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#1 of 26 Old 03-26-2005, 01:51 AM - Thread Starter
 
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there was a little boy who pulled down his shorts & peed on a tree (his mommies explained he refuses to use the toilet :LOL)... then he turned around, whipped off his undies & began running around naked from the waist down ~ and he was intact!!
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#2 of 26 Old 03-26-2005, 01:58 AM
 
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:LOL That's great advocacy!
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#3 of 26 Old 03-26-2005, 02:13 AM
 
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Last summer at the beach there was a boy around 3 or 4 who stood on top of the playground equipment and proceded to pull down his pants and pee down onto the sand below. :LOL He was also intact! Makes you wonder how clean the sand is at the playground or the beach.
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#4 of 26 Old 03-26-2005, 11:08 AM
 
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That's great that he is intact,but peeing outside because he doesn't like toilets is not something I agree with. I don't think I would like ds doing that unless there were no toilets in the area.
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#5 of 26 Old 03-26-2005, 05:20 PM - Thread Starter
 
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that really wasn't the point, mattemma04.
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#6 of 26 Old 03-27-2005, 12:17 AM
 
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Two summers ago, I was at the beach, and it was starting to get late and all the mommies were changing their toddlers out of their swimsuits on the beach. There were 3 or 4 nudie boys running around, every single one of them was intact

I decided that was the beach for me :LOL
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#7 of 26 Old 03-28-2005, 10:19 AM
 
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How Great! I look forward to the day, and I know it will come, when circumcision is unheard of.
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#8 of 26 Old 03-28-2005, 03:33 PM
 
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Itlbokay, fifteen years ago my sister gave birth to her DS. This was in the U.K. I casualy asked her opinion on circ - so that I could jump in with info if she was in any way for it. She did not know what the word meant !!! How col is that ??
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#9 of 26 Old 03-28-2005, 03:36 PM - Thread Starter
 
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yeah, over in the UK it's just not that big of a deal. unfortunately i think it should at least get *exposure* so that people can know about it, and work to stop it.
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#10 of 26 Old 03-28-2005, 08:16 PM
 
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My friends and I were down at the beach and our kids were out running around without any swimsuits on and it seemed that most of the boys were intact as far as I can tell or unless some were circumcised very loosely.
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#11 of 26 Old 03-29-2005, 06:24 AM
 
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Originally Posted by klothos
yeah, over in the UK it's just not that big of a deal. unfortunately i think it should at least get *exposure* so that people can know about it, and work to stop it.
I live in the UK (although I'm American), and whenever I mention the fact that about 55% of American newborn boys are circed just after birth, everyone (without exception) looks at me in horror.

They just can't imagine why anyone would do that. Most people overe here are under the impression that circ only happens for religious reasons...they really have a hard time comprehending that this is done routinely to little boys for social reasons in the States.
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#12 of 26 Old 03-29-2005, 12:59 PM
 
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I don't think "social reasons" really gets it. The vast majority don't know why they are doing it, they just do it. They dutifully put their child in the line just because they think that is what they are supposed to do. I don't think most actually even really consider that they should have a reason.

I guess I have a different type of personality in that I automatically question these things. For instance, I drive a sports car and the last 4 of 5 cars have been sports cars. This is in an area where a large portion of vehicles are SUVs. People here buy SUVs that really have no need for a vehicle like this. They are the same people who 30 years ago wouldn't have been caught dead in a station wagon. What's the difference besides the size and "Wow!" factor? Well, there's a lot of difference and if those people really thought it out, they would be in a station wagon, a sedan or coupe or even a sports car.

I realized that my last car that would seat 4-5 people only had someone in the back seat 3 times in the 100K miles I drove it. I really had no need for a back seat! I also realized I like a car that performs. The other cars were slugs and my sports cars have been rockets. My sports cars handle like go carts and can park easily in spaces a SUV couldn't even get started into. I can't haul manure, rocks and a lot of other things in my sports car but I wouldn't want to haul manure in a $40,000.00 SUV either. Instead, I bought a trailer for $450.00 and I can haul anything in it. If I had bought a SUV, I would have been getting about 15 MPG but my sports car gets 31 MPG. I easily save enough just on gas that if I need a sedan, minivan or any other kind of vehicle, I can rent one. I've already paid for it with the savings just on gas. Then, all of the other parts and maintenance and repairs are much more expensive for the larger SUV. It just doesn't add up.

Many of those same people who are driving SUVs wouldn't have been caught dead in a station wagon. A station wagon just doesn't have the same social panache' that a SUV does. I thought outside the box and went my own way. People who circumcise their sons do not have this same kind of analytical thinking. They just do it just because the trend setters in their neighborhood buy SUVs. They do it never considering the cost. Fortunately, you can sell your gas guzzling, hard to park, expensive to maintain SUV. There is no market for damaged penises and the son will be stuck with it for life.




Frank
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#13 of 26 Old 03-29-2005, 04:59 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Frankly Speaking
People who circumcise their sons do not have this same kind of analytical thinking. They just do it just because the trend setters in their neighborhood buy SUVs. They do it never considering the cost. Fortunately, you can sell your gas guzzling, hard to park, expensive to maintain SUV. There is no market for damaged penises and the son will be stuck with it for life.

Frank

Not fair Frank, I love my Jeep and my sons have foreskins!

Tara

Tara Momma to Callum and Gavin
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#14 of 26 Old 03-29-2005, 05:42 PM
 
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Originally Posted by howard smith
Itlbokay, fifteen years ago my sister gave birth to her DS. This was in the U.K. I casualy asked her opinion on circ - so that I could jump in with info if she was in any way for it. She did not know what the word meant !!! How col is that ??
That's what I'm talking about

I am optimistic that one day everyone's reaction will be one similar to hers, and/or one of disbelief
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#15 of 26 Old 03-29-2005, 06:27 PM
 
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Originally Posted by callumsmom2001
Not fair Frank, I love my Jeep and my sons have foreskins!
Tara

I know, I know. Economy isn't everything and I'm not guilt free for being a gas hog. I have a pick-up that should have a direct pipe line to an OPEC country. :LOL But for that reason, I only drive it less than a thousand miles a year. The last time I drove it was October. It would cost about $75.00 to fill it up now. OUCH!!!! I actually spend considerably more for the insurance than for the gas because I drive it so little.

However, something to think about . . . Just the gas for your Jeep will cost you about $6,300.00 more in 100,000 miles than for my sports car and I'll race you and beat you every time! :LOL With my savings, I'll buy you a (few pick-up truck loads) beer at the finish line when you get there!




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#16 of 26 Old 03-29-2005, 06:42 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frankly Speaking
People who circumcise their sons do not have this same kind of analytical thinking. They just do it just because the trend setters in their neighborhood buy SUVs. They do it never considering the cost. Fortunately, you can sell your gas guzzling, hard to park, expensive to maintain SUV. There is no market for damaged penises and the son will be stuck with it for life.

Frank
That's quite a sweeping generalization, Frank. I am one who circ'ed my first 3 sons. I was young when I had my first and I, honestly, didn't know I had a choice. When asked, I was like, "Well, of course!" I had no idea that some people didn't do it. It was extremely traumatic for me, but the doctor MUST have known what he was doing, right? (Yeah, right...)

When my 2nd son was born, I had read a little bit about circumcision and didn't want to do it. I asked my husband and his response was, "We're DOING it!" No discussion. Well, ok, but this time, I wanted to nurse him while they did it. I didn't want him suffering alone. I had to get an x-ray after the birth and I came back upstairs and my baby was gone. Dh said they had taken him for his circumcision. I was so mad that dh didn't go with him. I was more mad that he allowed them to take him without me going along. Dh said he didn't cry at all (he stood outside the room), which helped ease my anxiety a bit, but not completely.

When my 3rd was born, I had him at home and I did NOT want him to be circumsized...period! Dh insisted that it WOULD be done. Dh drove us to the doctor's office. They handed me the paperwork to sign...I didn't touch it. I said, "I'm NOT signing that because I don't want it done." My dh took it and signed it and then he took the baby from my arms as I was sobbing. He went with him and I sat in the waiting room for what seemed like hours listening to him scream. I sobbed the entire time and kept asking if the doctor was almost done.

My older boys are 12,10 and 7 now and I'm sitting here crying at the memories of it all. It was horrifying and it took me 3 years before I could stop thinking about it constantly and crying every time I thought of it. I was so mad at my dh. He wouldn't even read about it.

My boys, on the other hand, talk about how they're GLAD they were circumsized and that it's not a big deal at all. Whenever I talk about how upset I was by it, they say, "Geez, Mom, it was a long time ago and it's no big deal!" Sweethearts.

I ended up going through a divorce because my ex was verbally, emotionally and beginning to be physically abusive.

I remarried and now have a beautiful, intact son (5 mos. old). My dh didn't even consider circumcision because he knows how I feel about it and understands that there's no medical reason for it, so why put our baby through that?

So, Frank, there are people who have it done who DO care and who know exactly what the permanent damage will be.

Jodi
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#17 of 26 Old 03-29-2005, 07:12 PM
 
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Originally Posted by jodskiinca
That's quite a sweeping generalization, Frank.
Yes, it is and as is the case with generalizations, they don't apply to every single case as it is with you. Also, we also learn from our experiences.

I am sorry for what this man did to you and to your sons. I feel certain it is a good thing you got away from him. I just hope your sons are no longer subjected to his abuse. They've had enough!




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#18 of 26 Old 03-29-2005, 11:34 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Frankly Speaking
However, something to think about . . . Just the gas for your Jeep will cost you about $6,300.00 more in 100,000 miles than for my sports car and I'll race you and beat you every time! :LOL With my savings, I'll buy you a (few pick-up truck loads) beer at the finish line when you get there!
Frank
I'm holding ya to that Frank baby! mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmBeer!

Tara

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#19 of 26 Old 03-29-2005, 11:44 PM
 
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Originally Posted by jodskiinca
When my 3rd was born, I had him at home and I did NOT want him to be circumsized...period! Dh insisted that it WOULD be done. Dh drove us to the doctor's office. They handed me the paperwork to sign...I didn't touch it. I said, "I'm NOT signing that because I don't want it done." My dh took it and signed it and then he took the baby from my arms as I was sobbing. He went with him and I sat in the waiting room for what seemed like hours listening to him scream. I sobbed the entire time and kept asking if the doctor was almost done.
I read this part and thought, "Why is she married to this guy!?!?!"

I'm glad to see you've moved on. for your boys, too.
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#20 of 26 Old 03-30-2005, 01:04 AM
 
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Originally Posted by callumsmom2001
I'm holding ya to that Frank baby! mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmBeer!

Tara

I expect to be blowing through your area next summer so we'll have to get together and down a few! (Where is the beer icon?)




Frank
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#21 of 26 Old 03-30-2005, 02:48 AM - Thread Starter
 
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ok, jodi, i'll make a deal with you...

you give me that jerks name and address.... and the name of the dr's and nurses who let that happen... and i'll disappear with my sledgehammer for awhile, mmmkay?

on a serious note ~ i am so, so sad that happened to you and your babies. your post had me between tears but too enraged to cry.



s
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#22 of 26 Old 03-30-2005, 12:36 PM
 
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Every summer my family makes a pilgrimage to southern Cal. There's an area called Venice Beach, which used to be really scuzzy but over the last 10-15 years has gotten a facelift, but nonetheless still has enough bohemian atmosphere to be interesting.

There are always toddlers running au naturel and the overwhelming majority of those seem to be intact. Of course many of the youngsters are wearing trunks (especially above a certain age), so who's to say what the overall intact ratio is. I'd be curious to know if there's a correlation between nudity and non-circumcision. Just a thought.

We live much closer to Santa Cruz but for some reason we hardly ever make it over there. There's a similar population and I'd expect to see the same thing. Who knows.
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#23 of 26 Old 03-30-2005, 05:03 PM
 
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Thank you, everyone, for your kind words. I've been having a really hard time after typing that out. I guess I'm not over it like I thought I was. I just feel so guilty for allowing my ex to take my baby. *I* was the one who called and made the appointment for my 3rd, even though I didn't want it done. I didn't throw myself over my baby to protect him. I should have held tightly and not let go. I never should have gotten in the car with him. I'm sure I'll never get over that guilt.

I wished for a girl with each pregnancy after #1. Not only because I would have liked a girl, but because I didn't want to have to circumsize. The pain is just too much to bear when I think about what I allowed to happen to my sweet, innocent babies.

I don't know what I'll do if my boys choose to circumsize their children. I think I'll DIE! As of now, they say they are glad they are circumsized and that it would look "weird" if they weren't. I'm hoping that their intact 5 mo. old brother(who is EC'd and naked all the time!) will change that perception. I guess, my goal now is to save my grandsons! I only hope they don't have wives who insist on it. I can't even think about it....

Jodi
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#24 of 26 Old 03-30-2005, 11:24 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Frankly Speaking
I expect to be blowing through your area next summer so we'll have to get together and down a few! (Where is the beer icon?)




Frank
WooHoo!

Tara

Tara Momma to Callum and Gavin
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#25 of 26 Old 03-31-2005, 10:12 PM
 
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Not to hijack this thread but it made me think of my little intact boy running round at the beach in the buff last summer, his long blond curls blowing in the wind, and a little girl pointing at him and saying loudly, "Look Mom! That girl has a PENIS!"
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#26 of 26 Old 03-31-2005, 11:10 PM
 
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Yeah, speaking of the British... we were at my 18 mo son's swim class, and there was a mum there (she had a British accent, so I'm assuming she was British) changing her son who was CIRCED?!! I was so shocked (my DH is british so I know how the country feels about it). I'm assuming she has some typical, stupid American male husband (sorry, sweeping generalization) who said the typical, stupid "he's got to look like me". I just don't see how she could have done it.

Oh, I do long for a day where it's no longer done.
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