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#91 of 120 Old 07-02-2012, 09:22 AM
 
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I was at a small beach the other day, perhaps 15+ people. I took note of what the kids were wearing.

Besides my niece who is 8 (and wearing a "bikini" - bikini bottoms with a top that covered her entire front (triangle top/top, skirted bottom), and ties in the back), my 2 year old (in a sun suit / bikini) and my 9 year old son, swim trunks & bare chested (someone above thought a bikini exposes lots of skin, but so do boys trunks, even though they are long, the upper half is all bare) and a bunch of other younger kids and a couple other girls approximately 10-12, in various types of bikinis.  Not one child was strutting or being flirtatious or posing / being sexy. They were a bunch of kids having fun in the sun, frolicking in the sand, running up and down the beach, playing in the water and not giving particular attention to anyone else.

 

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#92 of 120 Old 07-02-2012, 12:50 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Sharlla View Post

dd's first swim suit is a bikini.

 

 

oh Sharla what a BEAUTIFUL picture. i dont even see the bikini. i see a child having so much FUN. what a joy to see. 


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#93 of 120 Old 07-03-2012, 06:16 PM
 
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I think that's Lindsay Lohan; that is a GREAT suit.  I've got no beef with adult women wearing bikinis if that's what they want.  Showing off your bod in a sexy suit is your perogrative, and if you've got it, flaunt it!  My point is that prepubescent girls don't "got it" quite yet, so flaunting "it" is not something I think is a great idea. 

I don't think prepubescent girls are thinking about flaunting anything, they are thinking about having a neat suit they like and many other people, young and old, also wear. I just realized that my dd's tankini top is one that has a "adult" cut at the top but it isn't anything that concerns me and it hasn't made her act differently. I think a bikini, will be the same once she gets one and I don't think it will make a difference in how she acts or sees herself. It may change how some parents see her but around here she is late coming into possession of a bikini so it shouldn't be an issue.

I agree with the many posters who have pointed out that the adult ideas we have about bikinis aren't the same as the ideas the children wearing bikinis have. I am glad this discussion is taking place because it has helped me work through my worry about my dd wanting a bikini.
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#94 of 120 Old 07-03-2012, 06:57 PM
 
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With DD1 I was against it because I thought it was part of the early sexualization of children in our society.  But with DD2...I just didn't feel that way any more, and bought a cute bikini for her when she was just 9 months old.  I still wouldn't buy one that said JUICY on the butt, though!

 

It's really a lot easier to change diapers on a squiggly baby that way.

 

HOWEVER- if they're really going to get a lot of sun, I try to have them in rash guards for sun protection.  Most of the ones we have are two piece, like a t-shirt and full butt coverage bottoms. 


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#95 of 120 Old 07-04-2012, 07:50 AM
 
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I am apparently not conveying myself well.  I am not in any way implying that little girls who wear bikinis are flaunting anything, nor thinking about it; that teenagers or women who wear bikinis are "looking for trouble", or that there is anything wrong with bikinis in general.  I think the human body is an amazing, beautiful thing and that bikinis can look killer when the right suit on the right person.  We go to no great lengths to cover up in our house when transitioning from showers to dressed, so we are not button-ed up totally modest people over here, either.

 

My problems are that clothing manufacturers and fashion industry are marketing "sex sells" younger and younger to girls in every season of clothing, in dolls, in all other forms of media/advertising, while boys are being covered up by looser and bigger clothes (but also being programmed that girls should be wearing much less than they are). Sometimes it's subtle, sometimes it's blatant.  I don't like the message it sends, period. 

 

A boy's torso may be exposed when he's wearing just board shorts, but he is completely covered from his waist to his knees in billowy fabric.....not in a pair of tight, small underwear and no top.  Huge difference. 

 

Again:  If *everyone* was dressing this way, in shorter, tighter clothes ( a la the 70s, 80s), then it wouldn't be as big of a deal to me. When I look at pictures of me as a kid, all of us were wearing shorts that were mid thigh and snug, fitted tshirts, tube socks; boys and girls.  I cannot find a pair of shorts for my son in a local storefront that is above bermuda length or are fitted, but 75%+ of the shorts for my daughter at the same stores don't even approach mid-thigh and are very snug.  I can find bermudas for her, but even those are snug.  THIS is the problem I have with clothing in general, and it extends to bikinis.  Not that little girls think they're flaunting anything, but that girls are expected to have that as a choice of normal, but boys aren't.  I hate it.

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#96 of 120 Old 07-04-2012, 09:04 PM
 
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so heather what you are saying is you dont like the genderization of the clothes that are happening now right?

 

like if boys are loose and flowy so should girls be that way. 

 

so there should be bermudas loose that are in pink and blue right?!!!

 

i think you bring up a very good point about blending in. what if everyone is wearning a bikini but your child wears a one piece? clothes is one area people DO tease. 


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#97 of 120 Old 07-05-2012, 09:28 AM
 
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I don't think there's any real "should be", that's the point.  I don't think all girls should be wearing coulottes and all boys should be wearing short shorts.  I just don't like the expectation/implication that having one gender of children's clothing being mostly small/short and snug, and the other's mostly big/long and loose brings about.  What is the message being sent?  Not one that I like or agree with. 


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#98 of 120 Old 07-05-2012, 09:47 AM
 
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 What is the message being sent?  

 

 

that the majority do not feel like you do

 

it's a consumer driven market and it sells- at my local Target there were no bikinis even left for young girls- only a few one piece outfits

 

children's clothing reflects adults and their desires- if the demand wasn't there neither would the items

 

we don't desire (as a society) to see larger woman in covered up bathing suits- what sells is the opposite and men don't seem to be getting thinner and wanting to have smaller suits so you won't see thin types for young boy

 

majority dictates fashion 

 

you may not like the message but it won't change unless the majority change their mindset 


 

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#99 of 120 Old 07-05-2012, 10:00 AM
 
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I fully realize that I'm in the minority, but it doesn't stop me from getting irked about it.  ;)


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#100 of 120 Old 07-05-2012, 11:58 AM
 
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I fully realize that I'm in the minority, but it doesn't stop me from getting irked about it.  ;)

hey i dont mind you being irked about it. what i would like to do is understand your point of view. it helps me understand how i look at it.

 

but hasnt the disparity in clothing always been there? historically? except for the 80s 90s (however i wont say i really know about fashions in the last 100 years). i'm thinking of the typical 1800s fashion and those before where men wore tight clothes and women wore loose gowns with corsets inside. i mean werent there a disparity in clothes most of the times with genders?

 

on another level hasnt the demand always been there? when i was growing up there were no bikinis or even bras for 3 4 year olds. so what i had to do was wear my moms bra and stuff them. however dd didnt have to do that because she had her own bra at 3 that she was sooooo proud of. she never had to wear mine the way i wore my mom's. 

 

but yes i totally agree with the capitalist consumption. the whole make your money while you can. if there is a desire fulfill it. if there is none then create it.

 

the way the bikini irks you, its the bottle of pasta sauce that irks me the most. get people more addicted to processed food. make it easier to eat- harp on no cooking but spending time with your family - so no one needs to eat whole foods and thus the corporations can make money.  so why grow a great tasty tomato that you cant make money on - make pasta or pizza sauce. 

 

i guess what i am discovering Heather is that the bikini irks you, but its the food industry that irks me. because most of america does not cook anymore. they just assemble - which they call cooking. and one day that's going to cost us a great deal. which it already does.  


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#101 of 120 Old 07-05-2012, 12:36 PM
 
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I would never dress my daughter in a bikini, personally. I think its a combination of things. Bikinis aren't inherently practical. They are flimsy, expose too much skin to the sun and could impede fun. Also they fall under the same category as racy underwear in my mind. In that sense they don't align with my values. Because I do personally believe that bikinis are just for attracting attention and that a ten year old shouldn't be mimicking that sort of behaviour. You are going to the beach presumably to have a swim and splash about, not for the opportunity to wear a cute bra like some particular adults. A bikini to me is placing an adult expectation on the way a girl should look, so going to the beach stops being about having a swim and also starts to be about wearing the right sort of thing.

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#102 of 120 Old 07-05-2012, 04:47 PM
 
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i guess what i am discovering Heather is that the bikini irks you, but its the food industry that irks me. because most of america does not cook anymore. they just assemble - which they call cooking. and one day that's going to cost us a great deal. which it already does.  

 

Oh, that irks me, too.  lol.gif   I'm finding the older I'm getting, the more grossed out I am by our society as a whole - I think humans can be awesome and many, many are from all walks of life, but the mainstream, popular culture that is presented in the media is so disconnected from a lot of what *made* us human and connected that it makes me sad.  Re:  clothing, that's just one of many issues I take with women's issues in society.  And yes, the disparity has been there for a long, long time, but has not seemed to be as increasingly hypersexualized as it is in recent decades.  Also the older I get, the less I want my daughter to have to deal with the BS - she is a little girl with a WIDE range of interests, and I do NOT want that squashed by the culture machine, nor do I want her to think she owes it to society, or anyone to be pretty/attractive.  This is a HUGE thing for me, because I will admit I bought into all of it when I was younger....until about the last 10-15 years or so, really - I was raised to think that beyond being smart and capable that it was also important that I look appealing, and while I don't think it necessarily scarred me, I do think it's a crock.  My only obligations to society, IMO, are to be a decent, contributing person.  Looking as good (or bad) as *I* want to is what matters.  How I look has NOTHING to do with my worth or value to society, nor should it bear on how I am treated.  But alas, that is not the society we live in, so I find the older I get and the older my daughter gets, the more vocal I am becoming about these particular topics.  Beyond that, making sure my son doesn't wind up contributing to the problem and this topic alone feels like a full time job!!

 

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#103 of 120 Old 07-05-2012, 05:09 PM
 
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Bikinis aren't inherently practical.

personally as another poster mentioned I find them extremely practical! I never wear a one piece - they make going potty great-quick and easy!

 

I over heard a mother today complain how she was throwing away the one piece when they got home because of what a PIA it is to pull up a wet suit on squirmy toddler.


 

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#104 of 120 Old 07-05-2012, 07:59 PM
 
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i actually just pull the crotch over to side to use the bathroom, very simple

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#105 of 120 Old 07-05-2012, 08:00 PM
 
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Oh, that irks me, too.  lol.gif   I'm finding the older I'm getting, the more grossed out I am by our society as a whole - I think humans can be awesome and many, many are from all walks of life, but the mainstream, popular culture that is presented in the media is so disconnected from a lot of what *made* us human and connected that it makes me sad. 

oh gosh heather. that is my BIGGEST fear now. gosh i am turning into such a CROTCHETY old woman. 

 

but i am really working on not doing that. i am trying to see that society isnt all about grossed out. i am trying to see all the good there is around you know. which means i dont watch fox news but i know that NPR and democracy now and foreign media DOES exist.

 

the one big thing i dont like about myself is i can become way too pompous with a holier than thou attitude. and i dont want to be that. i dont want to see society as bad. i look back at my mom and i see the same things which today are normal for us - used to irk her so much. 

 

that really isnt true. while yes main society is fooled a lot, but good parts do exist. 

 

its capitalism and deculturization that disgusts me today. we all go how terrible the slave trade was. compared to todays women and children slavery the holocaust and the total americas slave trade was just a drop in the ocean (well maybe a bucket in the ocean). today the amount of people in slavery (mostly women and children) is the biggest than the world has ever seen. 

 

but there is so much more also going on. so much good stuff. like microloans (to me that whole program is ABSOLUTELY BRILLIANT based totally on trust and morality), people helping people on a one to one basis. that is so rising. 

 

so i am trying to focus on the miracles happening around and not try to focus only on the bad things ya know. i dont want to die a embittered, sad woman. 


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#106 of 120 Old 07-05-2012, 08:00 PM
 
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i actually just pull the crotch over to side to use the bathroom, very simple

Me too.

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#107 of 120 Old 07-05-2012, 08:08 PM
 
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i actually just pull the crotch over to side to use the bathroom, very simple

 

 

you clean a butt this way too? or isn't it really cleaned?

 

please explain how you get a toddler to do this too?

 

 

I'm really curious since both of mine held on to the toilet and couldn't not even do this own their own- and certainly would not feel comfortable doing it since is goes against how we normally go-how is this done?


 

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#108 of 120 Old 07-05-2012, 08:29 PM
 
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My 2 year old moves her crotch over and squats to pee. But only outside at our house or somewhere where peeing outside is okay. Otherwise, she has a diaper on.

I move my crotch to pee, not to poo. I take my whole swimsuit off to poo.

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My 2 year old moves her crotch over and squats to pee. But only outside at our house or somewhere where peeing outside is okay. 

that doesn't work at our local pool-big NO NO


 

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#110 of 120 Old 07-05-2012, 08:49 PM
 
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I just had a very comical memory of when I was a teenager and dancing 5 days a week, and being able to pee without taking my bodysuit off by p-u-l-l-i-n-g my tights wayyy down on the sides, then pulling the crotch of the bodysuit over.  I can only imagine the pain/mess that would have been involved if my tension/grip broke and it all snapped back on me.  God bless lycra/spandex! lol.gif


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#111 of 120 Old 07-06-2012, 06:42 AM
 
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My 2 year old moves her crotch over and squats to pee. But only outside at our house or somewhere where peeing outside is okay. Otherwise, she has a diaper on.
I move my crotch to pee, not to poo. I take my whole swimsuit off to poo.

wow!!! that's amazing. my 9 year old cant do it. in fact when we go camping we carry an yoghurt container for her to pee in.


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#112 of 120 Old 07-06-2012, 10:26 AM
 
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Pulling the crotch over only works if your kid is not a stubborn child.  Mine would pee her pants before she did that.


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#113 of 120 Old 07-06-2012, 02:02 PM
 
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I'm in the "it has to be practical" camp for my 9 YO DD.  But that changes depending on the occasion, which is why she has lots of suits and they are a mix of styles.  IMHO, a "string bikini" is never practical for a child.  (And it probably shouldn't be for a grown woman but that's a different set of posts.)  But a two piece can be great when she has to wear a swim suit under clothing at camp and she won't be swimming until the afternoon.  Otherwise she has to take off everything to go to the restroom -- standing on the floor in bare feet with clothing piled on dirty floor -- yuck!  But if she is going to be diving through the waves in the ocean, a one-piece makes more sense because it is more likely to stay on.  And a one piece is less likely to get a rash on her tummy from boogie-boarding.  Swim shirts come off and on depending on weather, sun, length of time outside etc.  But then, we live in So. CA and she wears a swimsuit at least once a day in the summer, so it makes sense for us to have several on hand.  If I were limited to one, I would probably choose something between a two piece and a tankini as the most practical "all purpose" suit, with a swim suit/rash guard to go with.  And, of course, her preferences count too -- she should feel good about the way she looks and like the clothes she wears.

 

Choosing any clothing generally means a conversation about practical clothing from all sorts of angles -- does it stay put, will it be in the way, does it fit, does it itch, is it appropriate for the occasion, can I wash it... but also does she like the color, does she like the way it looks, does it make her feel good, is she comfortable with the message it sends...  Doesn't really matter if its a fancy party dress or a swim suit.
 

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#114 of 120 Old 07-06-2012, 04:45 PM
 
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wow!!! that's amazing. my 9 year old cant do it. in fact when we go camping we carry an yoghurt container for her to pee in.

Wait, you mean she won't pee outside? I think that is pretty normal, but we live on a farm and are often pretty far away from the house (meaning, a toilet), so DD has been peeing outside for a while now. Most little kids arent in situations where they pee outside very often.

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#115 of 120 Old 07-06-2012, 05:56 PM
 
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i hate peeing outside, we camp/swim at places that have a bathroom.
 


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I would rather pull down a swimsuit bottom than pull over the crotch to pee, and I'm guessing my girls feel the same.
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#117 of 120 Old 07-07-2012, 06:45 AM
 
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Originally Posted by mamazee View Post

I would rather pull down a swimsuit bottom than pull over the crotch to pee, and I'm guessing my girls feel the same.

Yeah, there is no way my 6yr old would do it. She has a very set idea of right and wrong, and usuing public bathrooms and porta potties is challenging enough for her already!
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#118 of 120 Old 07-10-2012, 09:51 PM
 
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Two-piece, yes, bikini, no. By two-piece I mean a tankini (NOT a halter top style bikini) or a shirt with bottoms. In the US, many chain stores routinely carry the shirt/bottom style for girls now, even in toddlers. I don't wear a one-piece myself, but I was not allowed to have a halter style bikini until 10 or 11 & I see no problem w/ that whatsoever. I prefer some modesty for my girls and I do not see how a bikini of any kind is remotely modest.


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#119 of 120 Old 07-12-2012, 10:17 AM
 
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I guess my question for you would be is there anytime when you feel that a bikini would be inappropriate?  Like if she gets boobs in 5th grade, are you going to want her to wear a 1-piece because the 2 piece makes her look to old?  If so, then I would say no.  My mom let me wear 2 pieces when I was little.  Then when I started to develop, she freaked and wanted me back in one pieces.  I really thought she was ashamed of my body.

 

I do not have a problem with 2 pieces, but my kids do not swim without a parent, so I do not worry about people looking at them.  We live in the south, so we usually do swim shirts (even my son), to minimize the sun exposure.  DD has a 2 piece with a swim shirt top.  I wear a tankini.


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#120 of 120 Old 07-12-2012, 02:10 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adaline'sMama View Post


Wait, you mean she won't pee outside? I think that is pretty normal, but we live on a farm and are often pretty far away from the house (meaning, a toilet), so DD has been peeing outside for a while now. Most little kids arent in situations where they pee outside very often.

no she will pee outside but she hasnt perfected the squat method without getting her pants wet. so she pees in a cup and then waters the plants with it. 

 

lol.gif instead of using a feminine urinary director http://www.rei.com/product/407267/sani-fem-freshette-feminine-urinary-director we use a yoghurt container. 

 

she is little miss perfection. one drop on her and she has to change. 


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