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  Topic Review (Newest First)
07-18-2010 06:50 PM
WuWei This is my new favorite site for evidence-based research about alternative treatments. There are over 120 studies linked from PubMed about the power of probiotics!

Pat
03-08-2010 09:13 PM
annarose999 bump. it took me two days to find this again!
01-23-2010 11:51 PM
treehugginhippie bumping and subbing
08-09-2009 06:51 PM
WuWei


Pat
06-07-2009 06:13 PM
WuWei My favorite subject.


Pat
01-13-2009 07:31 PM
momofmine Wow, Pat, you rock! Thanks for digging this up! I'll be back tonight to read more.
01-13-2009 04:36 PM
tanyalynn I need to go back, I just thought I'd share our dairy-free probiotic approach. We're dairy-free, have been for a year and a half and probably will be for at least another 2 or 3 years, I'm guessing. I love making fermented vegetables. In fact....

http://mothering.com/discussions/sho...ight=fermented

this thread in Traditional Foods is full of great ideas about how to ferment many, many different types of veggies. I like the section on fermented veggies from Nourishing Traditions, but it makes it seem very complicated (and it calls for whey, which is just strange) but this discusses how to really do it and have the ferments turn out.

For now, given that we can't have any dairy, I am starting to look into whether fermented veggies that some cultures have consumed in relatively large volumes (sauerkraut, kimchee, pickles, haven't gotten beyond that yet) could have a comparable effect on regulating the bacterial balance in the gut.

I can say that having kimchee and pickles 2-3x/day (after we'd taken out our allergens, for us gluten and dairy) has had a very nice effect on her poop. It was somewhat pale and falling apart a bit too much (variable depending on other things as well) but it's turned brown and formed and it looks nice.

http://www.enzymestuff.com/rtstools.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bristol_Stool_Scale

I found those helpful with the poop situation.

I haven't looked far yet into how much difference, in terms of bacteria, there is between different types of veggie ferments, but for right now, I'm trying to focus on ones we like that have a history of being eaten in volume.

Now I'll go back and read this monster thread. It looks fun.
01-13-2009 03:37 PM
naturalmom08
Quote:
Originally Posted by goodearthmama View Post
I didn't read through all 25 pages, but I did read something the other night that I did not know and thought was a great tidbit of info:

Your child receives 80-85% of their probiotic bacteria when they pass through the mother's birth canal during natural childbirth. The remaining 15-20% is acquired through the child's environment (soil-based org. in food & natural environment or probiotic supplements, etc.)

WOW! Just one more reason to advocate a natural birth!!

Also, after reading that, I am researching how to really boost up my personal probiotic count and intestinal flora before I give birth to my first this July(or June). I will post a thread soon about it when I know more!! or anyone else knowledgeable about this-let me know!!
Came across this old post today, and wondered if anyone else had any more info on this. This is the first I've heard about this. I know babies get probiotics through breastmilk, but hadn't heard about getting it during natural birth. And what about other births (with meds administered) causes the babies to not get probiotics during birth?

Also to add, for those of you asking about what to give young babies, I've always given my 9 mo. old dd a probiotic...natrogen or Jarrowdophilus, or Primadophilus for kids. I don't give more than the suggested amount, but have given due to antibiotics (she's had 2 surgeries), and flu season. Interesting tidbit as well...did you know that about 70% of our immune system is related to our guts? Good reason to take a probiotic.
01-09-2009 05:51 PM
WuWei
11-30-2008 12:46 PM
WuWei Bumping to read more.

Pat
04-12-2007 12:11 AM
TushasAmi
Quote:
Originally Posted by PapayaVagina View Post
Here's a thread where you can post for people to send you some

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=517191
Thanks a lot! I hadn't ventured over to the tradional foods forum yet. Lots of good info there!
04-10-2007 11:55 PM
PapayaVagina
Quote:
Originally Posted by TushasAmi View Post
Great! Thank you. Any suggestions about which ones and where to find them?
Here's a thread where you can post for people to send you some

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=517191
04-10-2007 09:35 PM
TushasAmi
Quote:
Originally Posted by PapayaVagina View Post
You could do water kefir grains
Great! Thank you. Any suggestions about which ones and where to find them?
04-10-2007 01:13 PM
PapayaVagina
Quote:
Originally Posted by TushasAmi View Post
I started reading this thread a few weeks ago and was getting excited to make my own yougurt and then figured out that dd is sensitive to dairy. So then I thought I could make water kefir using the Body Ecology kefir starter powder. However, I emailed them and they told me that their starters are cultered on dairy and therefore are obviously not dairy-free.

What are my options for homemade probiotic foods that are dairy-free? and what starter can I use?

Thanks for any help you can give me. I'm eager to get started!

-Heather
You could do water kefir grains
04-10-2007 12:00 PM
TushasAmi I started reading this thread a few weeks ago and was getting excited to make my own yougurt and then figured out that dd is sensitive to dairy. So then I thought I could make water kefir using the Body Ecology kefir starter powder. However, I emailed them and they told me that their starters are cultered on dairy and therefore are obviously not dairy-free.

What are my options for homemade probiotic foods that are dairy-free? and what starter can I use?

Thanks for any help you can give me. I'm eager to get started!

-Heather
04-02-2007 11:30 AM
cohsmama I started doing kefir about 2 weeks ago. I gave my dd and ds kefir twice since then. My daughter developed a stomach ache 5 days ago. For 2 days it was just stomach ache. Then, she developed a fever and has been doing cold/flu symptoms with a major sore tummy. Is there any chance that I gave her some germ-y kefir?

I had one day where the kefir smelled like acetone. I dumped it, rinsed it and have been kefiring successfully since then. She hasn't eaten it since before that day. My ds is fine and I am fine.

Thanks for helping me figure this out.

Ann
03-31-2007 04:10 PM
JaneS
Quote:
Originally Posted by Love_Cyber_Cat View Post
Hello!
After reading this wonderful thread I still have a question- can you believe it?
Is it OK to feed 8 1/2 mo baby with homemade yougurt? She is going through stomach virus and i would love to help her immune system fight it off, it seems she is doing better but then in a few days she starts puking again. She is EBF with just a few solids here and there- nothing big...
Thanks!
Maybe, it's really individual. If she has had digestive and gut flora problems it could lead to allergic reaction but if not it's fine. Yogurt predigests the proteins so really it makes sense for yogurt to be the first introduction to dairy for a babe. You can also take the probiotics yourself, there's really nothing better than healthy breastmilk for the digestive system. I think at her age she probably still needs bifidobacterium and maybe L. Reuteri and L. acidophilus will help combat the crisis.

Vitamin A is also excellent at treating viruses (standard measles treatment) get some high vitamin cod liver oil and take a tablespoon yourself, she will get the A thru your milk.
03-31-2007 04:02 PM
JaneS
Quote:
Originally Posted by mat4mel View Post
Yet another newbie here with questions.

I would like to give my 5 and 2 yr old probiotics for off and on yeast problems (they got from me.. I have always struggled with it.) They both have loose stools. I would also like something for myself (and I am nursing a 7 mo baby.)

I discovered Three-lac at amazon.com and it intrigues me. Has anyone tried it? It seems so expensive, and I would like to find something that would work for less but I am willing to try three-lac if it's the best.

Thoughts?
There are a few threads around on it, have you searched? Personally I would go with homemade kefir for the beneficial yeasts and high counts. Raw milk dairy kefir stopped my thrush while bf'ing. You can make dairy or water kefir.
03-31-2007 03:57 PM
JaneS
Quote:
Originally Posted by goodearthmama View Post
Also, after reading that, I am researching how to really boost up my personal probiotic count and intestinal flora before I give birth to my first this July(or June). I will post a thread soon about it when I know more!! or anyone else knowledgeable about this-let me know!!
Please do link to your post. I think a number of things can effect vaginal flora, including probiotics we eat like the strongest versions of homemade yogurt and kefir. Possibly using super strains of yogurt bacteria like Natren's. And including bifidobacteria in your pg regime since it will be over 90% of a healthy babe's flora. Avoiding antibiotics is definitely a must.

I'm also thinking that some of the allergy doctors advice I've come across to supplement babes immediately right after birth with bifidobacterium makes a lot of sense.
03-29-2007 11:55 AM
snuffles Yet another newbie here with questions.

I would like to give my 5 and 2 yr old probiotics for off and on yeast problems (they got from me.. I have always struggled with it.) They both have loose stools. I would also like something for myself (and I am nursing a 7 mo baby.)

I discovered Three-lac at amazon.com and it intrigues me. Has anyone tried it? It seems so expensive, and I would like to find something that would work for less but I am willing to try three-lac if it's the best.

Thoughts?
03-27-2007 05:17 AM
Love_Cyber_Cat Hello!
After reading this wonderful thread I still have a question- can you believe it?
Is it OK to feed 8 1/2 mo baby with homemade yougurt? She is going through stomach virus and i would love to help her immune system fight it off, it seems she is doing better but then in a few days she starts puking again. She is EBF with just a few solids here and there- nothing big...
Thanks!
03-12-2007 02:09 PM
goodearthmama I didn't read through all 25 pages, but I did read something the other night that I did not know and thought was a great tidbit of info:

Your child receives 80-85% of their probiotic bacteria when they pass through the mother's birth canal during natural childbirth. The remaining 15-20% is acquired through the child's environment (soil-based org. in food & natural environment or probiotic supplements, etc.)

WOW! Just one more reason to advocate a natural birth!!

Also, after reading that, I am researching how to really boost up my personal probiotic count and intestinal flora before I give birth to my first this July(or June). I will post a thread soon about it when I know more!! or anyone else knowledgeable about this-let me know!!
03-12-2007 01:14 PM
Lady Lilya subbing and bumping
03-10-2007 01:48 PM
JaneS I get my freeze dried Yogourmet starter at Whole Foods but I've seen it many places online. Lucy's Kitchen Shop for ex. Never had a batch fail.

Natren's starter is in some stores on west coast or online at www.natren.com. I happen to be on a Natren kick right now b/c they have the super strains DDS-1 Acidophilus and LB something or other Bulgaricus.
03-10-2007 01:45 PM
JaneS
Quote:
Originally Posted by manoj_2002 View Post
Very informative and eye opening thread, but after reading all the posts, I am totally confused.
Can someone please answer some of my basic questions:

1. From what I understand, we have to make 2 separate yogurts to capture most of the good bacteria. Now where do I buy the yogurt starters? Can you please also give me the specific names?
2. Are the freeze dried starters any good?
Goodpapa and many make separate yogurts to vary bacterial strains. But its not necessarily needed.

Yes, both Yogourmet and Natren are good starters. I've added bifidobacterium or acidophilus or Reuteri separately to my batches for high counts that I couldn't get from pills.

Quote:
3. Is that correct to say we can make about 5 cycles of yogurt (using previous cycle's yogurt) before using the starter again?
Personally I use fresh starter but that's just me.
Quote:

4. What is the best milk to use? Pasteurized and Non-homogenized? Can we get it in the store?
Raw grass fed. Has omega 3's and doesn't have oxidized cholesterol. Otherwise organic grass fed pasteurized homogenzied next best bet.

Quote:
5. Apart from Yogurt, what are the other sources I can get the good bacteria. I know this is a difficult question to answer. But if you suggest some products (sauerkraut?)and brand names etc, that will be great.
I know these are too many questions, but answers would help a lot of people like me.
I highly recommend Kefir (raw milk the best). It contains beneficial yeasts as well as lactobacillus. Lactobacillus is very helpful for the digestion but it actually is a very small part (1% or less) of your gut flora. If you are having problems, best to include other strains for maximum effect.

There are Kefir grains that are renewable (and you can eat them too, your own personal probiotic factory!
http://users.sa.chariot.net.au/~dna/kefirpage.html

Or powder:
http://www.mercola.com/forms/kefir.htm

Yogourmet makes a Kefir powder too but I haven't tried it.

Sauerkraut yes indeed, one of the best for L. Plantarum. Must not be pasteurized. I forget brands, there might be a thread in Traditional Foods, you can start one asking for recs if not.

Get the book "Nourishing Traditions" to learn how to make many different kinds of probiotic foods such as pickled cucumbers and red peppers (my favorite, search on my name for recipe). And why they are good for you, aid digestion, boost immune system, etc.

Fermented ketchup is great too, I just posted a recipe in recent ketchup thread in N&GE forum. Also can make other dairy ferments such as villi or fil mojik (sp?). And fermented beverages such as lacto fermented sodas, kombucha, water kefir, etc. etc. Traditional diets have also included probiotic foods for good health and yummy eating, they have died off in our horribly processed modern food culture.

You are welcome, sorry I didn't see until now! (hope you are around.)
02-27-2007 04:42 AM
PapayaVagina Holy cow! I just need to sub so that I can remember where this thread is

I'm getting started on dairy and water kefir and will be picking up some kombucha SCOBY this week! Yay!
12-06-2006 09:21 PM
Becken bump!
11-22-2006 11:05 PM
manoj_2002 Very informative and eye opening thread, but after reading all the posts, I am totally confused.
Can someone please answer some of my basic questions:

1. From what I understand, we have to make 2 separate yogurts to capture most of the good bacteria. Now where do I buy the yogurt starters? Can you please also give me the specific names?
2. Are the freeze dried starters any good?
3. Is that correct to say we can make about 5 cycles of yogurt (using previous cycle's yogurt) before using the starter again?
4. What is the best milk to use? Pasteurized and Non-homogenized? Can we get it in the store?
5. Apart from Yogurt, what are the other sources I can get the good bacteria. I know this is a difficult question to answer. But if you suggest some products (sauerkraut?)and brand names etc, that will be great.
I know these are too many questions, but answers would help a lot of people like me.
Thank you everyone
11-20-2006 07:51 PM
Pookietooth Whatever happened to Goodpapa, anyway?
11-17-2006 05:04 PM
JaneS
Quote:
Originally Posted by crystalkr View Post
OK - so my head is swirling and I'm trying to get it sorted out Basically, my goals are to find the best quality probiotic for the least cost. My ds has several (now) mild food allergies/intollerances, my dh is lactose intollerant, and as for me, I'm 11 weeks pg and would like to try to prevent the reflux/food issues that my first ds went through. So, my questions:

1. Am I correct in thinking that the probiotics found in yogurt you make at home is better both in quality and in numbers than a store bought supplement?

2. If I do start making the yogurt - should I use a starter that has multiple strains in it, like the Yogourmet CBA Probiotic Yogurt Starter http://yogurtmakers.livingright.com/...t-Starter.html

3. How much yogurt would me and/or my 2 yo need to have daily?

Am I on the right track??? Thanks in advance!!

Crystal
1. Yes and no.

24 hour yogurt removes all lactose and has highest bacterial count, see here: http://www.healingcrow.com/ferfun/co...onspiracy.html

The types of bacteria in yogurt cultures and the specific strains are different though than in supplements. I have been adding some super strains to my yogurt mix: Nature's Way Reuteri and Natren's Acidophilus and Bifido factor for this reason. And Natren's Yogurt starter for their super strain of Bulgaricus. I may experiment with Culturelle next. Super strains have been identified to actually live longer, attach to intestinal walls... basically to stick around to do some good better than other versions of certain bacteria.

Goodpapa orginally used several super strains in his yogurt making method and we should learn from that. However, one issue that complicates this is that some strains may crowd out others. Bifidobacterium for example has a tendancy to do this. I do not know how others behave. That Yogourmet multi is interesting b/c it also brings up the point that different bacteria may like different temps too.

2. Yes that looks like a good mix of bacteria but it seems like it must be used with a certain yogurt maker to get the full benefit of all strains?

3. Completely individual depending on needs, current health and desired results. You might want to start slow to be sure it is tolerated well and doesn't shift gut flora so fast.

All of these issues illustrates why kefir is so unique and may be more beneficial for certain people rather than yogurt. Kefir contains both beneficial yeasts and lactobacillus in a symbiotic relationship... they all get along together.

See other posts regarding bifidus and infants.
http://www.mothering.com/discussions...61&postcount=9

Supplement with bifidobacterium, avoid all antibiotics and vaccines (you and them), and give no other food than BM if you want the best chance of good flora in your next babe. This is nature's way of sealing up the infant's gut and avoiding reflux/allergies as good gut flora is the gatekeeper of the immature immune system. Even more crucial at that age b/c other immune factors are not developed yet.
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