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We should bring back more oppression.
I suspect that was a tongue in cheek response, but when it comes to raising kids, I am squarely in the camp that sometimes it's a parent's job to oppress a kid. Until the age of 25, the human brain has still not fully developed complex decision making skills. So sometimes the parent has to be the voice of sanity. And that can be oppressing - especially to teen-agers.
:wink:
I am not saying to be intolerant, and there is nothing wrong with wanting to occasionally run around in your birthday suit. But there is a time and place for that.

My oldest daughter used to be a notorious nudist whenever she could get away with it. We didn't say it was wrong. We just told her to be naked on her own time.
 

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My suspicion has always been that there was a trolling element to this thread. The original poster only ever contributed to this one thread, and hasn't returned to MDC since a week after it was posted. I wouldn't hold my breath for an update.

miranda
 

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Nope. I am going to be that lone voice and say that I think it's a bad idea. If your daughter
wants to be nude in her room, that is fine. But outside of that, I think it's absurd.

My husband likes to not wear clothes when it's just the two of us, but he would never do so around the kids. Our oldest is also prone toward nudity, but we were adamant it be in her room only, and only when she is alone. Frankly, it's weird and a bit rude to push your nudity onto others. I don't want to see it. Most people don't.

These days it's trendy to not oppress the individual, but when that individual freedom ends up making others have to deal with weirdness, it's time to reign it in.

When you daughter gets older, what kind of life do you want for her? For us, we wanted our kids to have the skills and knowledge to fit into mainstream society. It's okay to be different, but it's still important to know what is expected and be comfortable dealing with it. For us, the household is a place to teach those skills. We expect the kids to act at home like they would act in society. No swearing. Be respectful. Wear clothes...
Really? No swearing? At all? Does that mean mom and dad don't swear? Do you really think a 15 year old is so stupid that they think that being allowed to go nude at home means that they can go nude anywhere, or that forcing them to fit your version of "normal" will make them not weird. If you are uncomfortable with nudity in your home, own it, don't try to pass it off as trying to teach social rules.
 

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If you are uncomfortable with nudity in your home, own it, don't try to pass it off as trying to teach social rules.
I think it's a more nuanced than being a matter of teaching "social rules." A respectful well-socialized person, unless there are compelling reasons to the contrary, avoids behaving in ways that make others uncomfortable or inconvenience them. Empathy means taking the subtleties of others' experiences into account, and respectfully weighing our own words and actions against those.

There are plenty of low-level inconveniences and concerns that could result from a teen's nudity, some of which have been raised up-thread. For example, it's reasonably likely that a younger sibling, if his school friends found out, would be teased and bullied about his sister's habits of nudity.

A teen has a right to be nude in her own home, just as I have the right to free speech. Rights are absolute. But whether it is good, kind, empathetic and respectful to exercise those rights fully in ways that have a negative impact on others, that's not a black and white issue. To me it really comes down to whether the teen's reasons for wanting to be nude are compelling enough to outweigh any ongoing inconvenience or discomfort produced in others around them.

Miranda
 

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I think it's a more nuanced than being a matter of teaching "social rules." A respectful well-socialized person, unless there are compelling reasons to the contrary, avoids behaving in ways that make others uncomfortable or inconvenience them. Empathy means taking the subtleties of others' experiences into account, and respectfully weighing our own words and actions against those.

There are plenty of low-level inconveniences and concerns that could result from a teen's nudity, some of which have been raised up-thread. For example, it's reasonably likely that a younger sibling, if his school friends found out, would be teased and bullied about his sister's habits of nudity.

A teen has a right to be nude in her own home, just as I have the right to free speech. Rights are absolute. But whether it is good, kind, empathetic and respectful to exercise those rights fully in ways that have a negative impact on others, that's not a black and white issue. To me it really comes down to whether the teen's reasons for wanting to be nude are compelling enough to outweigh any ongoing inconvenience or discomfort produced in others around them.

Miranda
Except that she didn't mention any of that in her post, she merely spoke as if there is a set list of "normal" behaviors that must be prescribed by the parent, nothing about being sensitive to the feelings of others. That my point.
 

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Really? No swearing? At all? Does that mean mom and dad don't swear? Do you really think a 15 year old is so stupid that they think that being allowed to go nude at home means that they can go nude anywhere, or that forcing them to fit your version of "normal" will make them not weird. If you are uncomfortable with nudity in your home, own it, don't try to pass it off as trying to teach social rules.
Really. No swearing at all. And we refrain as well.

I am in a management role in an engineering company, and 99% of the time I don't swear at work. Why? It's unprofessional. And that's what I teach my kids. If the kids want to swear, we tell them don't do it home. We avoid it because it's a bad habit, and we teach the kids the same.

It affects your ability to succeed at life. Any time you choose to ignore societal norms (like wearing clothing), or be undisciplined in your choices, you are making trade-offs with your how your life path will go. Sometimes it's a good thing, and sometimes it's not. But in our home, we won't cater to absurdity or the weird post-modern acceptance of bizarre hedonism. It's not healthy.
 

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"Be respectful" covers a lot of ground.

Miranda
It could also be used to tell someone not to breastfeed in public, for example, or to wear only certain clothing styles ("modest") to respect those with more conservative beliefs. How far does one take it? On the other hand, calling people who swear or who go nude behind closed doors "weird" is not really respectful, is it? It's literally using a judgmental word to describe behavior without attempting to understand that there may be special needs under neath it.
 

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Really. No swearing at all. And we refrain as well.

I am in a management role in an engineering company, and 99% of the time I don't swear at work. Why? It's unprofessional. And that's what I teach my kids. If the kids want to swear, we tell them don't do it home. We avoid it because it's a bad habit, and we teach the kids the same.

It affects your ability to succeed at life. Any time you choose to ignore societal norms (like wearing clothing), or be undisciplined in your choices, you are making trade-offs with your how your life path will go. Sometimes it's a good thing, and sometimes it's not. But in our home, we won't cater to absurdity or the weird post-modern acceptance of bizarre hedonism. It's not healthy.
It seems to me that your choice to impose your own brand of values is rather arbitrary and not exactly healthy either, in that you are expecting all your family members to unconditionally defer to your judgment and think the way you think, rather than allowing them to evaluate things themselves. This often leads to rebellion, especially in teens, and can result in young adults who have been unable to make their own choices suddenly doing the opposite of what their parents wanted, or just following the crowd they find themselves among. I realize you mean well, and you really do believe that your values are shared by the majority (and therefore, more valid than those of others), but once your children are out in the world, what will they think when they find out that the values you consider universal are not actually that universal? Swearing may be "unprofessional" in some jobs, but part of the way you relate in others (sports, for example, or construction or any other number of blue collar jobs); regardless, the home is not the workplace, and many rules that apply to workplaces, such as dress codes, do not apply to the home. We come home, get into our comfortable clothes, and relax. Why should work place rules follow everyone, especially since your workplace is only one type (my husband's company, a software company, does not have a dress code and swearing is fairly common, even up to the CEOs).
 

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My suspicion has always been that there was a trolling element to this thread. The original poster only ever contributed to this one thread, and hasn't returned to MDC since a week after it was posted. I wouldn't hold my breath for an update.

miranda
sounds about right. As for WWID if my child wanted to be nude, they would only be allowed to do it in their own room and bathroom, the common areas they would need to at least be robed. just because one person wants something doesn't mean that their desire trumps everyone else's comfort.
 

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sounds about right. As for WWID if my child wanted to be nude, they would only be allowed to do it in their own room and bathroom, the common areas they would need to at least be robed. just because one person wants something doesn't mean that their desire trumps everyone else's comfort.
Does this have a minimum age? Does it include toddlers?

As for swearing (not that you mentioned it, but another person did), I found this interesting:
http://www.timjlawrence.com/blog/2015/12/7/why-swearing-is-important

Also, this:
http://www.scarymommy.com/9-rules-of-swearing-for-my-children/
 

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Not the same. Babies have a need to eat. No one has a need to be naked in public.
Except that she didn't qualify it that way with need vs. desire. She only stated that others' discomfort was the only criteria of determining whether it's appropriate or not, and that she wants to teach social rules by recreating them as she perceives them to be in society in her own home. As in, if you wouldn't walk around on the street naked, you can't do it at home. PLENTY of people have a problem with public breastfeeding, and thus you could apply the same strict universal rule to that. She also spoke about it not as in "we need to be sensitive to others' feelings" but instead "this is how you're supposed to act out in the world and therefore you must act that same way all the time at home."
 

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Is that universal, regardless of the heat? Must bathroom doors always be closed, then?
I agree with Sharlla, 3yo is old enough to keep something over their bottoms. Heat shouldn't matter because you can be just as cool and comfy in under pants or a pull up as they could be in the nude.
Also why should it matter if the bathroom door is open or closed? Does your family make it a habit to keep it open regardless of what actions they're taking IN the bathroom, their state of undress, or the company in the house? That seems slightly awkward to me. I don't think I'd visit friends is they were pooping with the door open or other type of PERSONAL functions while they have guests over.

Just my two cents.
 
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