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#31 of 47 Old 08-20-2012, 06:15 AM
 
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After reading all the posts, I think that if you visited Europe, you'd be surprised to see kids in the park at 10pm during summer holidays :)

 

My daughter gave up napping when she was about 3.6 yr. She tried a few different schedules but what she has been doing since she was 4, she goes to bed at about 8:30 (and fall asleep at about 9:00) and wakes up at 7am -this is during preschool/kindergarten. During holidays she can stay up late (up to midnight but this is rare) and wakes up between 8:30-10:00. She doesn't nap during the day and this works well for her and us. 


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#32 of 47 Old 08-20-2012, 10:49 AM
 
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Somehow for working parents and/or kids that are required to be somewhere by 9 am, this would not work well.

 

I am always surprised at the amount of kids that stay up late during summer--- many kiddos I know have to be up for camp/childcare/etc because parents are awake/working by 8/9 am. But, yes in the summer I often see kids in the common area of our townhome until 9/10 pm. I cant imagine them getting up at 6/7 am!

 

Even when Dh is on vacation (or I am not working), we keep roughly the same schedule. It makes for crabby kids to stay up for a few days and then switch back to early wake-ups. DH works 40+ hours and I work part time.

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#33 of 47 Old 08-20-2012, 01:42 PM
 
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KC i work from home so i dont have to be anywhere.

 

our summer schedule is way off. dd goes to bed around midnight to 3 am and gets up anytime between 11 and 2 pm. if there is a great book she wakes up earlier. 

 

the thing is that is dd's natural rhythm that we have to constantly change when school is out. 

 

when she had to do camp we went back to our old routine. 

 

she is such a relaxed happy different child during summer that i just cannot keep to her early routine. plus the neighborhood kids are out late so dd is out late too. 

 

and because i am home, i can do this. 

 

we are the type of family where it would suit us better if school started at noon. in fact there are many countries which actually have school starting that late. 


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#34 of 47 Old 08-20-2012, 01:56 PM
 
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Meemee, my kids wouldn't usually stay up til 3am (for sleepovers or other special occasions—no prob), but would usually go to sleep around 11pm or midnight. That's their natural rhythm, too. They're not super early risers, but often get up around 8 or 9. Maybe sleep in until 9:30, but rarely later than that. 

 

I've often thought we were on more of a European schedule. We eat late, too. They don't want breakfast when they first get up so we often don't eat brunch until 11am and then maybe have lunch at 3 and then supper around 8 or 9. That's our natural rhythm. It is an adjustment for school. I don't know why it seems like society looks down on night owls. Many people (including me at times) are often at their most productive in the evening or even overnight hours. I guess it's ol' Ben Franklin's fault with that whole "early to bed, early to rise" saw.


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#35 of 47 Old 08-20-2012, 05:31 PM
 
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Originally Posted by meemee View Post

KC i work from home so i dont have to be anywhere.

 

our summer schedule is way off. dd goes to bed around midnight to 3 am and gets up anytime between 11 and 2 pm. if there is a great book she wakes up earlier. 

 

the thing is that is dd's natural rhythm that we have to constantly change when school is out. 

 

 

we are the type of family where it would suit us better if school started at noon. in fact there are many countries which actually have school starting that late. 

 

 

That makes more sense. Around here- few parents work from home. It is a suburb and a large commute-to-work area. I often wonder if the kiddos I see outside at 10pm that also go off to camp for the day in the morning get enough sleep.

 

It is hard to fight natural rhythms....one of my DDs is the opposite. She would get up at 5am if we let her and frequently asks when bedtime is on a day that is busy.

 

We purposely chose a school that started early (half Elem. school start one time other half start an hour later) for that DD. She does so much better in the morning. Other DD is a morning person, but not to that extreme.

 

 

I have a hard time understanding why our High School start so early, when it is proven that teens have a 'later' biorhythm than everyone else. They would be best with a 10 am school start time, but around here it is 7:25!! 

 

Anyone know how the current 'school' schedule came about timewise?? Now I am curious...

 

 

 

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 I guess it's ol' Ben Franklin's fault with that whole "early to bed, early to rise" saw.

Heehee! This made me laugh since it is pretty ingrained in American culture. I think we are one of the earliest 'eating/sleeping/start work' nations. A good friend went to France for a year and LOVED the more laid back atmosphere. Also the workday was broken into 3 am hours  (9-12) and then 4 pm hours (2:30-6:30). She adored it- then she ate a late lunch/dinner/etc. She said she never felt better rested since she could sleep in, but still had time to exercise & rest midday.

 

DH is a night owl and often rails that the work day does not suit his tendency to just get going as the day is winding down and everyone is leaving the office. He often will work from home in the evening since he is more productive then.

 

Me- I am a mid day person. I have a hard time getting things done before 9am or after 9pm!

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#36 of 47 Old 08-20-2012, 06:54 PM
 
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Originally Posted by KCMichigan View Post

I have a hard time understanding why our High School start so early, when it is proven that teens have a 'later' biorhythm than everyone else. They would be best with a 10 am school start time, but around here it is 7:25!! 

 

They do have the schools set up in our area so that Elementary school starts earliest at 7:50, then middle at 8:20, and high school at 8:45. I just wish it was all another hour later. 

 

Love that France schedule. Sounds wonderful!


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#37 of 47 Old 08-20-2012, 10:14 PM
 
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Originally Posted by KCMichigan View Post

 

I have a hard time understanding why our High School start so early, when it is proven that teens have a 'later' biorhythm than everyone else. They would be best with a 10 am school start time, but around here it is 7:25!! 

 

Anyone know how the current 'school' schedule came about timewise?? Now I am curious...

ugh!!! high school here starts the same time as yours. if dd wants to still do her favourite elective she has to be in school by 6:40!!!! i am grateful for the opportunity, but come on. 

 

current school schedule i believe are from the english factory school days. i have noticed here over the years that no matter where one is from elem. school usually starts around 8 am. whereever there are later times i have found in my experience they are the mother language schools in foreign countries. in the commonwealth - english based schools all start around 8 am. 

 

and i believe even today the factory system is still highly encouraged. 


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#38 of 47 Old 08-21-2012, 08:43 AM
 
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Originally Posted by KCMichigan View Post

I have a hard time understanding why our High School start so early, when it is proven that teens have a 'later' biorhythm than everyone else. They would be best with a 10 am school start time, but around here it is 7:25!! 

 

Anyone know how the current 'school' schedule came about timewise?? Now I am curious...

 

 

 

That seems so early. DD's high school starts at 8:50 am. and I think that's typical for most schools in the area. 

 

I wonder if it's a combination of a majority of 2 income families and the organization of  junior and senior students for the school bus schedule. In our system, to maximize use of the buses, each bus runs 2 routes in the morning and afternoon. There is an "early" route for schools that start around 8 am and end after 2 pm. The schools on the "late" route start around 9:30 am and end after 3:30 p.m. It means the system needs fewer buses overall but serves a fairly large number of students.

 

If your high school students start at 7:25, I'm guessing they are done at 1:25 pm. It's not a big deal if a teen is out of school in the mid-afternoon since they don't need babysitting. However, if there are mostly 2 WOHM parents in the families in your area, it would be very inconvenient for parents if their small children were all done school just after lunch. 

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#39 of 47 Old 08-21-2012, 11:38 AM
 
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If your high school students start at 7:25, I'm guessing they are done at 1:25 pm.

 

Are you talking about year round schools? I know for me high school was 7:45-2:45. For my son it is 8-3. It does seem a bit much to me. There are no minimum days at all.

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#40 of 47 Old 08-21-2012, 12:01 PM
 
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My kids are about the same ages - DS is 9, DD is 6. 

 

Bedtime during the school year is between 7-8pm for both of them, and not later than 8pm in the summer.  DS rises at 6am (sometimes earlier in the summer when it is lighter earlier) and can very rarely sleep beyond that no matter how late he goes to bed, so we keep a very tight bedtime with him.  He needs that amount of sleep and things go downhill quickly if he doesn't get it, even for one night.

 

DD is much easier going about sleep.  And she will still nap on occasion in the car. We do her bedtime routine at the same time as DS, but she is allowed to do quiet activities in her room after 8pm.  She will read, draw or play quietly, and falls asleep on her own usually by 8:30 or 9pm.  She usually sleeps until 7am, sometimes as late as 8am in the summer or on school year weekends.

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#41 of 47 Old 08-21-2012, 12:31 PM
 
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I was just thinking about this thread again. Retail hours are much more compatible with our family's lifestyle than the school hours gig. Many stores (like at the malls such as Gap, etc) open at 10am and close at 9pm. That's closer to our natural rhythm than getting up at 6am and eating supper at 5pm. 


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#42 of 47 Old 08-22-2012, 09:37 AM
 
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Are you talking about year round schools? I know for me high school was 7:45-2:45. For my son it is 8-3. It does seem a bit much to me. There are no minimum days at all.

 

Your school day is 7 hours. That seems long to me because I'm used to school days that are closer to 6 hours. That's why I speculated that the pp's 7:25 start would result in a 1:25 dismissal. (And no, not year-round schools). Even with a 2:25 dismissal, that's still a challenge for working parents to arrange care for most of the afternoon, since most workplaces end the work day closer to 5 pm. Not a big deal for teens, but significant for younger students. I think this is all OT, though, since my guess that school bus schedules are part of the issue for setting school timetables hasn't been confirmed. 

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#43 of 47 Old 08-22-2012, 06:24 PM
 
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I believe high school here runs from 7:25-2:10 with 30 minutes for lunch. If a school had a longer lunch period, the day would probably be longer so the required number of instructional hours were being met. Maybe the goal is 6 hours not counting lunch and homeroom?

 

The middle school starts next and the elementary school starts the latest. The staggered starting times is so the same buses can drive all the kids, of course.


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#44 of 47 Old 08-23-2012, 12:28 PM
 
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 For my son it is 8-3. It does seem a bit much to me. There are no minimum days at all.

is this middle school? do they get an hour lunch and longer breaks? maybe that's why the school day is long. in our area its only in elementary school that lunch is 45 mins to an hour. from middle to high school lunch is half and hour with one ten minute break in the morning and 4 mins between each class.

 

dd is a  happy camper. due to budget cuts and other reasons her elementary school just cut out half an hour from the day. 


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#45 of 47 Old 08-25-2012, 12:32 PM
 
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is this middle school? do they get an hour lunch and longer breaks? maybe that's why the school day is long. in our area its only in elementary school that lunch is 45 mins to an hour. from middle to high school lunch is half and hour with one ten minute break in the morning and 4 mins between each class.


This is high school. And he only has one 10 minute break and then a 40 minute lunch break. The elementary school is 8:30-3.

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Your school day is 7 hours. That seems long to me because I'm used to school days that are closer to 6 hours. That's why I speculated that the pp's 7:25 start would result in a 1:25 dismissal. (And no, not year-round schools). 

It seems long to me too. We are in CA. Maybe that's just typical of the schools here. And like I said, my high school (also here) was 7:45-2:45 with the same breaks as my son's.

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#46 of 47 Old 08-26-2012, 10:29 AM
 
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Our district went to later starts for middle and high school about five years ago. There's lots of evidence that it improves attendance an test scores, lowers truancy and behavior issues. Side effect for home life is that with less unsupervised time it also appears to lower pregnancy rates in some communities.

My kids aren't to high school yet, though my oldest is in middle school. So my kids have not moved to later rising. They both are up with th birds, and always have been. I've had people suggest I keep them up later so they would sleep later, but that never worked. They might sleep 30 minutes longer if kept up several hours late, but they would also be cranky and emotionally fragile. They really need a solid 9-10 hours of sleep most nights; when they get up at 6am, that means bed between 8 and 9, ideally. And that's for upper elementary. Through about 2nd grade, they did best with 8pm as the latest time we would aim for.

While I know that averages are averages and every kid is different, I suspect that there are huge numbers of children who are very, very sleep deprived, most of whom have parents who say "well, my kid is different! S/he just doesn't need much sleep at all!". Then they usually list a bunch of behavioral symptoms of sleep deficit and call them evidence that the kid doesn't need or want to sleep.

Given the growing body of evidence on the role of sleep in hormone production, particularly growth and appetite control hormones, I wonder what role chronic sleep deprivation has in things like the rise of childhood obesity, diabetes, etc.

savithny, 42 year old moderate mom to DS Primo (age 12) and DD Secunda (age 9).

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#47 of 47 Old 08-26-2012, 11:50 AM
 
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This is high school. And he only has one 10 minute break and then a 40 minute lunch break. The elementary school is 8:30-3.

It seems long to me too. We are in CA. Maybe that's just typical of the schools here. And like I said, my high school (also here) was 7:45-2:45 with the same breaks as my son's.

So that comes to 6 hours of instruction time subtracting the break, lunch, and 10 more minutes likely spent moving from class to class. Our high school does not have a 10 minute break and has only 30 minutes for lunch so the day is a little shorter. 


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