Raise your hand if you think "kids these days" are nicer than they used to be - Mothering Forums
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
#1 of 55 Old 09-15-2011, 04:33 PM - Thread Starter
 
OliveJewel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 550
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I hope I am not being naive, but it seems to me that the children in my son's school seem much more caring and supportive of each other than what I expected from a public school.  And I get the feeling that most children these days *want* to help each other and care for each other.  I have read some stories and known people whose children experienced bullying, but for the most part the kids that were bullied were able to understand that people who bully are people who have experienced a lot of negativity in their life and that the majority of people are not bullies.

 

Do you feel like the world is actually becoming a nicer place through our next generations' attitudes toward one another?  

OliveJewel is offline  
#2 of 55 Old 09-15-2011, 08:34 PM
 
Linda on the move's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: basking in the sunshine
Posts: 10,545
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)

I do.

 

I also think that schools are more likely to approach problem behavior in a more positive way. I think that kids are more accepting of special education students than they were back when I was in school. I also see a lot of kids who are concerned about the environment and want to do something about it.

 

I think the world is getting better!

MJB likes this.

but everything has pros and cons  shrug.gif

Linda on the move is online now  
#3 of 55 Old 09-15-2011, 08:52 PM
 
whatsnextmom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,928
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)

Not really. I think different people have different experiences. Some is just the luck of being in a sweet class as opposed to an aggressive class. My DD has experienced very little negativity from peers. My DS has experienced too much.  I wouldn't say that kids are better or worse towards each other though I would say that behavior in the classroom has gotten much worse than I remember it as a child.

 

Having a child that's been bullied, I will say that the new "poor bully" mentality drives me up the wall. I'm all for compassion but it often goes too far resulting in more compassion for the bully than for the victim. Nothing worse that sitting in a meeting and spending the whole time talking about the "poor bully" and how lucky your child is because their parents aren't getting a divorce or whatever. Yeah, so lucky to get tortured at school. You try and try to be compassionate but eventually hit that point as a parent when you could care less how bad another kid has it... you just want them to keep their hands off your baby whose crying to sleep every night. Sorry, touchy subject obviously.

Youngfrankenstein likes this.

Married mom of two, DD 17 and DS 13.
whatsnextmom is online now  
#4 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 01:01 AM
 
rubidoux's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,731
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

whatsnextmom,  I think I would feel the same.  My son has not been bullied, but there have certainly been times when other kids have treated him badly and hurt his feelings and *I*can't*stand*it*!  When I see it, I feel kicked in the stomach and, though I know I should be adult about it and all, I have a very hard time being compassionate toward the kid who's making my kid feel bad.  And in my former life I was a criminal defense attorney and felt (very strongly, in fact!) that there was good in all people and that the people don't do bad things unless bad things have happened to them.  I still do believe all that, but now I'm also a mama bear.  

 

Anyhow...  as for the OP...  I will have to watch for this.  I actually haven't witnessed or even heard any first hand accounts of the kind of bullying I saw as a child.  I moved around a lot and I think at every school I went to there were one or two kids who just got treated terribly.  Milo goes to a small montessori where they'd never allow anything like that to happen, but I have friends who's kids go to all sorts of schools or don't go to school and I haven't heard of any such stories.  OTOH, I definitely think there're plenty of kids with *issues* and it's hard for me to believe that things could really be changing much in that regard.  I guess I kind of think that it's part of the human condition.  It would be great if it wasn't and there was some sort of progression towards people really treating each other well.


Jayne, sewing up a storm mama to ds1 9/03, ds2 2/09, and 2 sweet furbabies.

rubidoux is offline  
#5 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 06:29 AM
 
Imakcerka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 4,065
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
The bullying we experienced was all part of growing up. I haven't seen the poor bully mentality, though they do teach the kids why some people bully. I think understanding it is a very good thing. The class environment depends greatly on the Teachers willingness to turn an eye or do something about it. And so far, when anything has come up it's taken care of immediately. DD was getting bullied by a boy in class.
Imakcerka is offline  
#6 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 06:51 AM
 
purslaine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 6,937
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)


Quote:
Originally Posted by OliveJewel View Post

  I have read some stories and known people whose children experienced bullying, but for the most part the kids that were bullied were able to understand that people who bully are people who have experienced a lot of negativity in their life and that the majority of people are not bullies.

 

Do you feel like the world is actually becoming a nicer place through our next generations' attitudes toward one another?  

 

I don't think a bullied kid cares or even should care that a bully has a lot of negativity in their life.  I think they primarily feel angry, hurt and degraded - it is really unlikely (and perhaps not healthy) for them to feel sympathy towards their abuser.  Yes, firm  words, but I was bullied and it is a form of abuse.

 

I expect adults to care about the bulliers and try to help them stop the pattern - but I do not put the expectation of sympathy and understanding on the bullied.

 

I do not know if kids are getting nicer or not - but I do have a couple of points:

 

-kids hide bullying and being teased.  It could be a pride thing, fear of how the parents and school will react, etc - but we know they hide it.  I knew I hid bullying from my parents.  When I think kids seem nicer overall, I simply wonder if I am deluding myself.   Maybe it is a self-protective thing adults do?   I do think my kids have it easier than I did - and I am so happy about it!  Heck, 2 of my kids choose to go to school - something I never would have done.  That is somewhat telling of the environment, I guess.  

 

-cyber bullying is a whole new world.  I think the cyber world can be very inclusive  (they all friend anybody) but can get out of hand quickly. They revert to swearing at each quite easily, and flame wars.  Posting inappropriate stuff about other people in a rage.  Stealing other peoples account information and impersonating them (often to get information or for kicks).  I have seen all of the above - though thankfully my daughter was not involved in most of it.  

 

 

 

purslaine is offline  
#7 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 07:33 AM
 
Imakcerka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 4,065
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
I'm not sure I've met one person who has not been bullied.
Imakcerka is offline  
#8 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 07:50 AM
 
NiteNicole's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 4,696
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)

Most kids are nice, but the ones who are mean...just MEAN...are so intense.  There's a lot of casual age-appropriate stuff like making clubs and leaving someone out and I won't be your best friend, but the kids who set out to be mean and get a reaction are so above and beyond ANYTHING I would expect from a kid, kid - it's shocking.  There's this mentality of hounding someone until you have just thoroughly, utterly dominated them that I can not understand.  I don't understand how a kid thinks it's ok to be like that and I don't understand how a parent doesn't pull them out of school and make them stay home till they learn to act human.  It's almost like schools are so on top of things that most kids are developing habits of being inclusive and considerate so in reaction, the odd mean kid has to amp it up.

NiteNicole is offline  
#9 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 07:52 AM
 
purslaine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 6,937
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)


Quote:
Originally Posted by Imakcerka View Post

I'm not sure I've met one person who has not been bullied.


I agree with you (although I think intensity and duration of bullying vary dramatically) but I am a little confused - do you think kids are nicer, meaner or the same as in the past?

purslaine is offline  
#10 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 08:01 AM
 
purslaine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 6,937
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)


Quote:
Originally Posted by NiteNicole View Post

  It's almost like schools are so on top of things that most kids are developing habits of being inclusive and considerate so in reaction, the odd mean kid has to amp it up.



I do think schools do a decent job of trying to promote inclusivity and a acceptable job at promoting consideration. I do not think they do a good job of dealing with bullying, though.  Obviously this is only based on what I have seen. YMMV.  

 

My sons school wasn't on top of things when he was being picked on.

 

Indeed my son and most of his friends would not tell the teacher of issues because:

 

-unless the teacher saw it or there were witnesses or the bully admitted it (ha!)  there was little the teacher could do

 

-both parties got pulled into the office and lectured and asked to see "their part" in the ordeal - when really child a was playing nicely, and child b went out of his way to pick on child a...but they were both in trouble.  Likewise if A hit B, and "B" hit back - both would be in equal amounts of trouble.

 

purslaine is offline  
#11 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 08:06 AM
 
Imakcerka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 4,065
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
I think most kids are nicer. The bullying that goes on in the play grounds is stopped immediately. And most kids are more caring and helpful towards their peers. Now it could just be the school my kids attend, but I've been on the play ground during recess and the bullying is seriously a kinder gentler bullying. Still there but not what I experienced when I was that age.

I think we can attribute that to more attentive parenting. I see parents stepping in and stepping up more than ever. Moms and dads are not letting it continue. The mentality of it will work itself out and it's normal is practically over. Don't we all wish our parents saw what we see now? So far I have a great relationship with the DDs teachers and they let me know what is going on even if the DDs don't. I'm always in their corner and most parents are just as involved. The ability to talk it through with them and help them come to a better understanding is important. I hope they see that we won't allow it to happen to them because it's ugly, and we won't allow them to do it either.
Imakcerka is offline  
#12 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 08:12 AM
 
philomom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Pacific Northwest
Posts: 9,430
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
My kids have always gone to public schools with a low tolerance for bullies. Even a hint of it can get a kid talking to the counselors and parents being called. I love it.

One_Girl likes this.
philomom is offline  
#13 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 09:51 AM
 
Coral123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 88
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I'm not sure that I think kids are nicer.

 

Just because a school has a policy on paper regarding bullying, it doesn't mean there is much effort to try to enforce it.

 

Just as teachers turned a blind eye to theses issues years ago, they still do today.

 

My son had an issue with two different individuals.  One was a girl, who repeatedly was trying to be physically affectionate with him.....then eventually became more aggressive, and choked him.  The other was a kid who would repeatedly touch him, including on the butt.  Both of these individuals were known to be behavior problems....but no one seemed to monitor them.

 

I'm not sure that I would characterize them as bullies....but my eventual fear is that my son was going to react in a way that the school wouldn't consider appropriate.  Even though my son had told the teacher numerous time....but nothing seemed to really happen.

Coral123 is offline  
#14 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 10:03 AM
 
philomom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Pacific Northwest
Posts: 9,430
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coral123 View Post

Even though my son had told the teacher numerous time....but nothing seemed to really happen.

You spoke to the principal, the school counselors... called the parents of the other children? Gave your son some coaching on how to handle them? I find it hard to believe that in this day and age of the anti-bully that this could still go on. The couple of incidents my kids faced were dealt with swiftly and decisively and the incidents were never repeated again by the bully.
philomom is offline  
#15 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 10:08 AM
 
whatsnextmom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,928
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by kathymuggle View Post





I do think schools do a decent job of trying to promote inclusivity and a acceptable job at promoting consideration. I do not think they do a good job of dealing with bullying, though.  Obviously this is only based on what I have seen. YMMV.  

 

My sons school wasn't on top of things when he was being picked on.

 

Indeed my son and most of his friends would not tell the teacher of issues because:

 

-unless the teacher saw it or there were witnesses or the bully admitted it (ha!)  there was little the teacher could do

 

-both parties got pulled into the office and lectured and asked to see "their part" in the ordeal - when really child a was playing nicely, and child b went out of his way to pick on child a...but they were both in trouble.  Likewise if A hit B, and "B" hit back - both would be in equal amounts of trouble.

 


I agree. DS's school did act quickly and got the aggressive bullying to stop (once we realized that the teacher felt too sorry for the bully to really make a difference and went to the principal.) I'm very grateful for that. However, that doesn't turn a negative situation into a positive one for the victim. The victim rarely regains their social standing and the bully usually ends up winning class president (there have been studies on that and it's true... in elementary/middle school, popular boys tend to be the most aggressive.) My DS was pretty much invisible the last two years of elementary and that's pretty hurtful too. Certainly, there is a lot of peace talk on campus but it hasn't really changed kids in my opinion. It just changed their vocabulary. I'm not saying it's worthless but I think it's important that we don't make assume that because the words sound good that all the kids are truly embracing them. 

 

I also agree with the earlier post about cyber-bullying has replaced a lot of school yard bullying. My DD gets stalked by this girl she did one show with 4 years ago (when they were only 10.) We stepped in right away and blocked this girl from any access to DD. They haven't even been in the same room for 3 years and I know this girl moved several hours away. Still. after all this time, this girl continually seeks my DD out. Within a month of any new online presence DD has, this girl pops up to trash her. DD is smart, doesn't respond and blocks her. We're fortunate that it hasn't really effected DD who actually laughs about itl. However, we know other girls who have left schools, changed all their numbers (including family home numbers) because of the constant out of school harrassement.

 

 

 


Married mom of two, DD 17 and DS 13.
whatsnextmom is online now  
#16 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 10:14 AM
 
purslaine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 6,937
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I think MDC is a unique sort of place.  

 

Most parents here practice alternative and/or attachment parenting.  I tend to think that most parents on this forum  (Learning at School) are overall happy with their childs school experience or they would change it.  HS, another school, etc.  In short, I think MDC parents are quite aware of options and many have the means to do something different if their school has bullying issues.

 

I am not sure that is the case in the real world and across socio-economic boundaries.

 

So while it is great that most people here have their kids in schools where the kids are nice - it does not really prove kids are getting nicer (although they may be!) it just proves parents on here have their kids in schools with nice kids.

 

 

 

 

purslaine is offline  
#17 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 10:34 AM
 
Coral123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 88
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)


Quote:
Originally Posted by philomom View Post



You spoke to the principal, the school counselors... called the parents of the other children? Gave your son some coaching on how to handle them? I find it hard to believe that in this day and age of the anti-bully that this could still go on. The couple of incidents my kids faced were dealt with swiftly and decisively and the incidents were never repeated again by the bully.

 

 

I didn't speak to the counselor, no, because he seems like he is afraid to act on anything.  My son was told by the "curriculum" that he should tell the teacher, and he did.  The problem is though, that whoever is monitoring the playground isn't really trying very hard to monitor the kids they know that are behavior problems.

 

You can believe whatever you want.  These issues are past....but I could go to the school's playground right now, and probably get video footage of adults huddled together ignoring problematic behaviors.

 

The irony is that my kid tried to handle things as he was told he should.  I'm sure my kid would have been in a heck of a lot of trouble if he would have physically put a stop to butt toucher.  

 

 

Coral123 is offline  
#18 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 10:43 AM
 
ollyoxenfree's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,933
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)


Quote:
Originally Posted by OliveJewel View Post

 

Do you feel like the world is actually becoming a nicer place through our next generations' attitudes toward one another?  


I hope so. 

 

But I don't think I believe it as a general truth. To be true, I think people have to become nicer, not just children. People are not nicer. If they were, we wouldn't have the political, social, and environmental problems that exist today, which are no better (and sometimes worse) than in earlier eras. 

 

I think there is greater awareness and more understanding generally. I think people have higher expectations of good behaviour and that has made a difference. There are more resources and alternatives, so when problems arise there are often better solutions than when I was at school. Certainly, I don't witness the kind of outright physical abuse, racial intolerance, and gender bias that I experienced when I was in school. My kids and their friends are pretty quick to jump on any signs of racism, sexism, classism, ageism etc. So perhaps I should be even more hopeful. 


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by kathymuggle View Post

I think MDC is a unique sort of place.  

 

Most parents here practice alternative and/or attachment parenting.  I tend to think that most parents on this forum  (Learning at School) are overall happy with their childs school experience or they would change it.  HS, another school, etc.  In short, I think MDC parents are quite aware of options and many have the means to do something different if their school has bullying issues.

 

I am not sure that is the case in the real world and across socio-economic boundaries.

 

So while it is great that most people here have their kids in schools where the kids are nice - it does not really prove kids are getting nicer (although they may be!) it just proves parents on here have their kids in schools with nice kids.

 

 

 

 


 

And yet, I've seen behaviour at MDC that rivals any schoolyard. I don't want to resurrect the controversies from this past year, but if mamas here can act like that to each other, what do we really expect from our kids? And it's nothing compared to the piling on that happens at other message boards. 

 

I really hope that younger generations are kinder, respectful, more tolerant, forgiving, yes, nicer than previous generations. If others are seeing it, that's wonderful and inspiring. I'll keep hoping. 

ollyoxenfree is offline  
#19 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 10:52 AM
 
Imakcerka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 4,065
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
You may very well be right muggle.
Imakcerka is offline  
#20 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 11:07 AM
 
philomom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Pacific Northwest
Posts: 9,430
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coral123 View Post



 

 

I The irony is that my kid tried to handle things as he was told he should.  I'm sure my kid would have been in a heck of a lot of trouble if he would have physically put a stop to butt toucher.  

 

 


I taught my kid to say in a very loud voice "stop touching my body part" No one has the right to touch you without your consent. If you speak/yell loud enough... adults will hear and the word butt will get attention. No one wants sexual harassment issues at their school. The staff gets classes on that every year. No school wants any negative attention on that front.


Kathymuggle did have a point in that if you are miserable with your kids school.. you should make a change. As someone who has homeschooled and public schooled as a parent , I can tell you they both have their challenges but you can find a balance for your family needs and your child's needs.
philomom is offline  
#21 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 12:04 PM
 
VisionaryMom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,856
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)


Quote:
Originally Posted by Linda on the move View Post

I do.

 

I also think that schools are more likely to approach problem behavior in a more positive way. I think that kids are more accepting of special education students than they were back when I was in school. I also see a lot of kids who are concerned about the environment and want to do something about it.

 

I think the world is getting better!


We see this trend as well. I know that lots of things that were labeled as "kids being kids" when I was in school now are seen as bullying issues. My son had guidance classes last year that I really disliked, but his current school has counselors who seem to put together some thoughtful, productive programs. They're more about being compassionate and kindness and how to handle it if someone isn't being nice to you. Overall I definitely see more attention placed on personal actions than when I was a kid.

 


It's us: DH , DS ; DD ; and me . Also there's the . And the 3 . I . Oh, and .
VisionaryMom is offline  
#22 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 12:53 PM
 
purslaine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 6,937
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)


Quote:
Originally Posted by ollyoxenfree View Post

 

And yet, I've seen behaviour at MDC that rivals any schoolyard. I don't want to resurrect the controversies from this past year, but if mamas here can act like that to each other, what do we really expect from our kids? And it's nothing compared to the piling on that happens at other message boards. 

 

 

Goodness, yes.  

 

I think that is some of the issue with the cyber world in general (and the cyber bullying people see).  It is so easy to be mean to each other online.  We do it on online conversation/forums, and people do it through cyber bullying or just online nastiness.  There are reasons, I think, why this medium is tied to such things.

 

It can also be a fairly friendly medium, however.  I can get a hug here anytime i want just for asking.  It is virtual, but it counts. smile.gif  I have seen less-than-popular kids have numerous "friends" on facebook.  I don't know how real the friendships are - but at least they have someone to talk to.  

 

 

Despite me being a bit of a naysayer on this thread - I am hopeful of positive change.

 

While the schools in this area have not been able to stop bullying yet they are at least talking about it - which is more than I can say for my youth.

 

 

 

purslaine is offline  
#23 of 55 Old 09-16-2011, 01:18 PM
MJB
 
MJB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 1,565
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Yes, it does seem to me that kids are getting nicer and bullying is dealt with quickly when it pops up. 

One_Girl likes this.
MJB is offline  
#24 of 55 Old 09-17-2011, 08:19 PM
 
Coral123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 88
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)


Quote:
Originally Posted by philomom View Post



I taught my kid to say in a very loud voice "stop touching my body part" No one has the right to touch you without your consent. If you speak/yell loud enough... adults will hear and the word butt will get attention. No one wants sexual harassment issues at their school. The staff gets classes on that every year. No school wants any negative attention on that front.


Kathymuggle did have a point in that if you are miserable with your kids school.. you should make a change. As someone who has homeschooled and public schooled as a parent , I can tell you they both have their challenges but you can find a balance for your family needs and your child's needs.

 

As I pointed out the situation with my son is past.  Hindsight is of course 20/20, and Monday morning quarterbacking is easy to do.. I don't recall saying we were miserable.  While leaving school would certainly have been an option...it wouldn't have been one I would have chosen quickly.  
 

 

I'm a cynic.  My point was just because there is a policy on paper, doesn't mean everyone follows it.  I still believe just as it was when I was a kid, it still is now...school officials turn a blind eye to many situations.

 

Coral123 is offline  
#25 of 55 Old 09-17-2011, 08:30 PM
 
One_Girl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,735
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 35 Post(s)

I think kids are much nicer than they used to be.  I have noticed that schools are much more responsive and they work to help both children learn from the experience in developmentally appropriate ways.  It seems like the schools do a better job of teaching empathy and respect as group lessons through the elementary years and it is paying off.

One_Girl is online now  
#26 of 55 Old 09-19-2011, 06:46 AM
 
ollyoxenfree's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,933
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)


Quote:
Originally Posted by kathymuggle View Post



Goodness, yes.  

 

I think that is some of the issue with the cyber world in general (and the cyber bullying people see).  It is so easy to be mean to each other online.  We do it on online conversation/forums, and people do it through cyber bullying or just online nastiness.  There are reasons, I think, why this medium is tied to such things.

 

It can also be a fairly friendly medium, however.  I can get a hug here anytime i want just for asking.  It is virtual, but it counts. smile.gif  I have seen less-than-popular kids have numerous "friends" on facebook.  I don't know how real the friendships are - but at least they have someone to talk to.  

 

 

Despite me being a bit of a naysayer on this thread - I am hopeful of positive change.

 

While the schools in this area have not been able to stop bullying yet they are at least talking about it - which is more than I can say for my youth.

 

 

 


I'm hopeful too. I think my own naysaying arose because I was reading some depressing stuff last week and I guess it coloured my view a little. Generally, I think there is a lot to be hopeful for - bullying isn't generally accepted as inevitable or a necessary part of growing up and there are programs to encourage empathy and kindness. Implementation may not always be effective, but at least there is better awareness and people are trying - or know that they should be trying. 

 

ollyoxenfree is offline  
#27 of 55 Old 10-13-2011, 01:54 PM
 
ollyoxenfree's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,933
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)

 

Reviving this thread because I read the NYT book review for The Better Angels of Our Nature by Steven Pinker last weekend. Since it reminded me of this conversation, I thought others might be interested in the book too. The author's thesis is that our world is less violent and less cruel than at any time in the past and it sounds like he's done a lot of research to back up that claim. I'm very interested in reading it. 

 

 

ollyoxenfree is offline  
#28 of 55 Old 10-13-2011, 02:45 PM
 
JollyGG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,647
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)


Quote:
Originally Posted by kathymuggle View Post

 

I don't think a bullied kid cares or even should care that a bully has a lot of negativity in their life.  I think they primarily feel angry, hurt and degraded - it is really unlikely (and perhaps not healthy) for them to feel sympathy towards their abuser.  Yes, firm  words, but I was bullied and it is a form of abuse.

 


Actually, it does help my son to talk about why someone might be bullying. We talk about what might be going on with the bully and why they are acting the way they are. We stress that the behavior is not okay and it's not acceptable. But it does help my son step outside the situation and see that it is not about him, but about the bully. There isn't anything bad about my son that causes the bullying, but the bully has bad feeling that they are inappropriately expressing.

 

For example we were talking about one girl (A) who bullied him last year and how he was in class and friends with her friend (G) from the year before. We talked about how she was targeting him because she felt lonely and excluded. Did that mean he had to include someone who made him feel bad? Hell no. Did that mean he should stop being friends with G? No. Does that mean he needed to except how A treated him? No. Was any of this his fault? No. That last statement was the one that he needed to understand, and talking about the rest got us there.


Mom to DS 4/24/03 and DD 4/17/06
JollyGG is online now  
#29 of 55 Old 10-14-2011, 02:16 PM - Thread Starter
 
OliveJewel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 550
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

yeahthat.gif

It helps my son, too, to understand that people who bully really don't feel good about themselves and that is why they are acting aggressive toward other kids, *not* because of anything that the kids getting bullied have done.  He has seen this played out when a boy in his class, who had been somewhat thoughtless and careless with classmates, got removed from his home because his caretakers needed to go through rehab.  Fortunately an extraordinary family of another boy in that class took the little boy into their care as a foster child to help out.  We were able to discuss how that boy had less than ideal home situation and so was hurting inside.  And my son got to see the boy change as he lived with a family who were kind and patient with him.

OliveJewel is offline  
#30 of 55 Old 10-15-2011, 12:06 PM
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 4,722
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)



I am reading The Sociopath Next Door and those really mean ones are probably sociopaths.The book said 1 in every 25 people are sociopaths,but my friend says it was updated recently to 1 in 10.The book it really good at explaining behavior such as this.

 

I have dealt with the bullying of my kids.Thankfully the last year or two has been rather peaceful.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NiteNicole View Post

Most kids are nice, but the ones who are mean...just MEAN...are so intense.  There's a lot of casual age-appropriate stuff like making clubs and leaving someone out and I won't be your best friend, but the kids who set out to be mean and get a reaction are so above and beyond ANYTHING I would expect from a kid, kid - it's shocking.  There's this mentality of hounding someone until you have just thoroughly, utterly dominated them that I can not understand.  I don't understand how a kid thinks it's ok to be like that and I don't understand how a parent doesn't pull them out of school and make them stay home till they learn to act human.  It's almost like schools are so on top of things that most kids are developing habits of being inclusive and considerate so in reaction, the odd mean kid has to amp it up.



 

mattemma04 is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Drag and Drop File Upload
Drag files here to attach!
Upload Progress: 0
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mothering Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off