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Thread: brother wants me and my family to get vaccinated? Reply to Thread
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  Topic Review (Newest First)
07-17-2014 09:05 PM
Deborah
Quote:
Originally Posted by apeydef View Post
Wow well I hope the baby wouldn't get sick!!
I hope so too. But if the family is expecting vaccines to keep the baby safe, I would NOT want to be the one unvaxed person around.
07-17-2014 03:34 PM
samaxtics The information about cocooning is for the OP not the parents of the infant. The OP asked what others would do if they were given the choice between vaccinating or staying away from the baby.

If cocooning (vaccinating for the benefit of the baby) doesn't really work, then there is no point in subjecting yourself to the risks just to see that baby during the first few months.
07-17-2014 02:21 PM
apeydef Not really bc she's not going to change their mind! They stated their case and now she must make a decision as to what she's going to do.
07-17-2014 01:38 PM
samaxtics
Quote:
Originally Posted by apeydef View Post
Also I believe the point of this thread was not to turn Into a debate if cocooning works or not, but the OP wanted advice on what to do.
The OP is being asked to vaccinate for no other reason but to be allowed to visit with the infant. Therefore discussing whether cocooning works is totally relevant to the OP's post.
07-17-2014 11:18 AM
apeydef I am a non vaxxer. With that said it is their baby and their choice. There is not much the OP can do but get vaxxed or stay away. I would not fold on my beliefs over this. I would just tell them, I choose not to vaccinate, so please let me know when you will allow me around. Bottom line is it's their baby, whether you agree or not! Also I believe the point of this thread was not to turn Into a debate if cocooning works or not, but the OP wanted advice on what to do.
07-17-2014 11:10 AM
apeydef
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deborah View Post
When the baby gets sick despite cocooning, you'll be safe from blame...trying to look on the bright side...
Wow well I hope the baby wouldn't get sick!!
07-17-2014 11:05 AM
cynthia mosher applejuice and teacozy, stop making personal stabs at each other in your posts or you will lose your vax posting privileges.
07-16-2014 06:31 PM
Turquesa
Quote:
Originally Posted by teacozy View Post
How did I miss the point?
Because food handling, preparation, and delivery can spread infectious illness as readily as holding an infant.
07-16-2014 06:27 PM
applejuice
Quote:
Not sure why maybe because I was Breastfeeding?
Most probably, yes.
07-16-2014 05:55 PM
jclarke22 I would just tell them that you can not visit. You do not want to risk a reaction for the Vax and So they do not blame you for anything.

I know I told family not to visit if they were sick. They did not know they were sick until a few days later. What was funny is they had the flu and everyone in the family got sick but me and DD. Not sure why maybe because I was Breastfeeding?
07-16-2014 05:15 PM
Deborah My ongoing concern with the pertussis and influenza vaccine cocooning is that neither vaccine has demonstrated an ability to prevent carriage or transmission of the illness. Which means that vaccinated people, who have been cleared as "safe" for baby, could cough or sneeze and expose the baby to something very dangerous. Vaccines just aren't good enough to use that as a dividing line and feel that a baby is protected.

That sort of misinformation will (probably already has) caused some more babe to suffer through a dangerous dose of pertussis.

Pro-vaccine people regularly say: "you shouldn't make up your mind based on bad info." The claim that the pertussis vaccine will protect babies from exposure to pertussis by friends, family and caretakers is bad info.
07-16-2014 04:31 PM
carnelianlight Parents will be paranoid. (Isn't our choice not to vax also borne out of a heightened awareness and concern for our kids?)
You have to let people make their own decisions and mistakes. It is sad to have to miss the infancy of your niece, but hopefully the injunction is just temporary? Or do they intend to restrict your access forever?

Hopefully they will tire of missing you and extend you an invitation if you don't pressure them.
07-16-2014 04:19 PM
sierramtngirl I think it's reasonable to ask people who want to hold baby/ cuddle with baby to vaccinate if that is what the family chooses to do. If someone chooses not to, that's ok too, but they have to expect that the family may not let them hold baby until later .
07-16-2014 02:59 PM
crazyms
Quote:
Originally Posted by teacozy View Post
How did I miss the point?

You stated that it was inconsistent to care about the vaccine status of family members and friends coming to visit and hold your baby and not care about the vaccine status of the person who puts mail in your mailbox. Unless you're inviting your mailman to come and visit and hold your baby too then I don't see how it's inconsistent.

I should think most people aren't that friendly with their mailman/plumber/pizza delivery guy.
Okay totally off topic but this made me laugh. I got addicted to pizza while I was pregnant with dd. It was a major craving and I saw the pizza guy at least once a week. He loved coming to our house since we tipped well. He'd go out of his way to be able to deliver to us. When I delivered at the hospital we even ordered a pizza in the hospital and surprise surprise! It was our regular pizza guy that ended up with the delivery. He actually DID come in and see the baby at that point saying "Oh I was wondering why y'all hadn't ordered lately"

To the OP though I agree that I wouldn't vaccinate to make someone else feel better. We each do what we feel is best for our own children. I wouldn't change what I do to protect my children to suit someone else's views.
07-16-2014 02:43 PM
teacozy
Quote:
Originally Posted by applejuice View Post
Personal insults get you no where. You missed the point, but then you usually do. No further comment.
How did I miss the point?

You stated that it was inconsistent to care about the vaccine status of family members and friends coming to visit and hold your baby and not care about the vaccine status of the person who puts mail in your mailbox. Unless you're inviting your mailman to come and visit and hold your baby too then I don't see how it's inconsistent.

I should think most people aren't that friendly with their mailman/plumber/pizza delivery guy.
07-16-2014 11:58 AM
applejuice Personal insults get you no where. You missed the point, but then you usually do. No further comment.
07-16-2014 11:17 AM
teacozy
Quote:
Originally Posted by applejuice View Post
Interesting! Would they be ordering pizza while they are home in those six-eight weeks postpartum? Do they require the pizza delivery person to be "up-to-date"? Are the persons boxing and making the pizza up to date? Let us be completely consistent here. How about the water delivery person, the Culligan man, the pool man, the mail man, milk man, gardener, housekeeper, plumber, any repairman, and others who may be in and out of the house?
Wow, you must have a much cozier relationship with your pizza guy/postman/pool man/plumber etc than I do.

I certainly wouldn't invite them to come in and hold my newborn baby, especially during flu/pertussis season.
07-16-2014 09:52 AM
applejuice
Quote:
From Turquesa's post #4 "...Did you still want us to bring you over some take-out?"
Interesting! Would they be ordering pizza while they are home in those six-eight-ten weeks postpartum? Do they require the pizza delivery person to be "up-to-date"? Are the persons boxing and making the pizza up to date? Let us be completely consistent here. How about the water delivery person, the Culligan man, the pool man, the mail man, milk man, gardener, housekeeper, plumber, any repairman, and others who may be in and out of the house?
07-16-2014 09:40 AM
applejuice
Quote:
Parents should be pushy when it comes to the safety of their babies.
OK - you should know that the Australian government has dropped the policy of cocooning with the DaPT shot because it was found to be useless.

Forcing others to undergo an unnecessary, useless and unavoidably unsafe medical procedure to visit is quite arrogant in my estimation.

And as I was told by the oncologist, keep any recently vaccinated children AWAY from my stage D DH who was dying of cancer. The same for an acquaintance who had an organ transplant and did not see his grandchildren for weeks after their vaccines. So I was very pushy and refused visits from any recently vaccinated persons.

Why would an oncologist say this? What does he know about vaccines and recently vaccinated children that they should stay away from my immunocompromised DH?

TO THE OP: I hope that the mother of this child is breastfeeding. That is far more important than any artificial immunization. In this age of Skype and the internet, no one really has "to go" to see the baby for a few months anyway.
07-16-2014 07:35 AM
sassyfirechick
Quote:
Originally Posted by tadamsmar View Post
Parents should be pushy when it comes to the safety of their babies.

The arrogance of nonvaxers is amazing!
Wow, pot calling the kettle black. Last I checked, asking someone to take the risk of vaxxing (without even knowing why they came to that decision) to "protect" your own child is truly arrogant. I don't ask people to vax to protect my child under the heard theory (which I don't believe in anyhow) but I have no idea if those I associate with are fully vaxxed or unvaxxed, it makes no difference to me. My focus is on MY child.
07-16-2014 07:28 AM
samaxtics I agree with Turquesa's post and Deborah's post that by staying away at least they can't blame you or your family if the child does get sick.

ETA: I doubt that these parents would be that receptive to information that counters what they believe as they have gone so far as to ask you to get vaccinated or stay away.
But by being gracious and saying something like "I understand your position but I cannot compromise my children's well-being with vaccination and so we will wait until you are comfortable" sends a pretty strong message that you have absolute conviction in your non-vaccinating stance. That may do more to get them to at least start questioning vaccination than by you trying to convince them with info at this time.
07-16-2014 07:23 AM
samaxtics
Quote:
Originally Posted by tadamsmar View Post
Parents should be pushy when it comes to the safety of their babies.

The arrogance of nonvaxers is amazing!
Who said anything arrogant? Quote please.

OTOH, I'm glad you agree that parents should be pushy when it comes to the safety of their babies, Tadamsmar!
07-16-2014 07:10 AM
kathymuggle I would respect their wishes. I think they are wrong - but it is their baby, their call.

I would try and give them a bit of information on why you have made some of the decisions you have made, when the time is right. It is always tricky where friends and family are concerned - how to raise a subject, without crossing a boundary.

I may just start with:

"There are reason we do not vaccinate. If you ever want to pick my brains or want some links, let me know. Pertussis and flu in particular are not very effective vaccines, and should not be relied on to protect babies…."

If you do send them links, make them very mainstream. There are plenty of mainstream links of flu and pertussis vaccine concerns
07-16-2014 06:23 AM
fruitfulmomma What Turquesa said... respect their choice not to have any unvaccinated family members over and let them know they can call you when they are ready. I certainly would not vaccinate just to please them and see the baby.

Quote:
As for pertussis I'd be a lot more worried about somebody spreading and not knowing they were a carrier which is what the vaccine will do.
And this. Under no circumstances would I rely on a persons vaccination status to protect my children from pertussis. It does not prevent transmission and because it actually works to reduce the symptoms a person can have it with "just a little cough" or no symptoms at all and go around spreading not knowing they have it because they believe they are immune from the vaccine. Fully vaccinated persons can and do spread pertussis.
07-16-2014 06:21 AM
tadamsmar Parents should be pushy when it comes to the safety of their babies.

The arrogance of nonvaxers is amazing!
07-16-2014 06:19 AM
Deborah I had a friend with adopted twins. She asked people not to visit if they had even the slightest symptoms and when people entered she asked them to remove their shoes and wash their hands thoroughly.

This seems like a sensible approach.

Asking people not to cuddle and kiss other people's newborns is also a sensible move.
07-16-2014 05:44 AM
sassyfirechick controversial indeed it's really nobody's business whether you are vaccinated or not and if they don't intend to ask everyone at the grocery store to be up to date on their vaccines it's a bit pushy to ask you. As for pertussis I'd be a lot more worried about somebody spreading and not knowing they were a carrier which is what the vaccine will do. Perhaps the best you can do is to say you were doing some research and you read about pertussis being spread after vaccination and that you're not comfortable putting their baby at risk. They should be more worried about the common cold than anything else personally my friend had a 35 week preemie and we didn't visit the baby until he was about 2 months old because we had sniffles here and there and I did not want that to be an issue for her baby. It's rude and its bold for somebody to ask you to take a risk with yourself and your own children for the sake of their child it's like putting their child above your own on a pedestal.
07-15-2014 10:31 PM
Serenity Now We were on the other side, asking our family to be up to date to see our baby. We live in an area with a lot of pertussis, and we had a preemie. All of my family was understanding, and actually thankful for letting them know that they probably needed a booster. Our child was born during flu season, so we were very cautious about visitors and public appearances until the child was older. If, on the other hand, someone in the family didn't want to keep up with their vaccines, we would politely tell them that they could visit with our baby after the baby was old enough for the vaccine. Since it's my baby, and my choice, I would hope that people who care about us would respect that choice.
07-15-2014 07:05 PM
katelove
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turquesa View Post
Cocooning is a controversial practice, to be sure. http://www.theatlantic.com/health/ar...babies/250521/

I wouldn't factor any threats of not seeing the baby into your decision. Just read carefully and decide if it feels right for you. Be ready to say, "Oh, I'm so sorry. We've weighed the evidence carefully and won't be doing that. Please send us lots of photos, and we can't wait to meet the baby when you feel comfortable introducing her. Did you still want us to bring you over some take-out?'
Yep, I think this is all you can do I'm afraid.
07-15-2014 06:43 PM
Deborah When the baby gets sick despite cocooning, you'll be safe from blame...trying to look on the bright side...
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