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#31 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 01:32 PM - Thread Starter
 
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why am i posting this novel here? b/c I am nursing a 2 mo and a 3 yo.
pretty pretty please start a new thread? It would really help save my sanity (remember? ADD?) if personal puzzles stayed separate from these general discussions. While personal anecdotes are totally relevant to figuring out the general stuff, and this thread will be very relevant to your own situation, I personally would rather have a million focused threads than the 10 or so general purpose ones we have going right now. It'll make finding information much easier later.

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#32 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 03:20 PM
 
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pretty pretty please start a new thread? It would really help save my sanity (remember? ADD?) if personal puzzles stayed separate from these general discussions. While personal anecdotes are totally relevant to figuring out the general stuff, and this thread will be very relevant to your own situation, I personally would rather have a million focused threads than the 10 or so general purpose ones we have going right now. It'll make finding information much easier later.

:cop: thread police


darnit whome! you are so strict!



but you are quite good at organizing information so...


https://mothering.com/discussions/sho....php?t=1047252

here is the new thread!
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#33 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 03:39 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Fat soluble toxins are incorporated into the bile. Would it fit that the longer the bile is sitting in the liver, the more toxins it can collect for excretion? Is that why morning is better for detox? Is that part of why intermittent fasting (one eating window/day) works?

And how does that fit in with the lemon juice and eating fat and clay? Once toxins are in the bile, what's the safest and most effective way to get them out?

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#34 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 03:50 PM
 
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I believe that once toxins are in the bile they're excreted via passing stools.

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#35 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 03:59 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Yeah, that's what I think is supposed to happen, too. But what are ways that that process can go wrong? IOW, I'm still stuck on how lemon juice works and can be dangerous.

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#36 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 04:27 PM
 
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all i can think of is that lemon juice has ALOT of vitamin C. more than any other fruit, i think.
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#37 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 04:44 PM
 
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Yeah, that's what I think is supposed to happen, too. But what are ways that that process can go wrong? IOW, I'm still stuck on how lemon juice works and can be dangerous.
Well, I found this when googling: Does lemon juice detox the liver?

I'm still searching but also need to sit with ds and get his math done.

One more quick one: Why detox your body with lemon juice. Now off to do math!

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#38 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 05:52 PM
 
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My symptoms are leaking proteins into breastmilk, being gassy (just from milk products since the birth of dd 1, now from almost all foods but esp any nuts or seeds -unsoaked), when i went off gfcf during my last pg for abt a week i started having major thyroid symptoms (i think that's what they were) - hot flashes, heart racing, anxiety, i think that was it. oh and the only other symptom i think i have (aside from not doing the dishes - is that caused by leaky gut or just a coincidence?) is really, really bad dandruff.
Have you considered the possibility that you were in withdrawal? It may not be that your thyroid was as affected as you think. I would suspect candida with you (and I'm not a person who sees candida everywhere) because of the dandruff and the leaky gut.

I take a mineral complex and a probiotic every day. i am getting back on the bandwagon with enzymes (whome wrote on her site that lack of digestive enzymes causes gas, if so what causes lack of digestive enzymes?) vit C and B complex. Solgar makes a D3 that is sold here that i'll try to get tomorow when we go to a city. I love my veggie ferments esp drinking the brine. i love my broth but sont always have some ion the house.
There are many things that cause gas, lack of enzymes is one. I would wholly support a digestive enzyme if you think that you have leaky gut issues. It helps cleave the antigens from the proteins and cycles IgG cells through faster.

What makes a lack of enzymes....good question. We have a finite store. It could be that you have plenty of enzymes but they aren't being triggered (lack of HCl and low cholesterol) or it could be that your stores are waning. Either way you may want to assess bile production.


My history is that i was always constipated as a kid, had 3 seizures in childhood for no known reason, had lots of ear aches and lots of abx, and had IV abx during dd2s birth. and some mild ppd after. I always have low BP and think i have alway been low on minerals - it used to be that if i did not make chicken soup for friday night ("traditional" jewish food) and then have leftovers for most of the week, i would be a wreck - physically and emotionally. i crave chocolate... do you guysthink this could all be caused by a lack of mineral stores? my intuition says yes but i dont know what to do and which of my pathways to strengthen.
Dunno if you have already thought about this...do you know or suspect you have adrenal fatigue? Are you under constitutional homeopathic treatment? Yes, you sound like you are low in minerals. I would think about magnesium for sure (comes naturally in chocolate) and helps with depression. I would DEFINITELY look at B vitamins for you.

why am i posting this novel here? b/c I am nursing a 2 mo and a 3 yo.

ETA: I have an abcess in one of my breasts (lump, whatever you want to call it) since an episode of mastitus 2 years ago. I want to try clayb/c i thinkthat would help that and i think it works by absorbing toxins and escorting them out as opposed to circulating them not sure.
I would do a castor oil pack on it. I would also look at iodine stores as iodine is essential to breast health. Clay is an anion and does attract positively charged ions (toxins) and escorts them out. If the IgG cells have pulled things into the bloodstream they need pathways to be strengthened to get them out. IF the toxins are still in the gut they can exit directly. Byproducts from die off in the intestines will be greatly helped by clay. It can also draw transdermally (so you could do an external poultice as well) I dont' know how easy it is for the clay to draw BACK through the intestinal wall if the permeability is low.
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#39 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 05:55 PM
 
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pretty pretty please start a new thread? It would really help save my sanity (remember? ADD?) if personal puzzles stayed separate from these general discussions. While personal anecdotes are totally relevant to figuring out the general stuff, and this thread will be very relevant to your own situation, I personally would rather have a million focused threads than the 10 or so general purpose ones we have going right now. It'll make finding information much easier later.

:cop: thread police

d'oh. I just left the thread open and came back to respond. I didn't see any of the subsequent responses! Sorry!
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#40 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 06:00 PM
 
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I believe that once toxins are in the bile they're excreted via passing stools.
yes. This can go very wrong if the person isn't producing enough bile and there are too many toxins for the bile to collect. It can also go very wrong if sec IgA is depressed...but that's a different discussion.
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#41 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 06:39 PM
 
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Is there a home test for bile production?

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#42 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 06:49 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Is there a home test for bile production?
Possibly stool color? Pale is a bad sign, brown is good.

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#43 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 07:07 PM
 
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I found this page helpful, my daughter's poop tends to go light when we don't do fermented veggies regularly and in rather high quantities (but I'm glad/lucky that was enough to fix the situation).

http://www.enzymestuff.com/rtstools.htm
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#44 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 07:18 PM
 
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I found this page helpful, my daughter's poop tends to go light when we don't do fermented veggies regularly and in rather high quantities (but I'm glad/lucky that was enough to fix the situation).

http://www.enzymestuff.com/rtstools.htm
This sounds like my daughter's stools. Light colored & voluminous. She won't touch fermented veggies. Working on enzymes. Taking her to GI doctor at end of the month.

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#45 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 07:22 PM
 
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This sounds like my daughter's stools. Light colored & voluminous. She won't touch fermented veggies. Working on enzymes. Taking her to GI doctor at end of the month.
I think JaneS had bile issues with her son, so if the GI doc doesn't have good options, check her old threads, I think digestive enzymes and maybe kefir? I think enzymes were big, though.
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#46 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 07:28 PM
 
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I think JaneS had bile issues with her son, so if the GI doc doesn't have good options, check her old threads, I think digestive enzymes and maybe kefir? I think enzymes were big, though.
interesting. The dr. I'm taking her to was mentioned in the "New Childhood Epidemics" book so I'm hoping that he's a little more progressive than some.

DD just took a shine to water kefir. Maybe it will do some good.

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#47 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 10:11 PM - Thread Starter
 
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description of the bile process (I still don't have a clear enough picture, though):
http://www.skyeherbals.com/pages/detox.html

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#48 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 11:38 PM
 
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would there be detox symptoms in the nursling..has anyone discovered/experienced this?

my ds is totally out of sorts teh past couple days since i started the milk thistle tea and lemon water in the morning

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#49 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 11:40 PM
 
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How old is he? I think it is possible to have things mobilize into the breastmilk. I thought I read on one of these threads (I am involved in so many now I can't remember where) where someone was saying that they upped their little one's vitamin C to offset detox symptoms in the nursling. Hmm, was it Tanya? Is your ds old enough to take some vitamin C? (I know I sneak sodium ascorbate into things even for my 2 year old (and did even before he was 2).)

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#50 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 11:43 PM
 
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How old is he? I think it is possible to have things mobilize into the breastmilk. I thought I read on one of these threads (I am involved in so many now I can't remember where) where someone was saying that they upped their little one's vitamin C to offset detox symptoms in the nursling. Hmm, was it Tanya? Is your ds old enough to take some vitamin C? (I know I sneak sodium ascorbate into things even for my 2 year old (and did even before he was 2).)
Yes, that was Tanya. She only realized it because his vitamin C requirement went up though- he didn't show any symptoms of having toxins dumped into his system. But every child is different.

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#51 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 11:44 PM
 
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he's 4 months old
I'm holding off on the lemon water after yesterday's HORRIBLE nightwaking, but i'm sticking to the milk thistle.
i dont have any vit. C that i think would be ok for him..any recs? or should I just REallY up my vit.C

eta: we part-time EC so i know he needs to have a bm, but just won't. he's uncomfortable and seems like he's trying to go but just squirms/fusses/cries instead, he was up last night EVERy.HOUR. I finally gave up at 4 am and just took him into the living room :yawn:

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#52 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 11:45 PM
 
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If I recall correctly, I believe that someone said doing the lemon water while breastfeeding isn't a good idea because it does mobilize toxins.

Milk thistle, on the other hand, supports the liver in detox efforts.

At least that is what I remember from the thousands of threads.

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#53 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 11:47 PM
 
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How old is he? I think it is possible to have things mobilize into the breastmilk. I thought I read on one of these threads (I am involved in so many now I can't remember where) where someone was saying that they upped their little one's vitamin C to offset detox symptoms in the nursling. Hmm, was it Tanya? Is your ds old enough to take some vitamin C? (I know I sneak sodium ascorbate into things even for my 2 year old (and did even before he was 2).)
He didn't have symptoms, but thinking about how much better I was feeling made me wonder, and that's why I upped his vitamin C (by about 12 grams per day) and stopped the lemon. If you see symptoms, I'd stop. I'm sorta pro lemon-juice for most people and anti-lemon-juice for nursing moms, based on what I saw with us.

I gave my son vitC directly once he had started solids, it got us through our first winter of constant colds. Before solids, he seemed to get enough through milk if I'd up my vitC (as long as I dosed 4+ times per day), it minimized the severity of his colds quite well.
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#54 of 123 Old 02-25-2009, 11:49 PM
 
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aren't the foods he reacts to acting as toxins anyway? I just want this over. I'm so on edge, and depressed (not because of this, but in general) and irritable and trying really hard to understand.
I'm not being argumentative, I'm just thinking out loud

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he's 4 months old
I'm holding off on the lemon water after yesterday's HORRIBLE nightwaking, but i'm sticking to the milk thistle.
i dont have any vit. C that i think would be ok for him..any recs? or should I just REallY up my vit.C

eta: we part-time EC so i know he needs to have a bm, but just won't. he's uncomfortable and seems like he's trying to go but just squirms/fusses/cries instead, he was up last night EVERy.HOUR. I finally gave up at 4 am and just took him into the living room :yawn:
We use either Bronson sodium ascorbate item 50B or NOW sodium ascorbate which is much less expensive (esp if you look around, there's a really wide variation in the prices!). I'd go to bowel tolerance for you to help with what you've already got circulating. Nutribiotic looks like a good brand to me that's available sometimes at Whole Foods.
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#56 of 123 Old 02-26-2009, 12:03 AM
 
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I'm sorta pro lemon-juice for most people and anti-lemon-juice for nursing moms, based on what I saw with us.
I have been drinking a lot of water kefir daily. I use half a lemon in my kefir and squeeze the juice in. So I probably drink the juice from half a lemon a day. Do you think it matters that it's in my kefir, or would it have the same effect as lemon juice in water? I am nursing and I have been doing this for over a month.
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#57 of 123 Old 02-26-2009, 12:04 AM
 
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its so funny, i was just going to start a thread about bile and here you all are talking about it! i have to read the link that whome posted.
whenever dd reacts to a food (and her whole life before goat milk kefir helped her poops), her stools look just like what she eats (same color, almost same texture).
today she managed to grab a piece of natural cat food (shoot me and then later had two bms that were seriously like white cottage cheese (partly dig kefir). why is it that when her body ingests a food that she cant handle, she totally stops absorbing properly and her bile production seems to diminish? any ideas about how to support bile production better? sorry, i dont want to go ot - i need to go find jane's old posts asap.
also, i wish i could give dd vit c. i have kirkmans which i was giving her only about 125 mg per day because it seems to bother her. now, she doesnt even seem to tolerate that much. how the heck can i get the huge amts of vit c that everyone is mentioning in her with foods and not supps?
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#58 of 123 Old 02-26-2009, 12:06 AM
 
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I have been drinking a lot of water kefir daily. I use half a lemon in my kefir and squeeze the juice in. So I probably drink the juice from half a lemon a day. Do you think it matters that it's in my kefir, or would it have the same effect as lemon juice in water? I am nursing and I have been doing this for over a month.
good question. i eat lemon or use it in cooking very often, not sure how that affects the whole process if it's not specifically lemon juice in water in the a.m.

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#59 of 123 Old 02-26-2009, 12:13 AM - Thread Starter
 
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aren't the foods he reacts to acting as toxins anyway? I just want this over. I'm so on edge, and depressed (not because of this, but in general) and irritable and trying really hard to understand.
I'm not being argumentative, I'm just thinking out loud
I'm getting everyone confused... Did you start a thread for yourself yet? Cause there are very related things you can do to help depression and irritability.

And that's exactly what this thread is supposed to be about - how to *safely* detox while breastfeeding so that we don't end up dumping *even more* toxins into our LO's

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#60 of 123 Old 02-26-2009, 12:16 AM
 
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oops, sorry. ill take the hint bile thread: https://www.mothering.com/discussions...5#post13260125
sorry whome
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