The Thyroid Thread (Part II) - Page 28 - Mothering Forums

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#811 of 863 Old 10-11-2010, 09:23 PM
 
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Stop the Thyroid Madness website has recommended labs you can order tests through.

Here's what I cannot understand about Synthroid and other synthetic thyroid hormone... wouldn't it shut down your calcitonin production by the thyroid if the TSH is shut off and led to calcium problems? Does Armour contain calcitonin?
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#812 of 863 Old 10-11-2010, 09:30 PM
 
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Stop the Thyroid Madness website has recommended labs you can order tests through.

Here's what I cannot understand about Synthroid and other synthetic thyroid hormone... wouldn't it shut down your calcitonin production by the thyroid if the TSH is shut off and led to calcium problems? Does Armour contain calcitonin?
... How is TSH tied to calcitonin production? I mean.. Yes, the thyroid produces it, but... Well...
The adrenals, for example, produce way more than one hormone, yes? If you were to supplement one of those hormones (let's say cortisol), does it shut off the production of all hormones from the adrenals? Why should that be the effect of supplementing one hormone which the thyroid produces?

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#813 of 863 Old 10-11-2010, 09:52 PM
 
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Hmmm.... Well, from what I'm reading, calcitonin levels effect TSH levels (higher calcitonin suppresses TSH), but so far I'm seeing no indication of the reverse being true...

Hmm. Okay, there's one now. That's really confusing.
I'll do more reading about it later.

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#814 of 863 Old 10-11-2010, 10:52 PM
 
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Hmmm.... Well, from what I'm reading, calcitonin levels effect TSH levels (higher calcitonin suppresses TSH), but so far I'm seeing no indication of the reverse being true...

Hmm. Okay, there's one now. That's really confusing.
I'll do more reading about it later.
calcium regulation issues related much? How about parathyroid hormone?

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#815 of 863 Old 10-12-2010, 12:17 AM
 
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Are you supplementing selenium? it's been shown to help with T4-T3 conversion.
No, I tried looking through all the supplements I should be taking at one point and just got confused.

Plus I can't afford to take several good quality supplements on a regular basis. My Armour is around $40, plus my test strips, Glyburide is cheap, but it's still adds to it, prenatals, CLO.......ds has to have ergocalciferol, plus both boys need multi-vitamins... nevermind insurance costs and co-pays LOL...

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#816 of 863 Old 10-12-2010, 12:17 AM
 
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I thought I read that Armour does have calcitonin somewhere... can'tfind it again though.

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#817 of 863 Old 10-12-2010, 12:59 PM
 
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calcium regulation issues related much? How about parathyroid hormone?
They are. Calcitonin removes excess Ca from blood stream and stores it, and parathyroid increases it in blood by releasing from storage and bones.

My father has high parathyroid hormone... he has lost bone/teeth and has calcium deposits.
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#818 of 863 Old 10-12-2010, 01:05 PM
 
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They are. Calcitonin removes excess Ca from blood stream and stores it, and parathyroid increases it in blood by releasing from storage and bones.

My father has high parathyroid hormone... he has lost bone/teeth and has calcium deposits.
So busted thyroid - not enough calcitonin - high serum calcium levels - calcium regulation issues? If I had time for more than stealing moments at the computer, I'd so look up calcitonin regulation.

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#819 of 863 Old 10-13-2010, 02:40 AM
 
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They're still not running the labs I want. Still not running FT3, just TSH and FT4.

Anyway, not much reference but:
Last test (April):
TSH 3.26
FT4 0.81

This test (yesterday):
TSH 2.15
FT4 0.69

So TSH is lower but so is FT4?
I suppose that's moving in a positive direction but it certainly isn't where I want it to be. I hate that I'm going to have to phone to request an increase again. I always am worried that there's going to be a confrontation at some point because of my last PCP.

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#820 of 863 Old 10-13-2010, 01:27 PM
 
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That's annoying JR! What is reference range for FT4, usually you want it in the upper range right? Do you still have symptoms? You are on how many grains now? Did they run antibodies, wouldn't that be important too?
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#821 of 863 Old 10-13-2010, 02:52 PM
 
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That's annoying JR! What is reference range for FT4, usually you want it in the upper range right? Do you still have symptoms? You are on how many grains now? Did they run antibodies, wouldn't that be important too?
They only ran anti-Tgab in February. It was >1000 then.

Reference range is 0.61-1.27.
I take 1.5 grains daily.
I won't get into the long and pathetic list here, but chances are they won't be recognized as thyroid issues by anyone but Broda Barnes .

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#822 of 863 Old 10-18-2010, 03:41 PM
 
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Alright ladies... I'm back as I had some updated blood work done (despite not feel hypo symptomatic) since I was in the MD office for strep. I have a dx of hashi, so they want to keep on top of it.

Updated TSH (which is the only one they test me for) came back 8.6. Last Dec it was 9.5 so some decrease but not much.

Also I have lowish Vit D at 28 (vs. 32), but I explained I wasn't taking the supplement since it was summer and I've been outside a good deal.

So I'm getting a slightly increased dose of Synthroid (125mcg)and I managed to talk my MD out of a crazy Vit D supplement in hopes to find something else to help support/elevate my vit d levels.

I've made changes to my diet by trying albeit slowly going GF and somewhat grain-free too and that has made the difference for my elbows and digestive issues. I take about 1-2 tbs of CO throughout the day with my coffee, and I've added (as I remember) to eat 2 brazil nuts a day for Se.

In going back a bit through the thread, I've found these 2 posts regarding additional supplementation, so if you were going to put together a plan of supplements, which ones would you do/recommend?

Also should I be pressing my MD (family practice) to get a recommendation to see and be evaluated by an Endocrinologist?

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Originally Posted by JaneS View Post
Lack of the following nutrients can cause an inability to convert T4 to T3 and thus cause hypothyrodism:
  • iodine
  • iron
  • selenium
  • zinc
  • vitamins A & D
  • B vitamins esp. B6 and B12

Magnesium defiency mimics symptoms of hypothyroidism.

Copper excess (common in veg*an diets) can cause hyperthyroidism and also low zinc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nichole View Post
I like something for me personally called optizinc. I have hashi's and also consider myself hypo. I was reading on ithyroid.com that hypos tend to be low on zinc and hypers tend to be low on copper. The nice thing about optizinc is that it contains just a small amount of copper so that you do not throw yourself off balance. You might be able to have a naturopath test your saliva for heavy metals. I find ithyroid.com's supplement section to be very informative on what minerals and vitamins hypos and hypers need. He does say you need to consult your physician, but my physician is about as helpful as a monkey when it comes to supplements so bah!

I just read on ithyroid that if you have excess mercury in your system, you may need extra selenium, not to exceed 600mcg. I temporarily bumped my Se from 200 to 400mcg b/c I have been soooo tired and did get my amalgams out a year ago. I'm nervous to take too much Se, but I think 400 for a few weeks will be okay.

I am out of some of my vitamins including b complex and flavanoids to take with my C. Before I get back on my regimen, I am supposed to find out the lab results including tsh, t3, and t4 next week so I'm trying to hold off to see if my dr can help. If he can't, I guess I'll just try iodine on my own and get back on all the cofactors. I don't want to change too many things at one time. If a little bit more synthroid is what I need to be able to take better care of my family, I'm down with that. I like the idea of healing my thyroid naturally, but sometimes I'm not sure if that is possible for me. Maybe iodine is the missing link for me or maybe it is too late. I really don't care how I feel better...just as long as I do! If extra synthroid doesn't help me, I'm thinking of ordering the Iosol Iodine. It is a low dose so that way I can proceed slowly and keep an eye out for side effects.
TIA!

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#823 of 863 Old 10-18-2010, 04:19 PM
 
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Originally Posted by JacquelineR View Post
They only ran anti-Tgab in February. It was >1000 then.

Reference range is 0.61-1.27.
I take 1.5 grains daily.
I won't get into the long and pathetic list here, but chances are they won't be recognized as thyroid issues by anyone but Broda Barnes .
So clearly you need more hormone to shut off your body's production regardless of how "normal" the TSH is? Or does your current practitioner not think the antibody count should be treated?

eta: do I have that right... your TSH should be .01 so your body is not producing thyroid hormone, and therefore the antibody attack should stop?
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#824 of 863 Old 10-19-2010, 01:37 PM
 
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Please help!!! I am making my way through this thread, and the various websites that have been suggested, but can't wait any longer to ask for your advice.Here is my situation (I'm sorry this is so long ):

Yesterday was my first appt with an endocrinologist. He is strongly medical model, not open to holistic care. (I am seeing my ND & acupuncturist for treatment, also started a gf diet, and am taking supplements - he basically rolled his eyes).

When diagnosed this past Sept, my TSH was 7.06, my free T4 & free T3 were on the low end of normal, and I tested positive for both thyroid antibodies. I was told I have subclinical hashimotos, although I was feeling very symptomatic (zero energy, brain fog, recent weight gain, etc). I have been on thyroxine (synthetic TSH) for the past month, haven't got my new blood results back as of yet. Also, ultrasound picked up at least one nodule that is suspicious and will be biopsied.

My endo thinks I should continue ttc as soon as my TSH is between 1-2 (I'm >35 and we've been ttc for awhile). He says that even if the nodule turns out to be cancer, we can treat postpartum. He described thyroid cancer as more of a nuisance than life threatening (?!!). I plan to wait until after the biopsy results (and if I'm clear, to go ahead ttc).

My questions are:
-how risky is pregnancy if I have thyroid antibodies? (assuming TSH is regulated)
-do thyroid antibodies tend to rise (as TSH does) in pregnancy? Is there any way to lower/control antibodies?
-in the case of cancer, can a person decline the radioactive iodine?
-should a woman begin taking extra synthroid while ttc, even before a positive HPT?
-do you have experience breastfeeding with hashis? How likely is it that I won't produce enough milk?
-Is there anything else to consider before ttc? (i.e. any other risks, issues I haven't thought of)?

TIA for your time reading this & for any input you can offer.

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#825 of 863 Old 10-19-2010, 02:45 PM
 
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ktg, from what I've seen, most endos aren't worth their weight in salt (though a good one is worth his weight in gold).
JaneS, My current practitioner (the most informed one I've found), doesn't have a clue. She only ran the antibodies bc I asked for them and had to 'figure out' which antibodies to test (even though I asked for both and she only ran the one but whatever).
The issue is my FT4 is low and I' have no idea where my FT3 is. And yes, thyroid function is supposed to be suppressed in order to stop the antibody production. Going GF would probably help too. But I'll cross that bridge at another time. Right now, I just have too much on my plate to deal with that aspect of life (and yes, it would be easy what with DS1 on a GF diet and all but it still takes discipline which I don't have atm).

I can't really answer any of your questions, peaches' mom, except to say:
my last pregnancy was after I was dx'd Hashi's and, other than having HG, it was a perfectly "normal" pregnancy. I'm assuming that my antibodies were no better during pregnancy than before or now.
I'm assuming your doctor is going by TSH <10 for dx? Is s/he aware the newest rec's are that anything above 2 be treated? Sorry. Doctors annoy the vinegar out of me.
Antibodies: going gluten free, selenium, suppression of thyroid all decrease antibody counts
The only time I had problems with milk production is when my thyroid first tanked and I wasn't treated and had tsh of <100

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#826 of 863 Old 10-20-2010, 11:40 AM
 
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Originally Posted by peaches' mom View Post

My questions are:
-how risky is pregnancy if I have thyroid antibodies? (assuming TSH is regulated)
-do thyroid antibodies tend to rise (as TSH does) in pregnancy? Is there any way to lower/control antibodies?
-in the case of cancer, can a person decline the radioactive iodine?
-should a woman begin taking extra synthroid while ttc, even before a positive HPT?
-do you have experience breastfeeding with hashis? How likely is it that I won't produce enough milk?
-Is there anything else to consider before ttc? (i.e. any other risks, issues I haven't thought of)?

TIA for your time reading this & for any input you can offer.
I have no idea of antibodies but I assume it's risky to be pg with low thyroid hormone since its well known that effects baby's brain development.

Most nodules are not cancerous and are instead indicative of low iodine and Hashimoto's. Did you have your calcium and parathyroid levels tested? They can also be calcium deposits.

See alternative to radioactive iodine here:
http://www.naturalthyroidchoices.com/

I would not take synthroid, see here for desiccated thyroid info:
www.stopthethyroidmadness.com
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#827 of 863 Old 10-20-2010, 07:35 PM
 
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More random dosage questions here. I have had my TSH tested every 4 weeks b/c it hasn't really stabilized during this pg (I wasn't hypo during any of my others).

4 weeks ago, I was on 50 mcg Levo and TSH was 2.33. Prior to finding out that number, my mw had upped my dosage to 75 mcg b/c my previous TSH (4 weeks before) had been 3.5 or so.

When the number came back at 2.33, she told me to go every other day with the 50/75 and we'd check again in 4 weeks. THis week, TSH was 2.17. Does it seem right that it went down so little with the every other day increase in dosage? I think my mw would be fine with me going to straight 75 mcg, I'd like to try to get the number under 2 for once to see if I get any energy. The only reason she might not is b/c I haven't gained any weight at 14 weeks and she'd like to see at least a couple pounds by my next appt.

Sorry about hte novel, but is it worth pursuing the steady higher dosage? FWIW, I have rxs for both dosages, but I want to make sure this is a good idea!

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#828 of 863 Old 10-22-2010, 07:53 PM
 
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Thanks a lot, Jane, for your info. I really appreciate it.

Nadia - I can't offer any insight, but I wanted to send you . I'll be interested in any advice you get.

Here is something I posted on the ttc board, but wanted to put it on this thread in case anyone can offer help....

Just got results from my labs after being on synthroid for 5 weeks. My TSH went from 7.06 to 2.6. At my appt last week, endo said he wants me in the 1-2 range before ttc. However, now that the results are back he seems to have changed his mind, says that my TSH is normal. I pressed him about his previous target (which also fits with everything I've read) but he just repeated, "your tsh is normal". (FWIW, I should also mention that he was completely dismissive that I have had any symptoms of hypothyroid at 7.06 - even though my symptoms have been textbook )

What do you think, should I go ahead and ttc at this level? My gut tells me that we'll just continue to be unsuccessful (and get even more frustrated) if it isn't in the "ideal" range. I am >35 and feeling the time pressure already.

Isn't it "safer" to start a pregnancy at a lower tsh, given that we know most women's tsh goes up during the pregnancy? If I start out with a tsh of 1 there is more leeway, no?

If you have BTDT, what did you do about your synthroid dose during pregnancy? Were you proactive in upping the dose? Or did you wait and see? What was your experience?

thanks in advance for any insight you can offer me. Your advice is invaluable, especially given that I can't rely on my hcp!

jen

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#829 of 863 Old 10-22-2010, 07:58 PM
 
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Ooops sorry I responded in TTC post, I didn't recognize you. I would run to desiccated thyroid and a new dr. at this point given you've had infertility issues... which is a classic low thyroid symptom.
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#830 of 863 Old 10-22-2010, 08:14 PM
 
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thanks so much (again), Jane. I agree I need to find a new doc, shall press my PCP for a new referral (have no idea if this is even possible and what the wait time may be).

I am struggling with the Armour decision because, although I am very naturally minded, I have been vegan for most of my life. I need to get some really good info about it. Have read a bit from pro-armour sources, but I admit most of my info comes from medical care providers. They are all pushing me toward synthetic claiming that the natural dessicated is too hard to standardize. I do realize they are brainwashed but I guess it has made my vegan dilemma easier. I need to revisit it.

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#831 of 863 Old 10-22-2010, 08:16 PM
 
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Ooops sorry I responded in TTC post, I didn't recognize you. I would run to desiccated thyroid and a new dr. at this point given you've had infertility issues... which is a classic low thyroid symptom.

I was proactive in increasing my dose during pregnancy, yes.

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#832 of 863 Old 10-22-2010, 08:23 PM
 
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I think i will call Monday and see if I can okay the dose with my mw.

I wouldn't push it, but I am still SOOOOOO tired (I do have a screwy work schedule and ge tup at 3am, but I go to bed by 8) and I have several days a week where I get so cold that I cannot warm up despite layers and blankets. If I go to sleep, I will eventually wake up toasty warm, but I hate being that cold.

I honestly haven't felt good since about 2 months into starting meds (a year ago). After the baby is born my mw wants to check antibodies -- that would be checking for Hashis, right?

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#833 of 863 Old 10-22-2010, 09:10 PM
 
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Just thought of another question - has anyone tried going gluten free and found any impact (or not) on their thyroid labs?

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#834 of 863 Old 10-22-2010, 09:11 PM
 
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Originally Posted by nadia105 View Post
I honestly haven't felt good since about 2 months into starting meds (a year ago). After the baby is born my mw wants to check antibodies -- that would be checking for Hashis, right?
Yes, as I understand it, antibodies confirm hashis.

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#835 of 863 Old 10-23-2010, 08:57 AM
 
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Quick question: Would iodine supplementation alter a thyroid blood test?
I am going to a doctor in a couple weeks to discuss some of my symptoms (brain fog, short term memory issues, low energy, dry skin...) but given all my recent reading, I really want to try supplementing iodine. Just wondering if that would interfere with the test results and perhaps not give the full picture of what's going on? Should I just wait to start taking iodine or does it not matter? Thanks!
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#836 of 863 Old 10-23-2010, 12:15 PM
 
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I can't answer your question, here2now. All I can say is that increasing my iodine caused my thyroid to crash and burn (again). But I do have confirmed Hashi's so that may not be so for others w/o it.
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Just thought of another question - has anyone tried going gluten free and found any impact (or not) on their thyroid labs?
yes and yes, which is why I keep going on about how I know I should be gf.
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Yes, as I understand it, antibodies confirm hashis.
yes, elevated antibodies confirms Hashi's (or Graves). Because the immune response is somewhat suppressed by pregnancy, there are sometimes negative results if the test is performed then

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#837 of 863 Old 10-24-2010, 12:05 AM
 
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JR,
has there been any research on multiple m/c and Hashi's? There should be. I want to have enough money to fund my own research (and publicize the heck out of it!!!!)
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#838 of 863 Old 10-24-2010, 02:58 AM
 
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Quick question: Would iodine supplementation alter a thyroid blood test?
I am going to a doctor in a couple weeks to discuss some of my symptoms (brain fog, short term memory issues, low energy, dry skin...) but given all my recent reading, I really want to try supplementing iodine. Just wondering if that would interfere with the test results and perhaps not give the full picture of what's going on? Should I just wait to start taking iodine or does it not matter? Thanks!
Yes, from what I understand (and have experienced) Iodine can raise your TSH for up to six months, but your free t-4 and free t-3 should be in normal range. My TSH was super high after first starting iodine (20-25!) I've been on 50mg of iodine for about 8 months and have just taken my first "post-six-months" test. I haven't received the results back yet.
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#839 of 863 Old 10-24-2010, 04:09 PM
 
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Yes, from what I understand (and have experienced) Iodine can raise your TSH for up to six months, but your free t-4 and free t-3 should be in normal range. My TSH was super high after first starting iodine (20-25!) I've been on 50mg of iodine for about 8 months and have just taken my first "post-six-months" test. I haven't received the results back yet.
Erratum - Can you explain more about your iodine supp? I'm unclear, are you still taking 50 mg or does the "post-six-months" refer to after ending this supp?
I am very interested to learn more. I suspect that I overdosed on iodine, which led to my hypo diagnosis. I was taking a high dose of maca (which I have recently learned is very rich in iodine) in the months preceding my diagnosis.

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#840 of 863 Old 10-24-2010, 06:28 PM
 
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JR,
has there been any research on multiple m/c and Hashi's? There should be. I want to have enough money to fund my own research (and publicize the heck out of it!!!!)
you'd think there would be, wouldn't you?
I haven't looked for it specifically, so I'm not certain. My 3 miscarriages were all pre-diagnosis, as were 2 of my children, and 2 of my m/c were during periods of extreme stress (although so was DS2's pregnancy)... Hmm.

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