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Just putting this here for the next person who suggests there was no cancer before vaccination.

I know most people don't believe, but I have definitely seen it argued here.

I haven't seen it.

I have seen cancer linked to vaccines, but I have never seen anyone say all causes of cancer are vaccine related.

Oh, well.
 

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I've recommended it before and here it is again:

Read The Secret History of the War on Cancer by Devra Davis. Cancer goes way back. Modern cancer rates have a lot to do with our cleverness in developing new chemical mixes and exposing people to them.

I think the association with cancer and vaccines goes back to the smallpox vaccine.

Here is the citation I found 2 Mullins Eustace Murder by Injection pg 132 The National Council for Medical Research, P. O. Box 1105, Staunton, Virginia 24401 and here is the quote:
In the early 1900s an astute Indiana physician, Dr. W.B. Clarke, stated "Cancer was practically unknown until compulsory vaccination with cowpox vaccine began to be introduced. I have had to deal with two hundred cases of cancer, and I never saw a case of cancer in an unvaccinated[2] person."


We hear a lot these days about cancer being caused by VIRUSES, right?

And yet polio vaccine contaminated with SV-40, a monkey virus which turns up in lots of cancers, is claimed to just be there coincidentally. That virus doesn't cause cancer. According to all the best authorities. And anyone who does point to a connection between that particular virus and cancer is wrong.

Anyway, the smallpox vaccine was produced under horrendously unsanitary conditions and administered under horrendously unsanitary conditions, so it was an ideal opportunity to pass both viruses and bacteria from person to person. With millions of people receiving vaccines, it does seem pretty reasonable that some people would have cancer causing viruses shoved into their skin along with the vaccine, doesn't it?

Of course modern vaccines are never contaminated by unexpected viruses! Never! And don't look behind that curtain in the corner.
 

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Examples of viral contamination of vaccines
http://www.virology.ws/2010/03/29/deep-sequencing-reveals-viral-vaccine-contaminants/
The sequence analysis revealed the expected vaccine strains in each preparation, and in three cases, other unexpected viral sequences. The retrovirus avian leukosis virus was found in the measles vaccine, but at a very low level (700 nucleotides from 4 sequence reads). A virus similar to simian retrovirus was identified in Rotateq (276 nucleotides from 1 sequence read). Significant levels of porcine cirovirus 1 were found in Rotarix. The entire viral genome sequence was deduced from 6344 sequence reads, comprising over 40% of the reads done for that vaccine.
http://www.i-sis.org.uk/Viruses_and_Virus_Nucleic_Acid_Contaminate_Vaccines.php

Many live attenuated vaccines are produced using cell culture. A number of such vaccines have been found to contain not only the live attenuated viral pathogen but also contaminating viruses or viral nucleic acid [1]. These contaminants are garbage, and people administering such vaccines should inform patients of potential risks associated with the garbage. Recently, the United States Food and Drug Administration (FDA) acknowledged the contamination of the live attenuated rotavirus vaccine (to prevent traveller’s diarrhoea) and suspended the vaccine, but later decided that the benefits of the vaccination outweigh potential contamination risks [2]. The FDA opinion is premature because the circovirus contaminating the vaccine is active in replication, transcription and translation of viral genes and able to produce toxic products. Contaminated vaccines are not isolated cases, they are widespread.
Cheer up! The FDA held a meeting and they are maybe going to do something. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22294577

Improved assurance that vaccines do not contain harmful adventitious agents is expected to enhance public confidence and promote vaccine benefit. The recent discovery of porcine circovirus 1 in some rotavirus vaccines using massively parallel sequencing suggests that newer technologies could be employed both to identify potential adventitious viral agents and to provide increased assurance that such agents are absent. This article includes a discussion of the new virus detection methods and approaches that could be used to facilitate their use in a regulatory setting.
This is a very shallow scratching of the surface on a huge problem which has been present from the first use of vaccines as a preventative.
 
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I'd love to discuss this topic further, since I did manage to track down the original quote about cancer and vaccines and come up with a reasonable link between viral contamination of the smallpox vaccine and subsequent cancer.

Is it totally off the wall?

More examples of problems.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20456974
Vaccination is one of the most important public health accomplishments. However, since vaccine preparation involves the use of materials of biological origin, vaccines are subject to contamination by micro-organisms. In fact, vaccine contamination has occurred; a historical example of vaccine contamination, for example, can be found in the early days of development of the smallpox vaccine. The introduction of new techniques of vaccine virus production on cell cultures has lead to safer vaccines, but has not completely removed the risk of virus contamination. There are several examples of vaccine contamination, for example, contamination of human vaccines against poliomyelitis by SV40 virus from the use of monkey primary renal cells. Several veterinary vaccines have been contaminated by pestiviruses from foetal calf serum. These incidents have lead industry to change certain practices and regulatory authorities to develop more stringent and detailed requirements. But the increasing number of target species for vaccines, the diversity of the origin of biological materials and the extremely high number of known and unknown viruses and their constant evolution represent a challenge to vaccine producers and regulatory authorities.
I didn't know this fascinating bit of history, although I did find an old article in the archives vigorously denying that vaccines were ever contaminated with tetanus. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18453724

The pharmaceutical industry developed in the late 19th century as a consequence of both scientific and commercial innovations, such as the development of diphtheria antitoxin and the commercialization of smallpox vaccine. Two tetanus outbreaks in 1901 -- from contaminated diphtheria antitoxin in St. Louis, Missouri, and contaminated smallpox vaccine in Camden, New Jersey -- raised public concern about pharmaceutical safety. In St. Louis, errant manufacturing processes were found to be the source of the outbreak. In Camden, investigation identified contaminated vaccine from one manufacturer as the cause. These investigations, the first known pharmacoepidemiologic studies, were widely reported. They formed the basis for the 1902 Biologics Control Act, which focused on the safety of biologics produced and sold by the pharmaceutical industry and established a precedent of federal regulation of this industry. That power, welcomed by manufacturers to restore the public's trust in their products, was enhanced in the 1906 Food and Drug Act, which created the Food and Drug Administration.
And I bet this will be the only piece that any vaccine supporter will respond to: "look, problems with vaccines are reported and dealt with!"

This one also acknowledges the contamination problem with the smallpox vaccine http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17157663
In addition, this vaccine was historically produced using animal intermediaries in a process that was prone to contamination and not acceptable for current manufacturing standards.
The method of producing smallpox vaccine that guaranteed that it was contaminated continued into the 1970s http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/13033

here have been few changes in the preparation of smallpox vaccine since Eduard Jenner described his method of preventive inoculation in 1798. Jenner's vaccine, "the matter", was maintained in man by arm to arm passage. The only major achievement in production methods was the introduction of an animal host for virus propagation. The skin of living calves or sheep was inoculated with seed virus and the "pulp" harvested three to four days later. The disadvantages of this procedure are evident: massive bacterial contamination in spite of rigorous cleanliness and excessive amounts of undesired tissue debris in the crude material to be used for vaccine production. In spite of these obvious disadvantages the method is still in use all over the world.
Note that the improvements lauded in 1977 are still considered inadequate and there continues to be research on how to produce a cleaner smallpox vaccine.
 

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The real questions:

1) Are viruses clearly linked to the development of cancer?
2) Have some viruses that looked like they might be linked to cancer been conclusively cleared, for example SV-40, or does the debate continue?
3) Can we assume that there might be many more viruses that are linked to the development of cancer that haven't yet been identified?
4) Can we also assume that older vaccines, or even current vaccines, could have been or currently are contaminated with viruses that could be linked to the development of cancer?

It is certainly very difficult to get a clear epidemiological signal with something as widespread as smallpox vaccine, given the many different animal sources used and the enormous amount of contamination. The rise in cancer over the last 100 or 150 years could be blamed on increasing lifespans (it used to be a disease that occurred most often as people aged); on increasing exposure to industrial chemicals, especially in the workplace; or on multiple other exposures, including viral contamination of vaccines.

I'm not trying to conclude that there is something there so much as exploring a possible factor for an increase in cancer due to massive viral exposures coming into human bodies via contaminated vaccines.

This article shows a significant rise in cancer in the 20th century and discusses some of the ways statistics around cancer have been manipulated.
https://jonbarron.org/article/growth-cancer
 

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SV40 is an abbreviation for Simian vacuolating virus 40 or Simian virus 40, a polyomavirus that is found in both monkeys and humans. It was named for the effect it produced on infected green monkey cells, which developed an unusual number of vacuoles. Like other polyomaviruses, SV40 is a DNA virus that has the potential to cause tumors in animals, but most often persists as a latent infection.

SV40 discovery revealed that between 1955 and 1963 around 90% of children and 60% of adults in USA were inoculated with SV40-contaminated polio vaccines.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SV40

The rest of the article is whitewashed, but it even admits that SV40 "has the potential to cause tumors in animals, but most often persists as a latent infection." So if it doesn't give you cancer, it just gives you an "autoimmune" disease.
 

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SV40 is an abbreviation for Simian vacuolating virus 40 or Simian virus 40, a polyomavirus that is found in both monkeys and humans. It was named for the effect it produced on infected green monkey cells, which developed an unusual number of vacuoles. Like other polyomaviruses, SV40 is a DNA virus that has the potential to cause tumors in animals, but most often persists as a latent infection.

SV40 discovery revealed that between 1955 and 1963 around 90% of children and 60% of adults in USA were inoculated with SV40-contaminated polio vaccines.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SV40

The rest of the article is whitewashed, but it even admits that SV40 "has the potential to cause tumors in animals, but most often persists as a latent infection." So if it doesn't give you cancer, it just gives you an "autoimmune" disease.
how comforting...thanks!
 

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Is cancer related to vaccinations?

I know for a fact that veterinarians vaccinate an animal in the same leg so that when, not if, a tumor occurs in that leg, THE LEG CAN BE CUT OFF, and the animal can go on and live a life.

Pet owners, ask your veterinarian. This is the truth.

"First, Do No Harm." OMG!
 

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Bumping up this thread in the hopes that we could have a bit more discussion about viral contamination of vaccines and the role of viruses in the development of cancer.

Note that the role of HPV in the development of cancer is everywhere you turn. A never-ending drum-beat pounding into our minds that there is a connection between this particular virus and all sorts of cancers.

It sort of reminds me of the way that mild childhood illnesses turn deadly when a vaccine becomes available.

On the other hand, there could be many other viruses that are provoking cancers, but until there is a vaccine we won't hear about them, even if they are coming into our bodies via vaccines.

Weird world, isn't it?
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I'm confused actually.

You seem to believe viruses cause cancer when they're contaminating vaccines ;which by the way I'm against. We should definitely encourage vaccine makers to minimise viral contamination of their vaccines), but where a vaccine has been developed to prevent a virus known to cause cancer your opposed to that.

Seem confusingly inconsistent to me. :)
 

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I'm confused actually.

You seem to believe viruses cause cancer when they're contaminating vaccines ;which by the way I'm against. We should definitely encourage vaccine makers to minimise viral contamination of their vaccines), but where a vaccine has been developed to prevent a virus known to cause cancer your opposed to that.

Seem confusingly inconsistent to me. :)
Well, I can understand your confusion.

I'm glad we agree about viral contamination of vaccines.

If the HPV vaccines didn't have a few little problems, I'd be in favor of them.

My concerns:
1) side-effects being dismissed as coincidence on inadequate data. If you are going to talk about "background rates" you need many years of data, clear data, solid data AND data that actually corresponds to the presenting symptoms.
2) the problem of serotype replacement, which doesn't seem to me to be resolved by the release of a new vaccine with more serotypes. If we want to avoid creating more problems than we are solving, we need to understand what happens when we push out some viral types. Hoping for the best isn't science.
3) the problem of aluminum, especially the aluminum used in the placebo in the original trials.

There is more, but I think that will get a discussion going.
 

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Well, I can understand your confusion.

I'm glad we agree about viral contamination of vaccines.

If the HPV vaccines didn't have a few little problems, I'd be in favor of them.

My concerns:
1) side-effects being dismissed as coincidence on inadequate data. If you are going to talk about "background rates" you need many years of data, clear data, solid data AND data that actually corresponds to the presenting symptoms.
2) the problem of serotype replacement, which doesn't seem to me to be resolved by the release of a new vaccine with more serotypes. If we want to avoid creating more problems than we are solving, we need to understand what happens when we push out some viral types. Hoping for the best isn't science.
3) the problem of aluminum, especially the aluminum used in the placebo in the original trials.

There is more, but I think that will get a discussion going.
Just put in an example of serotype replacement on another thread, so I'll bounce this one up too.
 
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This thread is such a great example of real issues being sort of dodged that I decided to bring it up again.
 
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