preference. Telling the students that they can wear the local team jersey or no jersey really is.......yuck, IMO. I would have been more comfortable if the counselor said to pick any sports team's jersey. I'm likely missing something since this is a private school with uniforms, so they already have a pretty defined dress code. It just seems that if they are going to make an exception day for dress code, it could have been widened a bit.
Ok, I see your point now and I can see why it would bother some families to be limited to only one team, even if it's the local one. Oh and I really, really didn't mean to imply that you didn't get why the school wanted to do it that way, sorry it kind of came across that way!

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It does if you live in OH. But seriously, you can't even pick up a paper here without seeing something about the Cavs (that's the basketball team LeBron plays for) on the front page the day after a game. And you just hear news stories about him doing this or that all the time, even on NPR. So you'd almost have to be trying to not know who he is.
OK if I lived in Cleveland and didn't know who LeBron played for, that would be pretty bad, especially since I am a paper reader when in the U.S. Here in the Detroit area (where we are visiting family) I don't think the teams have been getting that kind of coverage It would really have to be on the front page since I don't read the sports section.

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There's a difference between being a fan or even just interested in sports and being aware of the world around you.

I don't see anything to be proud of in intentionally choosing to remain in the dark about something which is clearly important to the area around you. I'm not suggesting spending alot of time watching sports or even following it. But at some point it becomes almost perverse to go out of your way to avoid knowing about large segments of social culture.
The thing is, you don't have to be intentionally choosing to remain ignorant about something to not know about it. It depends what it is and where you live.
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#20 of 40 Old 01-19-2010, 03:09 PM
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She can decide how she feels about it when she's old enough to understand. At 7, almost 8, a child isn't going to know enough about team loyalty to do anything but parrot their parents.
This just isn't true at all, and it's disrespectful of children IMO. My children are 4 and 7 and old enough to form their own opinions. They enjoy watching sports and they have their own favorite teams and players that are not the same as my husband, myself, or even each other. Not to mention there's nothing wrong with supporting your parents' alma mater-- I did as a kid and ended up going to that same university and now my sons are fans. It's also about supporting your hometown in many cases (especially for college teams).
I heard the same kind of disrespect for kids and their intellectual capabilities during last year's election. Children are not parrots. They are humans and thinkers. My kids joined the Obama bandwagon before we did-- we all watched the primaries together and they formed their own opinions based on the issues that matter to them.
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#21 of 40 Old 01-19-2010, 04:55 PM
 
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Children are not parrots. They are humans and thinkers.
Ironically, by refusing to make space for a child to form their own views (by doing things like saying they are too young) parents force their kids to be parrots.

If you don't want you child to be a parrot, then you have to let them have their own views. If the parent has already made all the decisions about what the family does, then the kid has to be a parrot. They've got no choice -- it's the only role left.

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#22 of 40 Old 01-20-2010, 02:22 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Velochic, what did you end up doing? I would have been ticked. Your daughter shouldn't have had any pressure put on her.
Well, I talked to dd about what happened. She said that she was upset because she didn't care about football and felt like she was supposed to and had to wear what the other kids were wearing. I supported her in this and told her I'd talk to them about it.

I gently suggested to the principal in an email that on these "spirit" days to support the local team, that it's not a day where you either have to wear a "supporting jersey" or school uniform, but allow the kids who do not support the team to wear street clothes as they do on the other "non-uniform" days. I didn't say anything about the counselor making dd cry. No reply yet.
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#23 of 40 Old 01-20-2010, 02:38 PM - Thread Starter
 
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This just isn't true at all, and it's disrespectful of children IMO. My children are 4 and 7 and old enough to form their own opinions. They enjoy watching sports and they have their own favorite teams and players that are not the same as my husband, myself, or even each other. Not to mention there's nothing wrong with supporting your parents' alma mater-- I did as a kid and ended up going to that same university and now my sons are fans. It's also about supporting your hometown in many cases (especially for college teams).
I heard the same kind of disrespect for kids and their intellectual capabilities during last year's election. Children are not parrots. They are humans and thinkers. My kids joined the Obama bandwagon before we did-- we all watched the primaries together and they formed their own opinions based on the issues that matter to them.
You've actually kind of proven my point. They know about sports because you watch them. Without that input from parents, then how would they even understand "team loyalty"? How would they understand "cheering on a team" or "booing" another? They're learning it from you.

As for the election... dd was in 1st grade for that and I didn't hear her say anything that dh and I had not already stated. I don't think she could have, in any way, shape or form been able to independently come to a conclusion to support John Kerry or Obama on her own because she didn't even understand the issues. And she is a very smart cookie and very aware of politics because that *is* something we're interested in at our house. I think it ridiculous to say that kids don't form these connections through their parents. I think it would be SCARY to say they don't... I'd like to think that at 7, dh and I are STILL dd's biggest influence in life!
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#24 of 40 Old 01-20-2010, 04:53 PM
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You've actually kind of proven my point. They know about sports because you watch them. Without that input from parents, then how would they even understand "team loyalty"? How would they understand "cheering on a team" or "booing" another? They're learning it from you.

As for the election... dd was in 1st grade for that and I didn't hear her say anything that dh and I had not already stated. I don't think she could have, in any way, shape or form been able to independently come to a conclusion to support John Kerry or Obama on her own because she didn't even understand the issues. And she is a very smart cookie and very aware of politics because that *is* something we're interested in at our house. I think it ridiculous to say that kids don't form these connections through their parents. I think it would be SCARY to say they don't... I'd like to think that at 7, dh and I are STILL dd's biggest influence in life!
I heard my kids say lots of things I hadn't stated and the issues that matter to them aren't the same as the ones that matter to me (for instance, my 7yo is very anti-war, which isn't a priority for me). If kids are exposed to things and encouraged to think about them, they will form opinions. My kids have opinions on things I know nothing about. You keep bragging about how you keep your child sheltered from these things as if sports were pornography. Sooner or later, she'll see a basketball game. And she might like it.

And it may be scary, but the truth is that kids' peers have a huge influence on them, as you are finding out. It's not scary to me as I value my children as people separate from myself.
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#25 of 40 Old 01-20-2010, 06:07 PM - Thread Starter
 
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You keep bragging about how you keep your child sheltered from these things as if sports were pornography. Sooner or later, she'll see a basketball game. And she might like it.
I never "bragged" that I keep her sheltered. I said we are not interested in spectator sports and we don't watch or participate in the "rah-rah" stuff. How does that make it "sheltering". She's certainly getting enough exposure (to the point of exclusion) at school. She still doesn't want to watch football. Should I force her to, so she can "fit in"?

How about other cultural exposure? We do watch foreign films and she is exposed to that... for those that don't do that, are they sheltering their children from watching movies with subtitles? How about people who don't raise their children bilingual? Are they sheltering them from foreign influence? What about people who don't take their kids into nature or plant gardens? Are these all things that they are "sheltering" their kids from, or could it just be that they aren't interested in those things? Why are spectator sports any different? Am I depriving her because we also hate car racing but I'm actually a good parent if I try to keep processed food out of her diet (because you know, McDonald's is certainly a CULTURAL ICON!!!)?

I don't really give a rat's ass if she likes sports or not, but I'm not going to FORCE her to support a team she has no clue about, for a sport she has no clue about and shows NO INTEREST in finding out about! I happen to be a former competitive cyclist, high school basketball star, college tennis player, swimmer and diver. I grew up playing competitive sports. I've never enjoyed watching them. I'm not going to sit there and mindlessly watch sports on TV just so dd can get "exposure" or not be "sheltered". She can decide to watch if she wants when she's older has her own TV. ETA: and I'm sure as hell not going to let her watch the TV advertisements that go along with spectator sports on TV. And I'll not waver from that for one second!
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#26 of 40 Old 01-20-2010, 06:56 PM
 
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I just stumbled upon this thread and read with interest. We don't have a TV and I guess some folks here would call my children "culturally ignorant" because they don't know Disney characters, the NY Jets or [fill in the blank].

However, I think as parents it is our decision. Seven years old is still quite young, in my opinion, to be watching professional sports (and the commercial breaks), let alone be forced to support them.

Velochic, I hope your daughter was satisfied with the resolution.
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#27 of 40 Old 01-21-2010, 12:43 AM
 
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I don't exactly view professional sports in the same category as pornography, but almost. I think they are pointless and a huge waste of time and money. I think they have a largely negative societal impact. Pornography at least has a point.

There is no good reason to waste my child's time or my time on junk like that. I have better things to do than cheer on overpaid, steroid enhanced football players pounding the bejeezus out of each other. If it floats your boat, that's fine, and I don't care whether or not somebody else wants to get involved. That is also kind of how I feel about porn, come to think of it.

There are lots of things my kids are going to remain culturally ignorant about for as long as is reasonably possible. We don't immerse ourselves in gang culture, listen to rap music or watch reality shows or cable TV. So far, the kids are doing pretty well, despite the deprivation of not owning football jerseys.

Our elementary school also had days when kids were supposed to wear jerseys supporting their favorite teams, but it was much lower key than the OP. We ignored it, and as far as I can tell, the kids don't need therapy.
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#28 of 40 Old 01-21-2010, 09:29 AM
 
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*disclaimer* As I type this I have one eye on MDC & one eye on the Australian Open (tennis), & I am currently cheering every point Casey Delaqua makes. I'd love to see her get through to the next round. *disclaimer*

That said, I think that what a lot of what velochic is being taken to task over here is really insignificant. I would hope that most kids age 7-8 (or older) are directly influenced by their parent's lifestyle choices, & hopefully the parent's choices are positive ones like velo & her DH have made. I see nothing at all wrong with not watching sport of any kind. Goodness, many people don't watch any TV at all & there is nothing wrong with that! Personal choice people, personal choice, & the day we are not allowed to have personal choice in how we live our daily lives is a victory for totalitarianism. Not the kind of victory I want to see.

In my opinion there is nothing at all 'perverse' about choosing not to watch or participate in a particular cultural activity. What is really perverse & wrong is that others see the non-participant as 'wrong', somehow. That is just so.... &#$^@%. It's a big world, with plenty of room for diversity. Shame on those who want to turn this into a culture war.

Aussiemumhippie.gif (40), DH caffix.gif (39), DD reading.gif (13), & DS 2whistle.gif(11).

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#29 of 40 Old 01-21-2010, 11:08 AM - Thread Starter
 
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In my opinion there is nothing at all 'perverse' about choosing not to watch or participate in a particular cultural activity. What is really perverse & wrong is that others see the non-participant as 'wrong', somehow. That is just so.... &#$^@%. It's a big world, with plenty of room for diversity. Shame on those who want to turn this into a culture war.
Thank you aussiemum, and others.
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#30 of 40 Old 01-21-2010, 12:04 PM
 
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What is really perverse & wrong is that others see the non-participant as 'wrong', somehow.
I don't see non-participation as wrong, I just think it is a choice for a child to make for themselves. I wouldn't *force* my kids to participate, but I would *let* them.

very, very different things.

but everything has pros and cons  shrug.gif

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