[Maggies*Mommy]

UGH! Where do I begin? Maggie has always been spirited, from day one. Which doesn't surprise me because I was/am also and I kind of expected it. But, i'm really starting to have a hard time. She is a really sweet little girl, but, is a little spit-fire at the same time.

Right now we are really having a problem with re-direction. I know she "gets it" on some level that she is doing something she isn't suppose to do because she will look back at me to see if I am watching. I usually will say her name and tell whatever it is she is doing she shouldn't be and why and then move her to another location. She immediately goes back to where she was without hesitation. This could go on all day, she has a one tract mind and she is very determined.

I have tried using a more stern voice when the re-direction isn't working and she will either laugh at me, or roll her eyes at me.

I'm at a loss on what to do. Ive read The Discipline Book/Sears, Ive read Raising Your Spirited Child, among other books. I have been staying consistent, but, its just not working for us. I have been re-directing her since she started crawling, so this isn't a new concept to her.

Its tiring, its frustrating. She is able and does follow other directions-Maggie, go get me your cup, Maggie lets get your shoes and we will go outside, Maggie, get mommy your purple color crayon-etc. Her impulse control is just so much I guess she just cant control herself(I don't expect her to control herself, but, at least pretend she is listening to me

)

Any tips or ideas? I'm one frustrated mama. What do you do at this point to get her to listen more? I dont see time outs working for us because there is no way she will sit anywhere for any amount of time.

HELP!

 

[irinam]

Um… how should I say it without sounding harsh, 'cuz I don't mean to be, I honestly don't! (Pa-a-at! Help!)

What I realized that the goal of "them listening to me" (a.ka. "do what I said") was a) not exactly in accordance with my beliefs b) especially with "spirited" kids was probably not attainable unless harsh methods of "making" them do stuff are used (not that I tried, LOL)

I mean, I would not want other people to tell me what to do. I would not mind, however, other people ASKING me to do stuff. Even then I reserve a right to refuse.

After I realized this, I thought that if I was to treat my kids (or anybody for that matter) as I want to be treated, I probably should let go of the expectation that kids (or anybody else) will "listen" to me.

I also realized that in many instances (majority, actually), kids (and other people) love to help and cooperate..

When I approach situations in our family life where I would desire my kids help - be it with getting a cup, or not teasing the cat, I ask. I also explain WHY I ask (and yes, initial explanations can be lengthy, but so are many other things that I want my kids to learn)

I found myself often pleasantly surprised at the level of cooperation my kids exhibit.

OT - where in North Cali are you mama?

 

[Maggies*Mommy]

Thanks for the reply Irina

Don't worry about sounding mean....you didn't.

I really do try to talk "to" her rather than "at" her. I admit, there are times when i'm just done and pretty much tell her what to do. But, by that time she has pretty much worn me down and its the end of the day and im just exhausted. It seems like its a constant thru out the day to try to get her to not do certain things. And, ofcourse she is a dare devil, so the things we "battle" with are the things that will hurt her. I have tried to the best of my capability to make this a "yes" environment, but, there are those things that cant be fixed. lol And, ofcourse, those things are her targets.

I guess all I can really do at this point is re-direct/talk to her and explain the situation to her. I really feel like i'm going know where real fast with this. But, I don't know what else to do.
Why does she have to be so much like me?

Her dad is passive to a fault-she could have at least come out a nice half/half of us!

We live in Santa Rosa. Where in the Bay Area are you at?

 

[faithnj]

Well since this isn't the CL thread......I'm going to feel free to give a non-cl answer.

Bobbi, my DD is the exact same age as yours, and I'm going through almost the exact same thing. I posted in parenting about how yesterday, my very well potty learned daughter got OFF of the pot, lied on the floor in front of it, announced she was going poo poo, then proceeded to pee on the floor with a smile on her face. She's doing a lot of that "I know this is a no-no, but smile!...Here I go! Now what are you going to do about it?" stuff. I'm finding I can barely make this a "yes" environment enough for her. Really. It seems like the more yeses I give to her, the more she demands-- it's just never enough.

Anyway.....so I went in search of some answers last night. For the peeing, I got ignore it, and then clean it up when she's not looking. I also got from I think it was Sears? that at this age, re-direction can seem insulting to a child because they have a good memory, know what they want, and can't as easiy be disuaded. (However, some people here say that when you redirect, honor the original impulse by redirecting to something that basically satisfies the original need.) l I know is that this is all age appropriate behavior for those in the 18 month to 2+ set. Does that mean it will pass? I don't know. Something in my gut says if it's not addressed correctly, well be the next set of posters talking about how we hate our 2 year olds, and want to run away from our lives with our 3-4 year olds. So I'm going to continue to be on the lookout for info from moms who have actually worked through these issues in ways that resulted in happy, healthy pre-schoolers. And if you get any good answers, I'll be looking forward to reading them.

Faith

 

[Melinda06160220]

I don't want this to sound wrong. But, I could just jump up and down in my seat and shout to the top of my lungs. Thank GOD someone else is going through this too. I am the mom of two wonderful children. A 10yr old son and then Emily 2 1/2. I own a child care center so luckily I have to have all this training on caring for children. They have NEVER met Emily!

I have a beautiful 2 1/2 yr. She was the most precious thing I ever wished for - UNTIL exactly 18 months old. It was like a light switch was flipped. Since July 12 she doesn't sleep through the night. Actually she was just diagnoised with insomnia!!!!!! The the attitude kicked in. Literally, in June I could see her doing something wrong, say her name firmly and follow up with "No No" and she would turn and walk away. Now, I wake up at 2 am and she's pulled the bar stool over to the pantry, climbed up onto a shelf and pulling down the potato chips.

:

Let's talk exausting!

I wish I had some great unknown secret to give you. All I can do is say "I know". I can tell you this. Your child is not stupid. She is VERY smart. She's just in a small body and she can't drive yet. Emily hasn't figured that last part out! (LOL) Anyway, don't treat her as though she doesn't know what she is doing. If you continue to let her control the situation she will. You have to be in control. Just let her think she is. Otherwise you'll look up and she'll be 16 and your still letting her control the situation and we won't be talking about making a mess in the kitchen pantry. You have to be smarter than they are. Give her two choices. Just make sure you can do either. For example, Emily just came in wanting to play a game on the computer. When I told her I was working. She started with the whinning thing. I said, you can either watch mommy work and then we will play your game or you can play in your room and and we will not play your game. Worked for now anyway. Good luck and if you find that great unknow secret send it my way. PLEASE.
Melinda,MS

 

[Maggies*Mommy]

Oh, im so glad to see others are going thru this too! I dont feel AS alone. And, I dont feel like im the worlds worst parent. You really start to question what you are doing some days, kwim?

So, I guess this is just what happens when you have toddlers. YIKES! It does(at least right now at this moment) make it easier to deal with and understand when you hear of others who are going thru it too. Its funny because I dont really get mad at Maggie, I get mad at myself for not knowing what to do. But, I guess what im doing is really all I can do.

I LOVE that she is searching out her independence. Its so fun to watch her do things and try things. And I dont want to hold her back and stunt her. But, I also dont want to be kicking myself in the butt when she is older and out of control. In my perfect world, she will grow up to be independent, and brilliant and love and respect her mama.

What do you guys do when the redirection is going in one ear and out the other? Do you just keep doing it? I know every child is different, but, do you have any other method or suggestions?

 

[irinam]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maggies*Mommy We live in Santa Rosa. Where in the Bay Area are you at?

I am in Milpitas near San Jose

Another thing I remembered that helped (and is still helping) - Playfull Parenting (there is actually a book by this name, but I did not read it, just read up on various mamas suggestions here on this board). The name speaks for itself. Many tight and uncomfortable situations can be defused by well... just laughing at them (the situations, not the kids

)

Oh, and on growing up and being "out of control"... I noticed that the best type of control is self control and not the imposed control. I know that there is no way I could now control my teen. I am glad he is controlling himself

Your DD will learn (not now of course

)

Quote:

In my perfect world, she will grow up to be independent, and brilliant and love and respect her mama.

And I bet she will

 

[Dar]

What sort of things are you "redirecting" her away from?My experience was that there were very few things my daughter was completely barred from doing at that age, and those were generally out away out of sight. If things were possibly fragile or dangerous, I explained that to her, with expression and modeled toughing them carefully. She never broke anything and she was cutting with sharp knives (well-supervised) by 18 months and never cut herself.

dar

 

[Maggies*Mommy]

Hi Dar-

Lets see, the kinds of things she is not allowed to do. She is not allowed to hit our tv with the handle of her play mop-for some reason she likes the sound, she is not allowed to climb on her chair hold the back of it and try to rock it while standing up, she isnt allowed to play with the knobs on the stove, she isnt allowed to open up the dishwasher(she does unlock it) so she can get inside of it or empty out the dirty the dishes, she isnt allowed to climb up on her chair to get on top of the table to check out the fan-all things that could hurt her. The list could go on. And, I feel bad as im writing this out because she sounds like a terror, she really isnt, she is extremely curious. And I *love* that. But, these are things that can hurt her.
I have put away all things that im afraid she will break, anything expensive or has a lot of sentimental value. I dont think its fair to her at this age to have things out that will attract her and then have her get in "trouble" if something happens.

I have no problem re-directing her, but, the temper tantrums after each situation are just starting to get unbearable. I am calm with her, I explain what can happen if mommy lets her do these things, I keep thinking im doing things right-but, I must not be.

 

[BellinghamCrunchie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maggies*Mommy I dont think its fair to her at this age to have things out that will attract her and then have her get in "trouble" if something happens.

I think you are exactly right!

Sounds like that chair is the cause of some problems (climbing onto the table, standing on it and rocking it). Maybe the chair could go into storage for a few months? Same with the mop, or have the mop only used for special occasions (such as when you are mopping and she would like to participate with you).

Can you remove the stove knobs and place them up high for use when you use the stove? And get a childlock for the dishwasher?

Our DD does all these things, or would, if she had access to them. At 19 months, I feel that although DD has the ability to understand that some things are not safe or okay to do, she does not have the impulse control to not do them.

I really like the concept that the attachment between parent and child is more important than teaching them to obey. Too many "no you can't do that" and the child starts to see the parent as that "no" person whose purpose in life is to thwart their desires.

 

[Maggies*Mommy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by BellinghamCrunchie I think you are exactly right! Sounds like that chair is the cause of some problems (climbing onto the table, standing on it and rocking it). Maybe the chair could go into storage for a few months? Same with the mop, or have the mop only used for special occasions (such as when you are mopping and she would like to participate with you). Can you remove the stove knobs and place them up high for use when you use the stove? And get a childlock for the dishwasher? Our DD does all these things, or would, if she had access to them. At 19 months, I feel that although DD has the ability to understand that some things are not safe or okay to do, she does not have the impulse control to not do them. I really like the concept that the attachment between parent and child is more important than teaching them to obey. Too many "no you can't do that" and the child starts to see the parent as that "no" person whose purpose in life is to thwart their desires.

Thanks for your reply!

You know, the suggestions you gave are such 'no brainers" but, I never even thought about removing the stove knobs, child lock on the dishwasher, etc. Im so glad you stated the obvious, because for some reason, I over looked those options.

As far as the chair....it is the root of a lot of evil. LOL It does get put away a lot. I do bring it out because she uses it for coloring at her table, eating her snack, etc. Its the times I forget to put it away because I get preoccupied with making dinner, etc.

I agree with you 100%....I dont want to be a "no" person. I try really hard to reserve no for the really big things.

Do you live in Bellingham, Wa? We are dying to move there! Hopefully next year.

 

[monkey's mom]

Quote:

Something in my gut says if it's not addressed correctly, well be the next set of posters talking about how we hate our 2 year olds, and want to run away from our lives with our 3-4 year olds. So I'm going to continue to be on the lookout for info from moms who have actually worked through these issues in ways that resulted in happy, healthy pre-schoolers.

Uh, I've worked through these issues and (in my opinion) have a pretty happy, healthy pre-schooler.

I personally think the way to not address it correctly and end up the way the poster quoted said, is to make it a big deal that your kid "obey" and punish a lot. I've seen some of my son's peers evolve into very angry, unhappy, power-hungry kids who behave in ways that I would not want my kid to behave.

I agree with irinam's post and I think the suggestions to remove the knobs and other problem issues are spot on. I also think it's very helpful to work with them when they want to do things that are potentially dangerous or destructive. We did a LOT of "one finger touch" with delicate items. Or having me hold the item and let him examine it that way. And I tried to make sure that I express what MY fears where about the situation, rather than make blanket statements like, "If you touch the knife, you'll get cut." I'd try to say, "I'm afraid if you touch the blade of the knife you could get cut. Can I help you use the knife and show you how to cut safely?"

I found the more little stuff I didn't say "no" to, the more we lived joyfully AND he respected the "no" for big stuff much more (not every time, but overall).

Hope that helps! Keep posting scenarios, you know? It is so helpful to be able to get the "no-brainer" suggestions that we miss--often b/c we are too close to the situation.

Hang in there!!

 

[Maggies*Mommy]

Thanks for the input Monkeys Mom.

Today has been MUCH better. I removed the stove knobs and the chair has been put away until she does an activity at her table. One thing she does is climb on top of her toy box-its in a bad location and she could get hurt doing it so its always a "thing" on a daily basis. So, today I pulled it out in the middle of the room and she got to stand on it, dance on it and jump of it like she so badly wants to do every other day. She wore her little self out and at the moment is taking a NICE nap.

It just finally clicked. WHY fight her on it. Its not so high off the ground she is going to get hurt, and maybe the "fun" willl wear off and it wont be such a big deal once she gets to play on it. And, if she enjoys playing on it, then I will have to just push it in and out as we use it.
She did dance so hard and get out of control while listening to Laurie Berkner at one point she fell off the back, after that she was much more careful.

I REALLY do appreciate everyones input and perspective on things. Like Monkey's Mom said, sometimes we are just too close to the situation to see the simple solutions. You guys have been a great help!!