www.vaccinetruth.org - Mothering Forums
 
Thread Tools
#1 of 16 Old 02-01-2005, 04:56 PM - Thread Starter
 
policyvote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 14
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Okay, so I've been trying to research this subject like crazy the past couple of days. I'm trying to get to the real scientific analysis that shows a link between vaccinations and real medical harms. I had a really hard time finding any sites that had legitimate information. I just got back from www.vaccinetruth.org, where I read the sitemaster's heartbreaking horror story and subsequent research. Some of the research she found was very, very compelling, and some of it was a little iffy, but on the whole I had basically decided that further vaccination of my daughter was probably going to be a shot-by-shot decision . . .

And then I reached the end of her research: a complete rejection of germ theory and western medicine, and an espousal of diet and homeopathy instead of real medical care. Now, this doesn't completely invalidate some of the points she makes--there are some vaccines where the side effects listed on the label are much worse than the disease they're trying to prevent--but I find her conclusion totally invalid, and IMO it casts a very large shadow of doubt on her other conclusions as well.

Is there any information for us concerned parents still living on Planet Reality? Or, is a rejection of vaccines also a rejection of modern medicine as a whole?

Peace
policy
policyvote is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
#2 of 16 Old 02-01-2005, 05:59 PM
 
amnesiac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: at the end of the longest line
Posts: 4,863
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I'm not really sure if I'm on the same page as you since I do feel many dietary interventions & alternative health approaches are very valid. However, I also believe in the use of some "modern medicine" under certain circumstances.

I like most of these because they aren't as "out there" as a lot of anti-vax stuff you run across & there are plenty of mainstream references for you to check out:
http://www.naturalfamilyonline.com/a...ccinations.htm
amnesiac is offline  
#3 of 16 Old 02-01-2005, 06:57 PM - Thread Starter
 
policyvote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 14
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by amnesiac
I'm not really sure if I'm on the same page as you since I do feel many dietary interventions & alternative health approaches are very valid.
http://www.naturalfamilyonline.com/a...ccinations.htm

Thanks for the link!

I do not mean to dismiss all diet/alternative health approaches, but to say that diet and homeopathy alone replaces all medical care . . . that doesn't jibe with my worldview, to say the least.

I also find it this passage bizarre:

Quote:
Holistic Physicians follow the principle laid down by Samuel Hahnemann, the late 18th-century physician and founder of homeopathy. The basis of this theory of medicine is as follows, “That which makes you sick shall heal you.” Along with a treatment called Biosyntonic, which restores information to the body in a natural and non-invasive way, he prescribed a “remedy” against the vaccines.
So, we vaccinate against vaccines with homeopathy? I don't get it.

Peace
policy
policyvote is offline  
 
#4 of 16 Old 02-01-2005, 08:50 PM
 
menudo's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: S to the J
Posts: 3,732
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Many of us here seem as "out there" as her but were where you are now some time ago. Really. I vaccinated my first. Iquestioned and began to "delay" with #2...the more I read (both sides) the more I came to learn. I do reject alot of mainstream western medicine for many resons/ Sure it has its place but it is overused and is a money making machine! We make drugs to treat symptoms of a disease and drugs to treat the side effects of the original drugs, etc...it is a mess.

So read everything, it wasa PRO VAX book that finally turned me completely against vaccinating!
menudo is offline  
#5 of 16 Old 02-01-2005, 09:09 PM
 
Gitti's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Ready to move on...
Posts: 14,488
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
I had to laugh when I read you post because that was so like me a few years back.
I kept reading and saying, ok they almost had me convinced and now they went off their rocker. I think they are all nuts. They are a bunch of fruitcakes.... (I am referring to some sites! not posters.)

But there was this knowing doubt about continuing to vaccinate my grandson. His paternal cousin had been diagnosed with autism and it was definitely due to the MMR vaccine. Even though doctors denied it. My own grandson had never smiled in his whole little life and the ped kept calling him a 'serious child'. At the time he was 2 yrs. old. And we had given him lots and lots of reasons to smile. He only stared.

Those were a few of the reasons I kept coming back to research the issue. I ignored 'outer planet stuff' and stuck to what I wanted to find out.

Ingredients of vaccines, what each compound does in the body?
The medium vaccines are grown in?
Why we keep increasing the number of vaccines being injected into those little bodies? (dh and I had barely any.)
Then I looked at everything I could find about Childhood diseases. And when I read the definition and consequences of the childhood diseases from the CDC I began to wonder what they were describing? Certainly not the childhood diseases dh and I'd had?
Where are they getting the numbers of deaths? (The answer is of course AFRICA not Europe or America.)


I wanted to know why we now, in the last 20 yrs. have so many more children with cancer? Why we've built so many children's cancer centers? And why they are such huge money makers? (Makes me want to vomit just writing it down. But it is a fact.)

Anyway, to make a very long story short, I continued to research and when the next vaccine was due, dd and I decided from now on - one at a time. Good thing we continued with our reading, because that one was the last vaccine he ever got and my second grandchild is not and never will be vaccinated.

A good site to start with that deals ONLY in vaccines is www.909shot.com

Also, stick around, and keep us up to date on your research. Congratulations on checking it out. Most people don't until their child is damaged.
Gitti is offline  
#6 of 16 Old 02-01-2005, 09:09 PM
 
annalily's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: East TN
Posts: 1,074
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Homeopathy may be very foreign to you and may now seem totally "out there" right now. But as you get deeper into the research of vaccines and realize that the whole of conventional medicine kind of stands on them.... and then you realize (or at least this is how it was for me) that if they are wrong about vaccines "saving us," then maybe they are wrong about other things too. And when you think about how many diseases have "no cure" (but of course can be "treated" --with continuous use of drugs, which usually just supress symptoms and do nothing to cure anyone), then you wonder if conventional medicine perhaps is not the best way to address illness-- and certainly not the best way to address health.

I assume the mom who obviously put hundreds of hours into her site, vaccinetruth.org, came to realize just like I have, that conventional medicine ain't all that. Now, that is not to say that it does not have its place. I believe conventional medicine is superior to most any other system when it comes to emergencies and injuries (though I would still use and have still used homeopathy as well in those instances!). And that is not to say that anyone who questions or rejects vaccines must reject all of conventional medicine. For many of us that is where the journey has lead. And just because conventional doctors don't learn much about nutrition or put much stock in it does not mean that nutrition is not important.

Anyway, I agree with bebesho2, just keep reading. I really like that website and the amount of work it required is phenomenal. But I would never recommend that someone researching this issue read only one website.

Maybe do some reading from those who reject the germ theory and see what you think? At the least you will have some interesting reading!
Good luck!
annalily is offline  
#7 of 16 Old 02-01-2005, 09:30 PM
 
Rainbow Brite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Snuggled with dd
Posts: 1,402
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
nak

I was where you are only months ago. We decided not to vax, but still feared the diseases, till I kept reading and reading....
Just check around mdc, when I first came here, I was so overwhelmed, and thought some things were very out there- now I'm doing most of what I thought was strange
Rainbow Brite is offline  
#8 of 16 Old 02-01-2005, 11:07 PM
 
DesireeH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Orange County, CA
Posts: 8,238
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Add me to the "quack" list. LOL Conventional medicine aint all that it's cracked up to be. Sure it has a place, if I amputated a limb in a carwreck that is the first place I would go but to BUILD UP my immune system, conventional medicine is the LAST thing I would seek out.

Mama to a teen and tween
DesireeH is offline  
#9 of 16 Old 02-02-2005, 01:17 AM
 
sharon80's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Michigan
Posts: 24
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Yup- we don't vax either. People in "society" don't know how big of an issue this really is. Good for you for looking into what's best for you child.

Anoterh couple of sites to look into:
www.marytocco.com
www.thinktwice.com
www.909shot.com

I can't remember the site, but it's something like Titus Birthing Center.

Books by Stephanie Cave and Neil Z. ******, Aviva Romm, too. Good picks there.

Best wishes.
sharon80 is offline  
#10 of 16 Old 02-02-2005, 06:14 AM
 
Mommymama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 166
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Yeap. conventional medicine works for Trauma and Emergency situations but the rest is mostly expensive band-aids that don't address the real issues. In fact medicine and doctors are the third leading cause of death in the US:

http://www.mercola.com/2000/jul/30/doctors_death.htm

or maybe even the first:

http://www.mercola.com/2003/jan/15/doctors_drugs.htm

That is not to mention that the development of modern medicine parallels the development of the petrochemical industry in the past century. Many of the CEOs and directors of drug companies also site on the board of petrochemical companies and vice versa. The amount of conflict of interest between the government entities and drug companies is unbelievable:

http://www.mercola.com/2000/sep/24/v..._approvals.htm

My advice? Read, read, read. Go to the archives and start researching. You may end up changing your views of modern medicine radically. Good luck.
Mommymama is offline  
#11 of 16 Old 02-02-2005, 07:23 AM
 
Vito's Mommy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: In the land of overpriced homes.
Posts: 763
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I come from the do as your parents did kind of family. But luckily I'm a bit different. While pg I felt this need to read about all the stuff I was taught in the fam, but knew nothing about. So glad I did. It was a lot of research, on both sides, but worth every waking hour spent. Good for you in educating yourself about vaccs. There is a book I read that was helpful as well and I believe you can order it thru Mothering Magazine: Vaccinations, the issue of our time. Also http://cdc.gov/nip/publications/pink...excipient2.paf

This is the table of contents in vaccinations from the CDC
Vito's Mommy is offline  
#12 of 16 Old 02-02-2005, 12:34 PM
 
amnesiac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: at the end of the longest line
Posts: 4,863
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
but to say that diet and homeopathy alone replaces all medical care . . . that doesn't jibe with my worldview, to say the least.

I also find it this passage bizarre:
I totally hear ya. We totally do well-baby visits and see our docs for labs & sometimes meds when needed. And I don't really dig homeopathy.
amnesiac is offline  
#13 of 16 Old 02-02-2005, 08:29 PM - Thread Starter
 
policyvote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 14
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gitti
IHis paternal cousin had been diagnosed with autism and it was definitely due to the MMR vaccine. Even though doctors denied it. My own grandson had never smiled in his whole little life and the ped kept calling him a 'serious child'. At the time he was 2 yrs. old. And we had given him lots and lots of reasons to smile. He only stared.
See . . . that's where I have problems. There are a lot of people out there saying "it's the vaccines" but very little that actually connects the effect with the alleged cause.

[quote]Ingredients of vaccines, what each compound does in the body?
The medium vaccines are grown in?
Why we keep increasing the number of vaccines being injected into those little bodies? (dh and I had barely any.)
Then I looked at everything I could find about Childhood diseases. And when I read the definition and consequences of the childhood diseases from the CDC I began to wonder what they were describing? Certainly not the childhood diseases dh and I'd had?
Where are they getting the numbers of deaths? (The answer is of course AFRICA not Europe or America.)[/quote[

And this is the stuff I'm researching right now. Of all the links I've looked at, vaccinetruth.org had the most compelling information about how the vaccines are made and what they're composed of--but now I'm going to have to independently verify all of that information. It makes no sense to try to prove, scientifically, that vaccines are dangerous, just to turn around and embrace something that has no basis in science (or, if you ask me) reality.

Quote:
Also, stick around, and keep us up to date on your research. Congratulations on checking it out. Most people don't until their child is damaged.
Oh, I'll be around. Not just in the vaccine forum, either--I love forums and I love being a parent, so . . .

Peace
policy
policyvote is offline  
#14 of 16 Old 02-03-2005, 12:24 AM
 
Gitti's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Ready to move on...
Posts: 14,488
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by policyvote
See . . . that's where I have problems. There are a lot of people out there saying "it's the vaccines" but very little that actually connects the effect with the alleged cause.
There is no money nor effort to establish any connection. The money for research in health issues comes from the pharmaceutical cartel and the outcome is therefore determined by them.

Most doctors are discouraged to report vaccine side effects. At best 1 out of 10 will report any.

http://www.vaers.org/data.htm

First thing to research is whether vaccines work or not.

Look at epidemics and see that most affected are fully vaccinated. See any whooping cough epidemic even in the US and the present diphtheria epidemic in Russia, where everyone is forced to vaccinate.

The greatest fear is for vaccinated people to come in contact with unvaccinated. Why? That shows mistrust in the vaccine on the highest level. Does the vaccine protect or not?

If there is no evidence, no proof that vaccines protect than you should look at what is in the shot.

Because for sure we do know the effects of formaldehyde, mercury, aluminum, phenol, antibiotics, etc....

What is coming through that Needle?

Do a research about some unwanted viruses in vaccine such as the SV40. A latent virus that was injected with the polio vaccine and was found twenty years later in brain tumors. No only in the vaccinee but also in their offsprings.

And more recently: From the Food and Drug Administration web site: BSE
Gitti is offline  
#15 of 16 Old 02-03-2005, 02:15 AM - Thread Starter
 
policyvote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 14
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
NOW we're getting somewhere:

http://jpands.org/vol8no4/yazbak.pdf
http://www.909shot.com/Diseases/autismsp.htm

This is what I've been looking for all along. This is very, very interesting stuff. I'm really going to be putting my nose to the books here.

Peace
policy
policyvote is offline  
#16 of 16 Old 02-03-2005, 02:26 AM
 
Gitti's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Ready to move on...
Posts: 14,488
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
first I wanted to post this:

Links between Autism, ADHD and vaccine



Here is another one. I am always concerned about juvenile diabetes. There was a 1 yr. old child in our neighborhood who was breast-fed and was diagnosed with it. And there was NO family history. So very sad!

http://www.909shot.com/Diseases/Diabetes.htm
Gitti is offline  
Reply


User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off

Online Users: 887

7 members and 880 guests
fljen , kathymuggle , LadyDreamer , lauritagoddess , MattRandalloK6 , stellanyc
Most users ever online was 21,860, 06-22-2018 at 09:45 PM.