Mothering Forum banner
1 - 20 of 26 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
301 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Don't you think it's VERRRRRY odd that a woman in this country (USA) can LEGALLY decide to end her pregnancy and that of her child's life up UNTIL labor begins...

....but does not have the full informed choice (or support) of how to birth, with whom, and for how long AS SOON AS labor begins?!?

This thought just keeps circling my head, and getting me pretty steamed up!
: I mean, you hear it everyday...

"I was 42 weeks, so I was induced..."
"The baby was breech, so they cut me..." (hey, this happened to me!)
"They said labor wasn't progressing, so they cut me, filled me with drugs, etc..."
"I wish I could do it all alone, but I worry about the Child Protective Services..."
"I want a VBAC, but there are no care providers willing...."
"I don't want a cesarean, but I was forced by judge's orders..." (That's also for real!)

Please understand I am *NOT* wanting to start the abortion debate here! But what are your thoughts on this? Women have all these "choices" that some of us fight so hard for, yet our birthing and mothering "choices" are completely unprotected.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19,261 Posts
I think it is horrible!!!! I am not for abortion personally, but still feel woman should have the right to birth as they see fit.

And I am OUTRAGED that woman have to be fearful of CPS or reprocussions of their decisions to do UC or homebirth.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,933 Posts
I don't want to touch the abortion debate. Too easy to hurt feelings.

But I don't think it's the case that a woman can decide until she goes into labor. Case in point: the court ordered c-sections. The woman in Utah who was charged with murder because one of her twins died after she initially refused a c-section. Should they be charging doctors for murder because of choices that they make that cause a woman or her baby to die? Absolutely rediculous that a woman cannot make her own medical decisions.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,203 Posts
Abortion is only legal after 26 weeks if the mother's life is in danger or there is something very wrong with the fetus. Most states do not allow abortions after 24 weeks.

That said, I don't think the state deserves a say over women's bodies AT ALL, in the case pregnancy and birth choices, including abortion.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
301 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
mamas, I don't want this thread yanked for discussing the A word around here... we all know how yank-happy the mods are around here...


You're right about the mama in Utah, but that IS NOT the only case I have read about! The other cases basically had the same "thought" behind it: "This woman is endangering her child's life if she births vaginally." And magically, the judge signs it. Can you believe it?!?

And good point about the doctors! Nooooo... one musn't DARE blame the holy appointed doctors! It's always the mother's fault if something goes wrong, right?! I mean, that's why you sign all those waivers, right?!


I just don't understand the birth environment in this country! I don't know about other countries, so that is why I am talking specifically about the USA. I'd love other points of view from abroad, though!

Really, I find it SOOOO interesting how much discussion and attention *certain* parts of a woman's reproductive cycle get... while the actual birthing and mothering cycles are pretty much ignored, except in small circles (like this one!). How many of us had had "the look" thrown at us for: breastfeeding a toddler, breastfeeding two, homebirthing, freebirthing, leaving our sons intact, non vaxing??? Why is that? Any ideas???
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19,261 Posts
I am researchung homebirth and UC for my next birthing experience (if and when it happens) but I fear telling many people IRL.


I think we can say the A word, we just can't debate the topic.....if I am wrong...pm me and I will edit my pp.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,200 Posts
ITA.
I am afraid to tell other people about our birth/pregnancy care in the conservative city I live in, even if I think they are my friends, because I fear someone would call in CPS. I'm in Canada, and I'm doing NOTHING illegal or CPS worthy... but still. I know they are required to do a home visit regardless. I worry about stuff like my house not being clean enough, or all the bruises on the legs of my super-active and always-naked toddler.
This stuff swirls in my head every time someone asks me, "So which doctor do you have?".
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,551 Posts
Who has the most money to lose, are the ones who are virtually forcing women into choices they don't want or need. The hospitals, who depend on childbirth for up to 1/3 of thier income, the docs, who like the surgery they can get paid ten times as much for without the waiting(and CYB insurance), the insurance companies, who make it nearly impossible to birth anywhere but at home if you don't have insurance(that they jack up the rates for, increasing the chances NO ONE will be able to afford it, and then you have us, the mothers for whom all this scheming and churning is supposed to be in benefit for.
BTDT, don't wanna do it again! I'll take UC anyday, over someone who can royally screw up a birth, but wants surgery to fix it...I'll take the responsiblilty, gladly.Even if the outcome isn't my choice, that is life, and I can accept it....isn't that what being an adult is all about?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19,261 Posts
Quote:

Originally Posted by cathicog
Who has the most money to lose, are the ones who are virtually forcing women into choices they don't want or need. The hospitals, who depend on childbirth for up to 1/3 of thier income, the docs, who like the surgery they can get paid ten times as much for without the waiting(and CYB insurance), the insurance companies, who make it nearly impossible to birth anywhere but at home if you don't have insurance(that they jack up the rates for, increasing the chances NO ONE will be able to afford it, and then you have us, the mothers for whom all this scheming and churning is supposed to be in benefit for.
BTDT, don't wanna do it again! I'll take UC anyday, over someone who can royally screw up a birth, but wants surgery to fix it...I'll take the responsiblilty, gladly.Even if the outcome isn't my choice, that is life, and I can accept it....isn't that what being an adult is all about?
Very good points....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
727 Posts
I was just discussing this with a friend who, though not currently pg, wants a VBAC. Thankfully she's doing her research and finding a *good* MW (her first was w/ a MW who induced on her due date) neither her or hubby are comfy with UC... anyway the biggest problem is that our local hospital refuses to allow VBACs. I don't see how this can in anyway shape or form be constitutional. As far as I know it's a public hospital (not privately funded) but it seems to be that refusing a woman's choice to VBAC is against her basic civil liberties.
I am consdering putting together the research necessary (man I don't even want to think about just how much that is) and contacting the ACLU and NAPSAC. I really think there needs to be legislation that prohibits a hospital from enacting a policy that removes a woman's right to choose the direction of her health care.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
301 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I think that is an AWESOME idea, mama!

This is EXACTLY what I was talking about!!! A woman's RIGHT to birth (and parent, for that matter) in the way in which SHE chooses!

All the hub-bub about the right to choose, and us birthing mamas are left with virtually NO choices at all!


Kudos to you mama! Let me know if I can help!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
382 Posts
From what I understand there are laws governing hospitals that would do VBACs. They have to have 24 hr in-house anesthesia. Not all hospitals do, so legally they have to have a "no VBAC policy", BUT they also can't cut you open without your permission (assault) and can't deny you treatment. So if you walk in in labor and they hand you a form to sign for a repeat c/s, you can REFUSE at that time. Now if they have enough time for it, they might be able to get a court order, yada, yada, yada. And THAT is indeed unconstitutional. However if enough women did this, maybe there would be an attitude shift of some kind. Not really holding my breath though, think I'd just skip the mess and have my babies at home.

This is what I understand of the issue; could be wrong though. If I'm missing some nuance of how this works, please correct me.

Thmom said:
our local hospital refuses to allow VBACs. I don't see how this can in anyway shape or form be constitutional. As far as I know it's a public hospital (not privately funded) but it seems to be that refusing a woman's choice to VBAC is against her basic civil liberties.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
301 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I don't wish to dampen the spirit of free speech by editing my thoughts on some activities on this board....

HOWEVER, this thread is about a birthing woman's human and civil rights to birth and parent the way she chooses. That's all.


ETA: I never ever was referring to this particuar forum's mod, either... just in case someone was wondering. I *wasn't* actually referring to any ONE in particular.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,565 Posts
This is one of the things that makes me incredibly grateful that we live in the UK right now. I can patronize the family planning clinic with fear of hate speech etc. and I have the legal right to refuse any medical treatment. AND midwives have a legal duty to attend a woman in labor (or, labour, as they say) no matter where she is. AND the hospital here has a pro-VBAC policy! They won't do a repeat c-section without a 'trial of labor.' I don't always love the UK, but on issues like this, I am so glad that our first baby will be born here.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
301 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Thanks SO much for offering us this perspective!! So you would say the birth environment is a positive one in the UK?

What do you think of the medical "role" there? And how about parenting?

heehee I'm never short on questions!!

Oh yes, one more: were you born and raised in the UK as well??
 
1 - 20 of 26 Posts
Top