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relationship with dd deteriorating...HELP

989 views 15 replies 7 participants last post by  Sofiamomma 
#1 ·
Lately the relationship between dd & I is really deteriorating...I am absolutely miserable & I assume she is too.

She has always been 'spirited' & challenging, but lately I don't want to be around her. She throws tantrums, stomps her feet, screams, slams her door, refuses to comply. I feel like all day all I do is tell/ask her to behave differently than the way she is behaving. I am perpetually stressed with a terribly headache & sore, tense muscles (which makes it even more difficult to simply let things go...like running through the house, using loud voices in the house, etc).

I tell her when I appreciate her behavior. I talk to her about her feelings. It obviously isn't helping.

Is this sibling related??? My other dd is almost 10 months old. Helayna is very loving toward the baby & I spend one-on-one time with Helayna every day...but maybe she is unable to cope with having a baby around.

I feel so sad & guilty & upset...
I am to the point where I wish she were @ school 8 hours a day. And I know that is awful.

Do we need counseling/therapy??? Any insight would be greatly appreciated!!!
 
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#2 ·
First - let me empathize with you. I have a DD - 4 1/2 and she is a terror and I hate being with her sometimes, so I know what you are going through.

My first suggestion - take some time away from each other. My DD is in day care/school 3 days a week and I work 30 hours a week so I have some adult time and she lets off energy so we are not at each other's throats all the time.

2nd - I have found that sometimes when she is having a tantrum and she is so out of control, I suck it up and hold her - like a hug, but a little tighter and rock her (kind of like a straight jacket hold). This seems to calm her down some so we can talk a little about what is going on. I loosen my grip/hold as she calms down. I kiss her and remind her I love her even when she is having a tantrum.

3rd - When there are no listening ears on, I simply send her to her room and tell her she can't come out until she is going to listen to me. Unless she has to use the bathroom or eat dinner - then right back to her room. I always have to stress the extras because she takes everything at face value. She usually cries and storms upstairs. I wait about 5-15 minutes depending on the situation and then I go up and hug her (#2) and discuss her listening skills and why it is important she listen to me.

It is a very difficult situation to be in and take some time for yourself too - remember, the kids need you, but if you can't cope, then you are no good to them. It also got so bad recently for us, DH got a herniated disk and was useless for over 1 month - I couldn't cope and went on antidepressants. It's been about 1 month that I have been on them, and I now have a lot more patience to deal with DD than before. I am not suggesting that you do the same - unless you feel you need to - but that was what I needed for me and it has helped all around.
Let me know how things go.
Marcie
 
#3 ·
If you think you need professional help, get it. Go on your own for the first while and if you trust the person, bring your dd as well.

Please read Mary Sheedy Kurcinka's book "Kids, Parents, and Power Struggles". It is excellent and it puts your child's behaviour and your own in perspective. It is not a light read as parenting books go, but it is very helpful.
 
#4 ·
something other than "telling her to behave differently"? I know this will probably upset some here, but it sounds like you need a more constructive discipline plan. Too loud a voice you can tolerate, but slamming doors and stomping feet? To me that would be an unacceptable behaviour and earn a time-out. Or some other consequence that has meaning to her. When we were having problems with biting at preschool, just the threat of no TV time when he got home was enough to completely change my son's behaviour. Yes, you need to respect her personality, but if its causing you that much stress, its time to take some action too. If you feel more comfortable working with a professional, that's a good idea too.
 
#5 ·
I do send her to her room...but that doesn't seem very helpful. She slams her door (often more than once, kicks the wall, sometimes destroys things). Anger management issues???

DD is not allowed to watch tv during the week as a family rule, but I certainly could take away her weekend a.m. videos.

I think I need to do a better job of choosing my battles & not react to her all the time.

I started a Zoloft prescription yesterday (I have a LONG history of depression) & I hope that it will take the edge off my extreme irritability. Almost everything she does (litterally) is like a car alarm going off. So, after a few hours of the car alarm going off I am ready to explode. EVERY DAY is like that.
Sometimes I feel that way after only 5 minutes & then there are 10+ hours left together. I suspect she is responding to that by her out of control behavior (screaming, slamming doors repeatedly, etc).

I made a vow to not yell @ her today...so I hope today will be the beginning of a better relationship between us. We used to be extremely close. When things are calm she is still very loving & affectionate. I tell her I love her several times a day along with hugs & kisses.


One second at a time............
 
#7 ·
I hope the Zoloft helps too. I've been really lucky that some earlier depression problems haven't resurfaced with the arrival of children.

Good luck on the "no yelling" vow. Maybe a general lowering of the volumn will help both of you.

I have one friend who got so annoyed with door slamming that she removed the door. Her daughter was a preteen, so privacy was really important and it got the message across really fast. Sort of a variation on "if you can't take care of it you can't play with it" rule. I've stashed it away as an option if I ever have a door slammer.

Good luck and I hope you have a great day!
 
#8 ·
I have been reading a book about home schooling gifted children (DD has a very high IQ) and it was talking about how many gifted choldren have asyncronous (sp?) development. So, dd can read 5+ years ahead of her peers, does math about 3-4 years ahead of her peers, but her emotional development &/or her extreme sentivity, intensity, & superabundance (HIGH energy) make life very challenging. I expect too much of her because she is so intellectually advanced. She is still a little kid (almost 6) who is extremely sensitive, intenxe & HIGH energy. That is who she is & it is wrong of me to want or expect her to change...to stop. No wonder she is getting out of control. She is being asked to be someone other than herself all day. Especially less high energy. She can mo more easily change that than I can become HIGH energy on demand. That would make me angry & out of control!!!!!!!

SO...I hope that will my new perspective I will be able to approach her with more patience, compassion, empathy.


Wish me luck.
 
#9 ·
Maybe it would help to find a way to use all of that energy? Is she in sports or anything? Maybe a daily dance / gymnastics / soccer / swimming / whatever workout would help. I have a super-high-energy 3 year old, and if he doesn't get enough time to run each day he is impossible to control. Days he is in preschool he gets plenty of playground time. Days when he is home (I work PT) I make a special effort of at least 2 hours of physical play. Now that its summer that is usually an hour at the park in the morning and an hour in the pool in the afternoons. If its a particularly intense day, we add a walk with the dog. Its good for both of us! Or, maybe you could find something you could do together, because I bet the exercise would help you too. I know that when I had depressive episodes before, daily areobics were really important to my recovery. Do you have a YMCA or something nearby that you could both use?
 
#10 ·
Oh, angelsmama, your realization is wonderful! What a new way to look at things that may be the *right* way to look at things! I think your new perspective is awesome and a great reply to your original post!
My 4yo sounds alot like your DD. I am having her tested in a couple weeks to see if she is gifted and/or hyperactive or ???(although I can't get her to sit still long enough to even teach her to write or anything). I think if I have more insight as to what is going on inside her head and body, I will be better able to cope with things and not expect them to be different. I will know why she is acting the way she is acting and I can respond appropriately. Right now it's just very frustrating and I'm feeling like a crappy mother. I cried the other day because I tried to talk to her (gently, holding her, etc.) about her behavior and she wouldn't give me the time of day. I felt like I was losing her and we were always such best buds.

Good luck to you and your DD!!


Melanie
 
#11 ·
Angelsmama -

Quote:
I have been reading a book about home schooling gifted children (DD has a very high IQ) and it was talking about how many gifted choldren have asyncronous (sp?) development.
What exactly is this?? I tried looking it up in WebMD and there was nothing there. Where might I find more info on the web?
All this sounds like my DD which I have stated before. I have tried reading books on dealing with high maintance/energy children and they don't give many good ideas that have actually helped or worked. I have tried, but with no success. I am always looking for new and inovative was to deal with her and make our lives more pleasant. We seem to always be at odds with each other - just like everyone else here.
How is the Zoloft working??
DD latest is when I get upset with her about something - like purposely making a mess - she says "you don't love me, you always make me clean things up myself and know you won't read a story to me". One has nothing to do with the other! I have no idea why she says these things. Another example - I will tell her to go get her Pj's on and brush her teeth and get into bed. She will then say - What no book, no story? I say - I didn't say that, did I? I said to get ready for bed.. I will be in shortly to read to you and tell you a story. She gets all these ideas in her head. She takes everything very literal. I really have trouble with it.
 
#12 ·
There was a period of about 6 to 8 months that I couldn't stand my oldest DD. She is also spirited/high needs/gifted and she was behaving so horribly I actually called my mom to see if she could go live there for awhile.

I wish I could say that I have some miracle cure for you, but the only thing that seemed to fix the problem was time. I did get her involved in some activities (ballet, preschool, Irish Dance, gymnastics) and that seemed to curb her hyperactivity and meanness. However, it really was just a matter of time. Now, a year and a half later I can barely remember what she was like back then. She is a totally different child.

Just continue to do your best to support her and let her know you love her, and don't give her attention for the negative. My uncle who is a child psychologist said that fastest way to extinguish negative behavior is not to acknowledge it AT ALL. Kids will do anything to get attention, and they don't care if it's positive or negative. When she discovers that the negative gets her no attention at all she may drop some of the behaviors. We have used the technique successfully to stop swearing and hitting.

You will live through this, but it won't be easy. I'm so sorry you're going through it right now.

Good luck.
 
#13 ·
Quote:
Originally posted by mingber
Angelsmama -
What exactly is this??
I presume you are talking about the title of the book I'm reading? If so, it is Creative Home Schooling for Gifted Children. I liked Rasing Your Spirited Child as well. A site that might be insightful is http://www.hoagiesgifted.com There are a lot of resources there if you think your dd may be gifted.

It may be helpful to see a child psychologist/psychiatrist who specializes in giftedness. You might contact your public school & ask to speak to the person in charge of gifted ed. (if there is one) & they might be able to help. Another option is to call around. We took dd to see one (I feared she had ADHD or something else). He tested her & then explained that she has a very high IQ & many people with high IQ exhibit behaviors that can be mistaken for ADHD.

I laughed when you explained some of the things your dd says. Lately, mine has also been saying things like "why can't we go to the park today?" when therehasn't been any mention of the park & I would be happy to take her. My dd is also very literal & serious. She is annoyed by playful teasing or silly things people say to children. I recall being the same way.


DD is extremely challenging & I expect she always will be. I just have to constantly remind myself that she didn't choose to be born this way & it is critical that I help to foster a deep sense of self-acceptance & joy in who she is (even if she is difficult, exhausting & exasperating right now).

As for the Zoloft...I am in better spirits & more patient. Unfortunately, I am also much more tired. I felt tired all the time before, but now I actually feel like I need to sleep.
If I take it at night, my baby awakens frequently, crying. It might have been a coincidence, but after 2 nights I switched to taking it in the a.m. & it stopped. I hope that it (drowsiness) will go away as my body adjusts.

Feel free to pm me if you wish (any one here).

Take care!
 
#14 ·
Quote:
Originally posted by jen and her girls
fastest way to extinguish negative behavior is not to acknowledge it AT ALL.
Jen,

Does that include behaviors like slamming doors repeatedly, drawing on the carpet, chewing on books, being too rough with her baby sister, refusing to comply with requests (like putting toys away when finished), etc? Or does that just apply to annoying, but minor things like saying the same word OVER & OVER & OVER...?
:

Thank you.
 
#15 ·
I suppose it might work for the being rough with the baby sister thing, too, but I sure as heck wasn't about to test the theory. I used the IGNORE IT technique with things that were annoying, but not harmful - and I would put most of those things you mentioned into the harmful category - if it harms her, someone else, or your property I would vote to stop her, and do it fast.

I still cannot get over how similar our situation was to yours such a short time ago. I swear, I could have written your post. Emma is also gifted (IQ is 136) and I think she has definitely developed mentally much faster than she has emotionally. I also agree that I have come to expect too much from her because of how advanced she is. I forget that she is only 4, and not 14. But it's SO hard to discipline and guide these kids who have such a tremendous amount of energy and anger. I thought I was just a total failure as a mother until I had other kids, and realized that they are much different than Emma.

The antidepressants also helped me tremendously, I was able to be more calm with her, and she was more calm with me.

I am going to make one more suggestion, and I don't know how you will feel about it, but maybe you might allow her to watch a little bit of tv during the week. PBS does offer some excellent programming. Maybe a little time in front of the tube would give her a chance to decompress and give you a break from her. Just a thought.........

I had another mom at the park describe parenting a gifted child as "a bittersweet sojourn" - I thought she was nuts, but now I can see that she was absolutely right on.

If you ever want to e-mail me, please feel free.....

jenostrum@comcast.net

Take care,
 
#16 ·
Weird, my dd does that with the "what, no story?" when asked to get ready for bed thing, too. I started packing up her lunch once after telling her we had to hurry and would be leaving when I'd finished and she could eat in the car. I had *just* told her that and when she saw me packing up her stuff she started screaming like a stuck pig "DON'T THROW MY LUNCH AWAY!" I call it "assuming the worst". I don't understand why she does it, but I've been talking to her a lot lately about stopping to think, before she reacts, about what the person's best possible intention might have been. For instance, Suzy just stepped on my foot. I'll bet it was because she was backing up to get out of Tommy's way and didn't know I was standing here. Rather than, "YOU DID THAT ON PURPOSE!"

She is also extremely gifted. I have't had her tested yet (I'm almost afraid to, I can't quite sort out what the ramifications of *knowing* would be), but if I had to guess I'd say it was about 160-180. She's smarter than me, that's for sure and my mom's is 160 and the two of them are about an even match. Anyway, I agree it is hard sometimes to remember not to expect too much of her and just let her be a kid. It must also be hard to be a kid who is smarter than the folks you rely on for care and guidance. Maybe I should rent "Little Man Tate" or "Searching for Bobby Fischer" again.

I, too, have periods where I really don't like her and that makes me feel very, very bad and guilty. It is especially difficult when coupled with the feelings I have about others not liking her, which range from blaming her to blaming myself, to blaming others. sigh. We are in an upswing now out of one those bad periods. We usually have them when she is on the 3/4 year mark (or 3 months before her birthday), but this time it was 3 months after her birthday, but we also just added a new baby. Maybe we get to skip the rough time at 6 3/4? One can always hope!


What works for me is using Love and Logic, natural and logical consequences and being as honest as I can with her. Honest to the point that I wonder sometimes if it is appropriate to provide so much information to a 6 year old. And this includes my own feelings. She very much doubts my love right now. I've never said, but she knows this baby is easier for me and it makes her feel I love her sister more. She was at me and at me and at me the other day about how I was nicer to the baby and cared more about her being upset, etc. Finally, after being very patient, giving many reassurances, etc. I snapped, "Okay, I do like the baby better, is that what you want me to say?" She stopped fussing at me and was quiet, tears running down her face. We had a very good heart to heart talk after that about the care a baby needs and that I had given her what I am giving her sister, but more when she was a baby. She had me all to herself. I explained that I was giving her the special care she needed for who she is at the age she is. I also said I was not going to hold back my affection to the baby in order to spare her feelings. We also talked about how love is multiplied not divided. She seemed very happy and satisfied with my explanations and was much calmer. I'm still trying to make a concerted, but sincere effort to reassure her she is loved, though. Yesterday, I told the baby that I was going to miss her while I was at work. Sophia quickly asked in a very tight voice, her whole body rigid, "Will you miss me, too?" I said, "Yes, that's why I called you last night from work, because I missed you." It was the truth and she knew it and I could see the relief flood over her and she relaxed. Tonight she wanted to know if the button on my diaper bag said "Kids Are Special" or "Babies Are Special." I think this means she has caught on to my soft spot for babies. She saw my signature here and asked why I had chosen the baby symbol. I explained it was because I loved babies so much (I am a midwife and L&D nurse) and quickly added "and the kids they grow into", but I think she knew it was tacked on. Sigh. I need to watch that she does not translate this into meaning I therefore don't like kids. She is so very, very smart and knows me so well. I have to really stay on top of things to keep up with her or she plays me like a fiddle.

With very annoying behaviors I use a Searsism, "that disturbs my peace." I also use the energy drain stuff from Love and Logic. It really drains my energy to listen to you slamming around and saying the same thing over and over and over, so I will have less energy when the baby is asleep to read to you, play a game, etc.

P.S. edited to add we also use PBS, educational videos, yoga videos, and the occasional (
) <gasp!> Disney video around here, too
 
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