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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello lactation experts <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile"><br>
So, I thought that after nursing 2 other LOs into toddlerhood that this 3rd baby would be a walk in the park......I was so wrong.<br><br><br>
First of all we have thrush. It really does not seam so bad for him...but I find it very painful in me. I have been applying gen. violet for 2 days now, and I guess I am not sure how long its going to take to go away. He is on another med. that was prescribed by the ped. All and all, this is not our worst issue.<br><br>
Secondly, I have a low supply this time around (um, I totally thought this was a myth...something used by uninformed doctors to push formula). My big boy was born at 10.4 lbs, and at 2 weeks was down to 9.4 lbs. He was also very sleepy (we would have to wake him to eat)...so I think that he was not nursing enough that first week...then he was starving in week 2, and emptying me very quickly. At this point, I went out and bought an electric pump and started pumping after every feeding to bump up my supply....I was then suppose to supplement witht he milk that I pumped....but I just wasn't getting much at all...(less than an ounce)...so, we used formula to top off his nursing sessions. Not easy for a mama who EBF all her other kiddos.<br>
I am now pumping 3-4 times a day (it was reeeealy hard to pump after every feeding)and I am now able to produce 6-7 ounces a day...we are giving him mostly breastmilk, but still need 4 oz of formula. I hope to be able to pump all of the suppliments soon. I am sure I am doing this all wrong, so please be kind with your suggestions.<br><br>
At 3 weeks, he weighed in at 9 lbs 15 oz. a few more ounces to go to get him back to birth weight <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile"><br><br>
Lastly, I believe he might have a milk allergy. We went in to the ped. today, and he has several symptoms. blood in the stool, major diaper rash...ok, maybe not several, but the blood is a big red flag...we will be testing the stool for other things as well, but the only way to see if it is an allergy is to eliminate milk from my diet...and to either eliminate the formula or switch to soyformula. I feel like my supply is much better than it was 1 week ago, but I don't know how long it will take to make enough to cover the formula feedings...especially when I am only pumping 3-4 times aday...instead of after every feeding. So.....I am sitting here nursings this LO, and I am hungry.....what in the world CAN I eat? Everything in my pantry has milk in it. I am tired and frustrated, he seams like he nurses well...and he is a happy boy...super sweet and not fussy....I am so surprised thst we are having all these issues.<br><br>
Thanks to all who have gotten this far....I would appreciate any gentle suggestions to help gets us on our feet.
 

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I'm in the middle of this now, so I don't have any "I did this and it got better" stories, but I wanted to lend my support anyway. My DS2 is 11 weeks now, we noticed the blood at 5.5 weeks. I went off dairy and soy, then the other common allergens, then most other foods... with minimal improvement at each step. Then I just found out the BCP I was taking has lactose in it! So I stopped that, and maybe we'll see changes now. Like yours, my LO is large and happy, which gives me some peace of mind while I figure this all out.<br>
My thought for you, though, is to hold off on the soy formula- many babies are intolerant to both dairy AND soy- so I would just rely on your BM if you can- let him nurse all day... that should help more with supply, too. What you're already doing is great- especially with other LO's around!<br>
And you could come over to the Allergies forum... maybe a little overwhelming, but great support!
 

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As far as pumping, I would see if you can meet with a good LC and make sure everything is the proper fit and placement, it can make your pumping much more effective. I'm not alot of help on what you can eat but start with basics, you can have any fruits or veggies in their natural or cooked form! Chicken breast is an easy one too, you can just cook a bunch at once and then prep a bunch of different ways, stir fry with rice and add veggies, garlic chicken, salad with chicken, etc.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks for the support mamas<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/hug2.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Hug2"><br>
I am most nervous about the food allergies, and to be honest, I had no idea about the soy.....which is a great alternative to dairy....so, I bought a few soy products at the store tonight <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/irked.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="irked">. My ped. did not mention that at the appointment today. And as far as the formula goes, I think that my supply is close to being "full", but he will fuss if I don't top him off, and gets pretty upset at my empty breast <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/greensad.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="greensad">, So he would be getting about 4 ounces of soy formula a day. Hmmm, time to think of an alternative.<br><br>
Oh, and thanks for the tip about the pumping. I did have to go out and buy bigger 'flanges' for it...and also, I am only pumping after the baby nurses, so I did not expect to have huge amounts....this week is a bit better, I am getting 1.5 to 2 oz each time. Still, not enough to supplement fully with my breast milk. The ped, wants me to still feed on demand, but to also offer as much pumped milk/formula that he will take after every feeding....which is usually 2 oz. Although I have seen a lactation consultant, it has been a week, and I think I need to go back for some more help with the newest issues.
 

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You can pump at the breast whilst nursing on the other - it helps with flow, stimulation and eventually will up your supply. See if you can get one of the good electric pumps like a Symphony or Lactina - you might have done this already! You can do lots without using dairy products, there is the site dairyfree.com or org - can't remember, there are health recipe books to buy and sites on the internet - you may just have to do some research, the book I love is Feeding the Whole Family which I bought from LLL - it's made a huge difference to my 'concept' of cooking and I really think that it's worth having a look. For the thrush you could try oregano capsules - 3,3 x a day for 3 weeks, oregano is an anti-fungal and seems to treat these sorts of fungal things very well.
 

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Wanted to touch on the thrush and allergy. First, my newest and I have had thrush since day 6 and were on Nystatin first but it didn't fully resolve though the cream for me helped my pain within a day. We tried that for 2 weeks then ended up on Diflucan-both of us and his thrush was gone within 24 hrs and my symptoms haven't returned. We plan to be big on probiotics when this is done.<br><br>
About the allergy-I've had 2 kids with allergic colitis-allergy to dairy and other foods causing blood in stool as well as diarrhea and colic. My son had it bad. It's common in bf'ing moms and we chose Not to do formula. Because he was gaining weight, the ped and gi drs were fine with us bf'ing and me cutting out foods. I ended up cutting out dairy (including any in foods such as bread, etc as well as casein, etc), soy, tomato, strawberries, sunflower seed, gassy foods (broccoli, etc). He was super sensitive and still cried an average of 8-10 hr/day for 6 months and was up bf'ing every 1 1/2 hrs til 10 months. He didn't sleep through until 13 months.<br><br>
BUT, I'm glad I bf and didn't do formula. Because all formula is either soy or dairy based, it seemed a bigger risk to switch. If he'd reacted to formula what would we have done? I read about a lot of formula babies with allergic colitis on feeding tubes and failing to thrive. I felt like breast milk was the best option for us as long as he was growing.<br><br>
And, he ended up reacting to solids so he was exclusively bf for 10 months then foods were added Very slowly. He ended up reacting to dairy through age 4. He turned 5 in January and is just now tolerating small amounts.<br><br>
My daughter ended up with a much more mild case and since I'd been through it once, I quickly saw the symptoms and knew what to do.<br><br>
If this is what your son has, make sure they start testing his hemoglobin BEFORE 6 months. My son was anemic by 6 months with his hemoglobin at 5 1/2 which is WAY LOW! We never thought it would be that low and obviously had to start supplementing iron.<br><br>
Take care-this is scary but can be dealt with. Just make sure your ped is informed. There are some good books our there too but make sure you keep track of what foods Your baby reacts to if you can tell.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
<div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>momto4plus4</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/15386498"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Wanted to touch on the thrush and allergy. First, my newest and I have had thrush since day 6 and were on Nystatin first but it didn't fully resolve though the cream for me helped my pain within a day. We tried that for 2 weeks then ended up on Diflucan-both of us and his thrush was gone within 24 hrs and my symptoms haven't returned. We plan to be big on probiotics when this is done.<br><br>
About the allergy-I've had 2 kids with allergic colitis-allergy to dairy and other foods causing blood in stool as well as diarrhea and colic. My son had it bad. It's common in bf'ing moms and we chose Not to do formula. Because he was gaining weight, the ped and gi drs were fine with us bf'ing and me cutting out foods. I ended up cutting out dairy (including any in foods such as bread, etc as well as casein, etc), soy, tomato, strawberries, sunflower seed, gassy foods (broccoli, etc). He was super sensitive and still cried an average of 8-10 hr/day for 6 months and was up bf'ing every 1 1/2 hrs til 10 months. He didn't sleep through until 13 months.<br><br>
BUT, I'm glad I bf and didn't do formula. Because all formula is either soy or dairy based, it seemed a bigger risk to switch. If he'd reacted to formula what would we have done? I read about a lot of formula babies with allergic colitis on feeding tubes and failing to thrive. I felt like breast milk was the best option for us as long as he was growing.<br><br>
And, he ended up reacting to solids so he was exclusively bf for 10 months then foods were added Very slowly. He ended up reacting to dairy through age 4. He turned 5 in January and is just now tolerating small amounts.<br><br>
My daughter ended up with a much more mild case and since I'd been through it once, I quickly saw the symptoms and knew what to do.<br><br>
If this is what your son has, make sure they start testing his hemoglobin BEFORE 6 months. My son was anemic by 6 months with his hemoglobin at 5 1/2 which is WAY LOW! We never thought it would be that low and obviously had to start supplementing iron.<br><br>
Take care-this is scary but can be dealt with. Just make sure your ped is informed. There are some good books our there too but make sure you keep track of what foods Your baby reacts to if you can tell.</div>
</td>
</tr></table></div>
<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug"> Mama, you have been down a long road, thanks for sharing your experience. If Jameson has a milk allergy, Formula is the last thing I would want to give him...thats why I am freaking out about getting my supply up....I just feel like I am on the low end of a sinking ship, and I just don't know how I can pull myself out. 2 weeks ago, I had a big boy who was loosing lots of weight...and I was not able to pump much milk to help him along. Formula was a lifesaver...I finally saw my baby satisfieid after a feeding... now that his weight is heading in th right direction, I am ready to EBF....but we are not there yet. I am going to set up an appointment with the lactation con. ASAP, and I hope to get on some better medication for the thrush, and hope to get some much needed encouragement.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">You can pump at the breast whilst nursing on the other - it helps with flow, stimulation and eventually will up your supply. See if you can get one of the good electric pumps like a Symphony or Lactina - you might have done this already! You can do lots without using dairy products, there is the site dairyfree.com or org - can't remember, there are health recipe books to buy and sites on the internet - you may just have to do some research, the book I love is Feeding the Whole Family which I bought from LLL - it's made a huge difference to my 'concept' of cooking and I really think that it's worth having a look. For the thrush you could try oregano capsules - 3,3 x a day for 3 weeks, oregano is an anti-fungal and seems to treat these sorts of fungal things very well.</td>
</tr></table></div>
Thanks for the info....I am curious to see the difference between the hospital grade pump and my Medela pump in style. We had some annoying insurance issues with getting a pump, and they would not cover any electric pump <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/irked.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="irked">, so we ended up buying one out of pocket because we figured it would be better in the long run....but that is one thing I will ask the lactation con. and I may end up renting one anyway.<br><br>
Oh, and I am on day 2 of my dairy free diet and it is going pretty good...though there are so many things with milk in it...um, non-dairy creamer <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/irked.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="irked">....I am trying to stomach almond milk in my coffee...I actually love almond milk straight up, but I miss cream for my coffee (yes I drink coffee, only one cup....please tell me I don't have to give it up <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/redface.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Embarrassment">) Jameson's diaper rash is getting better, though I still see blood in his stools. I can go dairy free...its not as bad as I thought, but I keep seeing more foods to avoid (soy, strawberries ????).<br><br><br>
Pumping has gotten worse. The thrush has flared up, and I am in pain, pumping is far more painful than nursing, and I often only make it 5-7 minutes before I throw in the towel...but to be honest, I usually pump 99% of the milk in the first 5 minutes anyway (no matter how long I pump). I will keep you posted.
 

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Hayley-the strawberries were just for my son!! The main 2 culprites are dairy and soy but I kept finding more foods that my son reacted to.<br><br>
About the formula-my ped wanted my allergy kids on nutramigen or alimentum if they needed formula. So, if you're still needing to supplement, you might want to switch to one of those. Because they are "predigested" (I've never figured out what that means), they aren't supposed to cause the problems that other formulas would.<br><br>
We had to have a prescription diaper rash cream for my son. It was called butt paste but it's Not the kind you can buy over-the-counter. My son had a horrible reaction to the otc one but did great on the rx kind, just in case your son's gets worse again.<br><br>
Side note-it takes about 2 weeks for dairy to leave your body so you may not see the blood go away right away even if you're off all dairy and soy. And, if you get the blood to stop, I was told to try soy first, not dairy, when I started adding foods back in. But, I didn't get to add in foods until I weaned him. But, from what the drs have told me, most kids with allergic colitis outgrow it by age 1. My son is just super sensitive, still is.<br><br>
Oh, I get ya with the coffee too. I don't remember if I had to give that up or not. I just remember basically eating around the clock because I was up so much I had to constantly restore!<br><br>
Have you looked into any herbal supplements to help with supply? I thought I'd heard of some but don't remember now. It might be worth looking into though.<br><br>
Again, I think you're doing a great job! Especially with nursing through the thrush. I remember telling my husband I understood how women would wean because of thrush-it is SO excrutiating. I hope you can get meds soon to help.
 
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