would this be asking too much? - Page 4 - Mothering Forums
First ... 2  3  4
Learning at School > would this be asking too much?
mommia's Avatar mommia 03:05 AM 04-03-2010
I just want to state that I have ZERO intentions of accusing, labeling, hinting or saying anything specifically directly or indirectly about this man, I never said that I was going to say that...I would not do that without having a very good reason to. I did not state here or anywhere that I thought that he did something or that I was going to say that I thought he did.

My feelings are not based on any type of judgement of how he looks or does not look, they are based on a gut feeling period. I agree that there are people whose gut reaction is based on a prejudice or other misnotion and that is sad, but that is not the type of person that I am. This is not a feeling that I get often and while I agree that not all gut feelings are correct I do believe in paying attention to mine, they are not something that I get often. I've never regreted listening to my instincts and have never reacted in such a way that caused any harm by doing so. I have however wished that I would have acted on them before such as having a feeling that I should turn off a street and then minutes later after dismissing the feeling and staying on the same street being in a car accident. I am not a rash person who runs off and makes accusations or overreacts. I repeat that I have no intention of making any insinuations about this man in any way shape or form unless something in the future seriously gives me reason to. As far as how I am going to react to this gut feeling remains to be seen I will give it some more time and consideration and pay close attention.

For the record I did not mean the over the top spoiled comment to be about sailing lessons (or any other type of lessons for that matter), that's great if that's something they are able to do for their children. I meant it about other kids doing/having so much that a child living in a million dollar house feels deprived because their friends are able to afford so much more. There is more to life than material things. And yes there is such a thing as too much...


BTW Joensally that sounds like a great book, I really like that quote that you included in your post above.

meemee's Avatar meemee 03:29 AM 04-03-2010
perhaps the OP is not able to articulate what it is that sends her radars up.

however i will respect her instincts.

i am not sure if i would request your child be in a different class due to this fact. during field trips all classrooms go together. so essentially even if you put your child in a different class then there is a chance there still could be interaction with your child.

i personally would not make a request to the principal. we have had so many requests in our school for different kinds of reasons that the principal no longer takes those kinds of requests.

in our school the only parents allowed to drive or do yard duty or be in any kind of situation alone with kids have to have their background check done. this is a strict school policy.
TiredX2's Avatar TiredX2 03:44 AM 04-03-2010
Some of the comments on this thread have really angered and saddened me.

To read so many negativity into the actions of a father--- volunteering in class, giving his son a birthday party...

OP, I would kindly suggest you at least talk to the man (I don't understand how you *know* he is rude if you have never even talked to him) before you write him off as a human being. If you seriously have never had a "feeling" that was wrong, you are the first person that is true for.
Marsupialmom's Avatar Marsupialmom 05:01 AM 04-03-2010
I think you need to rethink about what and why your instincts are saying this about someone you have never spoke to. How is he rude?

Unfortunately the media teaches to be judgement of men and dads. They are suppose to be uninvolved. When they are involved the are held with "suspicion". Your statement about him being "alone" with the boys says a lot about you and maybe some bias you have against dads. Unconscious thoughts driven by fear more than reality

In this situation, you are better to keep your enemy's closer. Get to know the guy. There maybe more to him. Maybe you will validate your feelings. Or find out you misjudged him.

Your child was not in the Limo, so how do you know he was the only adult?

Is there a mom? Is there another Dad?
zinemama's Avatar zinemama 03:55 PM 04-03-2010
OP, your position is confusing to follow. First you say:

Quote:
Originally Posted by mommia View Post
OMG. I'm so glad you posted that I will be talking to the school! You cannot be too careful and if something happened to any of the kids I would be sich . All very good advice!!! Thanks so much for posting this!!! Hopefully this post will protect not just kids at this school but others of children of parents who are reading this. I'm not overreacting and once the damage has been done as it was with this "storyteller" at your school it cannot be undone, it's too late. THose poor kids and parents... My heart goes out to them.

I will definitely trust my instincts, thank you...
Now you assert:

Quote:
Originally Posted by mommia View Post
I just want to state that I have ZERO intentions of accusing, labeling, hinting or saying anything specifically directly or indirectly about this man, I never said that I was going to say that...I would not do that without having a very good reason to. I did not state here or anywhere that I thought that he did something or that I was going to say that I thought he did.
So what exactly are you going to be talking to the school about?
Drummer's Wife's Avatar Drummer's Wife 04:09 PM 04-03-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by zinemama View Post



So what exactly are you going to be talking to the school about?
"Hi, Principal. Bobby's dad gives me the creeps because he can afford a limo and has plenty of free time to volunteer at the school. Please make sure my child never comes in contact with Bobby, or his dad, because even though I've never spoken a word to him, my gut says they are bad news."


uumomma's Avatar uumomma 05:27 PM 04-03-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drummer's Wife View Post
"Hi, Principal. Bobby's dad gives me the creeps because he can afford a limo and has plenty of free time to volunteer at the school. Please make sure my child never comes in contact with Bobby, or his dad, because even though I've never spoken a word to him, my gut says they are bad news."


mommia's Avatar mommia 07:58 PM 04-03-2010
Argh had a post going and session timed out...

Anyways short and unfortunately not as well written version...

There have been other dads who have volunteered who I felt great about. I know lots of awesome dads....it's not that he is a dad. There are lots of dads I fell fine about, some I feel great about, some I don't have any feeling either way about, and a very few I don't care for and then there's getting a bad feeling. I am not saying that it has to be that he molested someone, or that he will... that would not be the only reason to have a bad feeling about someone for goodness sake. I said I have no intention of going to the school and hinting at that or even mentioning him at all unless there is a real reason to. All I was ever posting about is requesting that he be in a seperate classroom from the other child period.

I appreciate the differant points of view and as a couple of posters kindly suggested I do not certainly want to request seperation of the two kids and then in the future need something more pressing like a bullying situation directly with another child or a mean teacher which certainly would be a day to day concern in that that person would be there all day. I also would not want to be the straw that breaks the camels back and makes it that no one can make requests. Thanks to those posters who raised this issue.

There may be other ways of dealing with this and there is of course a chance that it will not be an issue as the placement may not end up that way anyways. And if they are in the same class I will deal with it as needed. If I have a REAL reason to suspect something I will certainly deal with it, I will not jump to conclusions, and anything that does not agree with our values can certainly be put up as an example of how not to act, just as if someone is rude in line at the store this can be used as an example of how others should be treated politely and with respect. As long as it's just field trips that he's around for, he'll be riding in my car so that's not an issue.


zinemama I understand your confusion and can clear it up what I AM going to talk to the school about is making sure that there ARE checks and balances in the volunteer protocal. THAT IS IT, nothing about this man, no mention of anyone, no accusation, no mention of a bad feeling just as I stated in my post that you referenced. My reaction that you also quoted was a reaction to the original post from another poster about something that happened at her school. I am NOT saying that THIS man did this or would do that . What my reaction was is that her story is a reminder to us all that while it's so nice to believe that everyone has good intentions it is naive to believe that EVERYONE is good. When I get a bad feeling I trust myself because I am not biased or jealous or judging based on appearance or any of the other negative things that anyone insinuated. It's rare that I get this feeling. I do believe that most people are decent.


To be honest at this point I'm a bit burned out on discussing this and need to take a step back and decide for myself how I want to proceed. I really appreciate all of your comments insight & advice and wish you all the best.
Emmeline II's Avatar Emmeline II 02:47 PM 04-04-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by mommia View Post
For the record I did not mean the over the top spoiled comment to be about sailing lessons (or any other type of lessons for that matter), that's great if that's something they are able to do for their children. I meant it about other kids doing/having so much that a child living in a million dollar house feels deprived because their friends are able to afford so much more. There is more to life than material things. And yes there is such a thing as too much...
I think my point was that children at any level of income could possibly feel "deprived" if their friends have something they do not.
4myfinn's Avatar 4myfinn 04:23 PM 04-04-2010
Wow. I'm a little disappointed at how this thread has turned against the OP. I think it's pretty clear that she has no intention of announcing to the school that she believes this man is a pedophile. She doesn't plan on ruining his life. She just doesn't get a good feeling about him and wants her DC to be safe. I don't think there is anything wrong with that. I think you are smart to listen to your instincts, OP.

I, personally, would not ask for him to be put in a different class. It's not going to ensure that your DC never has contact with this man and may give you a false sense of security. If they end up in the same class, I would make a point to volunteer whenever you believe this man will be there. It will give you a chance to get to know him. You will be able to see how he interacts with other students and the teacher and also see what the volunteers are responsible for in that class. In the meantime, make sure you talk to your son about his personal safety, inappropriate touching, etc. In Protecting the Gift, there is a nice little list of what to include when you have these talks with your child. Every child needs this information anyway.

I think you are very smart to honor your feelings. Only you have met him, only you know what it is that makes him icky to you- although it may be subconscious, you know. Just by being aware of how this guy makes you feel is a good first step to protecting your child.
4myfinn's Avatar 4myfinn 04:35 PM 04-04-2010
Oops! OP- I just read your most recent post and that you are done discussing this for now. I didn't mean to drag it back out. Good luck with this. I hope it works out for you!
phathui5's Avatar phathui5 08:32 PM 04-04-2010
Quote:
She has judged him & in her mind accused/convincted him of something that she can't even clarify.
Following your instincts means honoring a feeling that you can't clarify.
VisionaryMom's Avatar VisionaryMom 12:36 AM 04-05-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by mommia View Post
Oh my gosh I'm so sorry to hear that Linda. No of course no one should have made sure you weren't in their class... but your Dad most likely wasn't volunteering and driving children from your class, renting limos and going alone with bunches of little boys? That's the differance.
Still reading through, but I wanted to comment. STOP BUYING INTO STEREOTYPES! I really have a problem with the assumption that you can "see" who will be abusive. You can't, and that nice dad who plays checkers with his kids all the time may very well be abusing them at night. You just don't know. I know that makes the world a scarier place, but it's the truth.

My mother was president of the PTO for Pete's sake, and I was abused! The uncle who sexually abused multiple girls in my family was a baseball coach and a "great guy" who would "give anyone the shirt off his back."

I will admit that with my strong history of abuse, I don't have very finely tuned instincts. I'm careful with my children but more with logic than instinct. I just see so many people who say that they always trust their instincts, but really you don't know that you were right. You only know you're right if you *don't* do anything and your child is harmed. If you keep your child away from everyone based on instinct, you don't have any way to judge if you were right. So the whole "instinct" thing is illogical to me.

That aside, I recognize people I've known who fit your description. They're loud and want everyone to know how much they do, what they have, how much they paid for their car, etc. Yes, they drive me bonkers, too, but I don't think those traits make them dangerous - just annoying.
VisionaryMom's Avatar VisionaryMom 01:04 AM 04-05-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by mommia View Post

I agree that there are people whose gut reaction is based on a prejudice or other misnotion and that is sad, but that is not the type of person that I am.
You have made a number of biased comments on this thread. For starters, a dad being alone with his son & friends bothers you. Second, you said that it's far, far more likely for a man to be a pedophile, which is becoming statistically less true.

You have problems with people who may spend lavishly, get their kids' sailing lessons, go to Vegas. Oh, and the comment that your kids' parties are "more creativity than money dropped" as if people who make good money and people who are creative are mutually exclusive. And then the classic "wealthy or pretending to be." Yeah, I'd say you have *major* biases that you're not aware of or able to admit to having.

We all have biases. To state definitively that you have none suggests to me that perhaps you aren't really in tune with your true feelings.
Linda on the move's Avatar Linda on the move 01:50 AM 04-05-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by VisionaryMom View Post
For starters, a dad being alone with his son & friends bothers you.
This is a really an odd one to me. I don't have a son, but I would hope that if I did, my DH would do guy stuff with him and his friends, like I sometimes do nails with my DDs and their friends.

Is it really so unusually for a father to do things with his son and his friends?
sapphire_chan's Avatar sapphire_chan 02:26 AM 04-05-2010
Really, though, it doesn't matter if there's a reason to have bad feelings about the guy that will convince everyone reading this thread. They'll both be volunteering at the school in their respective kids' classrooms and she doesn't care for this guy and that's a good enough reason to ask to have the kids in different rooms.
velochic's Avatar velochic 08:31 AM 04-05-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapphire_chan View Post
Really, though, it doesn't matter if there's a reason to have bad feelings about the guy that will convince everyone reading this thread. They'll both be volunteering at the school in their respective kids' classrooms and she doesn't care for this guy and that's a good enough reason to ask to have the kids in different rooms.
I see it differently. Over the course of 12+ years, a parent is going to come into contact with many other parents that rub them the wrong way for some reason or another. This will not be the last time this happens. I think that talking to the school about the boys being in different classes because the OP doesn't like the other boy's father can be potentially VERY damaging to the father. They boys themselves are obviously not at odds. The OP has never even *talked* to the other father. She is judging from a distance based on some flimsy evidence, and only that the guy seems off to her.

When she walks into that office to ask that her son not be in the boy's classroom, if the administrators are worth anything, they'll want to know why. What is the OP going to say? The boys get along... there isn't a bully issue. Is she going to lie about it? Or tell the truth? Either way, it's a really bad situation. The administrators are going to have to document a reason for the request.

The original question is "is that asking too much?". The answer is, "Yes, it is." And there have been many great reasons WHY it is asking too much.
sapphire_chan's Avatar sapphire_chan 11:19 AM 04-05-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by velochic View Post
When she walks into that office to ask that her son not be in the boy's classroom, if the administrators are worth anything, they'll want to know why. What is the OP going to say?
"Timmy's father's personality is annoying to me because of my own issues. Since these early years mean a lot of volunteer time in the classroom, I was hoping you'd consider having our kids in separate rooms to make it more comfortable for both of us to contribute as much time as we'd like. Thanks!"

Yeah, the school will but they'll probably also : and see it as no huge deal to assign the kids different classes. It all depends on how many requests like that they have to deal with.

And yes, they'll probably still come into contact on group fieldtrips and I hope the OP will take the time to consider the guy as though she had never heard anything about him and honestly consider whether it would truly be a problem to work with him in a volunteer capacity, but that can happen when she's not feeling anxious.
arihillfarm's Avatar arihillfarm 03:51 PM 04-09-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drummer's Wife View Post
I guess I just can't imagine judging someone else basically based on a freakin' limo filled with kindergarten kids. I don't get it.
Well, were they all properly restrained, in booster seats or harnessed for those under 65-70 lbs? I am being facetious of course, but if we're all looking for _something_ to judge SuperDad on, I guess that could be it. :-)

-Astrid
First ... 2  3  4

Up