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#1 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 01:36 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Okay- I need some serious advice. I was sitting at home this evening cuddling in bed with my little girl (Lexie) and she told me a story about her day at school... Here is what I documented and I'm not sure who I should bring it to or how I should address this issue but I'M FURIOUS. Here goes:

Lexie verbalized to me (Lexie's mother) that she went to the toilet in the Elementary Girls bathroom at The Montessori School today, 5/18/04, and that she had diarrhea. Lexie then reported that she used a lot of toilet paper in an attempt to clean her bottom. She then reported that she flushed the toilet and that it became clogged by the toilet paper. After trying to flush the toilet Lexie reports that she went to get a teacher to help her. Lexie reports that Ms. Fanny came into the bathroom and proceeded to give Lexie a pair of “big yellow rubber gloves” and make her “pick the toilet paper with the diarrhea and pee out of the toilet and put it into the trash.” Lexie verbalized that she was very sad and embarrassed by what happened.

Alright, so WWYD?
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#2 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 01:40 AM
 
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I don't know. I understand that at Montessori they are trying to teach the kids that they can solve problems themselves...... but I think this was a job for a grownup.

Sorry. Hugs to your little one.
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#3 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 01:40 AM
 
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Call the school 1st thing in the morning.. Set up a conference with the teacher.. Unacceptable.. I'm all for being responsible for your own actions, but THAT is ridiculous.. I would be LIVID!! I am APPALLED by that teacher behavior, and it's not even my child..

CALL THE SCHOOL!!

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#4 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 01:45 AM
 
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Yes, call the school. These actions should be explained to you. Then you're gonna have to decide if she should continue going there.

Should have said that before.... implied.
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#5 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 01:46 AM
 
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Unacceptable.

Not only is it not your daughter's job, it is not sanitary. It makes me sick and really angry that she had to do this.

I am livid, I hope you kick some serious a** and...and....I don't know. If it were my daughter, I'd have to bring my calm dh to temper my red-headed fire!

Jesse
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#6 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 01:49 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Thank you so much for the replies. I am really feeling very sad about this. Lexie is only 4 years old! Not that I think this is acceptable for any age child to have to endure. She felt so embarrased and ashamed of what happened. I am so angry and sad about this. I can't figure out if I should confront the school in the morning or call a lawyer about it. I think this actually violates laws but I would have to do some digging to figure out which ones.

Thanks again for the replies it means a lot to hear from other people about this.

-Laura
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#7 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 02:21 AM
 
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This is taking it too far. She can't help it that she had diarreah. She didn't purposely try to make a mess. Shame on that teacher. Definately take it up with the school. She deserves an apology at least. to your dd.

*ETA: OMG, she's only 4 yo? That is so wrong. Please let us know how the school responds. This is just unacceptable.
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#8 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 02:22 AM
 
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i wouldnt send her back there. i would sue that teacher. that was wrong wrong wrong. and stupid of the teacher. she shouldve known better. or at least had some sort of love enough for kids to know that that was hurtful and inappropriate. i'm livid for you and your dd.

Erin, 33, salty southern mama, sitting by the sea with my DH35, DD10, DS4, &DD2!
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#9 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 03:22 AM
 
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All of this talk of lawyers and sueing is a little premature. Go into the school and talk to them about this. Obviously that teacher made a very bad decision and this was unfair to your daughter.
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#10 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 03:27 AM
 
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i would be livid too. 4 yo is too young. what child needs to do that?

I am sooooo sorry for lexie. Please, please,please (and I am sure you have) tell her that she did the right thing by asking a grown-up for help in that situation. And that grown-up was wrong to make her do that.

Oh, I am so mad at that teacher.
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#11 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 03:32 AM
 
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That is Abusive in my oppinion. If some one did that to my dd (also four in a week) I would be so angry. Really the thought of this makes me want to cry. I hope something big enough is done so your daughter understands how inappropriate that teachers response was. I'm sure she is unlikely to ever forget that. to your
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#12 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 03:37 AM
 
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maybe it is a little premature to say "sue" but i do think she should speak to a lawyer, perhaps have a lawyer contact the school-that was cruel and unhealthy and damaging. and if the teacher is so insensitive that she'd tell a FOUR year old to clean up after she'd been SICK in the toilet and accidently stopped it up, well, i don't think this person needs to be teaching 4 year olds without some more education and sensitivity training.
and it's a waldorf school? if you decide to pull her out, it would be helpful to have a lawyer call about it incase the issue of tuition refunding comes up.
if that's the kind of independance waldorf is talking about, yikes. my dd doesnt need that. i hope that's an isolated incident

Erin, 33, salty southern mama, sitting by the sea with my DH35, DD10, DS4, &DD2!
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#13 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 03:42 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by *Erin*
if the teacher is so insensitive that she'd tell a FOUR year old to clean up after she'd been SICK in the toilet and accidently stopped it up, well, i don't think this person needs to be teaching 4 year olds without some more education and sensitivity training.
ITA The more I think about it, the more this is upsetting and disturbing me. I'm so sad for you and your little girl. That teacher needs to at least be reevaluated. How could she ever think that was ok? Your poor little girl.

*Erin, it was Montessori*
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#14 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 04:06 AM
 
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I'm just so sorry this happened.

Completely unacceptable. She did this to a 4 year old??!! Come on, now.

Definately speak with the school administrators and the teacher. I'd try to get an apology, too. And this is just me, but I would not send my child back there.

to you and your dd.
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#15 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 05:21 AM
 
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I would go down to the school a raging pissed off mama.

I'd probably take a plunger with me and wave it in the teacher's face, ask her if she knew what it was for, and suggest she use it to get her head out of her *ss.

Rational behavior following would depend on the teacher's reaction.

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#16 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 08:08 AM
 
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i would never send my child back Get a lawyer and get your money back,assuming it's a private school.Another good tactic is to let them know you will be letting the local media know what happened.
I'm sorry your little girl had to cope with such aterrible situation Hope you get some closure soon.
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#17 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 08:22 AM
 
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Laura,

I am really sorry that happened.

I teach at a preschool, and if a child accidentally overstuffed the toilet, we would call maintenance. That's what custodians do... This teacher was being malicious. And, I would tell her and her director so!!!

Four year olds are supposed to be supervised by a teacher when they go to the bathroom at school. If your child had been, none of this would have happened.

~Laura
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#18 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 09:05 AM
 
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That is so awful!!!

As a member of the frequent toilet clogging club (my dh is the charter toilet clogger) I can tell you that even as an adult I would be humiliated and embarassed by that!!!

She's only 4!!!! What kind of world is that teaching her about??
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#19 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 09:42 AM
 
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I am so sorry you had to go through that. Poor Lexie. What the teacher did was obviously inappropriate.

I would definately talk to the administrator as soon as possible. I would not start talking lawyers or suing yet. You may get a very satisfactory response from the school. Perhaps she is a newer teacher. I know our Montessori school does not have a maintenance staff, teachers do the work. The teacher should have helped the child back to class and taken care of the job.

Good luck to you.
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#20 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 09:44 AM
 
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Obviously this teacher was WAAAAAY out of line. However, I would also be concerned that immediately withdrawing the child might make her feel like she did something bad, and is being punished by not being allowed to go back to school. Not that the OP wouldn't try to explain to the child, but kids have a tendency to accept responsibility even when it isn't their fault, KWIM?

It also concerns me that taking action that resulted in the immediate dismissal of the teacher might (again) cause the child to feel responsible, like her "tattling" got the teacher in trouble and caused her to leave, KWIM? I just think it should be handled with the utmost care, which of course I know it would be.

JMTCW....

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DS (2/02), DD (3/04), DS (1/06), DD (12/07), and DS (3/10)
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#21 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 10:25 AM
 
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I'd call the principal and request a meeting with the teacher and the principal present. The teacher should explain her reasoning to you directly. This teacher sounds ignorant and misguided to me. I would suspect this is her first year or two of teaching, and I would suspect she's never heard of a plunger, either! I too would be tempted to buy a plunger and bring it with and offer to demonstrate if necessary, too.

I would be sure to point out that it was embarassing and humiliating to your daughter and that teacher should apologize to you and separately to your daughter - in front of any other child who may have witnessed your child's having to go thru this! Even if they are trying to teach her how to be responsible for her actions, your daughter did the responsible thing - she called a teacher to help. This problem was too big for a 4 year old. It is not a developmentally appropriate expectation for a 4 year old to unclog a toilet. I am saddened and surprised that this teacher did not know that.

I wouldn't take her back to this teacher at LEAST until the talk. If there's more than 1 class available - I might request that your daughter switch classrooms or sessions to be with a more experienced, compassionate teacher.

As far as your DD being hurt, if you feel the need, just reinforce to her the difference between "tattling" and "telling" Tattling is trying to get somebody into trouble. Telling is trying to get somebody OUT of trouble. Explain to her that telling you was right and that her teacher will be learning from the consequences of her actions and it's not your daughter's responsibility at all. Just make sure your child hears that she did the right thing.

Good luck & let us know what happens!!
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#22 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 10:57 AM
 
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to your poor baby

I am on the "don't sue" (yet) side of the fence but definately bring it up.

IMO, it was very responsible (and that is where her responsibility ended) for your DD to get help. Many children would just leave it be. The teacher should have comforted her (if she had diahrea I am assuming she felt kinda sick, said it was no big deal and cleaned it up herself, or gotten another adult to). There are a LOT of things that kids need done that they can't do themselves.

I would definately get the reaction from the teacher/director before pulling your child from school. Esp since it is near the end of the year (I assume). I would also actually discuss it with DD (if she is really upset, she may prefer not to go back, but otherwise as pps have mentioned she may see it as a punishment).

Good luck!

 

 

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#23 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 01:41 PM
 
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Another vote for "completely inappropriate and wrong" here. I thought schools had janitors? If not, and the teachers do all the work, they knew what they were in for when they took the job! They can't just back out of their duties.

I hope your dd knows she doesn't ever have to do anything like that again.

When I'd get sick in school and vomit, no one EVER made me clean it up, even when I was 13 and capable. It's just not my job.
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#24 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 03:10 PM
 
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That is ridiculous, and I'm so sorry that happened. How humiliating! And totally inappropriate of the teacher.
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#25 of 51 Old 05-19-2004, 11:13 PM
 
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That teacher's action was horrid! I hope everything turns out alright...
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#26 of 51 Old 05-20-2004, 01:13 AM
 
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that really is a very sad story and I'm sorry that happened to Lexie. I am also of the mind that I would not allow my child to continue there, but given the time of the year, I'd probably allow my child to finish out the year and then make a change for the next school year as a natural transition. I would also ask for a meeting with the administrator and teacher to discuss the issue and make it clear that I felt it was inappropriate and see how they reacted. Based on that, I would feel I had a clearer vision of how soon I need to act on the change. As some have said, you may find that the teacher is truly sorry and will make a real change. Also, if your dd is not going to have that teacher directly in charge of her next year, it might end up being a nonissue soon enough. At best, it was bad judgment and inappropriate action. At worst, it's cause to remove her immediately. I'm sorry. Good luck. I'd like to hear how things turn out for Lexie and you.

Leah
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#27 of 51 Old 05-20-2004, 02:13 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Well mamas I thank you so very much for your kind words and support. This morning we met with the owner of the school, the teacher in question and Lexie's teacher, Melissa. The teacher admitted that she did make Lexie put on the gloves and pick the toilet paper out of the toilet and she quickly apologized for her actions. The owner of the school assured us that it would never happen again.

Okay, so, she apologized and that seemed to be the end of things.

Here's what happened today... Lexie's very close friend and classmate (age 7) told his mom that while Lexie was in the bathroom the teacher, Melissa, instructed all the children in the class not to look at Lexie, not to touch Lexie and not to be her friend. He told this to his mom twice in the car and then told his father the same story when he got home.

Obviously she will never ever go back to the school again. We have contacted the police and will file child abuse charges against the school and in the morning we will meet with a lawyer and file a lawsuit against them for both physical and emotional abuse.

I'm sick about this, so completely sick. She has been a student at this school since she was 18 months old. We trusted these people.
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#28 of 51 Old 05-20-2004, 03:01 AM
 
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Good luck

"not to be her friend?" what kind of sick twisted logic is that?
She was SICK for crying out loud!! And for being sick they humiliate her with the clean up ( would think that violates some hygiene rules as well considering her age - what would happen had there been a hole in the glove and what made her sick reinfected her ? but further with alienating her from her friends?
WTH is that supposed to teach her?
Let us know what happens with the lawyer and police report!
And you give her a big ol hug from me
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#29 of 51 Old 05-20-2004, 10:47 AM
 
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WIth that knowlege.. I would go back to the school and INSIST on her dismissal..

What an awful woman..

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#30 of 51 Old 05-20-2004, 11:57 AM
 
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That teacher is a sick woman. She shouldn't be allowed around children. That's even WORSE than the bathroom incident. Don't be surprised if she denies it.
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