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Old 03-29-2010, 12:29 PM - Thread Starter
 
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There is a dad who makes me very uncomfortable at ds's school, is in a differant class this year luckily. He rented a stretch hummer limo for his kindergarteners birthday to pick all the boys in his class up after school, is rude and very involved (driving for field trips etc). I really don't want my son in his childs class...Is it to much to ask of the school, what would you do and if not any suggestions for wording this probably unusual request.

Thanks for any input
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Old 03-29-2010, 01:01 PM
 
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I guess it would depend on why he made you feel uncomfortable. In what way is he rude? I think the fact that he's very involved is generally thought to be a good thing, and I see no harm in the hummer thing if that's what his son and his friends wanted to do.

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Old 03-29-2010, 01:39 PM
 
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On the surface, yes, I would think this is too much to ask. It doesn't seem that he's causing you any personal harm.
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Old 03-29-2010, 02:04 PM - Thread Starter
 
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On the surface yes this would seem to be a good thing that he's involved but if you were around him you would understand... Not always a good thing and sometimes parents can be involved for the wrong reasons kwim? And come on a stretch hummer for a kindergarteners birthday? What does he plan to do for the kids 16th? Fly him to Vegas? To us that's too much too soon and a bad influence. It's more than that. There will always be crummy people who think they are big shots out there and he is, however ordinairily you can choose not to have your child have play dates etc with them and not be influenced by those parents...but because he's involved at school it's automatic that the kids are around him. I'm aware that at public school kids are around the full spectrum, the neglected, the overindulged, the kids from families who really care and are decent, the kids from families who could care less....

He simply makes the hair on the back of my neck stand up and when I don't follow my instincts I always regret it.... I think I just answered my own question. If something were to happen I would never forgive myself for not listening to my gut.

If anyone has had any experience with this and how you went about it that would be very helpful.
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Old 03-29-2010, 02:06 PM
 
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I guess it's also a little difficult for me to see how you would justify your request to the school.

Here's an idea: write a letter in your next post, the same one you would write to the administration. Lay it out to us the way you would to them so we can see how it sounds.
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Old 03-29-2010, 02:18 PM
 
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It's fairly common to ask for two children to be separated if there are serious issues like bullying. I don't think I've ever heard of separation of a student and the parent of another student. You would have a much harder time explaining your concerns to the administration. They are unlikely to separate students because one family doesn't like or doesn't approve of another - which is what it seems like from the information you've given. Maybe it's more serious than that, though - I don't want to minimize your concerns. What is "rude"? I suppose if the father exhibits bullying behaviour, not just poor manners, you could make a case to the principal.

How serious is the father's behaviour - does it amount to bullying? How often is he in the classroom? If it's a problem, then the teachers and principal should already be limiting his involvement in the classroom.

If your child's teacher is sympathetic, you could talk to him/her and ask for a recommendation to place your child in a different class next year. Organizing student placement is a headache though, because there are always special requests and special circumstances. The school is trying to balance classes - girls/boys, high achievers/slow learners, special needs, split grades....Personality conflicts will be considered, but usually only severe cases. If you don't give a good reason, they may not try to grant your request.

ETA: Cross-posted with you, but I'm still not sure what you are worried about. Perhaps you could clarify what is making your hair stand on end? Over-indulgence isn't great to be around, but I think the school might just suggest you talk to your own child about it, rather than trying to avoid the situation.
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Old 03-29-2010, 02:38 PM
 
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How many classes are in the next grade? What are the chances they'll be together anyway? And if he is very involved, will he be around your child anyway, for say... grade-wide field trips, etc? I'm just curious if having them in separate classes will really accomplish your goal anyway. As far as the hummer thing, unfortunately there will always be kids having/getting more "stuff" than other kids. It's just life. Some people may not be able to afford it, may not place value on it, or have a million reasons for not having as much - just like people who have more have a million reasons for that. It's just a lesson we all have to learn, starting in Kindergarten when Johnny gets a super awesome cool birthday party that all the kids are jealous of. And at least he over indulged in a way that gave a special opportunity to all of his kid's friends, and not just to his kid. He very well may be a creep, but I'm just not sure the school is going to care.

I like the PP's idea of writing your letter out here. At least that way you could get some feedback on it before you approach the school with your request.

Kat, wife to and mommy to (Dec 07).
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Old 03-29-2010, 03:26 PM
 
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I get where you are coming from and why you would want your child to avoid the influence of the family. I also believe in trusting instincts. I think if you make a request you can keep it vague: "From what I've observed, DS and 'Bobby' would probably do best if placed separately in first grade." Leave it at that and the school will probably honor your request without following up .. they get bombarded by requests, I'm sure. Good luck.
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Old 03-29-2010, 04:04 PM
 
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I know a woman, who did not like another parent at her daughters headstart program. Instead of keeping her mouth shut and putting on a fake smile she would make snide remarks within ear shot of the other parent. Eventualy things escalated to a yelling match that included some poor words to be said in front of a class of preschool children. The other parent pulled her child out of the school, and the woman I know was forced to write letters to each and every parent apologizing for her behavior as well as the staff in order to keep her daughter in the program.

If they are for some reason put in the same class next year just have as little contact as possible with the other parent. It's better to teach the kids now that there are always going to be people you don't like for 1 reason or another but mutual respect is always the best response. I seriously doubt your son will be alone with this man even while he is volunteering and if there is a chance I would make it a point to volunteer that day.

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Old 03-29-2010, 04:43 PM - Thread Starter
 
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5 or 6 classes, so hopefully won't be an issue but will be small classes for next year so if in same class there's more reason to be concerned. As far as what it is it's hard to explain but I have really good instincts and am a better safe than sorry kind of person.

I'm not planning to write a letter rather I'm thinking of approaching it as a casual conversation.

As far as the haves and have nots and some kids getting better parties than others, having more stuff whatever, it's not a matter of my child or us being jealous of course there will always be people who give their kids too much whether because they are wealthy or pretending to be. There will always be kids who have more and those who have less and we are in the middle of the road. We raise our child to appreciate what he has and even if we could afford it would never go overboard. With all class trips the kids are seperated by class and I always drive anyways. Trying to remember all the questions: ), clicked on the wrong type of response so can't see other posts. I'll have to look into the extent that he's in the classroom, and definitely would volunteer the days he's there if we get stuck with him in the same class.

The guy makes me uncomfortable period. Forget about the limo thing.

I honestly can get along with pretty much anyone and am a very open and nonjudgemental person. I just know that if my hair stands on end it's something I need to listen to. Talking it out kind of made me figure it out for myself.


I can imagine class placement is very tricky and time consuming and certainly appreciate that.
Thanks you guys.
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Old 03-29-2010, 04:49 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I know a woman, who did not like another parent at her daughters headstart program. Instead of keeping her mouth shut and putting on a fake smile she would make snide remarks within ear shot of the other parent. Eventualy things escalated to a yelling match that included some poor words to be said in front of a class of preschool children. The other parent pulled her child out of the school, and the woman I know was forced to write letters to each and every parent apologizing for her behavior as well as the staff in order to keep her daughter in the program.

If they are for some reason put in the same class next year just have as little contact as possible with the other parent. It's better to teach the kids now that there are always going to be people you don't like for 1 reason or another but mutual respect is always the best response. I seriously doubt your son will be alone with this man even while he is volunteering and if there is a chance I would make it a point to volunteer that day.

Oh my goodness, I would never act like that, there's never been any negative words exchanged in any way. It's not a personality conflict, it's just a gut feeling. It's not about me, it's about my child. I teach him every day how to get along with others and resolve differances, I'm a very calm cool and collected person and take him with on purpose when I need to do something where I need to stand my ground in a polite respectful way such as a return at a store for example. I totally agree if it were that I simply didn't care for the other parent of course I would just minimize contact and be polite when needed to be around them.
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Old 03-29-2010, 04:53 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I get where you are coming from and why you would want your child to avoid the influence of the family. I also believe in trusting instincts. I think if you make a request you can keep it vague: "From what I've observed, DS and 'Bobby' would probably do best if placed separately in first grade." Leave it at that and the school will probably honor your request without following up .. they get bombarded by requests, I'm sure. Good luck.
Thanks! That's kinds of the lines I was thinking. Maybe it would be best to put it in the terms you suggested, about the two kids... Theres nothing worse than not following your instincts and then regretting it because of something that happens as a result kwim. I bet they do get tons of requests and I' m sure it's tricky to balance everything.
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Old 03-29-2010, 04:57 PM
 
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Thanks! That's kinds of the lines I was thinking. Maybe it would be best to put it in the terms you suggested, about the two kids... Theres nothing worse than not following your instincts and then regretting it because of something that happens as a result kwim. I bet they do get tons of requests and I' m sure it's tricky to balance everything.
I hope I didn't come off harsh or rude. I truly didn't mean to. I think if he really gives you the heebie jeebies, the best you can do is cross your fingers they're in different classes, and if that doesn't work out volunteer as much or more than him whenever you can so you're always there when he is.

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Old 03-29-2010, 05:04 PM - Thread Starter
 
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How many classes are in the next grade? What are the chances they'll be together anyway? And if he is very involved, will he be around your child anyway, for say... grade-wide field trips, etc? I'm just curious if having them in separate classes will really accomplish your goal anyway. As far as the hummer thing, unfortunately there will always be kids having/getting more "stuff" than other kids. It's just life. Some people may not be able to afford it, may not place value on it, or have a million reasons for not having as much - just like people who have more have a million reasons for that. It's just a lesson we all have to learn, starting in Kindergarten when Johnny gets a super awesome cool birthday party that all the kids are jealous of. And at least he over indulged in a way that gave a special opportunity to all of his kid's friends, and not just to his kid. He very well may be a creep, but I'm just not sure the school is going to care.

I like the PP's idea of writing your letter out here. At least that way you could get some feedback on it before you approach the school with your request.
LOL oh I know about the super awesome birthday parties, he's been to one that had to have cost several hundred for the party alone and included the whole class, boys and girls... and he's also been to home parties where the kids play, eat cake and ice cream and watch the birthday child open presents and the kids have fun just being together. That's not my issue, sorry if it came off that way: ). DS has great parties with more creativity than money dropped and the kids have a blast and ds is happy. It's that this was over the top AND feels like the intentions may not be the best. If it were someone else I would still think it was overdoing it for this age for sure, but it wouldn't make me feel uncomfortable on this level. It's something else. I don't know that I'll write a letter, I think a conversation might be best instead.

Thanks for responding: )
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Old 03-29-2010, 05:09 PM
 
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LOL oh I know about the super awesome birthday parties, he's been to one that had to have cost several hundred for the party alone and included the whole class, boys and girls... and he's also been to home parties where the kids play, eat cake and ice cream and watch the birthday child open presents and the kids have fun just being together. That's not my issue, sorry if it came off that way: ). DS has great parties with more creativity than money dropped and the kids have a blast and ds is happy. It's that this was over the top AND feels like the intentions may not be the best. If it were someone else I would still think it was overdoing it for this age for sure, but it wouldn't make me feel uncomfortable on this level. It's something else. I don't know that I'll write a letter, I think a conversation might be best instead.

Thanks for responding: )
To the bolded: I think that is the key. As soon as you said that I did get a vision of a man alone in a limo with a bunch of 5 year old boys. Maybe that wasn't the case though? But I can see how that would put the boys in a vulnerable situation.

Kat, wife to and mommy to (Dec 07).
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Old 03-29-2010, 05:11 PM
 
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If he makes you uncomfortable in a "he might do something to harm a child" sort of way, I'm wondering if you shouldn't be more proactive about the whole situation. Sure, you could maybe get your child away from him, but where does that leave the other children? Maybe you could suggest a better way of screening and training volunteers in general in hopes of preventing anything happening to any child? Maybe suggest a policy to require background checks, some sort of observation requirement and some sort of feedback system for all volunteers?
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Old 03-29-2010, 05:45 PM
 
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It's one thing to request that your child not be in his car for a field trip, it's another to request that you child not be in the same room as his child.

The school really and truly cannot separate all the kids of all the parents who don't like each other. Sadly, a lot of the parents don't like each other. (My kids are in middle school and some parents are annoyed at other parents about things that happened in K).

RSVP "no" to the birthday party (if your child is invited). No matter what class your child is in, if you knew all the parents, you wouldn't like some of them.

but everything has pros and cons  shrug.gif

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Old 03-29-2010, 06:18 PM
 
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My mom was an elementary principal for years, and these types of requests are VERY common! Don't mention the dad, just simply submit a brief request in writing asking that your child and the other child not be placed in the same class together. That's all you need to do. If a parent goes to the trouble to make such a request the school will generally assume there's a good reason and try to honor it. No one in the school wants two kids who are mortal enemies in the same class causing a ruckus all year when it can easily be avoided by such a request, and it will probably be assumed that's the case here. I've never seen a school where this type of thing would even garner a blip on the radar.
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Old 03-29-2010, 06:34 PM
 
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My mom was an elementary principal for years, and these types of requests are VERY common! Don't mention the dad, just simply submit a brief request in writing asking that your child and the other child not be placed in the same class together. That's all you need to do. If a parent goes to the trouble to make such a request the school will generally assume there's a good reason and try to honor it. No one in the school wants two kids who are mortal enemies in the same class causing a ruckus all year when it can easily be avoided by such a request, and it will probably be assumed that's the case here. I've never seen a school where this type of thing would even garner a blip on the radar.
I wish your mom was our principal! Almost every school my dc have attended has sent home a note in the spring, asking that parents refrain from making placement requests and noting that such requests will only be granted in extreme circumstances.

It doesn't stop parents from trying every year. I just know a lot of parents who have been left unsatisfied because they didn't get what they wanted for their kids.

And definitely, a vague request like "I don't approve of that parent" wouldn't be enough.

Think about it - if that dad said he didn't want his son in the same class as the OP's son because they DON'T have lavish birthday celebrations - I doubt anyone would expect that the request would be granted.
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Old 03-29-2010, 06:36 PM
 
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I would examine very closely what it is that bothers me; sometimes our gut tells us before we're able to organize our thoughts, but it often all comes together at some point.

Anyhow, I'd consider a letter requesting separate class placement in the general terms PPs have outlined. Would STRONGLY encourage the suggestion re volunteer screening. Also, can you submit a letter about who drives your child on field trips? I.e. limit it to you, a staff member, maybe a friend or two? Or maybe specifying that this particular parent not drive your child?

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Old 03-29-2010, 08:14 PM
 
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My nephew lives with his grandmother to attend a prep school (the type of school where diplomats and such from NYC board their children and sailing is an after school activity). This grandmother has a $1.5 million home overlooking the beach...and she still has to explain to my nephew that they don't have the resources to do what a lot of his friends can do .

I don't think you would get anywhere talking to the school about separating the boys into different classes, but if he is rude and hostile to students or other parents you could bring that up to the teacher.

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Old 03-29-2010, 08:33 PM
 
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It's not about me, it's about my child. I teach him every day how to get along with others and resolve differances,
I disagree. It is YOUR issue that you're projecting onto your child & making it an issue for him. You may be teaching your son how to get along with others & resolve differences BUT you're not acting in the same manner as you're trying to teach him.

Is your gut instinct that he's not a safe person for your son to be around, or is it that he's someone you just wouldn't normally associate with?

IMO it makes a difference in whether I'd say anything about placement or not. I haven't seen you write anything about the father that would, imo, justify asking for the kids to be separated. Even if the dad is an arrogant jerk you could be keeping your child away from someone who could be a good friend. If there were specific instances between the CHILDREN then I'd ask for special placement, but this is between the adults.
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Old 03-29-2010, 09:44 PM
 
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I wish your mom was our principal! Almost every school my dc have attended has sent home a note in the spring, asking that parents refrain from making placement requests and noting that such requests will only be granted in extreme circumstances.
Ah.... you just have to know how to work the system. I've gotten great placements for ds by describing the qualities of the teacher that he would do best with. "Ds would do best in a quiet, structured classroom, with a teacher who will challenge him, even though he is quiet." If you're specific enough, you can describe the one or two teachers who would fit your child best. That's not making a teacher request, it's describing how our children learn and who would be a good fit for them.

For kids, I agree that being vague as to "Ds and so-and-so might do better in different classrooms." will work best. I'm going to do that for dd. We have a neighbor girl who is fine, but I know that if she and dd are in the same class, I'm going to hear about conflicts all year.

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Old 03-29-2010, 10:06 PM
 
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Ah.... you just have to know how to work the system. I've gotten great placements for ds by describing the qualities of the teacher that he would do best with. "Ds would do best in a quiet, structured classroom, with a teacher who will challenge him, even though he is quiet." If you're specific enough, you can describe the one or two teachers who would fit your child best. That's not making a teacher request, it's describing how our children learn and who would be a good fit for them.
I did that when dd1 was in grade 5, to avoid a particular grade 6 teacher. And she got the lousy awful teacher. I was in there at least once a week complaining, as every issue I knew would happen, did. I think the principal was VERY sorry he didn't honour my request.
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Old 03-29-2010, 11:23 PM
 
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My thoughts may be different than the other posters so take them as you wish. While the boys may or may not be in the same classroom what happens at lunch, recess, assembly time? Before school and after school? What happens in 2nd grade etc... Really you are going to put a heck of alot of energy into avoiding this one kid and his parent. Surely there is going to be a class field trip, what if the kids are in the same work group for something on the trip? Parents volunteer at the school, sometimes they can be sent to another classroom to help out. Have you ever thought of that?

What happens when it comes time to sign up for little league? What if your ds wants to join a school club? Will everything be based on what this ONE KID does? That hardly sounds fair.

I honestly don't think you are being realistic. Let the classroom assignments happens as they may and then see what happens. If your ds gets invited to a bday party there is nothing that says he needs to go. There is nothing that says your ds and this child have to be best friends but there is no way you can spend the next X# of years avoiding the child and his family.

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Old 03-29-2010, 11:25 PM
 
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I did that when dd1 was in grade 5, to avoid a particular grade 6 teacher. And she got the lousy awful teacher. I was in there at least once a week complaining, as every issue I knew would happen, did. I think the principal was VERY sorry he didn't honour my request.
SS that happened to your DD for one grade. That is different, seem my 'opinion' above. hugs to you and your dd.

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Old 03-29-2010, 11:50 PM
 
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Is your gut instinct that he's not a safe person for your son to be around, or is it that he's someone you just wouldn't normally associate with?
Even if a parent of a child in your class isn't a safe person, how does that effect your kid?

I don't get it, and the more I think about it, the more off it seems to me.

I was abused and neglected as a child. My father is not a safe person. Should other parents have asked to make sure I wasn't in their child's class?

but everything has pros and cons  shrug.gif

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Old 03-30-2010, 12:28 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I hope I didn't come off harsh or rude. I truly didn't mean to. I think if he really gives you the heebie jeebies, the best you can do is cross your fingers they're in different classes, and if that doesn't work out volunteer as much or more than him whenever you can so you're always there when he is.
Thanks Kat, you didn't! I really appreciate that though! Actually you made me feel a little better. I just may cross my fingers, and wish on stars;-) and hope that it works out that they're not in the same class. I don't want to come off as asking for too much, especially when I could really need something in the future and I already requested a teacher I really want him to have and don't want to push my luck. I volunteer a lot so that's not a problem, I truly want to be there anyways: ). He honestly does give me the heebie jeebies...
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Old 03-30-2010, 12:32 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Linda on the move View Post
Even if a parent of a child in your class isn't a safe person, how does that effect your kid?

I don't get it, and the more I think about it, the more off it seems to me.

I was abused and neglected as a child. My father is not a safe person. Should other parents have asked to make sure I wasn't in their child's class?
Oh my gosh I'm so sorry to hear that Linda. No of course no one should have made sure you weren't in their class... but your Dad most likely wasn't volunteering and driving children from your class, renting limos and going alone with bunches of little boys? That's the differance.
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Old 03-30-2010, 12:39 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by zebra15 View Post
My thoughts may be different than the other posters so take them as you wish. While the boys may or may not be in the same classroom what happens at lunch, recess, assembly time? Before school and after school? What happens in 2nd grade etc... Really you are going to put a heck of alot of energy into avoiding this one kid and his parent. Surely there is going to be a class field trip, what if the kids are in the same work group for something on the trip? Parents volunteer at the school, sometimes they can be sent to another classroom to help out. Have you ever thought of that?

What happens when it comes time to sign up for little league? What if your ds wants to join a school club? Will everything be based on what this ONE KID does? That hardly sounds fair.

I honestly don't think you are being realistic. Let the classroom assignments happens as they may and then see what happens. If your ds gets invited to a bday party there is nothing that says he needs to go. There is nothing that says your ds and this child have to be best friends but there is no way you can spend the next X# of years avoiding the child and his family.
I'm not trying to avoid the child, it's the dad. And we live in a big city and no where near them so the little league stuff is irrelevant. Of course I would never dream of in a million years letting ds go to one of his parties. To be honest at this school you're with the class your child is in period, I volunteer there all the time. And if the Dad is involved, yes we will avoid it, unless my dh or I are there. Like I said I have to trust my instincts. God gave kids parents for many reasons number one is to keep them safe and if something doesn't feel right we will do what we need to. If I see what happens and what happens is something bad and I swallowed my instincts I could never forgive myself. I appreciate your input, but respectfully disagree.
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