[whooopsy]

Hello

as i am not a "real" american i am not sure if above used term is the right word for a child of an afro-american man and a white (german) woman. if not, please be patient with me

anyways, my lovely little daughter emily (16 months by now) is the perfect mix of me and my ex-boyfriend. he is very dark-coloured and i am "average" white

:

lately i have been wondering how it will be for emily later in the future, when she realizes that she is neither white nore black. i don't want to make a huge issue out of it and i certainly don't want to reduce it to the colour of her skin, but i think it is important for her to find her own identity inbetween two cultures (someday ;-))

how do you manage this? do you get in contact with other "mixed" families?

curious for your answers!

 

[Maggieinnh]

Kommt SEHR drauf wo Du wohnst nach meiner Meinung!

If you live in the US and in a city area you should not have too many problems finding other inter- racial families, which probably would be beneficial, but I think it does not matter that much with whom you are in contact with, as long as the people are open minded, tolerant and friendly. The surroundings you are living in also make a big difference I think, do you have neighbours of different cultures living around you or is it mainly a caucasian area or mostly afro- americans?

 

[Kavita]

The term here most commonly used is "biracial" I believe.

I think there may be a forum in "finding your tribe" for biracial/multiracial families.

My DD is half white/jewish and half East Indian.

 

[cristinaoketch]

since you stated that we should be patient, i guess i wont take offense to what you stated...."half-caste"

: my FIL refers to his other grandkids and bi-racial family members as this, and as a bi-racial person myself, i am quick to correct him.

that being said, i myself am BI-RACIAL, and my daugher is multi-racial, as i am bi-racial and her father is African.

there are many obsticales your child may face, and i can only say from personal experience, that the way you refer to her and treat her will be her biggest support. my mother never spoke of race, we were what we were, it just never mattered. i remember asking my mother when i was in 4th grade if my father was black, and that was that. if you dont make it something that is strange or different, than your child will never know the difference.

one of the things about other family members of mine that bothers me, is their constant comment on my daughters skin color, not that its negative, but just bringing attention to it, when no one talks about the white skin, puts a notion on darker skin that makes it weird or strange.

you stated that you wonder how it will be for emily when she realizes she is neither black nor white. that statement worries me, for your daughters sake, as it should be acknowledged and celebrated that she is "black AND white". she is not neither, she is BOTH.

i have had many experiences in my life where i was too light to be excepted in black circles, and too "kinky" haired or different looking to fit into white circles. but being able to go home and see my parents who accepted me and always complimentated me on my curly hair and my pretty eyes, that made me feel normal and accepted.

your daughter may face challanges, but she will take her cues from you. if you dont mind the ignorant comments, then neither will she.

I refer to myself as either bi-racial or "black AND white", not somewhere in between. Your daugher is Black and she is white, she has the best of both worlds and i'm sure she is gorgeous

and you are right, it is important for her to know both sides of her culture, but it doesnt mean you over compensate by trying to make her "fit in" or match one race of the other. you are who you are, and she can be as german as her mommy and still be bi-racial

and remember that she may have feelings that you cannot understand, as she gets older, but you can only embrace them. acknowledge that she is unique and only more precious because she represents so many special people.

we have worked too hard to be refered to correctly, so my biggest suggestion would be to drop "half-caste", and just say black or "african-american", if you feel it is necessary to tell others about her heritage. and when they ask "where she came from" if they think she was adopted ( i used to get that at the playground alot), just say " from my uterus". and the questions stop

we live in NYC so it is more commen to see bi-racial and tri-racial kids, but i know that even travelling to the midwest, or upstate new york, we dont get as many happily inquiring faces, but we have never really experienced out right racism or disrespect. maybe a few cutting eyes, but those never affected me to begin with, so i dont think twice about it, never have. oh, and the word "mix" or "mixed", just feels wrong. dogs are mixed, humans are not.

having a friend who can relate to your situation is always helpful, but i dont think you have to go out of your way to find someone. that just seems like you are making it something that its not. "we" are all around, so i am sure you will cross paths with someone just like you and your daughter.

Celebrate her differences and teach her about ALL her history. it is priceless.

 

[Ethan*sMom]

Unless you live in a very small town, you can usually find bi-racial children everywhere.

It's nice that people aren't being rude about the term the OP used. It is a common non-derogative term many people from other countries use.

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Quote:

Half caste is a term used in the United Kingdom and other English-speaking parts of the world. An example is a child of black African and white European parentage. The term mulatto has also been used for this particular mixture. Both terms are considered impolite and potentially offensive by some in the U.S., as the words have been used pejoratively in the past to ostracize and isolate the offspring of such unions. However the term 'half caste' is considered acceptable in the U.K. For example, "children of the plantation" (the children of African-American slaves and their European-American masters in the U.S. Southern states) were not accepted as heirs, and in most cases, the relationship was never acknowledged, and "half-caste" conveyed the deliberate exclusion. The coloureds of South Africa and the half-breeds of North America are further examples. The term was commonly used in Australia to describe children of mixed Australian Aboriginal and European descent, as were the terms quarter-caste and quadroon in the 19th century. Today, they are generally deemed offensive, particularly by Australian Aborigines[citation needed]. The current politically correct way to describe a person of multiple ethnicities is "mixed race" or - particularly in the United States - multiracial. Note that not all peoples of mixed race prefer to be called mixed race or multiracial - some prefer more regional terms, for example Eurasian or Afrasian. The term originates from the Indian caste-system, where a person of 'lesser' or half-caste would be deemed to be of a 'lower class'. While the origins of the term are derogatory, its usage has evolved to give it the more objective meaning described above.

 

[thismama]

I know British people, and they do not use the term half-caste. They know it but understand it to be less than respectful, like the word 'mulatto.'

 

[amitymama]

I live in Britain and they DO use the term. Not always, and not everyone, and it is slowly being replaced with 'biracial' or 'mixed race' but I've heard even very well-educated, well-spoken, PC people use it. It's not meant to be offensive, it's just an outdated term that hasn't been replaced fully yet. But I'm working on it -- I always correct people when they use that word and tell them that it's offensive. They're usually very apologetic and absolutely gobsmacked that it's considered an insult.

 

[thismama]

Quote:

Originally Posted by amitymama it's just an outdated term that hasn't been replaced fully yet.

Yes that is my impression also.

Quote:

But I'm working on it -- I always correct people when they use that word and tell them that it's offensive. They're usually very apologetic and absolutely gobsmacked that it's considered an insult.

That is good. I know here some people don't realize a term like 'mulatto' is not appropriate. This is the same thing, IMO.

I would love to see the OP on this thread edit her post and use a more respectful word, now that she has received new information.

 

[Calidris]

I believe the OP says she is German, and is probably simply trying to translate the word. Most likely with a somewhat archaic dictionary.

And my DD is multiple castes

OP - mixed race, or simply mixed will work, biracial is popular among Americans. Mulatto and half-caste are very old fashioned and considered offensive.

 

[Calidris]

Quote:

Originally Posted by thismama I would love to see the OP on this thread edit her post and use a more respectful word, now that she has received new information.

Eh, she's got a grand total of 2 posts on here, I know people with a thousand who don't know how to edit the title of a thread.

Maybe you should write a tutorial

 

[thismama]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calidris I believe the OP says she is German, and is probably simply trying to translate the word. Most likely with a somewhat archaic dictionary.

Oh, I see. I was thinking it was the commonly used phrase where she was, in her opinion. I didn't think uh gee, it's a whole other language.

:

 

[tdoreenb]

All of my children are biracial. I'm African-American and both my "babies' daddies" are Caucasian. My oldest has had a few challenges. Let me highlight his ongoing identity journey for you.

I was a single mom for most of DS's life; we lived with my family in a pretty much all AA community. So, his early years were really affected by that. He did spend some time with his dad and his then wife (She was Japanese-American) in their very upscale predominately Caucasian neighborhood. Although he did not interact very much with children there. At that time everybody in his eyes was brown, some were light brown and others dark brown, but everybody was a variation on a theme.

Fast forward to when I returned to college and DS and I moved to family housing in Riverside, California. We lived there from the time he was 3 until he was 7. That was a very eclectic neighborhood. DS got to meet people from all around the world and that I think expanded his world view beyond the standard black/white. He decided then than it would be unfair to describe himself as exclusively one thing or the other--he tried to embrace his "biraciality."

After that we moved back to L.A. and my mother's neighborhood. I started going out with Dh who lives where we live now, a predominately Caucasian suburb of San Diego. It's a relatively small town with a small town atmosphere. While he still embraces his "mixedness or "mulattoness" (both his terms not mine

) I think he more strongly identifies as AA because there are so few around here.

Sadly, my son has gone through a lot of issues with his looks and I think that's because my family was his template for looks for most of his life. He's often complained to me that he wishes he was darker skinned and that his hair was "nappier" and darker, instead of sandy brown with big curls or that his eyes were brown instead hazel.

Those are the hardest things for me, because I feel somewhat responsible for creating the confusion. I try to instill self love beyond color and the constructs of race. We're still trying to get there.

As for socializing with other multi-cultural/racial families. I don't know any AA/Caucasian families out here although I know they are around. DH's father is remarried to a Phillipina and has adopted her now adult children. We socialized with them a lot.

I truly did not mean to write a book and I'm not sure I even began to answer your question

. But, I hope it helped in some way.

Tracy

 

[Individuation]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cristinaoketch we have worked too hard to be refered to correctly, so my biggest suggestion would be to drop "half-caste", and just say black or "african-american", if you feel it is necessary to tell others about her heritage.

Why would she say this? Her daughter is half European (German), isn't she? So wouldn't it be kind of innaccurate to say she was black or AA?

 

[Calidris]

Whoopsy:
To edit the title click edit and then the go advanced button, you'll have more options there

 

[Maggieinnh]

tdoreenb, do you think your son would have less of an identity crisis if he would have grown up most of his childhood/teenager years in a multicultural/ bi-racial surrounding, like where he was between the ages of 3 and 7 years?
Just asking out of curiosity, hope you do not mind! I am from Europe and since living in the US have discovered different lifestyles regarding foreigners and people from various races, although I have to say I do not live in a major city hub, which I know is very different.

 

[boodafli]

well, i'm bi-racial. and i think it's incorrect to say that i'm neither black nor white, or that i'm both black and white. i'm bi-racial, which is a racial construct in and of itself, but depending on who i'm interacting with, i'm sometimes viewed as 'white' and sometimes viewed as 'black' and sometimes viewed as 'mixed'.

it's a complex thing, being bi-racial. it's true that we've got the best of both worlds, but at the same time, we get excluded from those worlds a lot too. there have been many a time when i haven't been white enough, or black enough, and there have been times when i've been too white, or too black.
society as a whole tends to dislike grey areas, so to speak. so you see halle berry, barack obama, tiger woods, and they're all being referred to as black. but then there's jennifer beale. and everybody thinks she's white, but she's bi-racial.

the most important thing you can do for your daughter, is explain to her that she is a blend of two wonderful cultures. expose her to octoberfest and juneteenth. make sure she embraces both sides, and learns about her history and heritage equally.

be there for her. she'll face some adversity, and she needs to know that she's got one place where she's accepted no matter what. she'll probably go through what a lot of bi-racial kids go through, and strongly identify as black for a while, and then strongly identify as white for a while, and eventually find a happy medium. don't take it personally, and make sure her father doesn't either. she's not rejecting either race, or percieving one to be better than the other, she's just carving out her own space in the world.

because so many of the bi-racial role models seem to 'pick a side', it's hard to develop a bi-racial 'culture' so to speak. when you can look to people who've travelled a similar path, you can see how they overcame obstacles, and so on. so look to bi-racial adults in your area, or older bi-racial kids to give her an idea of what growing up bi-racial looks like. teach her about langston hughes, and benjamin banneker, and all of the great bi-racial famous people who came before her.

but mostly? just love her.

 

[eepster]

We have gotten very bogged down here about what is and isn't considered offensive language. Often what is considered offensive to one person is not to another. One PP mentioned that they dislike the term "mixed" yet other posters are suggesting it as a great alternative to "half-caste."

I've had european-american people tell me that the term "oriental" is offensive to asian-americans b/c they shouldn't be reffered to as rugs. However, my very well educated chinese-canadian DH never takes offence at the term b/c he is aware that it is simply an archaic word that means eastern and that people who use it are old fashioned not racist. He knows that oriental does not mean rug. Some of the people who still use the term oriental also use the term occidental which is a similiarly archaic word for westerners.

Some of the PP mention using the term "mulatto" b/c they find that less offensive. Personally I find it a more offensive term b/c I have heard it originates from the word "mule" (a mule is the sterile offspring of a horse and a donkey.) I don't know if this is true or accurate since it came from a person who also claimed using "oriental" meant one was calling people rugs. Whether or not the term has truely offensive roots it kind of rubs me the wrong way.

I worked in a store where we had a particular employee whom most of us had called a "boy" on a few occasions simply b/c he was very young and we didn't have alot of male employees so he was the only "boy" in the store. BTW he happened to have dark skin. One day I was saying to a customer I was assisting "I'll just go get you that bolt and be back in a moment" and she says "just send the boy to go get it" (the tone she used is lost in typing just trust that the tone had alot to do with it.) Suddenly the exact same word I had call this guy had a whole different meaning and it was an extreemly offensive one.

What I'm getting at is that what word you use doesn't matter nearly as much as what you mean by it.

BTW the prefered term around here is multi-ethnic.

 

[whooopsy]

First of all: thank you so much for all the answers!!! i tried to edit the subtitle of my message but it wouldn't work. I definitely didn't want to offense anyone, i just didn't know better, sorry! I have a (black) Jamaican friend and she uses the term "half-caste" without a problem. I will now use the term "bi-racial" - it even sounds nicer to my ears. I do live in Germany and people here would call my daughter "mixed".

@Maggieinnh
Du sprichst deutsch! Bist du Deutsche?

Well, unfortunately I live in a more or less "white area", I live in Germany's 2nd biggest city, though not in an area with a lot of multi-cultural peope. Sometimes you do see black people but not every day. I may locate to a different area with more open minded and multi-cultural people.

@Kavita
thnx for the info ! now i know better

i bet your daughter ist very beautiful!

@cristinaoketch
thanx a lot for your detailled answer! it means a lot to me hearing all that from you!

i guess i need some discussion with other bi-racial peope\mums just to feel better again. mostly, people react very friendly to me and my daughter - as she is very beautiful and cute (of course any mother thinks that of her child

) but i got a few very negative reactions. one older man even called her "n...."-baby, he wrapped it up in a compliment about how cute she was, but for a moment i couldn't breathe and then i told him that only stupid people would use that word. then, a lot of people (mostly kids) want to touch her hair or make comments about her skin, jokes like "she took a long sun-bath". i never really know how to react to those comments, though they hurt me and i want to say something about it. did you mean that i should ignore those comments? but don't i have to fight for my daughter if someone makes bad comments about her colour\hair etc.? i feel like i do have to!

anyway, i am happy that you shared your experience with me. i do love my daughter very much, she is actually the love of my life, i have never knewn before that you can love someone so much as i do now

and i just love everything about her look: she has so gorgeaus lips (other people pay lots of money with not even almost having such beautiful lips), i love her cute little curls, she has the most perfect skin colour.... i only want to protect her from people who want to hurt her. i know she will have to go through challenges in life though.

and yes, you are right - she IS black AND white! i guess i worried too much that she could queston her identity someday but if i give her the feeling that she has an identity than she wouldn't have to worry really.

to be alone with all these issues is sometimes really hard, her daddy and me are separated for the moment (we may get back together someday, but who knows) - he lives in the states and we live in germany right now. he offered to relocate to the usa too but we will see.

@Ethan*sMom and all the other mums who answered

thanks for the info!! i am greatful that i know the correct terms now!

@tdoreenb
thank you so much for your "story" - it helps me a lot to read from your experience! i hope your son is finding his way now.

 

[whooopsy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by boodafli well, i'm bi-racial. and i think it's incorrect to say that i'm neither black nor white, or that i'm both black and white. i'm bi-racial, which is a racial construct in and of itself, but depending on who i'm interacting with, i'm sometimes viewed as 'white' and sometimes viewed as 'black' and sometimes viewed as 'mixed'. it's a complex thing, being bi-racial. it's true that we've got the best of both worlds, but at the same time, we get excluded from those worlds a lot too. there have been many a time when i haven't been white enough, or black enough, and there have been times when i've been too white, or too black. society as a whole tends to dislike grey areas, so to speak. so you see halle berry, barack obama, tiger woods, and they're all being referred to as black. but then there's jennifer beale. and everybody thinks she's white, but she's bi-racial. the most important thing you can do for your daughter, is explain to her that she is a blend of two wonderful cultures. expose her to octoberfest and juneteenth. make sure she embraces both sides, and learns about her history and heritage equally. be there for her. she'll face some adversity, and she needs to know that she's got one place where she's accepted no matter what. she'll probably go through what a lot of bi-racial kids go through, and strongly identify as black for a while, and then strongly identify as white for a while, and eventually find a happy medium. don't take it personally, and make sure her father doesn't either. she's not rejecting either race, or percieving one to be better than the other, she's just carving out her own space in the world. because so many of the bi-racial role models seem to 'pick a side', it's hard to develop a bi-racial 'culture' so to speak. when you can look to people who've travelled a similar path, you can see how they overcame obstacles, and so on. so look to bi-racial adults in your area, or older bi-racial kids to give her an idea of what growing up bi-racial looks like. teach her about langston hughes, and benjamin banneker, and all of the great bi-racial famous people who came before her. but mostly? just love her.

i think you are right, it is a "challenging" issue. btw, i always thought that halle berry was bi-racial, she is sooooo beautiful and i love her!!

 

[whooopsy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by eepster We have gotten very bogged down here about what is and isn't considered offensive language. Often what is considered offensive to one person is not to another. One PP mentioned that they dislike the term "mixed" yet other posters are suggesting it as a great alternative to "half-caste." I've had european-american people tell me that the term "oriental" is offensive to asian-americans b/c they shouldn't be reffered to as rugs. However, my very well educated chinese-canadian DH never takes offence at the term b/c he is aware that it is simply an archaic word that means eastern and that people who use it are old fashioned not racist. He knows that oriental does not mean rug. Some of the people who still use the term oriental also use the term occidental which is a similiarly archaic word for westerners. Some of the PP mention using the term "mulatto" b/c they find that less offensive. Personally I find it a more offensive term b/c I have heard it originates from the word "mule" (a mule is the sterile offspring of a horse and a donkey.) I don't know if this is true or accurate since it came from a person who also claimed using "oriental" meant one was calling people rugs. Whether or not the term has truely offensive roots it kind of rubs me the wrong way. I worked in a store where we had a particular employee whom most of us had called a "boy" on a few occasions simply b/c he was very young and we didn't have alot of male employees so he was the only "boy" in the store. BTW he happened to have dark skin. One day I was saying to a customer I was assisting "I'll just go get you that bolt and be back in a moment" and she says "just send the boy to go get it" (the tone she used is lost in typing just trust that the tone had alot to do with it.) Suddenly the exact same word I had call this guy had a whole different meaning and it was an extreemly offensive one. What I'm getting at is that what word you use doesn't matter nearly as much as what you mean by it. BTW the prefered term around here is multi-ethnic.

you have a very good point here! a word can have different meanings depending on the tone.