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#61 of 393 Old 01-27-2011, 01:36 PM
 
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BleuMoose--both the starter kits I registered for are one size. I figure we will probably use disposables for the first month or so, until we get used to our kid's "poop rhythms." Then switch over to cloth.

 

Okay, seriously, I just wanted to type "poop rhythms."

 

Can someone clear up--are Flips pocket diapers? Meaning, the kind where you stick in an insert or a folded prefold, but it just fits in on either end--it's not like an all-in-one where it goes under an entire layer of cloth? In other words, with pockets, you don't have to wash the cover every time, right? That's why all-in-ones don't make sense to me--it just looks like a lot more laundry to do because you'd have to wash the whole thing every time. Plus more expensive because you'd have to invest in more covers.


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#62 of 393 Old 01-27-2011, 01:43 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I don't know what PUL stands for but it's the fabric that covers like Thirsties are made of.  

 

As far as flip vs. pocket vs. AIO...I'm not 100% clear on that.  If Grodiapers are a flip diaper then flips have a diaper insert that clips in between the baby bottom and the cover.  These covers can be used with other diapers (like PFs) and can be used more more than once before washing.  With pockets like the Bumgenius, I imagine you can use different inserts but you would want them between the fleece liner and the PUL.  You can not use these covers again after pee.  The fleece gets peed through...and it would be pretty nasty to pull the diaper out and reuse.  I've never seen and AIO but I guess I assumed it was something like a flip but the diaper is sewn in?  I don't know.  


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#63 of 393 Old 01-27-2011, 01:52 PM
 
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You would be better off with double gusset PUL (Polyurethane Laminate) covers like thirsties and some trifolded prefolds (or other newborn sized diaper) inside. I say this because - EBF poo almost always leaks out any disposables I've ever used. I'd much rather wash diapers than wash and stain remove extra clothes. 

 

Flips really are just covers with a special insert. Practically the same as using prefolds and covers.  You have to wash pocket diapers - covers and all - after each pee or poo. Pocket diapers are a piece of waterproof material sewn to a piece of cloth in the shape of a diaper with a fastener and then you stuff the inside with absorbent materials - usually inserts or prefolds. HTH 

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BleuMoose--both the starter kits I registered for are one size. I figure we will probably use disposables for the first month or so, until we get used to our kid's "poop rhythms." Then switch over to cloth.

 

Okay, seriously, I just wanted to type "poop rhythms."

 

Can someone clear up--are Flips pocket diapers? Meaning, the kind where you stick in an insert or a folded prefold, but it just fits in on either end--it's not like an all-in-one where it goes under an entire layer of cloth? In other words, with pockets, you don't have to wash the cover every time, right? That's why all-in-ones don't make sense to me--it just looks like a lot more laundry to do because you'd have to wash the whole thing every time. Plus more expensive because you'd have to invest in more covers.


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#64 of 393 Old 01-27-2011, 02:01 PM
 
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Flips are just a brand name for what DayisComing explains--a cover that you stuff with its own kind of insert (but I imagine prefolds or any insert would work--my friend had some and showed me and they look really convenient. You can get disposable inserts for travel/daycare/whatever if you need them. I think all in ones and pockets are the same thing (as each other, not as Flips), then, from these descriptions...

 

DayisComing--thanks for the word of advice re. poop leakage! I will perhaps rethink my plan.

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I don't know what PUL stands for but it's the fabric that covers like Thirsties are made of.  

 

As far as flip vs. pocket vs. AIO...I'm not 100% clear on that.  If Grodiapers are a flip diaper then flips have a diaper insert that clips in between the baby bottom and the cover.  These covers can be used with other diapers (like PFs) and can be used more more than once before washing.  With pockets like the Bumgenius, I imagine you can use different inserts but you would want them between the fleece liner and the PUL.  You can not use these covers again after pee.  The fleece gets peed through...and it would be pretty nasty to pull the diaper out and reuse.  I've never seen and AIO but I guess I assumed it was something like a flip but the diaper is sewn in?  I don't know.  


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#65 of 393 Old 01-27-2011, 02:01 PM
 
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I'm seriously considering cloth diaper our 3rd (due late April). We used disposables for our first two. I've been to two Cloth Diapering 101 workshops to help me wrap my mind around it all -- SO incredibly useful and full of information! If I hadn't of been able to take these workshops, I'd be utterly confused as well. It's great there are so many options and varieties these days, but it just makes it harder to decide if you ask me.

 

Although I still don't know which types/brands I'll start out with, the consensus from the workshops seems to be to have an assortment of different types, since each baby is different and day/night/traveling may call for different types each. Also, it was recommended to not cloth diaper until the meconium poop stage is over since it stains. Detergent used to wash them is also a huge factor ... which one is best for you depends on your water quality (hard vs. soft, etc.). Be sure to look this up. I have a chart from Bummies on acceptable detergents, but was told there are many charts available online with this information.

 

Going to my first cloth diaper swap in two weeks! I've got until then to decide, period -- husband is not happy I'm considering this :-) Once I have my beginning stash, I'll learn what I like best and use cloth diaper swaps (locally or online) to get what I like and unload what I don't like using.

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#66 of 393 Old 01-27-2011, 02:05 PM
 
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An AIO diaper is literally like a sposie but in cloth form. There is nothing to stuff, take apart or cover.

 

http://www.bumgenius.com/all-in-one.php

 

Pros:

Super easy to use

Nothing to stuff (no putting in inserts like a pocket dipe)

No covers needed

 

Cons:

Expensive

Takes a long time to dry

Can have bad stink issues


 

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  I've never seen and AIO but I guess I assumed it was something like a flip but the diaper is sewn in?  I don't know.  

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#67 of 393 Old 01-27-2011, 02:38 PM
 
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PUL = polyurethane laminate. It's a semi-breathable plastic. It's not completely occlusive like the old plastic pants that didn't allow for any air flow. More air flow is more sanitary. Because of that you can't really consider them completely waterproof. It's more like they are very water resistant. If they get wet enough, fluid will eventually soak through. I never had that problem with the center of my PUL diapers or covers. The problem I had was that the urine would wick from the inside across the fabric that covered the elastic around the legs and get clothes wet that way. Or with something like Wonderoos, the inner lining is sewn directly to the outer PUL layer so the inner layer could sometimes touch the clothing and urine could wick through that way. They also don't contain poo messes as well. With a separate cover over a diaper there's an extra complete barrier to contain poo that might leak out of the diaper. I did not have problems with wicking or leaking with Fuzzibunz.

With pockets, and it sounds like flip diapers (never heard of those before), you do need to wash the outer shell every time. You don't reuse the shell when the insert gets wet because the lining of the shell is now soaked with urine or covered with poo. With separate covers, whether PUL or microfleece or wool, you don't need to wash those after every change. Wool and microfleece can be reused several times before it needs to be washed. I washed my PUL more often because it seemed to get wetter and stinkier faster.

They will all lose their water resistance eventually. You can re-lanolize wool to regain that water resistance. You can't do that with PUL and drying PUL on hot will cause the plastic to break down faster. I recently read that you can use fabric softener on PUL to improve the water resistance. You don't want to use any kind of fabric softener on any of your absorbent diapers, inserts or AIOs because that will decrease their absorbency. Even using fabric softeners in the same washing machine and dryer on different laundry can decrease the absorbency of your diapers because the chemicals coat the machines and then transfer to anything that's washed or dried in the. You could probably use fabric softerner on fleece as well.

Oh, that's something to keep in mind that I found very handy. Any 100% polyester fleece clothing can be used as a diaper cover so those polyester fleece footie sleepers and pjs can double as diaper covers. 100% polyester fleece pants, shorts and skirts work. You would just want 2 or 3 pairs to use in a day so you can alternate one while the other is drying.

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#68 of 393 Old 01-27-2011, 03:12 PM
 
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IdentityCrisisMama,
I like Disana for general wear.  I but atleast a size up and felt down.  I love lanas for night, they are bulletproof.  I only use them at night but they never leaked.  I got mine used off diaperswappers.  Love love love interlock for the day.  Ive paid 28-35 new for the Wild Child and Luxe Baby ones and think they were worth every penny.

I think buying recycled or knitted wool is hit or miss.  Be prepared to lanolize the heck out of them and you can make mildly scratchy ones softer.  People's idea of soft just varies so much Id pick a WAHM that had great community reviews.  I wouldnt do snap/velcro wool and I dont dig the boiled wool covers either.

hyenacart is horrible.  LOL

The cute knitted soakers without the felting and a looser weave do work, but only for daytime.  Sometimes youll get a little dampness if you have a super wet diaper.  I used alot of them once baby started crawling and walking.. one less layer of clothes to take off and put back on.

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#69 of 393 Old 01-27-2011, 03:23 PM
 
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Polyurethane laminated.  It means the material has one side that is waterproof.

 

ETA: Oops!  I thought this wasn't answered but there was a WHOLE OTHER PAGE!! Sorry!


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#70 of 393 Old 01-27-2011, 03:36 PM
 
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They will all lose their water resistance eventually. You can re-lanolize wool to regain that water resistance. You can't do that with PUL and drying PUL on hot will cause the plastic to break down faster. I recently read that you can use fabric softener on PUL to improve the water resistance. You don't want to use any kind of fabric softener on any of your absorbent diapers, inserts or AIOs because that will decrease their absorbency. Even using fabric softeners in the same washing machine and dryer on different laundry can decrease the absorbency of your diapers because the chemicals coat the machines and then transfer to anything that's washed or dried in the. You could probably use fabric softerner on fleece as well.
 


This is why I went with pockets over AIO.  The covers dry super fast even if I just hang them in the bathroom and then I can blast the absorbent insert on high heat. 

 

The thing I found that works for avoiding detergent/mineral build up that causes stink:  I do a cold rinse and then a hot wash.  When I do the hot wash I leave the washing machine top open which stops it from going to the agitation stage and I leave it for an hour or overnight.  Then I close the washer and it completes the cycle.  The extra soaking time has really helped reduce needing to fully strip the diapers.  I add Calgon (not the "take me away" kind the kind in the laundry aisle) to help remove build up to my wash cycle.

 

Of course, I think stink can be completely avoided with a natural fiber, right?  I just knew prefolds were going to scare DH senseless!  Fuzzi Bunz were an easier transition for him and he's SAHD so I relented. 

 

I have a question - I want to do prefolds/covers until the OS FB fit (I'm having twins so expecting relatively small babies).  I'm wondering, realistically, with newborn breastfed poo if you can really reuse the cover?  How many covers do you think I need (per child) for the newborn period?


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#71 of 393 Old 01-27-2011, 03:52 PM
 
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hyenacart is horrible.  LOL

<</p>



 



What's wrong with Hyenacart? For buying used diapers and covers or just wool or new soakers or both?

Liora ~ How many covers you need really depends on how much or little you want to have to wash. With one baby, I know some people get by with just 2 covers. One to wear while the other is drying or to be washed. I'd want to have at least 4 per baby so I have a back-up in case there's a blow out and I don't get to washing right away. You might be able to get by with 6.

You can reuse the cover as long as there isn't poo on it. Obviously, if poo gets on it, you would want to wash it before using it again. It would only get poo on it if the poo leaked out the sides of the diaper, which can happen. The cover is really only to keep clothes dry. It's not absorbent at all, not for holding urine or poo.

One of the things that attracted me to wool rather than PUL is that unprocessed wool is naturally antibacterial. PUL and polyester fleece are not.

I definitely had more problems with stink with my fleece covers. I finally quit using them because I couldn't get the stink out. I also had trouble with felted wool, though. I think part of my problem is my front-loading washing machine. I've decided it is not good for cloth diapering. I don't know why but my diapers started fraying very quickly after I got the front loader and stank bad. I'm planning to get rid of it and get a plain ole top loader.

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#72 of 393 Old 01-27-2011, 03:55 PM
 
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Get the orange edge GMD prefolds (green mountain diapers) and it's a good idea to have 8 covers from what I read. I am referring to PUL covers. I'm not sure how many you'd want if you don't use PUL. I think it'd be a pain to use all wool or fleece on newborns though. 

 

I bought preemie prefolds once and they are just too tiny and don't look absorbent at all. 

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I have a question - I want to do prefolds/covers until the OS FB fit (I'm having twins so expecting relatively small babies).  I'm wondering, realistically, with newborn breastfed poo if you can really reuse the cover?  How many covers do you think I need (per child) for the newborn period?


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#73 of 393 Old 01-27-2011, 04:44 PM
 
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I personally think you can easily do well with less than 8 covers. If you are on a budget, 8 is a lot to buy. We have 5-6 and that is more than enough to have a couple drying, a couple clean and one in the diaper bag.
 

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Get the orange edge GMD prefolds (green mountain diapers) and it's a good idea to have 8 covers from what I read. I am referring to PUL covers. I'm not sure how many you'd want if you don't use PUL. I think it'd be a pain to use all wool or fleece on newborns though. 

 


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I can only speak for myself but it's the most UN-user friendly site I've ever seen.  It makes no intuitive sense to me.  I do like Spot's Corner but that's the only thing on there that I can deal with.  
 

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What's wrong with Hyenacart? 

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I can only speak for myself but it's the most UN-user friendly site I've ever seen.  It makes no intuitive sense to me.  I do like Spot's Corner but that's the only thing on there that I can deal with.  
 



 



Oh, I thought maybe there was something specific about the products or a problem with people get ripped off trying to get used stuff. I've heard Diaperswappers has problems with that. I don't think I've ever actually bought anything from there. I've only ordered from a few of the yarn co-ops. I've never used Spot's Corner but I have seen it when people post yarn for sale on Ravelry.

I used all wool with my newborn and didn't find it difficult at all. However, I do have a lot because I knit my own stuff. I have an entire trash bag full of hand knit wool soakers, shorts and longies.

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I would agree that 8 is a lot but if she plans to trifold and has a lot of poo on the covers - I could see the benefit of having that many. I have 7 x-small and 7 small covers. 

 

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I personally think you can easily do well with less than 8 covers. If you are on a budget, 8 is a lot to buy. We have 5-6 and that is more than enough to have a couple drying, a couple clean and one in the diaper bag.
 

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Get the orange edge GMD prefolds (green mountain diapers) and it's a good idea to have 8 covers from what I read. I am referring to PUL covers. I'm not sure how many you'd want if you don't use PUL. I think it'd be a pain to use all wool or fleece on newborns though. 

 




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#77 of 393 Old 01-27-2011, 06:18 PM
 
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Definitely planning to cloth diaper.  My last 2 were in cloth plus wool covers 100% of the time and I plan to do that again.  We use a dry pail and wash every 2 days (usually).  I prefer WAHM made diapers and covers.  I already have 18 elbees for this baby!  So excited about that--I got XS size, so I am also trading a friend (and WAHM)  to make me some NB diapers, and then some one size for after the extra smalls.  We use cloth wipes also, and this same friend makes the best ones I have ever tried.

 

For wool, I knit a LOT of my own, but I also love Wild Child Woolies.  She's on Hyena Cart and also Etsy.  They are pull-up soakers and pants.  She lanolizes them and they work extremely well.  I love the breathability of wool and the fact that it's a natural fiber. 

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MW - regarding the problems DS was having with fraud, I know they have really cracked down, now they won't allow you to sell without going through an identity verification process. I think they have done a decent job addressing the problems and I've purchased a few things there with no trouble whatsoever.


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#79 of 393 Old 01-27-2011, 07:07 PM
 
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What's wrong with Hyenacart? For buying used diapers and covers or just wool or new soakers or both?

Oh, I just meant using it.. I hate how they never update stocking calendars and you have to know when people are stocking.. and be like a stalking ninja to get the things you want often.

 

 

 

Oh and I think you could get by with wayyyy less covers then 8.  I had 4 for the newborn period and one never made it out of its packaging. Thirsties and a good angelwing fold and a snappi really helped me not have any problems with leaks more then once a day max.. more like once or twice a week..  So, if there was a poop explosion, Id just handwash the one cover and hang to dry.  It would be dry in a few hours.. if you stick it in the drier it takes less then 10 minutes.  We started wool only at 3 months and rarely had a poop leak, especially since I was using alot of fitteds by then.  I had 2 luxe, 2 wcw (both interlock day covers) 1 disana, 1 lana.. and that was plenty.. I ended up making a huge stash of wool but really could have easily gotten by without 2 of the interlock.

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Oh, I just meant using it.. I hate how they never update stocking calendars and you have to know when people are stocking.. and be like a stalking ninja to get the things you want often.



 



Ah, gotcha. I really haven't used it. I had 2 or 3 fave dipes and only stalked them by joining their yahoo groups. I did have to do some serious stalking for my fave fitteds but they were worth it. That was totally for fun, though, not from necessity.

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#81 of 393 Old 01-28-2011, 05:35 AM
 
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So I had another discussion with my reluctant husband about cloth diapering last night. One thing he brought up that I haven't heard talked about amongst cloth diaperers is the washing machine turning into a 'bacteria bath'. From everything I've read and talked about with others, I'm certain with the right detergent and wash cycle (cold rinse & spin, full wash on Hot/cold, extra cold rinse & spin) that the diapers and machine will be absolutely clean and free of pee & poop (and thus so will the family clothes).

 

If you cloth diaper and use your own washing machine to wash them, have you found that it's necessary to change filters or run an empty load with special detergent to clean out the washing machine? Has anyone else's husband mentioned using an ultraviolet light to illuminate the bacteria in the machine and our family clothes as proof??

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#82 of 393 Old 01-28-2011, 05:56 AM
 
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If you're going to illuminate your machine and clothes for bacteria, do it before you start washing diapers in it, too. You might be surprised by what you see.

To answer your question, I never had any problems with my top loader. I always wash on hot water and do a prewash, regular wash and extra rinse. My front loader and my clothes got stinky but that, apparently, is an issue with front loaders and not from washing dipes in it. I do have to clean my front loader by running an empty cycle with cleaner once a month. Also, breastfed poo is very different from artificial baby food poo. It won't leave the stains and gunk that artificial bay food poo might.

I keep forgetting to mention two things that can help with that. You can get biodegradable, flushable diaper liners. They catch most of the poo and you just flush it down the toilet. The other thing is a sprayer. It attaches to the water inlet on your toilet. You just spray any solid poo off the dipes and into the toilet before putting the dipes in the diaper pail.

Diaper Liners: http://www.toysrus.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2333113

Diaper sprayer: http://www.jilliansdrawers.com/products/clothdiapers/accessories/minishowerdiapersprayer

Bumgenious Diapersprayer: http://www.clothdiaperoutlet.com/bumgenius_diaper_sprayer.html, looks the same as the other one.

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#83 of 393 Old 01-28-2011, 06:18 AM
 
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MarineWife: thanks for the quick reply! After I posted, I realized I should do some internet searching first. Yes, I do agree that the light should be used prior to us getting cloth diapers. We do have a front-loader, but I've been told that a way to trick the machine to use more water is to put a wet towel in with the load. Although, I have CD friends with front-loaders who don't do this and say everything comes out clean.

 

Some good points my quick research made were that family underwear is equivalent to dirty cloth diapers. Soiled clothes (of pee & poop) have been in the machine, too, when our children were still in disposable diapers. Also, hot water wash kills bacteria, dust mites, etc. I'll have to get that exact temperature number, along with the hot water temperature number from our washing machine's manual to make my point ... only the facts will do with him :-)

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#84 of 393 Old 01-28-2011, 09:02 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I think it's a good point to bring up the washers.  We have a really old washer and the first thing I thought of when I decided to take the challenge of washing my own (instead of using the magical, beautiful service) was that I needed a new washer.  Turns out, based on my reading, that an old junkie machine is probably fine...if not preferable to some of the newer machines.  Something to keep in mind if anyone is worried about their old machine.  

 

I got an Aristocrat soaker in the mail today (got it second hand off Spot's Corner)  What a nice diaper for it being second hand - it looks untouched!  The wool isn't as super soft as I expected but, still, it is nice and I think worth the $20 I spent on it.  


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#85 of 393 Old 01-28-2011, 09:10 AM
 
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Marinewife is right.  THere are already tons of bacteria in your washer (remind him that his underwear and towels already get washed in there!).  Didn't Matt Lauer - or one of the other germophobe media types - do an "expose report" on the germs lurking in your washing machine that could get on your clothes and make you sick? (insert scary dramatic music here) LOL

 

I used a minishower sprayer and will again.  I tried the liners but mostly they bunched up and I had to spray anyway so I just skipped them.  I only had my FL machine a few months before DD PT'd but never noticed any issues beyond the typical FL stuff (keep door open till dry between loads, do the monthly maintenance with bleach or vinegar).  You can also do things like add vinegar or TTO to the diaper loads for disinfecting - or even a tiny splash (like a tsp) of bleach.  If he's still super worried, keep a spray bottle of diluted vinegar, bleach water, or whatever your family is comfortable using and give the wash tub a quick spritz after diaper loads.  ;)

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#86 of 393 Old 01-28-2011, 09:31 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I have another wool question.  With something like an un-felted Aristocrat - can you stretch the cover over your diaper or does that cause leaking.  I'm looking at this small Aristocrat and I swear if this new baby grows the same as DC this diaper will fit for A LONG time, especially if you can stretch it over a diaper.  Thanks!  


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#87 of 393 Old 01-28-2011, 10:09 AM
 
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LOL! KimMama are you married to an engineer? Because he sounds just like my BiL. My sister is talking to him about HB right now...she has to do the same things. But the good news is once you get them on your side they KNOW it is right and will defend it (CDing or HBing) to the death!


><> I'm a Christian, knitting, sewing, cooking SAHM to the fearless adventurer Jack born 11/08, and  a  USCG wife
And we are joyfully awaiting a new addition in April 2011! <><
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#88 of 393 Old 01-28-2011, 10:22 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IdentityCrisisMama View Post


I have another wool question.  With something like an un-felted Aristocrat - can you stretch the cover over your diaper or does that cause leaking.  I'm looking at this small Aristocrat and I swear if this new baby grows the same as DC this diaper will fit for A LONG time, especially if you can stretch it over a diaper.  Thanks!  




 



First, it's a wool soaker (cover), not a diaper, right? A diaper would be made of several layers of cotton or hemp or bamboo or a synthetic absorbent material (my mind just went blank at what that's called). Knit, unfelted wool stretches like crazy.

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#89 of 393 Old 01-28-2011, 10:33 AM - Thread Starter
 
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MW,

 

It's an Aristocrat cover -- I assume unfelted - doesn't look felted to me.  Just like the picture here: http://www.aristocratsbabyproducts.com/diaper_cover.html.  It is super stretchy, which if you can stretch it w/o having to worry about leaks, means that my child can probably wear this one size until potty learning.  My 9 year old can fit it (we make small people).  twins.gif  

 

If i can stretch this thing - it's way, WAY worth the $$ and I'll get a few more.  Maybe even the super expensive Kissaluvs.  

 

Also, I just got out the felted Lana diaper I have and I've got to say I don't like it as much - but maybe it's way more absorbent (seems so).  Perhaps I'll use that at night and use the unfelted knit by day?  


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#90 of 393 Old 01-28-2011, 10:38 AM - Thread Starter
 
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LOL! KimMama are you married to an engineer?


I can see my close engineer friend becoming the biggest CD weenie on the planet!   


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