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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Thanksgiving night, at about midnight while we were cleaning up from turkey day we found that one of the cats had peed on the floor. Only it wasn't just pee, it was mostly bloody pee. Dammit. Husband and I discuss for a bit, and opt to go to the regular vet the next morning, since they open at 7am, and whats 6 hours at this point.<br><br>
We changed our minds when George was circling my husband while he was brushing his teeth, and then George peed on the TP roll. More bright red blood. I start thinking aloud about just sucking it up and going to the E-vet, but we've both been up since 7am, and we're beat. Then we find another bloody puddle in the laundry room. Thats it - we're going to the E-vet. We wrestle George into the crate and haul him there. About halfway through the 45 minute drive, George pukes in his crate. Cat food mingled with fresh turkey. EW, thanks kitty.<br><br>
We get to the vet, the nice E-vet lady examines George, who is hissing ad growling and very not happy about things. She says his kidneys and bladder feel fine, and its probably just a UTI, but possibly crystals, but since his bladder is empty, she can't take a sample to verify, so she's just going to give him a shot of antibiotics, and some Clavamox to take home. She says if its a UTI that within 24-36 hours he'll be better, and if he isn't, then to just take him to our regular vet on Monday, unless we notice he can't pee, which means crystals and blockage and to bring him back to the E-vet asap when we notice.<br><br>
So we watched him all day yesterday and he was still peeing blood, and the amount seemed to be getting less and less, so we took him to our regular vet. They examined him, but without a sample - because of course, he peed right before we left and his bladder was empty, they can't be sure of what the issue is. The vet is as concerned about the amount of blood as I am, and so he is now on Clavamox - antibiotic, Metacam - Non-steroidal antiinflammatory pain medication and Phenoxybenzamine - antispasmatic. We also brought home some Lab Litter to try and collect a good urine sample, and a needle-less syringe to suck up pee in if he wizzes on the floor. He'll be put in the bathroom with his own litter box and some water and a kitty bed to sleep in. Hopefully we can get a sample from him tonight.<br><br>
Oh - and giving him the Phenoxybenzamine pill was disastrous. He would NOT swallow the darned thing. I finally dissolved the powder in water and used a needle-less syringe to squirt the watered pill into his mouth. The problem with this is that the med is supposedly VERY bitter and nasty, and he was NOT happy. He was struggling, squirming and fighting us, foaming at the mouth and drooling. I felt like a bad mommy for making him eat the nasty foul stuff, but if he had just swallowed the damn pill he wouldn't have had to taste the damn liquid. Any tips? The last time I had to give a pill it was tiny and just dissolved once it hit their tongue. This one is huge, easily the size of a multi-vitamin, and he just would not swallow it. I couldn't even get it into the back of his mouth. He just kept using his tongue to eject it.
 

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We did the special litter to collect a sample from my cat, too. You need to be watching to make sure the cat is still peeing, forcing fluids-I filled a bowl with water, then put food on it so my very stubborn cat would have to drink it all down to get to his food so he couldn't avoid it.<br><br>
Also, get a UT care food especially for the cat. I hope the results come out ok. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/hug2.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Hug2">
 

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I hope he's ok. please watch him very closely. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug"><br><br>
I have been through all of it before. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/greensad.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="greensad"><br><br>
what are you feeding? if you are feeding dry food, stop. feed canned food with water mixed in to help flush his system. the #1 culprit of crystals is feeding dry food and having a cat who does not like to drink water.
 

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Could you buy a pill popper from your vet? I have one here, it's very easy to use and insures that it's placed far enough back in their throat that they swallow.<br><br>
I've heard of people using things such as "aqarium gravel" and other methods to collect samples. I would think you would definitely want it done...urinary crystals in a male can be very serious...blockages can occur.
 

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I would definitely get a pill popper! You can get the pill far enough back in his throat that he'll have to swallow it! Also, like the pp's said make sure he is getting a lot of water and watch him carefully to make sure he continues to pee. I used to work as an assistant at an animal hospital and saw way to many male kitties get very sick from urinary blockages. It can cause death very easily if you wait to long to get them to a vet. My BIL and SIL's kitty just died from a urinary blockage, because his bladder ruptured. I don't want to scare you, just want you to be aware of the severity of the situation. It could be as simple as a UTI or as serious as a blockage. Let us know how he's doing!
 

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Good luck with your kitty.<br><br>
Blockages are so serious, as other posters have said. Both our male cats have had problems, and one had to be hospitalized with a catheter for several days when he had a blockage. Then we switched them to UTI formula foods and they've been fine ever since.<br><br>
(My mind boggles imagining how to catheterize a male cat - talk about a delicate procedure!)
 

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my old boy, PJ, was a loner. so by the time i noticed ANYTHING and rushed him to the vet it was too late.<br><br>
please keep a close eye on him. Pj was 14, but it was so freakin FAST<br><br>
it was a blockage. I was in shock!
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Well - I talked to the vet yesterday. George is peeing normally and a normal amount now, but the vet says there is "a signifigant number of crystals" in teh sample we gave them on Sunday.<br><br>
She really wants me to have George on the RX diet, but I'm against it. I just really don't want to feed him cheapie food with animal byproducts in it. The stuff we tried before when my other cat had crystals was Science Diet, s/d I think. This stuff the vet wants me to try she says is made my Waltham, and its called s/o? Is it any good?
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>ItyBty</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/9852730"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Well - I talked to the vet yesterday. George is peeing normally and a normal amount now, but the vet says there is "a signifigant number of crystals" in teh sample we gave them on Sunday.<br><br>
She really wants me to have George on the RX diet, but I'm against it. I just really don't want to feed him cheapie food with animal byproducts in it. The stuff we tried before when my other cat had crystals was Science Diet, s/d I think. This stuff the vet wants me to try she says is made my Waltham, and its called s/o? Is it any good?</div>
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If it were me, I'd temporarily go on the RX diet, then research online and find diets which have lower levels of the minerals that help crystals form. If I'm remembering correctly it's the calcium/magnesium (higher levels) that really help crystals form as well. But you can go check that! <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/duck.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Duck">:<br><br>
A breeder I'm working with was having a lot of expisodes when she moved down to FL, but has switched to bottled water and hasn't had a blockage since. She found out that because our water is REALLY hard down here, it contributes substantially to the formation of crystals. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/gloomy.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Gloomy">: Once she started talking to other breeders she found that others had the same experience. So, if you have hard water it *could* be a contributing factor.<br><br>
I thought I'd post that since I never realized that could have such a big impact.
 

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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>ItyBty</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/9852730"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Well - I talked to the vet yesterday. George is peeing normally and a normal amount now, but the vet says there is "a signifigant number of crystals" in teh sample we gave them on Sunday.<br><br>
She really wants me to have George on the RX diet, but I'm against it. I just really don't want to feed him cheapie food with animal byproducts in it. The stuff we tried before when my other cat had crystals was Science Diet, s/d I think. This stuff the vet wants me to try she says is made my Waltham, and its called s/o? Is it any good?</div>
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to be frank,and at this point you need to get things back into balance. my cat developed crystals when we were feeding felidae, which is a high quality food. sometimes, feeding a lower quality of food that is a different formula can help<br><br>
the goal of the rx diet is to get things back under control. we used hills c/d for three months, and then switched to the royal canin (waltham) s/o. our vet feels that the waltham is a better food than the hills (our vet is really into nutrition and food - he doesn't like iams or science diet and encourages people to feed wellness, innova and other high quality foods). we actually feed wellness too. The most important thing you can do is to push fluids. cats that develop crystals are more likely to get them if they don't drink water. mix water into his food.<br><br>
My bottom line was I was ok with feeding a food with some animal by products if it was temporary and used a tool for reaching our goal.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Ok - so now I'm really worried. It started up again tonight - he's pacing the house, being very talky, he peed about a thimble-full of pee in the litter box, but he's been pacing about like he is looking for another place to be besides the litter box. What really scares me is that he is still on the antibiotics (clavamox) for another 3 days, and still has another days worth of the anti-spasmodic, so he is still medicated, and now he is on the RX wet food too. I'm thinking it can't be a bladder infection, because he is on antibiotics still. He's also licking his junk a lot more than normal.
 

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Is he eating only 100% Rx? Or is he allowed non Rx food? Sounds like he still has crystals.<br><br>
We went through 2 rounds of this as well with one of our cats. I don't know why he had two infections back to back, but we switched brands of rx food and tried a stronger antibiotic. the second time. He was on that for about a year and now we've switched him to a high quality kibble. So far so good.<br><br>
You may need to take him back to see what they can do about the crystals (if that is his problem). I can't remember what, if any medications, can be given to help ease the passing of crystals.<br><br>
I hope he feels better soon! I know how stressful this is! <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug"><br><br>
~Julia
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
He is getting 80% RX wet food with a teensy bit of Innova Evo kibble on top (like 5-6 peices, just because he really loves it and otherwise turns up his nose at the wet stuff) but Innova is supposed to be really great for crystals so I didn't think a tiny bit would be a problem. What I really don't understand is that he's been on the Innova Evo exclusively since I got him in March without issues until I tried a different brand, and Bam! Crystals.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I brought Georgie to the vet at 9am - he is still there. The vet wanted to ultrasound his bladder and kidneys to check for sand and stones. Then from there we decide how best to proceed. I'm thinking I'll get 4 or so more cans of the RX wet food, and Georgie will get nothing but that RX wet food for at least the next week. No people food (I am guilty of giving them cheese and the occasional meat tidbit) no kitty treats, no Evo, just the RX stuff. Then I'll slowly ween him back on to the Evo, and get him checked again about 2 weeks from today. Does this sound like a good plan to you all? What would you do? I want to do what is best for Georgie, I really want him to be healthy.
 

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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">What would you do? I want to do what is best for Georgie, I really want him to be healthy.</td>
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I would switch to raw, if that's an option for you.<br><br>
Raw meat has a lot of moisture in it, my raw kitties pee so much compared to my old kibble kitties<br><br><a href="http://rawfed.com/myths/cats.html" target="_blank">http://rawfed.com/myths/cats.html</a><br><a href="http://rawfedcats.org/" target="_blank">http://rawfedcats.org/</a><br><br>
I <i>know</i> I read somewhere about it helping to clear up reoccuring crystals in cats, I just don't see it now that I'm borwsing my links <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/shrug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="shrug">
 

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Did you read my post about hard water as well? The main approach is going to be two fold...reduce the levels of magnesium and acidify the urine. They try to do both and it usually works. If you're giving him tap water that is *hard* water, hard water can have high levels of magnesium.<br><br>
I found out about the water issues when talking to some cat breeders down here in FL. Several of them found out the hard way what hard water can do to a cat who has tendencies towards producing urinary crystals.<br><br>
Some cats are more prone to these than others. There is also a medication that some will go on to help acidify the urine.<br><br>
I hope that you get some answers and quick! That has to be so frustrating (and expensive...sigh).
 

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DON'T give him table food again. He could have a food allergy/sensitivity which is making this more common. When my big boy gets anything with fish, his acts up horribly. So until you know, from now on it's better safe than sorry!
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Phatchristy - I did see your post, I don't think we have hard water here though, so that wasn't a big concern of mine, yet.<br><br>
Kitty - I don't often give them table food, just the occasional bit of cheese or meat - and maybe once a week at that. It's not a free-for-all. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile"> I know its bad for them, and I'm stopped as of now.
 
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