My ds is in 1st grade at the local elementary school. At this week's PTA meeting, I learned of what I think *must* be a new illegal policy concerning bathroom "privledges" for older children. Grades 1-3 have bathrooms in the classroom but the 4th and 5th grade wing has centrally located new hall bathrooms. Well, the restrooms were being trashed (in ways that I found shocking for that age group!!) so the new policy is that each class goes to the restroom as a group ONE time a day. That's right, ONE bathroom break for the entire school day. Children are getting on the bus at 8:30 am and not getting home until close to 4 pm. Now, they are permitted to ask to use the bathroom in the nurses office in "dire emergencies" but, to me, this is NOT a solution (and, some children have been deinied). The principal says there is no $$ in the budget for bathroom matrons on the elementary level and she cannot continue to have children use bathrooms with human waste on the floor and/or close bathrooms until the plumber can come to fix backed up toilets, etc. They did use a system of logging who used the restrooms when, but that did not deter the vandals.
Anyway, I am outraged about this policy and think it must be a violation of student rights. If this policy were in effect at my workplace, it would be outrageous. So I am in search of parent/student advocacy groups that deal with the NY area. I have searched the NYS dept of ed website but there was no info on bathroom accessibility. I think this must be an issue for children with disabilities as well. I'd also love to hear any suggestions anyone might have for how to deal with this. As I said, my son is only in 1st grade, but this is a policy being instituted in his school, with my tax dollars I might add, and I feel the need to work on a solution.
Students, unfortuantely don't have very many rights. And I don't believe going to the bathroom, very unfortunately, isn't a right. Hell, it wasn't a right in the workplace until 1998 (See Nickeled and Dimed ... for a reference to this one of the footnotes)
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One way to address it could be to organize a volunteer parent brigade to supervise the bathrooms during the day, since the district cannot/won't pay for it. It doesn't sound like the prinicipal would be adverse to that and if you as parents can come up with a creative solution, she may be receptive.
I suggested parent volunteer monitors but that is not allowed. For a district always complaining of lack of $$ and adults per student, they tend to be very anit-parent volunteers in our district.
Some of the stuff we have tried to use parent volunteers for at our school were rejected because of insurance/liability issues or because historically parents have overstepped discipline boundaries. Parents monitoring bathrooms skirts the whole sexual abuse/inappropriate contact problem too. At least school employees have had background checks and training.
What an awful problem! Fourth and fifth grade girls may be menstruating too, and not feel comfortable explaining to the teacher why they need to use the toilet in the nurse's office. I would have been mortified! At the very least I think the classes could visit the bathrooms as a group three times a day, once is not enough!
Sadly, though, at our school, the teachers would probably just use group punishments until the kids ratted on each other.
There is no way this could be legal. Talk to people not connected with the school if you have to.
I only hope those poor kids will pee their pants instead of hold it all day and risk bladder infections.
If the school is not allowed to have bathrooms with human waste on the floor, I bet they're not allowed to have classrooms with urine puddles on the chairs from students who couldn't hold it anymore. One break a day is not enough!
For now, you could get a note from your child's ped stating that your dc absolutely has to use the bathroom whenever the need is felt.
Bathroom rules like this are one of the main reasons I'm so against school. It's bad enough that you have to ask, but to be denied...??!!
Thanks, everyone. This policy actually doesn't affect my child as he is only in first grade and grades 1-3 have in-room bathrooms. The principal also suggested that parents who are concerned get ped notes but the point is that the policy itself is just so wrong, even if "exceptions" are made for children fortunate enough to have parents who can get them doctor notes. (sory about the run on sentence there) <sigh> I'm going to talk to some friends who are lawyers that work on behalf of the disabled and see if I can get anywhere that way. I will also be sending a letter to the superintendent.
The parent volunteers don't go IN the bathroom though. The students line up in the hall and the parent stands outside and sends in 3 or 4 at a time. This process happens after lunch but I'm sure you could get your teacher or principal to agree to some sort of compromise. Parents could come in 1 hour shifts.
Speaking directly to the molestation issue, our school recently began requiring background checks of all volunteers. After your background check you are assigned a number depending upon your level of security. Talk to the school board. They probably meet once a month and generally they have an open forum for parents to address issues.
the point is that the policy itself is just so wrong,
Yes, exactly. It's the ultimate in humilitation to have to plead for permission to answer nature's call.
It doesn't sound like your principal is very open-minded. What about going over her head and taking this problem straight to the superintendent? Try calling his or her office. If that doesn't get you anywhere, attend your next school board meeting and address them with this problem. In my experience, school board meetings have a public comment period at the beginning of the meeting, although you may need to sign up to speak when you arrive.
You say that you first heard about this policy at a PTA meeting. What was the other parents' reaction?
Back when I was in eighth grade, the principal decided we girls were too vain and spent too much time grooming during bathroom breaks. (It was a Catholic school
: ). So a rule was enacted that no girls were allowed to take their purses to the bathroom. Naturally, panic ensued, since most of us were menstruating at age 13 and we needed our purses. Luckily, some concerned mothers spoke up for us and the rule was quietly dropped.
I'm not surpised. I live in NY and have many problems with the schools in general.
We had this problem with the bathrooms in a school in which I worked (not in NYS). When students wanted to go to the bathroom, they signed in and out of the classroom. I was led to believe it was effective. There was one more incident, but the student was tracked down.
I skimmed the other responses, so I don't know if this was suggested, but... If the school does not change its policy, I wonder if a ton of parents getting a doctor's note that their child needs to go to the bathroom more often than once a day would help. Does that sound extreme? The new bathroom policy is obviously reactionary and unhealthy. The administrators didn't think it through.
Originally posted by daylily You say that you first heard about this policy at a PTA meeting. What was the other parents' reaction?
The issue was brought up by one of the concerned parents, who is on the PTA board and is a friend of mine (her youngest and my oldest went to kindy together and we were co-class parents). Anyway, she brought it up during the open forum and the principal really tried to hush her up. She (the principal) said that this seemed to be an individual teacher problem (teacher not responding to child asking for "emergency" nurse visit) and that they should discuss it in private. I piped up that a PTA meeting seemed the perfect place to discuss it because between teachers, admin and parents, prehaps we could come up with a better solution. The principal also made comments about how we didn't want to discuss the icky things the kids were doing to the facilities in front of other little kids (three parents had brought their children) and really just silenced this issue. I think that, more than anything, really got my goat. This is a new policy, that parents were never officially informed about, and it needs to be discussed! These are basic human rights and it affects the physical well-being of our community's children! Grrr. I am very aggrevated and will make it my mission to have something done about this!! I'm like a dog with a bone at this point. lol
It is definitely illegal for children to be prevented from using the bathroom at will in residential treatment facilities. The only exception is if the child is being restrained because their behavior constitutes an imminent threat to self or others.
I believe it is also illegal for schools to restrict bathroom access. If it's not directly in violation of the law in your state, it's easily construed to be a violation of students' right to a (physically and emotionally) safe learning environment, which is protected by federal law.
Besides, it's extremely counter-productive. Children denied access to a bathroom for 6 hours *will* find other places to go, leading to a serious schoolwide health and safety problem.
Have you tried writing to the principal and the school board?
The only exception is if the child is being restrained because their behavior constitutes an imminent threat to self or others.
I used to work in such a facility (mainly for adults, though) and the rule was that a restrained patient had to be offered the bathroom every 15 minutes.
My first job was as a motel maid in one of the sleaziest motels in town. Cleaning up feces in the shower and urine on the TV set was just part of the job. No one made a big fuss about it; we just got the rubber gloves and did our jobs. I would think a school janitor could do the same thing with the bathrooms there, until whoever is trashing them grows out of it. Things like this usually don't last too long.
I am 28 yo. When I was in grade schol _K-*) we had to go as a group-but it was 2x a day, otherwise we were told a Doctors note stating a bladder problem was necessary!!!!!!!!!! In grade 1 I peed myself-from then on I learned to HOLD IT. IF this was the rule in D's school-andshe is a frequent pee-er-unlike my Mom- I would be in their face.
I guess a lot of people believe that going only once a day is normal. I've never been that kind of person; even when I was getting 2 15-minute breaks and a half-hour lunch in an 8-hour workday, I still had to use the bathroom during times other than the breaks, and it wasn't because of a medical problem, I just needed to go.
If someone did get a bladder infection because of this rule, then they might need to go even more often than before. Infections might also mean time lost from school, which I'm sure would hurt the district somehow. Doctor visits mean parental work time lost, so everyone loses.
I think this would be a good place for one of my mass protest ideas. All kids above grade 3 should just pee themselves in class whenever they need to go. I predict that after a week of this, the school will get rid of its bathroom rule. And if everyone did it, no one would be embarrassed!
Originally posted by Greaseball If someone did get a bladder infection because of this rule, then they might need to go even more often than before. Infections might also mean time lost from school, which I'm sure would hurt the district somehow. Doctor visits mean parental work time lost, so everyone loses.
Just a side note - my first year teaching I had several bladder infections which I blame squarely on not being able to go to the bathroom when I needed to.
this is not right for the children or teachers. As someone who dealt with not even being allowed to after dr permission and now have a pacemaker acting as my bladder
there is a reason for 6-8 wet diapers when we start out. Contact the interstitial cystitis foundation. They have some very good stuff on why it isn't good to hold it in and potential problems.
That might help your cause since mainstream hard core like 'experts'
Perhaps dirty pool but hey
ok that was my piece of activism for the day.
Unfortunately, no. I've sent a couple of letters (superintendent, school board) but haven't received any responses. I'll be in the school a lot next week for our Book Fair, so I'm going to be talking about the topic to every parent within earshot. I think many parents *don't* know. The parents of children affected by the policy were not formally informed, so I am sure the parents of children who will be effected next year don't know anything about it. My plan is to get as many parents involved as possible. Perhaps they can all get doctor's notes saying their child is to report to the nurse's office every hour, on the hour, to relieve themselves. Maybe 15-20 showing up there will give the school a head's up. In the mean time, I am still researching the state board of ed and disability regulations. There is little to no mention of this kind of thing, but I do remember my own high school closing early one day because of a water problem---they could not legally stay open with only one functioning bathroom or something so I know there must be regulations somewhere about toilet access.
maybe the ICA and the kidney foundation will also have information that will help
If I can do anything let me know. I know I don't live there or anything but if you think of anything
voice of btdt now longtime sufferer letter if it would help..
and this: Child Advocacy.org which is an excellent article about how restricting toilet use is a common form of child abuse. There are additional links to explore on this site too.
Maybe you have already found this, but maybe not, I didn't want you to miss these links.
It is nice to know there is a group out there protecting our public restroom rights and another protecting the restroom rights of our children. These might be good resources to contact.
In a human sexuality class we talked about sexual fetishes involving urine and feces. We studied several case histories of such people, and guess what was common for all of them?
(Of course, with these people it happened at home as well as in ps.)
My own mother used to have to pay 50 cents to use the bathroom at home. Her father thought it was "getting in the way of her chores."
Hey Greaseball, I posted that link 6 minutes before you! I agree though, good article.
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