Paying for things at public schools - Page 5 - Mothering Forums

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#121 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 11:57 AM
 
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Originally Posted by karen ann
I haven't gotten a supply list for DS starting kindergarten (at least not yet). But his friend just moved to the next town over, and not only did they get a list, it was brand specific -- not the cheapo discount brands either: Crayola crayons, Fiskar scissors, Puffs brand tissues, etc.
I agree. This is one of the things that bothers me the most. It is one thing to ask me to bring in kleenex, hand sanitizer : , a thousand other name brand things and then 1 box of gallon sized Hefty One zip bags, 1 box of Hefty one zip sandwich bags, and 1 box of Hefty snack bags.

The school district dd is going to is a horrible horrible school, and I am surprised I don't have to send tp, but seriously, WHY name brand? I could've saved a ton not getting name brand. I would venture a guess that 90%+ of the kids going to this school are below the poverty line. Do you really think they can afford that stuff???

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#122 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 12:01 PM
 
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Originally Posted by MsElle07
That's great. Maybe she was in a wealthy district that could afford supplies. This is not the norm. Special Education now costs districts millions a year, and that was not the case in the 60s and 70s, when disabled children would often drop out.
No, it was a lower middle class neighborhood in Massachusetts and then when I went to school it was in the same areas I'm in now.

And I specifically recall having kids in Special Education in my class, more than my kids have now; additionally I had a pull-out class for gifted kids.

The "that's great" sarcasm wasn't really needed as I'm only trying to contribute to the discussion. But if you'd rather argue, "that's great". :

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#123 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 12:05 PM
 
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Originally Posted by MsElle07
It's about making sure one kid is not ostracized. That is often a very painful place to be as a child.
In the elem school I went to, all of our school supplies were dumped into big "community" bins for everyone to share. Which meant that all of those brand name supplies we were forced to bring in we never got to use. Because by the time that we got around to using them, they just brought out the old bins of remnants from the year before where all of the watercolors were the same brown color from use and the crowns were less than an inch long.

So, in theory, that works by making us all even, but then we just all ended up with crap to use. And the rare person who found a new crayon was like a King in the class.

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#124 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 01:22 PM
 
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Originally Posted by MsElle07
2000-2001. Actually, we were a National Blue Ribbon Award winner from the US Dept of Education.
Aparently you don't want to share what district this was for whatever reason. (you don't work there anymore right?) So I will just assume it is one of the districts that were taken over by the state in 2002.

2000-2001 - This is the school year rolling black outs were going on. Was this the sourse of your "intermitant" power failures? In which case that was not the school districts problem but the STATES problem. I know my daughter spent time at school in the cold and the dark that year. Btw, in a middle class neighborhood in the California Bay Area. Matter of fact, I believe our neighborhood was targeted because we were on the same grid as an HP plant.

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Originally Posted by mselle07
The state can't shut down one of their better schools, now can they? When I called the State Health Dept to complain, particularly because had to be "blood-borne pathogen certified," telling them that we had no hot water, soap, hand dryers, or paper towels, they told me flat out that none of those things were required for proper handwashing. :
They can and they will if the school is a health hazard and there is no electricity as you say. Unless of course the electric problems were caused by rolling blackouts which everyone in the state was effected by that year.

[quote=mselle07]I see people REFUSING to bring in needed supplies.[quote]

People are refusing to bring in supplies that are against thier personal beliefs, or name brands. Not flat out refusing.

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Originally Posted by mselle07
Having a sense of entitlement about the situation is different. Acting as if your child is OWED supplies is ridiculous. I have never been provided with supplies, as a teacher or student. The only thing you and your child are OWED is a "free and appropriate education," that is all.
Really that is odd. My children have gone to several different schools in California. They have NEVER been required to bring in more than paper and penciles. I was asked at one school for Klenex but that was it. When I went to school we didn't have to bring in anything. We were provided paper, a new pencil once a month, and a box of crayons twice a year.
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#125 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 03:18 PM
 
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Originally Posted by aniT
Aparently you don't want to share what district this was for whatever reason. (you don't work there anymore right?) So I will just assume it is one of the districts that were taken over by the state in 2002.
Don't assume. It's not. Silicon Valley area.

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2000-2001 - This is the school year rolling black outs were going on. Was this the sourse of your "intermitant" power failures? In which case that was not the school districts problem but the STATES problem. I know my daughter spent time at school in the cold and the dark that year. Btw, in a middle class neighborhood in the California Bay Area. Matter of fact, I believe our neighborhood was targeted because we were on the same grid as an HP plant.
Yes, we had rolling blackouts because of PG&E's ridiculous behavior -- shutting down power plants to drive up demand and such, as it sounds like you are familiar with. However, schools in a neighboring district had backup generators. We did not. We still had to carry on in the heat and the dark.

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They can and they will if the school is a health hazard and there is no electricity as you say.
It wasn't deemed a health hazard because there was running cold water, no standing sewage, the bathrooms were cleaned daily by janitors, and the cafteria met the health code. (All food was prepared off site and brought in.) I know because I called the Dept of Health myself, as I was appalled by the conditions.

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People are refusing to bring in supplies that are against thier personal beliefs, or name brands. Not flat out refusing.
Like the previous poster who said she would be against bringing in chalk and toilet paper? People have personal beliefs against these items?

Quote:
My children have gone to several different schools in California. They have NEVER been required to bring in more than paper and penciles. I was asked at one school for Klenex but that was it. When I went to school we didn't have to bring in anything. We were provided paper, a new pencil once a month, and a box of crayons twice a year.
As I mentioned before, no one is required to bring in supplies.
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#126 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 03:20 PM
 
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#127 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 03:20 PM
 
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Originally Posted by PajamaMama

I get your point.

Obviously you did not GET that this was a vent thread?
I get it. I think it's wrong to vent about something a teacher has no control over.
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#128 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 03:35 PM
 
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Originally Posted by 1xmom
I remember when I was in school, there was always a list of supplies, now the list has gotten longer. Instead of just making sure your child has a 3-ring notebook, folders, pencils and paper, it has gotten much worse. Things like dry erase markers, I can't imagine a teacher going thru that many if you have a class of 24 and you have to get a 4 pk-even if only 1/2 of the class gets them you would think that would be suffice. I am one of those parents who just shrugs it off and just gets what is on the list. I have been in the classroom and a teacher's job is not easy. If my just getting what is asked helps make my dd's teacher's job just a fraction better than I have no problem doing it.
There is one simple reason times have changed since we were children. Special education and English language learners. When were in school, the services provided to Spec Ed and ELL students were nothing like what they are today.

Districts must now pay for a bevy of lawyers to defend themselves against lawsuits, they have to pay for highly specialized special education teachers, speech therapists, occupational therapists, paraeducators, special education coordinators, IEP directors, ELL teachers, etc. In some areas, districts spend half their yearly budget on these things. When you look at per pupil spending in a district, it will usually appear to increase year after year. However, what you're seeing it an average of per pupil spending that includes every student, including those in self contained classrooms of eight students, two teachers, and three paraeducators. So while it appears that school funding may increase in a given area, the actual resources available to general education teachers are small.

For example, a district near me has one of the highest per pupil spending rates in the country. But it had to spend nearly $20 million just on special education HEARINGS last school year. This just includes IEP meetings, appeals, and grievances. This does not include the actual classroom implementation of IEPs.

Additionally, you're forgetting that President Bush cut funding for Head Start and School lunch programs. Schools can't just tell students, "Sorry, you can't eat." So the costs of feeding children have also increased. Some districts serve such poor areas that 90+% of the students meet the definition of poverty and qualify for free and reduced priced meals.

Let's also thank Pres Bush for the DELIGHTFUL No Child Left Behind Act which has mandated standardized testing at many levels of schooling. States and districts have had to pick up the tab for testing each and every student, usually to the tune of millions of dollars a year.

So, it's easy to sit back and blame a crappy school board or crappy teachers or throw up your hands and say, "When I was a kid, I never had to pay for this stuff." But neither did your school district. Your school district did not have to pay for what it has to pay for today.

A school district can be sued for not complying with a child's IEP. It cannot be sued for failing to provide Kleenex. So in the district's mind, the choice is easy.

Let's keep in mind that the problem is very multi-faceted. Let's work to change things that need to be changed and not rip on people who can't do anything about the 30 (I have had as many as 38) students in a classroom that will be showing up next week (for me, at least) and who need to provide them with the best education possible given very limited time and resources.
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#129 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 03:35 PM
 
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Fortunately, "Elmer's" glue sticks and "Fiskars" blunt scissors were the only name brand items on my dd's school list and I looked over the list for all the grades. I do buy Crayola b/c I do think they are a better brand and about a month before school starts alot of stores have the 24 count for .10 so I pick up a couple of boxes at a time.
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#130 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 04:07 PM
 
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wow pajamamama - your school is entirely out of control.

I don't mind bringing a couple boxes of cleenex or a bar of soap even. I don't mind a pack of construction paper or one or two specific brand name items.

but for the love of pete. lets keep it reasonable!

i think teachers should be allowed to ask for whatever they want but that they should have a budget to work inside of. For example they can ask for whatever crazy stuff they want so long as it doesn't total more than $50. granted they would have to be creative but I also think there is a lot of classroom waste.

I would find out what the consequences are for not bringing the stuff and then if there are none I would only bring what I felt my child would need.

but be careful. I used to work as a teaching assistant and in one of the classes the teacher gave the student a zero in the grade book for every day even one item was missing from the supply list. long story short it was a control thing and more about what she wanted to make her job easy rather than what the students needed for learning (she admitted all this. ) it made me sick.

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#131 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 04:22 PM
 
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I have high school children, probably one of the few on this forum with older children, but I am feeling a bit miffed that a public school charges my child for a parking pass. Granted, it is only $25 for the year, but heck, I am really saving the school district money by not having kids on the bus. I just wonder where this money is funneled. I don't think students should have to pay to park at a public school.
Great topic, I really enjoy seeing the posts and sharing of ideas and concerns.
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#132 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 04:48 PM
 
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Originally Posted by PDean
I have high school children, probably one of the few on this forum with older children, but I am feeling a bit miffed that a public school charges my child for a parking pass. Granted, it is only $25 for the year, but heck, I am really saving the school district money by not having kids on the bus. I just wonder where this money is funneled. I don't think students should have to pay to park at a public school.
Great topic, I really enjoy seeing the posts and sharing of ideas and concerns.
I disagree with this. You are not saving the school money by having your kids drive to school. The buses run, regardless. Your children are putting more congestion on the roads to the school, and taking up valuable space in mostly crowded parking lots. (Unless your school is new and was built with a huge parkling lot).

Of course, I also think we should make it harder for people to drive places when there are alternative ways to get somewhere.
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#133 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 04:51 PM
 
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Originally Posted by PDean
I have high school children, probably one of the few on this forum with older children, but I am feeling a bit miffed that a public school charges my child for a parking pass. Granted, it is only $25 for the year, but heck, I am really saving the school district money by not having kids on the bus. I just wonder where this money is funneled. I don't think students should have to pay to park at a public school.
Great topic, I really enjoy seeing the posts and sharing of ideas and concerns.
The student parking lot must also then be monitored and plowed. It would cost a lot less to have no student parking and have everyone ride the bus.
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#134 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 04:53 PM
 
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Originally Posted by MsElle07
The student parking lot must also then be monitored and plowed. It would cost a lot less to have no student parking and have everyone ride the bus.
Would cut down on traffic, gas usage, and the number of fender benders and worse that plague inexperienced drivers. Might help teen insurance rates, too.
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#135 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 05:02 PM
 
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Would cut down on traffic, gas usage, and the number of fender benders and worse that plague inexperienced drivers. Might help teen insurance rates, too.
Yep. Not to mention students leaving school because they want to fight someone, they want to score or sell drugs, they want to go home and have sex with their boyfriend/girlfriend, etc. (PDean, I am not saying your children do these things, just that it's pretty common for high school students with cars to do these things or give their friends rides to engage in these types of activities.)
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#136 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 05:58 PM
 
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I guess the question in my mind remains this.....why should the school pocket money from children for the use of a public school parking lot? I simply wonder where the money goes.
I could not wait to get my teens off the bus, the buses are crowded, hot, long rides, poorly supervised, etc.
I still maintain that children driving to school save the district money. Granted, the buses run anyway, but add up the number of total drivers in a whole district, and then pretend these children need a ride on the bus. That would create a need for more bus routes and drivers, and increase the cost. At our high school alone, there are about 500-600 parking spaces for students. That would increase the need for a lot of buses if all those students rode the bus.
If you have students who work or play sports, which mine do both, having a car is a nearly a must at school.
Thanks for all the chatter, what a great group of women!
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#137 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 06:00 PM
 
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I also have to say that I love the mindset of so many moms on this board, so great about thinking of our natural resources, and so environmentally aware. I have learned alot from you. I am not as good at this as most of you.....thanks for all the input.
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#138 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 06:08 PM
 
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Originally Posted by MsElle07
Don't assume. It's not. Silicon Valley area.
I never said word one about the Silicon Valley. Seems you are making assumptions now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MsElle07
Yes, we had rolling blackouts because of PG&E's ridiculous behavior -- shutting down power plants to drive up demand and such, as it sounds like you are familiar with. However, schools in a neighboring district had backup generators. We did not. We still had to carry on in the heat and the dark.
In the heat? The rolling blackouts went on during the winter when it was cold. You would have been WITHOUT heat just as my daughter was. I have never seen a school in my LIFE with a backup generator and at the time we lived in an upper middle class neighborhood.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MsElle07
It wasn't deemed a health hazard because there was running cold water, no standing sewage, the bathrooms were cleaned daily by janitors, and the cafteria met the health code. (All food was prepared off site and brought in.) I know because I called the Dept of Health myself, as I was appalled by the conditions.
Then maybe you should have started with the county then the state board of education. Or the news stations.


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Originally Posted by MsElle07
Like the previous poster who said she would be against bringing in chalk and toilet paper? People have personal beliefs against these items?
Some people do. Who are you to say what they should and should not do/believe.[/QUOTE]
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#139 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 06:08 PM
 
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Originally Posted by MsElle07
Yep. Not to mention students leaving school because they want to fight someone, they want to score or sell drugs, they want to go home and have sex with their boyfriend/girlfriend, etc. (PDean, I am not saying your children do these things, just that it's pretty common for high school students with cars to do these things or give their friends rides to engage in these types of activities.)

Yikes! That's some very negative stereotyping you're engaging in. IMO it's pretty common that high school students with cars are simply that, nothing more. :

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#140 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 06:09 PM
 
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Originally Posted by MsElle07
I get it. I think it's wrong to vent about something a teacher has no control over.
No one was venting about the teachers... This entire thread was a vent about the school districts wasting money and not giving the teachers what they need. I don't understand why you can't grasp THAT fact.
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#141 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 06:18 PM
 
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Originally Posted by mamato2boys
Yikes! That's some very negative stereotyping you're engaging in. IMO it's pretty common that high school students with cars are simply that, nothing more. :
Not to mention the fact that it is extreamly niave to think that walking/bussed students aren't doing these things.
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#142 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 06:42 PM
 
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Yikes! That's some very negative stereotyping you're engaging in. IMO it's pretty common that high school students with cars are simply that, nothing more. :
It's actually quite common. I like teenagers. But most teenage pregnancies and drug use occurs DURING school hours. Studies show that students with cars and access to cars are more likely to cut school and engage in illegal behavior. It's not my personal bias.
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#143 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 06:45 PM
 
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I never said word one about the Silicon Valley. Seems you are making assumptions now.
I'm not making assumptions. I am answering your question. I'm telling you I was working in the Silicon Valley area.

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I have never seen a school in my LIFE with a backup generator and at the time we lived in an upper middle class neighborhood.
Does this make it any worse that kids had to sit there with no electricity?

Quote:
Some people do. Who are you to say what they should and should not do/believe.
If someone has moral qualms with toilet paper, white board markers, and chalk, they should not send their children to public schools.
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#144 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 06:47 PM
 
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No one was venting about the teachers... This entire thread was a vent about the school districts wasting money and not giving the teachers what they need. I don't understand why you can't grasp THAT fact.
Please read post number 128 and you will understand why it is not usually districts wasting money. It is that the districts usually do not HAVE the money to give.
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#145 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 06:49 PM
 
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For want of a Kleenex the test was lost
For want of the test the class was lost
For want of the class a bus was lost
For want of the bus viriginity was lost
For want of virginity a future was lost
And all for the want of a box of Kleenex.
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#146 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 06:50 PM
 
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Originally Posted by LizD
For want of a Kleenex the test was lost
For want of the test the class was lost
For want of the class a bus was lost
For want of the bus viriginity was lost
For want of virginity a future was lost
And all for the want of a box of Kleenex.
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#147 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 06:59 PM
 
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Originally Posted by MsElle07
Please read post number 128 and you will understand why it is not usually districts wasting money. It is that the districts usually do not HAVE the money to give.
Regardless of that fact, no one is blaming or venting against the teachers. It is the SYSTEM they are venting against, but you keep bringing it back to the teachers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MsElle07
Don't assume. It's not. Silicon Valley area.
My error. I didn't see the period after not.
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#148 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 07:18 PM
 
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In the heat? The rolling blackouts went on during the winter when it was cold. You would have been WITHOUT heat just as my daughter was. I have never seen a school in my LIFE with a backup generator and at the time we lived in an upper middle class neighborhood.
just wanted to say that I live in po-dunk and our school has had backup generators for as long as I can recall. Granted they only run essentials like security lights {in classrooms/hallways/office/cafe/pool area, etc} fire & security control board, and now they have them hooked up to run the new security cameras they installed a couple years back... so I would imagine Cali schools and other upwardly mobile, more advanced schools have much better systems...
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#149 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 07:27 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Kaitnbugsmom
just wanted to say that I live in po-dunk and our school has had backup generators for as long as I can recall. Granted they only run essentials like security lights {in classrooms/hallways/office/cafe/pool area, etc} fire & security control board, and now they have them hooked up to run the new security cameras they installed a couple years back... so I would imagine Cali schools and other upwardly mobile, more advanced schools have much better systems...
Same here. Our generators also run the ventilation system at a minimal level to comply with the health code.
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#150 of 209 Old 08-20-2006, 07:28 PM
 
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Originally Posted by aniT
Regardless of that fact, no one is blaming or venting against the teachers. It is the SYSTEM they are venting against, but you keep bringing it back to the teachers.
You have brought up several times that it's the school DISTRICT. And there have been a number of people complaining of the lists that TEACHERS send home. Go back and look if you can't recall.
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