[root*children]

<p>Help!  I am so lost on what to do here.  My toddler (22 months) has breastmilk for about 90% of her nutrition.  I would actually love for her to eat more, but she really has no interest.  Her teeth are also rapidly losing enamel.  I'm assuming I should be able to incorporate something (or more of something) into my diet to curb this or even reverse this??  Any ideas?</p>
<p> </p>
<p>This happened to my now 9yo when he was a baby, and we didn't know anything about TF, so just kept having frustrating dentist appointments ("Stop bottle feeding him" "Stop giving him soda" "No more candy") giving us useless information because we weren't doing any of those things.  His top 4 front teeth eventually lost all enamel and we had to have them pulled.  At 9 years old, the adult teeth are finally just starting to grow in.  I REALLY don't want to go down this same road again - talk about feeling like a failure as a natural living parent.  I was vegetarian then, and started eating meats over the last few years and thought maybe my body stores would be filled up enough to nourish a baby, but now I am doubting it.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Is it something as simple as drinking milk?  I buy raw milk and my older kids drink it.  I don't have much of a taste for it, but if someone thinks that would be a key, I'd be happy to start.  I take FCLO/HVBO each day (about a tsp), make our own chicken broth, eat lots of good fats, cook nearly everything from scratch, etc.  We do eat some sugars, but anything we do is homemade baked goods and really not much of that.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Please any tips are appreciated.  It gets me to or near to tears when I dwell on how I am failing my baby here </p>

 

[root*children]

<p>Other thoughts - I have started buying the Spry mints and letting her have those for the Xylitol.  Should I be cutting out acidic foods, like oranges and such?  I guess I am seeking any advice for making this loss of enamel stop, as well as hopefully building it back up.<br>
 </p>

 

[RachelzMom]

<p>My little one went under anesthesia to have cavities filled and front teeth capped.   That got rid of all the decay and then treated with fluoride every 6 months and used xylitol.  He hasn't had a cavity since.  </p>
<p> </p>
<p>I know that many mommas here aren't in favor of using fluoride, but it really helped after getting rid of all the bad bacteria.   </p>
<p> </p>
<p>Keep in mind that if you are using xylitol, don't feed anything with the xylitol to the dog--it will put them into liver failure.  Great for killing the bad bacteria, though.</p>

 

[JuliaMaite]

<p><span id="user_yui_3_7_3_1_1359402798154_2739"><img alt="yeahthat.gif" id="user_yui_3_7_3_1_1359402798154_2738" src="http://files.mothering.com/images/smilies/yeahthat.gif"></span></p>
<p>I'm going through the same thing with my dd who just turned three, who I am still nursing and do not intend to stop anytime soon.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Started about 9 months ago with a visit to the dentist for older dd and the dentist sat her up on the chair to get her 'used' to visits.  Found five cavities, said we would just watch them (they were small).  Six months later for the next visit, found two more for a total of seven, so we are filling them slowly (ART on one and biocompatible composite on a second so far).  Her four top front teeth are the worst.  I've been doing non-stop research since I realized it was spreading. </p>
<p> </p>
<p>Dentist is our family dentist, absolutely fantastic and very patiently goes through with me all my crazy research and challenges.  She is sure that nightime nursing had some affect she says due to her front teeth ("classic"), so I went crazy trying to find a STUDY or something concrete that would tell me yes or no.  This is the best thing that I found with the help of a friend: <a href="http://kellymom.com/health/baby-health/tooth-decay/" target="_blank">http://kellymom.com/health/baby-health/tooth-decay/</a> , which contains what I was hoping to find "Breastmilk also contains lactoferrin, a component in breastmilk that actually kills strep mutans (the bacteria that causes tooth decay)"  HOWEVER, the dentist may be a little right as it goes on to say "However, if there are small defects in the enamel, the teeth become more vulnerable and the protective effect of breastmilk is <span style="text-decoration:underline;">not enough to counteract the combined effect of the bacteria and the <strong>sugars in the milk</strong></span>. Enamel defects occur when the first teeth are forming in utero. "  This is what I think is going on with dd.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>What I have been doing is brushing her teeth extra carefully.  I also give her xylitol, I make my own candy to ensure the xylitol is birchwood not corn, and is not mixed with anything else  (studies show that if it's mixed with sorbitol or other things it does not work or is actually cariogenic, but that calcium and xylitol combo is most effective, so I also give her calcium chewable made with xylitol Animal Parade, xyilitol from birchwood).  Xylitol has been proven in studies to stop, reverse and even help reminiralize the teeth in doses of 6 to 10 g a day taken spread out 5 times a day (so like 1g or 2 each time) after 6 months.  I have been doing this for 1 month (since the two extra cavities were found), so I am hoping and praying it works.  I give her xylitol after she nurses (while she is sleeping, you could either wipe your child's mouth with a cloth wet from xylitol, or my dd just chews the candy while she is sleeping).</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Let me know if the xylitol studies that I read interest you, I'll post some links.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>I would also like to know what other moms are doing (nutrition wise, I'm also doing CLO and broths and all other things mentioned, she does not like milk but will like to add kefir back to our home, I did it with raw milk when my older one was little, older one does not have any cavities, but it may be the difference in enamel from one to the other which is indicative of the difference in my diet while pregnant with each).<br>
 </p>

 

[JuliaMaite]

<p>Also, to brush her teeth before nursing at night to make sure the breastmilk is not mixing with other sugars (even starchy foods) - there is a paragraph in the above kellymom link that mentions a study where breastmilk ALONE actually makes teeth stronger but combined with sugar is worst than sugar water. </p>

 

[CookAMH]

<p>This recent blog post might interest you (and hopefully encourage too). <a href="http://www.thenourishinggourmet.com/2013/01/a-success-story-remineralizing-teeth-after-bottle-rot.html" target="_blank">http://www.thenourishinggourmet.com/2013/01/a-success-story-remineralizing-teeth-after-bottle-rot.html</a></p>
<p> </p>
<p>Is your daughter taking the CLO or just you? She needs it directly.</p>

 

[iowaorganic]

<p>This thread struck me.  In fact it hit me so hard I ordered the fermented CLO/BO that the blog recommended.  My kids all have horrible teeth and we don't use floride either.  How much should I give them once it comes?  1 pill or 2?  Any suggestions?  I really really want this to work for them.  The dentist doesn't pressure me about the floride but does lecture me on what the eat- and doesn't believe me that they don't eat candy and raisins and dry cereal all day ....</p>

 

[root*children]

<p>I have ordered Ramiel's book, and just saw that he posted a free 45 minute video on youtube of the basics from the first chapters:</p>
<p>> <a href="http://www.curetoothdecay.com/tooth-decay-presentation.htm?awt_l=J6GpA&awt_m=L3QgGfkfu2pPFS" target="_blank">http://www.curetoothdecay.com/tooth-decay-presentation.htm?awt_l=J6GpA&awt_m=L3QgGfkfu2pPFS</a></p>
<p> </p>
<p>So far, I'm the one taking the FCLO/HVBO - I can't get the baby to take it.  Just today though, she started taking the Nordic Naturals CLO gel caps.  She sucks the oil out and then spits the gel cap - that's a toddler for ya!  I might try ordering some other flavors besides cinnamon from GP - I think it's too strong for her.  I keep hearing mixed reviews of the chocolate though, and don't want to spend the $$ if she won't take that either and it tastes terrible.<br>
 </p>
<p>We have gone grain free this last week - boy is that a big change.  I really didn't realize how completely dependent our society is on grains and sugars until we started this diet! America's not making it easy for us.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>PP - you want 1-2 tsp of CLO per day, I think that's about 4 gel caps from GP, so I guess that as many as your kids are willing to do. </p>

 

[CookAMH]

<p>I will be checking back and will be so happy to hear if there is progress on this.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>The chocolate CLO sounds yucky imo. I haven't tried it though! I haven't had to try giving new CLO to a kid that hadn't had it since infancy...but, my DD now 22 mo, had the orange for months. I'd give it to her from the syringe and have her take a drink of milk right away. She always tolerated that, even asked for more, but I didn't like that flavor. I ran out of it, so I tried the cinnamon. Thinking it would be strong, I give her less at once and she likes it just fine. I do only give 1/4 tsp, sometimes more. If that happens to work for you, you could give it more often.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>The way the rest of us take it is in a shot of OJ. My almost 4yo does it fine that way, and now that my DD is better with a cup, I could start giving that to her (but I hate CLO spills esp on clothes!!).</p>
<p> </p>
<p>From some other posts, it seems very important to give CLO in the same meal that butter fats are present, either in the form of the butter oil, or raw milk, or even a spoonful of butter to those little mouths who find plain butter so palatable....<span id="user_yui_3_7_3_1_1360457154637_2170"><img alt="yummy.gif" id="user_yui_3_7_3_1_1360457154637_2169" src="http://files.mothering.com/images/smilies/yummy.gif"></span> It seems to have a synergistic affect.</p>

 

[womenswisdom]

Upper lip ties are also a possible cause of upper front tooth decay. You might want to look into that as a possible cause. It's fairly easy to fix.

 

[iowaorganic]

<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>root*children</strong> <a href="/community/t/1373183/breastfeeding-toddler-losing-tooth-enamel#post_17259646"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br><p>I have ordered Ramiel's book, and just saw that he posted a free 45 minute video on youtube of the basics from the first chapters:</p>
<p>> <a href="http://www.curetoothdecay.com/tooth-decay-presentation.htm?awt_l=J6GpA&awt_m=L3QgGfkfu2pPFS" target="_blank">http://www.curetoothdecay.com/tooth-decay-presentation.htm?awt_l=J6GpA&awt_m=L3QgGfkfu2pPFS</a></p>
<p> </p>
<p>So far, I'm the one taking the FCLO/HVBO - I can't get the baby to take it.  Just today though, she started taking the Nordic Naturals CLO gel caps.  She sucks the oil out and then spits the gel cap - that's a toddler for ya!  I might try ordering some other flavors besides cinnamon from GP - I think it's too strong for her.  I keep hearing mixed reviews of the chocolate though, and don't want to spend the $$ if she won't take that either and it tastes terrible.<br>
 </p>
<p>We have gone grain free this last week - boy is that a big change.  I really didn't realize how completely dependent our society is on grains and sugars until we started this diet! America's not making it easy for us.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>PP - you want 1-2 tsp of CLO per day, I think that's about 4 gel caps from GP, so I guess that as many as your kids are willing to do. </p>
</div>
</div>
<p>Thank You!  We will not have money for groceries if I give them each 4 caps/day- that stuff is $47/ bottle hopefully since it is fermented it is more concentrated   When you say no grains- do you really mean NO grains?  Like no wild rice or spelt or anything?  We were NO grains but we weren't getting nearly the carbs we should have.  So this year I am introducing back some home made sourdough rye/spelt bread and wild rice and some whole wheat.  I will try to watch the youtube video tonight that you posted...  </p>

 

[kejohnson]

<p>you might want to add in some bone broth to remineralize the teeth. My family eats it every day. I sneak it into my kids food.</p>
<p>Here is a recipe I developed: </p>
<p><a href="http://nursemompaleo.com/2013/02/08/7-day-bone-broth/" target="_blank">http://nursemompaleo.com/2013/02/08/7-day-bone-broth/</a></p>

 

[kejohnson]

<p>how do you fix an upper lip tie? I have a friend who's baby has this issue?</p>

 

[womenswisdom]

<div class="quote-container" data-huddler-embed="/community/t/1373183/breastfeeding-toddler-losing-tooth-enamel#post_17266693" data-huddler-embed-placeholder="false"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>kejohnson</strong> <a href="/community/t/1373183/breastfeeding-toddler-losing-tooth-enamel#post_17266693"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif"></a><br><br>
how do you fix an upper lip tie? I have a friend who's baby has this issue?</div>
</div>
<br>
There is a very active facebook group called Tongue Tie Babies Support that has an extensive list of practitioners who are experienced with revising lip and tongue ties. Just fyi for your friend, upper lip ties are almost always present in conjunction with posterior tongue ties.

 

[CookAMH]

<div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>womenswisdom</strong> <a href="/community/t/1373183/breastfeeding-toddler-losing-tooth-enamel#post_17266741"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style=""></a><br><br><br>
There is a very active facebook group called Tongue Tie Babies Support that has an extensive list of practitioners who are experienced with revising lip and tongue ties. Just fyi for your friend, upper lip ties are almost always present in conjunction with posterior tongue ties.</div>
</div>
<p><br>
That's interesting you say that because my DD had a posterior tongue tie with her lip tie. Both were clipped, and I'm glad we did it.</p>

 

[Smithdiana924]

Help!  I am so lost on what to do here.  My toddler (22 months) has breastmilk for about 90% of her nutrition.  I would actually love for her to eat more, but she really has no interest.  Her teeth are also rapidly losing enamel.  I'm assuming I should be able to incorporate something (or more of something) into my diet to curb this or even reverse this??  Any ideas?
 
This happened to my now 9yo when he was a baby, and we didn't know anything about TF, so just kept having frustrating dentist appointments ("Stop bottle feeding him" "Stop giving him soda" "No more candy") giving us useless information because we weren't doing any of those things.  His top 4 front teeth eventually lost all enamel and we had to have them pulled.  At 9 years old, the adult teeth are finally just starting to grow in.  I REALLY don't want to go down this same road again - talk about feeling like a failure as a natural living parent.  I was vegetarian then, and started eating meats over the last few years and thought maybe my body stores would be filled up enough to nourish a baby, but now I am doubting it.
 
Is it something as simple as drinking milk?  I buy raw milk and my older kids drink it.  I don't have much of a taste for it, but if someone thinks that would be a key, I'd be happy to start.  I take FCLO/HVBO each day (about a tsp), make our own chicken broth, eat lots of good fats, cook nearly everything from scratch, etc.  We do eat some sugars, but anything we do is homemade baked goods and really not much of that.
 
Please any tips are appreciated.  It gets me to or near to tears when I dwell on how I am failing my baby here

Did you happen to find out what was happening to your daughters teeth? We are currently going through the same thing with my 15 month old and desperate for answers. did it affect her permament teeth?

 

[root*children]

big hugs mama! It sucks. I got the Cure Tooth Decay book by Ramiel Nagel and we started following the diet protocol laid out there. We also found a biologic dentist who had seen this before in breastfed babies. He prescribed some type of iodide (I forget exactly what it was called) for brushing teeth with every so often to stop the decay. All of these things definitely slowed down the decay, but it was still happening. The biologic dentist eventually did work on the teeth by taking off the decay and rebuilding the teeth.
My daughter is nearly 5 now and those fake teeth are just starting to become show wear, but I'm not so worried about it since permanents will be coming in soon.
My older son who had his pulled only showed difference in permanent teeth in that they grew in MUCH later than his peers. The dentist told us that may be a possibility given the situation, so we were patient with it.

 

[NicoleT]

<p>Help!  I am so lost on what to do here.  My toddler (22 months) has breastmilk for about 90% of her nutrition.  I would actually love for her to eat more, but she really has no interest.  Her teeth are also rapidly losing enamel.  I'm assuming I should be able to incorporate something (or more of something) into my diet to curb this or even reverse this??  Any ideas?</p>
<p> </p>
<p>This happened to my now 9yo when he was a baby, and we didn't know anything about TF, so just kept having frustrating dentist appointments ("Stop bottle feeding him" "Stop giving him soda" "No more candy") giving us useless information because we weren't doing any of those things.  His top 4 front teeth eventually lost all enamel and we had to have them pulled.  At 9 years old, the adult teeth are finally just starting to grow in.  I REALLY don't want to go down this same road again - talk about feeling like a failure as a natural living parent.  I was vegetarian then, and started eating meats over the last few years and thought maybe my body stores would be filled up enough to nourish a baby, but now I am doubting it.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Is it something as simple as drinking milk?  I buy raw milk and my older kids drink it.  I don't have much of a taste for it, but if someone thinks that would be a key, I'd be happy to start.  I take FCLO/HVBO each day (about a tsp), make our own chicken broth, eat lots of good fats, cook nearly everything from scratch, etc.  We do eat some sugars, but anything we do is homemade baked goods and really not much of that.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Please any tips are appreciated.  It gets me to or near to tears when I dwell on how I am failing my baby here </p>

Our teeth are connected to the different systems within our bodies - digestive, immune, endocrine, etc. You may need to find out how's her inner health, such as, does she need digestive enzymes, etc?

 

[blessedwithboys]

We were NO grains but we weren't getting nearly the carbs we should have.

You'd be surprised at how completely un-needed carbs are. Veggies and a little bit of fruit is all you "need".

 

[Smithdiana924]

big hugs mama! It sucks. I got the Cure Tooth Decay book by Ramiel Nagel and we started following the diet protocol laid out there. We also found a biologic dentist who had seen this before in breastfed babies. He prescribed some type of iodide (I forget exactly what it was called) for brushing teeth with every so often to stop the decay. All of these things definitely slowed down the decay, but it was still happening. The biologic dentist eventually did work on the teeth by taking off the decay and rebuilding the teeth.
My daughter is nearly 5 now and those fake teeth are just starting to become show wear, but I'm not so worried about it since permanents will be coming in soon.
My older son who had his pulled only showed difference in permanent teeth in that they grew in MUCH later than his peers. The dentist told us that may be a possibility given the situation, so we were patient with it.

Thank you for your reply! I got the book too and we are following the protocol now. I figure if they remove her teeth she will also have teeth come in later since they were gone so early. So his teeth look normal though? Did they say it was decay? My daughter lost all the enamel already on her top 4 teeth :/