[karenge]

Yes, I am still trying this bfing "thing". I get so tired of everyone asking me why I am still trying, they dont have any idea how much Bfing means to me. Most of you probably know my story, so I wont go too far into it. My ds is days away from 4 months old and we have always had trouble bfing and he has always needed formula. I am getting donated milk from a friend and adding what little I can pump to her supply. I feed him as much as I can from the sns tube, but he also gets several bottles a day(its impossible to tube feed whne i am out). he just had his frenulum clipped abt 3 weeks ago. Also, a month ago I had to go on zoloft adn I stopped taking reglan because I thought it had caused my ppd. but now in a desperate attempt to get some sort of supplky back, I am back on the reglan. I just cannot afford the dom. DS wont even latch on anymore with out the sns., So, its not like he doesnt want to nurse, he just doesnt want to nurse if he cant get anything out. I am not even sure he is getitng any BM when he using the tube because i can still squirt milk across the room after he nurses. I have started trying to pump more during the past 3 days, but i am only getting a total of a half oz from both. I am goiong to go back on fenugreek and blessed thistle and more milk plus tomorrow and see if that helps.
I dont really have any specific question, just wanted to type for comfort and maybe get some more advice from all you wonderful ladies. I cant believe he wont even stay latched on now, I wasnt happy when he latched and then still needed a boittle, but now i would be happy with that. I hate using the tube every singe time, but not enough to give up altogether.
thanks for 'listening'.
karen

 

[Gidget]

Hi, first thing ,I think you are doing great! You say you can squirt milk after a feed. It sounds to me like your supply is actually up and while baby is getting some out, he is not removing it all. He probably is getting upset because he has gotten used to the amount he is getting from the combination of the tube and your new increased flow. Do you have letdowns? I know some do not when they are fighting a low supply. I did not at first when dd was born and even after I had an established supply my body was still stingy with the letdowns. Maybe you could let baby feed until you feel a letdown, then as quick as you can, take off tube and put baby back on? I am not sure how an sns works, I never got to that point, so I may not know what I am talking about. Good luck and keep up the good work. Oh, and I get the when are you gonna wean question, it is about as irritating as the one you keep getting. It really sucks to have people trying to undermine your feelings about it. We are here for you.

 

[wombat]

in a hurry but just wanted to ask:

have you tried getting the dom from New Zealand? I heard it's cheaper than from Canada. You know the New Zealand dollar compared to the US dollar is very low.

Also don't fret about getting small amounts when you first start pumping. It's totally normal. I remember reading your supply responds in days, well it was more like weeks for me. And it increased so gradually. I used to write down all the amounts I pumped and I'm glad I was so anal about doing that because that was the only way I noticed it WAS increasing. I also think I was one of those women who have 'low capacity', that is I could produce enough milk for dd - at my best I could pump 30oz in 24 hours but I couldn't pump more than 3-4 oz at a time and a lot of sessions were about 2 oz. I actually needed to pump that 8 times a day to get it all out. And it really varied throughout the day - I had my notes to see it. Early am was best for me - around 3 - 5am.

 

[foreverinbluejeans]

If you can squirt milk across the room you should be able to use breast compression to help your milk let-down and increase the amount your baby gets from the breast. Go to google.com and search using 'breast compression Newman' to find a good article.

Try not to be discouraged with your baby about latching. We know bottles can cause latching problems. You might try finger feeding - it can actually help teach babies to suck better.

I'm sorry you are having so many difficulties.

 

[Bleu]

Hi, Karenge! What great progress you ar emaking, and good for you for toughing it out despite all the difficulties you've had!

I agree with the poster who said that you sound like you're making a lot more milk than your baby is removing effectively. It sounds like you are ready to start taking away the SNS gradually. I used to start Bleuet off with the SNS and then remove it, or start with the tube in but the flow blocked and other variations. I also started offering just the breast with no SNS in the morning when I had my best supply and he was too groggy to remember to insist on the SNS. After a few days you can drop another SNS feeding and so on and so on. Keep an eye on his weight to make sure he's getting enough, and respond to his cues, and you'll see nice, slow, unsteady progress, just as you have until now.

Herbs -- IMO, taking More Milk Plus and the fenugreek and blessed thistle would be redundant.

 

[karenge]

Thanks everyone! Does anyone have a website for ordering the dom. from new zealand? I thought i read a post on here where someone ordered from there and didnt see any results, I think she was afraid the pills were not done right? I think i am already seeing results with the reglan. yesterday i pumpmed 1.5 oz from one side, normally i would get .5. So this morning I fed adam and then tried to pump so i could see if he was getting any and i could not pump anyhthing!! So, I know he is getting whats in there. PLUS, he did latch on without the sns tube for almost 5 minutes. I feel very encouraged by all of this.
Also, I have a friend who is on vacation in Washington dc. She called me from there today and said she went to chinatown there and talked to a chinese herbalist who sold her some herbs and said i should make a sort of soup with it. Unfortunately the lady didnt tell her how much to drink, so i am a little lost there. but she said I would definetly see a difference, also the lady said i should eat lots of fish, i never heard that one before. i happened to have some fish in the freezer, so of course i had that for dinner tonight.

I hope we have another good morning tomorrow( he never latched again all day without the sns, but i am still encouraged by our morning success)
wish me luck and thanks a million for your support!
karen

 

[sarahwebb]

Keep up the good work Karen!

It's possible that if you can squirt milk and pump after he nurses that he isn't getting the milk out of your breast. A baby can look like they have perfect latch but not be getting the milk out because of poor tongue position or clamping their jaws down on your breast.

Good Luck,
Sarah

 

[karenge]

He stayed latched this morning for 10 min. on one side and almost 5 on the other!! YAY. I cant believe, but i forgot to see if I could squirt milk out afterward. BUT, I left very full before he stared and not so full afterward. I am sure thats a good thing

He seemed to have good sucks and swallows while nrusing too, so I guess we are back on the right road. We are off to the doctor this morning for hiw 4 mon. check up

I will keep you all posted.
thanks again for all your help!!
karen

 

[wombat]

Hey that's great he's latching on for that long. I found that by the time dd COULD nurse well enough, she just chose not to some of the time. That's ok - it's clear he CAN do it and that's enough at this stage. It's pretty typical to feel like he's taking 1 step forward and 2 steps backward. That happened to us for awhile - it was really confusing at the time but in hindsight that's pretty normal development for all learned skills.

 

[karenge]

Thanks wombat! I hope this is all normal, but right now nothing having to do with BFing has seemed normal. First I was told all of our problems were due to my low supply, so I tried everything anyone ever told me to do to boost my supple and nothing worked!! Then we find out our problem were probably due to his tight frenulum, so we get that clipped, but now there IS a low supply because of all the bottles. Its been a crazy 4 months!! His check up and shots were this morning tho, he weighs a whopping 14lbs 12 oz!!! You would never think he had trouble gaining weight to look at hom now!! The doc did say i could start him on rice cereal now, what do you think of that? I cant decide if i should or not. the doc said, piut a spoon in his mouth, if he pushes it out, he is not ready. It still seems a bit early tho.
anyway, thanks for your encouragement, we'll just keeping truckin' along.
karen

 

[wombat]

dd's ped said the same thing at 4 mo about starting rice cereal. It's a bit strange because their own society, the AAP recommends exclusively using BM/formula for first 6 months. I took it to mean, you CAN but I understood you SHOULDN'T unless there is a good reason to. From everything I've read, babies don't really have the digestive enzymes for carbohydrates until around 7 months or later.

I didn't start my dd on solids til 6 1/2 mo due to my fears about allergies and concern about crowding out the BM in her diet. She had instant constipation with rice cereal - we stopped using it altogether. I recommend the Super Baby Food book by Ruth Yaron - lots of great, healthy ideas for making baby cereals. It's really easy.

 

[Quirky]

I wonder, especially since he had tongue tie, whether he still isn't putting his tongue forward? Babies need to put their tongues forward over their bottom teeth to massage the milk ducts in your breast to stimulate a letdown. That might explain if he's not getting the milk out of your breast. Do you see him swallow? He'll go flutter flutter flutter, his chin moving up and down just a little, then when the milk lets down and he starts swallowing his chin will go down, pause, go back up. Suck on your own finger - see how your chin drops during the sucking/swallowing part? Same thing.

Can you get in to see a lactation consultant or have your doctor refer you to an occupational therapist to get exercises to get him to put his tongue forward. I think if you finger feed with the SNS taped to your finger that might help, but I would talk to an expert to make sure that's right.

Hang in there, mama!