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#151 of 165 Old 06-08-2008, 05:10 PM
 
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I realize that this may be a silly question, but I'm wondering why the no talking at lunch rule? I'm probably lucky, but I have never heard of this at school.

My dc's would probably be big offenders of this since we use meal times as times to socialize with each other (among the many other times!.) And I find this rule interesting, because I remember reading many articles about the benefits of having family dinners as a way to connect as a family. I know that what happens at home can't always extend to the school, but as I've said, I've never heard of a rule like this at school.

Laura - Mom to ds (10) and dd (7) "Time stands still best in moments that look suspiciously like ordinary life." Brian Andreas.

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#152 of 165 Old 06-08-2008, 06:12 PM
 
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Originally Posted by LauraLoo View Post
I realize that this may be a silly question, but I'm wondering why the no talking at lunch rule? I'm probably lucky, but I have never heard of this at school.

My dc's would probably be big offenders of this since we use meal times as times to socialize with each other (among the many other times!.) And I find this rule interesting, because I remember reading many articles about the benefits of having family dinners as a way to connect as a family. I know that what happens at home can't always extend to the school, but as I've said, I've never heard of a rule like this at school.
Yeah i'm wondering the same thing... Is this common? I went to school (grade school) in Nebraska and we were certainly allowed to talk at lunch and even encouraged. When a child would interrupt class often the teachers would say, "Save it for lunchtime." or something to that effect.
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#153 of 165 Old 06-08-2008, 06:33 PM
 
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I realize that this may be a silly question, but I'm wondering why the no talking at lunch rule?
I suspect the main thing is the teachers/monitors not wanting to have to listen to the noise.
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#154 of 165 Old 06-08-2008, 06:41 PM
 
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I suspect the main thing is the teachers/monitors not wanting to have to listen to the noise.
My sister works in a Title I elementary school ranging in the very high 40's where most of the kids come from homes where the parents are gang members and/or prostitutes, etc. She says it's because they don't have adequate staff to prevent violence.

It's a sad, sad world.
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#155 of 165 Old 06-08-2008, 09:07 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I realize that this may be a silly question, but I'm wondering why the no talking at lunch rule?

I've only taught at one school that required NO talking, with which I wholeheartedly disagree since meals should be social and trying to maintain complete quiet is unnatural and borderline cruel. However, most schools do try to enforce use of "inside voices" or some other quieter level of conversation. I've seen noise meters like traffic lights designed to signal the kids when it's getting too loud: green light-okay; yellow light-getting too loud; red light-okay, time to hush.

In my current school, all five Pre-Ks eat together in an open cafeteria. That's 100 four-and-five-year-olds. If you don't at least try to keep the conversation at a dull roar, the rest of the building has to try to continue with classes amid a whole lot of noise. It's really just good manners to keep your conversation quiet enough that it doesn't disturb others. I wish more cell phone users would agree.
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#156 of 165 Old 06-09-2008, 07:56 PM
 
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Thank you for the explanations --- I certainly agree with indoor voices in the cafeteria!

Laura - Mom to ds (10) and dd (7) "Time stands still best in moments that look suspiciously like ordinary life." Brian Andreas.

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#157 of 165 Old 06-09-2008, 10:54 PM
 
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What is the principles role in the school? (an honest question as I don't know), but I imagine problem solving and checking up on the teachers is part of the job. Also, I don't think teachers really get much say in the kids they get in thier class. They are stuck with the kids wether the child fits in or not.
The Principal is in charge of the teachers. They should be following up & checking on any complaints.

At the school my kids go to in the 1/2 split the teacher gets all the kids from K & grade 1 who are known for behaviour issues because she is good at working with those kids. She is a very organized & structured teacher. Out of 23 kids, 5 of them are on the Positive Behaviour Plan. When I started doing Noon Supervision at the school in March there was 1 or 2 kids on it. the other 3 are recent since May. They get on this plan after multiple repeated behaviour problems. Notes are sent home & after 2 notes the parents are brought in for a talk & the kids are placed on the Positive Behaviour Plan. they have a form for each class day & each block of learning plus ALL the recesses & Lunch. If they have no issues they get a checkmark. If there is a problem in any block of time they get an X with an explanation of what the problem is. That's as far as my duty to the Behaviour Plan goes so I'm not sure what happens after that, if a report of how thier week was goes home or what. Out of the 5 kids, 3 & sometimes a 4th ask if they get their checkmark or not & the majority of the time they do. The 5th one never asks & he is often eating his lunch in the Principal's office because of his behaviour.

That kid is also (as of this week) a Good Choices Card kids. There are 3 in the school(out of 250). The other 2 are in Grade 3(he often spends his days in the Principal's office) and Grade 4. At all recesses they bring a card out to a supervisor & tell the supervisor where they'll be. AT the end of recess if they've made good choices they get their card back & off to class. If they haven't then they're either already in the office or they go & the Vice Principal deals with them which is usually the child writing a Behaviour Plan. These Behaviour Plans are a short form where the child writes what the incident was, what they did wrong, how they can fix it & a plan for future actions. Then the Principal reviews it & if she's satisfied they go on to class(I believe a copy of this goes home too, not sure).

If a teacher in our school did what this teacher did they'd be fired, no question. I wonder about the school as a whole, not just the teacher. If the parents went to the Principal & that person did nothing I could see the tape recorder as being a last resort to proove their case.

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I honestly think it is unnatural and asking for trouble to put one person in one room for 8 hours with a bunch of needy little kids day after day.
At the school here this is why I have a job as a Noon Supervisor. We have alot of new teachers to the school this last year. Both the new & old teachers don't want to do the Noon Supervision. It is a separate paid position from their regular requirements. They do HAVE to do the before, after & recess supervision. They want/need their break & so they hired me to do it for them. Some days that hour feels like 8, especially when I'm on Indoor Supervision but that's because those last 30minutes I pretty much have nothing to do but stand at the door & question what kids are doing when they come in.lol They do have TA's who come into all the classes at various times of the day to help. Guided Reading and Centres are 2 areas where there are always at least 2 people if not 4 in a class to help. All classes have a separate French teacher & some have separate library, gym, social, science & computer teachers. The older grades have a separate music teacher. Unfortunaly not all districts & schools can afford the luxury of hiring more than just the teachers.

If kids need to be talked to the teacher waits until the kids are in busy work & then takes the kid(s) out of the classroom for privacy. Berating children in front of a class has had 1 teacher here fired last year. I don't know if she was fired first or quit, but either way she was done teacher here. She moved away to teach in Mexico.

in this specific case when the teacher asked the rest of the class if they wanted him there & they said no. I wonder if they said it because it had been done before, OR if the kids were afraid of her & they said no to stay on her "good side".

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A bunch of little kids programmed to sit at desks all day with one human person, with no recess, no talking at lunch etc. ou're going to have problems.
Absolutely & it's why I'm glad our school doesn't do this. At Noon when I'm supervising I let the kids get loud to a certain point. If I can hear them down the hall they need to quieten down.lol I allow them to be up at their desks as long as they aren't interfering with others. They've been in class for just over an hour & WANT to go outside. They have to stay inside for 25minutes though & alot of days it's hard to not send them out early. In the winter it's easier.lol

I have zero training in teaching, classroom management, etc. After 1 bad day(that my real issue was lack of organization over the freezie sale) I came home & researched classroom management. I've found some simple things that I do in the classes that keep the kids eating & occupied without bugging others or doing things they shouldn't be. This week I'm in the Grade 3 and 4 pod. When I walked into Grade 3 they wanted to play one of the games I've done with them. If a classroom is not working the person in charge needs to find something that does work in that classroom, ask for help or move on.
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#158 of 165 Old 06-10-2008, 05:03 PM
 
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Just another thought, while it is isolated it does happen. Student last year accused another teacher is slamming him against the wall. This was after he was caught throwing things at moving cars. She never touched him and there were other adult witnesses. Just a week ago this same child accused another teacher of being mean and gabbing him. This child is manipulative and nasty and knows how to work the system at 9 years old. He is backed up by his mom as he ruins the careers of teachers he doesn't like.

Yes...that is true....but in this case they actual voice recording of her behavior.

My son had a teacher like this. She was supported by the other teachers, by the school headmaster....even though all the parents complained...but she was never fired. I never did anything about it. I am ashamed. I wish I had done something about it. Fortunately, she was reassigned to a different teaching task that took her out of direct contact with the children. She no longer teaches at the school, but what she did to my son, to other people's children....it still tells.

 

 

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#159 of 165 Old 06-12-2008, 02:10 AM
 
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Heffernhyphen, are you teaching at a public school or private school? How long have you been a teacher?

Quite honestly, this thread has scared the crap out of me. I am a mom of a soon-to-be Kindergarten student and if she winds up in a class with a teacher who is a burnt out and bitter as you sound, I will pull her out of there as quickly as I signed her up. I pulled my son out of a mother's-day-out program last year because I didn't care for the teacher's sarcastic tone. I wasn't going to pay $100 a month for my kid to go get yelled at twice a week.

I am curious if you have parent volunteers in your class or a classroom aide? If I suspected that you were angry or bitter with my child in the classroom, you would be seeing me all day, everyday....
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#160 of 165 Old 06-12-2008, 11:57 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Heffernhyphen View Post
Honestly? No, I'm not much the type for long-winded lectures and character attacks. When I lose it, which I do from time to time . . . even though I only teach sweet, innocent five-year-olds . . . I tend to get much more heated up and much more sarcastic. I know five-year-olds don't even get sarcasm, but it sometimes helps me. For instance, if we've been in class for 10 months, doing the same procedure every stinking day, and a kid acts like it's the first day of school, I will extend my hand and introduce myself, "Hi, I'm Ms Heffernhyphen; I'll be your teacher this year."

I know, it's shitty, but it helps me.

I wouldn't say, "You're ignorant." But I have said, "Are you thinking?! Was that a good idea?!" My words may be a bit nicer than hers, but my tone is much worse when I'm good and fired up.
Then why do you teach? God knows I wouldn't want someone with that attitude teaching my children. A little sarcasm is one thing, but that just sounds mean and cruel.

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Originally Posted by peacenlove View Post
I thought that "teachers" were suppose to be held up to a higher standard than other professionals.

There is no excuse for this behavior. period.
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I would go read the Gentle Discipline forum.

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#161 of 165 Old 06-12-2008, 01:13 PM
 
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You need to not be teaching children, dear.

This is NOT normal. This is not how you are supposed to feel about your students.
Ugh... I was thinking the same thing. Is there not a NVC for teachers programs? I bet that would help not only communication but how they view the kids - not to mention how they view traits that children have because they are CHILDREN! It is normal, but it does not fit well into the system of school as we know it today.
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#162 of 165 Old 06-12-2008, 11:07 PM
 
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One school I worked at had an observation room. You walk in the door and you're in the director's office right away. The first door on the left was to a small kitchen. The next door is to an observation room where you stood behind a one way mirror and could see the entire classroom. As a teacher, you had no clue who was in there (or if anyone was in there) unless it was a scheduled visit.

It's designed so parents and potential parents can observe the classroom without having to actually be a part of the classroom. (We did allow for parents to come in and observe as well...it just sets up a different dynamic, especially with their child. So for a better overall idea of what happens, it's best behind the mirror).

I never had the feeling I "had" to be good because someone might be back there. That didn't matter to me because I always wanted to choose the right things.

Did I mess up? I'm sure I did.
Did I apologize to the student once I did that? You bet.
Did I try my hardest to avoid making the same mistake again? Absolutely.

This seems far from a mistake. This was a big deal and any teacher should be able to recognize that it is. If they cannot, they're in the wrong business.

Matt
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#163 of 165 Old 06-15-2008, 05:49 AM
 
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When I taught one year I was in a "portable" classroom and there was another classrom on the other side of a very thin wall. (The wall was meant to be movable if you wanted to combine classes, though we never did). The other classroom was a 4th grade and the teacher there was one of the favorites at the school. She had been there awhile and was very nice & friendly to everyone. But, that teacher definitely shouted a lot and sometimes had that disgusted tone to her voice. Even if she wasn't saying anything that bad, she sounded like she was talking to someone who disgusted her. It was so sad. Sometimes my students would hear her through the wall and look at me for an explanation. I never could figure out the right thing to say! The teacher would say things like "SHUT your MOUTH".

I wish I had at least tried to talk to the principal about it, but I'm pretty sure nothing would have happened. Everyone LOVED her. And the principal was all about being strict. She once said she wanted my kids to be "well, not like robots, but like that." Um, they were 6 years old!

Anyway, I know there are bad teachers out there and it is scary to think how much power they have while no other adults are around. I wish every classroom had two teachers or at least one teacher and one aide. Maybe an "open door" policy where the principal would be walking by?
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#164 of 165 Old 08-09-2008, 03:44 AM
 
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I'm sending my babies (5 and 7 yo.) to school this coming school year for the first time and it's crap like this that just really makes me question the decision. If anyone ever spoke so unkindly to my children, well, there would be consequences.

Does anyone feel like sending a tape recorder to school with their kid just out of curiosity? Or paranoia?


-Melissa
Who is having second thoughts

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#165 of 165 Old 08-09-2008, 05:18 PM
 
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I'm sending my babies (5 and 7 yo.) to school this coming school year for the first time and it's crap like this that just really makes me question the decision. If anyone ever spoke so unkindly to my children, well, there would be consequences.

Does anyone feel like sending a tape recorder to school with their kid just out of curiosity? Or paranoia?


-Melissa
Who is having second thoughts
Just keep your ears open and help your kids talk about their days. In my experience, if something is going wrong, you'll notice. You'll see a mood change. I believe the parents from the original story did notice something, and the kid said something... that is why they took in the tape recorder. I wouldn't do a tape recorder, but I would go observe. It is telling what the adults at school think is normal, based on what they will do in front of parents.

mama to DS 9 and DD 5 and
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