Holy cow. If I have to buy all these supplies, why aren't I just homeschooling? - Page 3 - Mothering Forums

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#61 of 157 Old 06-26-2008, 10:48 PM
 
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Originally Posted by quinnsmum View Post
How many professions do you know of that have their people pay for
education that is required or pay for necessary supplies? Never heard
of any nurses who have to buy their own needles, have you? My aunt who is a kindergarden teacher spends
$1000+ a year on stuff for school, from glue stixs to snacks.
Isn't that the kind of thing where the teacher's union is supposed to stand up for their people? I just get the feeling that teachers are buying all this stuff because the administrators know that they'll buy it rather than not and the system continues to get away with not putting the money where it belongs.

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#62 of 157 Old 06-26-2008, 11:07 PM
 
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Isn't that the kind of thing where the teacher's union is supposed to stand up for their people?
There are many areas where unions, especially for teachers, are weak... Most teachers here are not union. Gives the union very little real power.

-Angela
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#63 of 157 Old 06-26-2008, 11:13 PM
 
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There are many areas where unions, especially for teachers, are weak... Most teachers here are not union. Gives the union very little real power.

-Angela
Not only that, but in some "right to work" states (FL, for example), public employees are not allowed to strike. That gives the union even less power.
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#64 of 157 Old 06-27-2008, 11:10 AM
 
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How many professions do you know of that have their people pay for
education that is required or pay for necessary supplies? Never heard
of any nurses who have to buy their own needles, have you?
I understand this except take it a step further. The client of the nurse who needs the needle isn't expected to supply the needle either.

The problem lies in the gov't who funds the hospital & the schools. The hospitals get more money so they can afford to supply the needles.

Some things I have no problem supplying. Other things I do have a problem with. Some things I disagree with ethically(baby wipes, sanitizer gels) and will not supply if they are asked for(aren't in our school).

A pp mentioned having the bells & whistles in the classrooms are nice to have. Our school has a laminater, the decorative stuff, centers, games, etc the secretary laminates & the parent group cuts out. The cost of the school(or school community council, not sure who purchased it) buying the laminater saves the teachers money in having to re-purchase these things since they won't wear down.

We have an excellent school community council(they're required by this province) that has saved the teachers alot of extra time by doing those menial jobs(cutting, colouring, photocopying, bulletin boards, decorating, etc) for them. In small ways it has cut down the amount of $ they have to spend on supplies for the classroom.
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#65 of 157 Old 06-27-2008, 09:21 PM
 
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I understand this except take it a step further. The client of the nurse who needs the needle isn't expected to supply the needle either.

Yeah, actually they are. The patient doesn't carry a needle in with them, but they pay for that needle, either through their insurance or out of their pocket.
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#66 of 157 Old 06-27-2008, 10:02 PM
 
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Yeah, actually they are. The patient doesn't carry a needle in with them, but they pay for that needle, either through their insurance or out of their pocket.
We pay for the school funding through taxes too. We aren't asked to supply extra when we go into the clinic for a shot. We aren't asked to bring in the sanitizing gel, kleenex for the waiting rooms, cleaning supplies, toilet paper, paper that goes on the beds when we come in.

As I stated the problem is the gov't & how they divide up the funding that we pay.
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#67 of 157 Old 06-28-2008, 01:53 PM
 
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I don't think that list is outrageous. it is on the long side but not terrible. They are asking for stuff in the sizes that come cheap . .

I will likely need to buy all that, pay a $70 book fee plus tuition ($6000 a year) and still do fund raisers. oh . . . and uniforms . . . its a good school though. I am not complaining.

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#68 of 157 Old 06-28-2008, 05:26 PM
 
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Quinnsmum, I totally agree with your point, it IS absurd. But, I can't expect my childs teacher to fork over the money either, THAT is equally absurd, kwim?? My daughter's First Grade teacher was saying that she usually spends $800 a year on extra stuff she doesn't get reimbursed for.:

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#69 of 157 Old 06-29-2008, 01:32 AM
 
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I have said this before, and I say it again..It is NOT the teacher's responsibility to pay for these items. Nor should it be mine. We pay enough in taxes, yet our money is going to protect oil and who knows where-else. Then we have to find these items that the teacher suggests on sale or cheap and those cheap items are made in another country, and not supporting this country which doesn't help our economy at all. (Which is another soapbox entirely.) At some point we have to stand up and demand better funding for our children. A far better investment than petrol, I'd say.
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#70 of 157 Old 06-29-2008, 05:45 PM
 
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Sorry if it sounded like I was disagreeing with you, because I wasn't. I completely agree with your point.

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#71 of 157 Old 06-29-2008, 08:11 PM
 
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I don't think the list is bad.
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#72 of 157 Old 06-29-2008, 09:36 PM
 
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Originally Posted by WC_hapamama View Post
I also tend to buck specific brand recommendations for stuff like scissors, pencils, markers and erasers, for which I have my own preferences.
The list for my rising Kindergartener includes a specific call for Purell hand sanitizer - no other brand allowed. Is there any way around this?
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#73 of 157 Old 06-29-2008, 09:39 PM
 
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Sounds like a pretty normal list. I had lists like that back in elementry school. I think it's perfectly fair for parent's to pay for supplies their kids will be using throughout the year. The education is free, the supplies helping their education are not. Parent's have always had to buy their kid's supplies. It's nothing new and I don't feel it's too much to expect.

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#74 of 157 Old 06-29-2008, 11:36 PM
 
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The list for my rising Kindergartener includes a specific call for Purell hand sanitizer - no other brand allowed. Is there any way around this?
Yep. You buy the brand you want to and give that. What are they gonna do, kick you out?

I can see certain brands being better for certain things. But for things like hand sanitizer, does it matter?
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#75 of 157 Old 06-30-2008, 09:47 AM
 
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Not only is the list typical for nowadays, but it seems pretty typical for the way it's been for some time. I'm in my *ahem* late 30's and I recall having a similar list. I would get so excited to go to the store and get all my lovely new school supplies!!


Is it tough for you financially to buy this?? Cuz I know right now given our financial situation I would be a little bummed to have to shell out $ for all that (although I'm sure schools work w/ people in this situation).
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#76 of 157 Old 06-30-2008, 11:22 AM
 
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Is this supply list thing recent? Because I don't remember ever receiving a supply list in ANY grade. Granted, I left high school in '92.

I mean, we always had to bring a notebook and a pencil, but never such an extensive list.
I graduated in '86 and never remember any lists all throughout school.

I try to remember that a lot of kids wouldn't bring anything at all if it weren't for a list at the beginning of the year. Too many parents depend on someone else to do it all for them. They send the kids off to school and I guess they just expect the teacher or someone else to give their kid what they need if they need it. It's sad that there are parents like that out there but there are.

Also, it can be disruptive to a whole class if one or two kids come in each day and have no paper, no pencil or no folder to keep their own papers in. Each time the child has to ask the teacher to fetch something for them that is taking away from class time or interrupting a lesson that has been going on. Students should be prepared and the first of the school year is the best time to make sure they all bring in what they need for the "whole" year IMO. Makes total sense to me.

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#77 of 157 Old 06-30-2008, 11:28 AM
 
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What's with all the Ziplock bags? If each kid brought in 3 boxes of 20 bags then the class will have an astonishing 900 flippin' Ziplocks, given that there's about 15 kids in a kindy class. Why???
But, you aren't taking in to account that each child will "not" bring in the Ziploc baggies. Plus, in the past when my kids were in school they were given a separate list for the classroom supplies like kleenex, soap, bandaids, baggies, etc and told that only a certain amount were needed and that everyone didn't need to bring them *all* necessarily. So that may be the case with some schools. But even if it isn't, I guarantee you that every single child in class is not bringing it all in anyway. The teachers know this too I'm sure.

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#78 of 157 Old 06-30-2008, 11:30 AM
 
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Wow. I feel pretty grateful. I live in southern Ontario, Canada and my eldest DS is just finishing JK. There was no list supplied last September - no supplies were needed. We're in the public school system.
But did you ever ask the teacher if she needed something anyway? Perhaps she was paying out part of the $$ herself.

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#79 of 157 Old 06-30-2008, 05:25 PM
 
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It looks pretty normal - last year I had to buy about that much stuff for DD's preschool plus I had to give them a $100 "supply fee" and then we were hit up for extra supplies during the year -- luckily her new school provides all of the supplies. It gets really expensive having to come up with all of that stuff. Your best bet is to hit Target when the back to school sales start. You can get stuff pretty cheap. Last year I went to WalMart to see if I could get the stuff cheaper, and their prices were not as good as Target's.
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#80 of 157 Old 06-30-2008, 05:26 PM
 
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Trust me, homeschooling costs ALOT more than that. I don't view that list as excessive at all.
That's what I was going to say!

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#81 of 157 Old 07-01-2008, 02:10 AM
 
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First, yes, the list looks normal to me. Ours (pubic school) was even longer for Kindy. We had lists like that in the early 70s and 80s too. (without things like hand sanitizer, but we did have kleenex and pencil boxes and specific sizes of Crayola crayons)

I was a volunteer para for my son for the first 4 weeks of Kindy last year and saw why it is so important to send what you can. There were kids that showed up the first day of school and weren't able to come to the classroom because the social worker had to do things like find appropriate shoes for kids who only had one pair of flip flops (and they were falling apart).

There are truly kids out there that come from extremely poor families and they aren't able to bring any supplies. It amazes me that there are so many people on this thread that are angry about communal supplies and being asked to participate in the financial burden of running a classroom. For all of the talk of "it takes a village" that I hear on MDC, it seems that even here it goes away pretty quickly when you are expected to be a part of the village.

Because so many teachers have to spend their own money to help the students that need it, I make it a practice to always send a target or walmart gift card for Christmas/End of Year presents, even if it is a small amount, to support their efforts (and not make them deal with another knick knack)

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#82 of 157 Old 07-01-2008, 11:39 AM
 
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It amazes me that there are so many people on this thread that are angry about communal supplies and being asked to participate in the financial burden of running a classroom. For all of the talk of "it takes a village" that I hear on MDC, it seems that even here it goes away pretty quickly when you are expected to be a part of the village.
I'm more aware of this after yrs of having kids in school. However, I have to admit that I initially fell into the category of being resentful when my girls first started school primarily b/c it wasn't made clear that these supplies would be shared.

My girls picked out "special" folders with kitties, purple supply boxes, extra large colored pencils with certain colors and fancy patterns, etc. -- you get the idea. We didn't realize that they wouldn't get to keep any of this. They were upset when the teacher put all of the folders in one pile, for instance, and then doled them out evenly giving my dd race car folders and giving her kitty folders to another girl.

Now that we are aware that they won't get to keep the things they select, we don't pick out supplies that they have their hearts set on. If the schools are more transparent about this, I would hope that the parents (and kids) would be less upset and mellow like we have over the years .
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#83 of 157 Old 07-01-2008, 12:35 PM
 
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My girls picked out "special" folders with kitties, purple supply boxes, extra large colored pencils with certain colors and fancy patterns, etc. -- you get the idea. We didn't realize that they wouldn't get to keep any of this. They were upset when the teacher put all of the folders in one pile, for instance, and then doled them out evenly giving my dd race car folders and giving her kitty folders to another girl.
well that does suck!

Our personal school supplies were always ours (folder, pencils, pens, notebook paper) and the communal stuff was the kleenex and manila paper (does anyone have to bring this any more?)

It is good to know some school do this (seriously it never occurred to me my kids folders wouldn't be theirs) and ask the teacher before picking out anything personal or special for your child.

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#84 of 157 Old 07-02-2008, 08:48 AM
 
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I'm in the UK and I've never heard of anyone here having to supplies crayons etc.

When I was at school (way back) we each had a tin of crayons. At the end of the year they were collected back and new labels stuck on for next years class. I don't remember anyone having a problem that they crayons weren't new.

I can see some things getting lost/used up but do you really need to get a new pair of scissors every year. Where do last years go if they are not sent home?
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#85 of 157 Old 07-02-2008, 09:57 AM
 
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But did you ever ask the teacher if she needed something anyway? Perhaps she was paying out part of the $$ herself.
I worked in southern Ontario in the early 1990s and I can state for sure that teachers did not have to buy basic supplies. Some bought extra-fancy supplies for their own reasons, but no one had to buy regular stuff.

Times may have changed but at that time the school board would do some research and then buy in massive bulk for all the kids. Then all the kids got the same supplies, and the cost was picked up as a part of the school funding as if those supplies were essential – which they were. And no, things were not fancy or new all the time (crayons, for example).

But I prefer that model because taxes are generally where we as society try to even costs out a bit – bigger homes, higher property tax, etc.

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#86 of 157 Old 07-04-2008, 06:51 AM
 
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Why is this a norm?
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#87 of 157 Old 07-04-2008, 10:41 AM
 
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Why is this a norm?
Not sure what you're asking...

School budgets cover the barest of bare supplies. Parents supply the rest. When parents don't/can't PTA/PTOs step in. If they aren't there or don't have the money, then teachers fill the void.

I have worked and observed in a number of public elementary schools. In NONE of them did they have any kind of school stash of basic kid supplies (paper, folders, notebooks, pencils, crayons etc)

-Angela
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#88 of 157 Old 07-04-2008, 01:21 PM
 
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It just always has abeen a bring your own supplies affair for me. I know I went to school every year with a big grocery bag full of supplies as well as a pretty good stock pile at home. and that started in 1980. this is nothing new in public schools.

actually I think it is kinda weird that teachers dole out stuff. how does that teach kids to be resonsible for their things.

and yeah it sucked being the kid with no cool supplies but I lived.

Also we have a charity here that supplies a new back pack full of school supplie to all students who need them (through elementry school what is neeeded is standard and individual teachers may not ask for more) from preschool through college. Supplies are donated year round by people in the community. One grocery store sells a back pack full of supplies for $5. it won't completely cover you but it will sure get you started.

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#89 of 157 Old 07-04-2008, 01:26 PM
 
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So I decided to see how much this original list would cost in these parts . . .

2x tissues generic - $2
2x folders $.20
1 spiral notebook $.10
1 box markers $1
1 box dry erase markers $7
10x large gluesticks $5
2 boxes of crayons (crayola please) $.50
1 box #2 ticonderoga pencil $2
colored pencils (crayola please) $1
3x box of ziploc bags (various sizes) $7.50 (good heavens! exactly what will they do with all these bags?)
pink erasers $1
2 liquid anti-bac soap generic - $2.50
band aids generic $2.50
1 hand sanitizer $1.50
4x6 spiral index cards $3
2 boxes baby wipes $4
colored or white copy paper $4

and those are generous estimates . . . . so max we are looking at $50 plus a back pack which can be found for around $15.

thats really not that bad and really there are just a couple things pushing that up like zip locks and glue and dry erase markers (these should really be provided by the school).

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#90 of 157 Old 07-04-2008, 01:58 PM
 
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actually I think it is kinda weird that teachers dole out stuff. how does that teach kids to be resonsible for their things.
IME it varies by age and socio/economic area. In higher income areas it has been more likely that kids keep their own stuff. In lower areas it seems more likely to be community property- for obvious reasons.

Also younger kids do better with class supplies in general.

-Angela
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