[jasperab]

Just went to another website looking for vac info and came accross their baby board and went down to "sleep teaching" area. well I never want to go there again. Before I came here to MDC (I was invited over as I was looking for vac info) I never knew there was such a thing as AP or mainstream, I thought we were all just mamas doing things alittle differently but doing the best for our kids. Some of us do this others that, but I always belive we need to love our children and be kind and gentle to them. There was a mom on there who let her 5mos CIO for 40 mins the poor baby was gasping for air she was so disrought(sp?) another mom let her baby do the same and found the poor baby sleeping standing up in her crib she had to pry her finger off the railing. These moms justified it by saying they didn't want to be "twisted around their babies little fingers". This is way too extreme for me and I think causes harm to babies. I am not for infringing on others parenting ways but this is too much for me I felt like throwing up. If my babies are crying they are in my arms because I sure would like someone holding me if I were crying KWIM

Just had to vent, I don't usually

 

[TiredX2]

 

[sleepies]

that is awful.

i can't imagine that.

those babies have no idea what is going on.

babies SHOULD have us around their fingers for "crying out loud"

 

[Piglet68]

I stay away from mainstream boards b/c of that. I always come away from there with high blood pressure, and a deep sadness for the lot of so many babies...

 

[party_of_seven]

ITA Piglet. That kind of stuff gets my hackles up. It breaks my heart.

Go hug your baby a little tighter!

Christina

 

[hjohnson]

People who "don't want to be twisted around their babies' fingers" shouldn't be parents in the first place. That's disgusting that the poor babe fell asleep standing up.

 

[Icequeen_in_ak]

Oh my god! I teared up just reading that. I can't stand it... it just completely breaks my heart to know what those poor innocent babies are going through.. and what the hell is wrong with society these days to think that abandoning your babies to cry until they feel completely helpless is acceptable! And we wonder why today's youth is getting more and more violent

 

[nicholas_mom]

I stay away from those boards because they make me uke

 

[jasperab]

You see, I don't even consider this mainstream. I know of some mainstream type of mamas who let their babies cry 5 to 10 min to see if their babies will settle and to me that is their business but there is no way any of them would let their little ones get to such a point and basicly abandon them. I don't think any parenting board no matter mainstream or not should avocate or allow such posting. It just realy disturbed me that such conversations were going on and no one saying, "hey you guys are way out of line" sigh

I'm still trying to save the world

 

[Justice2]

See, this really, really makes me ill. Go back and tell that poster what she is doing to her child...

Quote:

Letting a baby "cry it out" is bad if not dangerous advice. Prolonged crying is physiologically detrimental to the infant. The effects of crying are like the Valsalva Maneuver in the adult. [The Valsalva Maneuver is where you try to push air out of your lungs without opening your throat, it can also occur when an adult strains to have a bowel movement or during the pushing stage of labor.] The Valsalva Maneuver affects the way the body functions: large changes in blood flow occur, oxygen levels in the blood decrease, blood pressure rises, the heart rate slows, intracranial pressure (inside the head) rises, pressure on the ear drums increases, and blood flow from the inferior vena cava (a large vein in the abdomen and chest) to the heart decreases, which keeps the heart from pumping as much blood as it should. (Marasco and Barger)

This is from http://members.aol.com/davisrnclc/my...ge/cuefeed.htm . I have also read..somewhere, can't remember where, that a child left screaming for 20 minutes, unattended, has the same vital signs as an adult having a stoke. Bad new...these parents make me want to

 

[Kinipela79]

Quote:

Oh my god! I teared up just reading that. I can't stand it... it just completely breaks my heart to know what those poor innocent babies are going through.. and what the hell is wrong with society these days to think that abandoning your babies to cry until they feel completely helpless is acceptable! And we wonder why today's youth is getting more and more violent

I feel the same way...my heart just broke reading about those poor babies. And it hurts even more because I did it to my first son...thank goodness I know better now and I couldn't DREAM of doing that to ds2. I think it's interesting that AP (and I've heard this a lot) gets a lot of blame for "uncontrollable overly aggressive" kids.

 

[Hope'smom]

Well, I was on one of those "mainstream" boards and was told that I am "rude" because I disagreed with the original poster who let her son cry for three HOURS on and off...and not ONE person said to her that she should have her head examined. I am sorry, I might come off as assertive (I think it is my career background and education level), but damn, when I read that post I couldn't sleep that night and my stomach was in knots.
So, I offered the suggestion that perhaps Babywise isn't so wise, considering it comes from (what I understand, please correct me if I am wrong), a religious based point of view and not a pediatric/medical one.
And I was SLAMMED on the board.
I think what bothers me is the "gang mentality". I mean, honestly, if that girl were my neighbor and I heard her child crying throughout the night like (for three hours on and off--mostly ON), I seriously would have called the police, because I would have honestly thought that the child was left alone unattended, or that the parents were injured or dead or something.
Kwim?? I mean, I asked my husband what his thoughts were and he told me that he would call the police too, with the same thoughts--there must be something wrong if a baby is crying that long!! Wouldn't you, if you heard a baby crying for hours??
But NO, I get slammed on the board, and all sorts of nasty things are said.
And the kicker--I never once told anyone what I REALLY thought of them as a person, just tried to give them information that would hopefully enlighten them when it comes to "sleep training"--or sleep trauma, as it should be known as. I didn't say anything personal at all, to anyone! Ugh, I am frustrated just thinking about it.
Thanks for the vent, I am venting too, and I hope you don't mind that I hijacked this post a bit to complain--because I've been really upset thinking about that tiny baby, the same as my son, screaming in the dark.
Oh, let me hold my little man a little closer and try to forget what I read.

 

[Hope'smom]

I should have said that the "gang mentality" is what I find on those types of boards. The people gang up on others on those boards--those with less popular (even though more SANE) views and attack them personally.
Sorry for the added post.

 

[hallesmom]

I just find this heartbreaking and sickening.
I had an expierence at the hospital I work at and I was in tears when I left. Two nurses were talking. One had kids-the other didn't. They were talking about the baby crying and the one w/o kids said, "you just ignored him-RIGHT?" and the other one said ,'yeah of course'.
I made a comment that that's not right. But couldn't say much-I didn't really know these women and I was trying to work. But, it just is so sad and abusive!!!!!!

 

[*LoveBugMama*]

I can`t stand to read about things like this.

I don`t understand how ANYONE can think that letting a baby cry for HOURS is a good idea??

I don`t frequent "mainstream" boards because of this. I tried posting at another board a few months ago. But a lot of the posts really made me sick. More or less everyone agreed that slapping/hitting/cio was the absolutely right thing to do.

When I protested, I was told that I was a bad mom and that my son would become a brat.

Yeah, that`s what`s going to happen.

:

 

[Foobar]

I am regularly on a mainstream board and when someone asked about CIO for a little one, most people expressed their opinions as "no" or "too young" or "after 6 or 7 months, but only for 5 minutes, no longer".

It scares me that there is a pressure in some places for CIO indefinately to be a tool.

Most of the stuff on my other board is pretty sensible about these things.

 

[Tigerchild]

This is one of the main reasons why I've never gotten very involved (and will probably wait until my boys are older) with my local moms of multiples club. There are a surprising number of AP-friendly folks as part of it, but for a long time it seemed like on the board all these threads about CIO kept popping out in the infants section, or every meeting I went to I'd hear people talking about it, and they even have a copy of Babywise in their lending library. Me with all my hormones and adjustment issues just couldn't handle it.

Now that my guys are older, I'm going to donate some of my more AP friendly books, and maybe buy 3 or 4 copies of Elizabeth Pantley's book for their library and donate them. But yeah, it's so hard not to cringe when I hear about hard core CIO. I guess I just can't wrap my mind around letting any of my little ones cry like that. Not saying that I'm a superior person, but it's just so part of me to NOT use CIO I just can't fathom it. I do have sympathy and empathy for people who are at their wits end from sleep dep, though.

 

[TranscendentalMom]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jasperab These moms justified it by saying they didn't want to be "twisted around their babies little fingers".

Its sad. These are the same women who in 13-14 years will be writing....why doesn't my dd/ds talk to me about anything? How can you expect to have a close relationship with your kids when you begin by breaking bonds?

 

[USAmma]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jasperab You see, I don't even consider this mainstream. I know of some mainstream type of mamas who let their babies cry 5 to 10 min to see if their babies will settle and to me that is their business but there is no way any of them would let their little ones get to such a point and basicly abandon them. I don't think any parenting board no matter mainstream or not should avocate or allow such posting. It just realy disturbed me that such conversations were going on and no one saying, "hey you guys are way out of line" sigh I'm still trying to save the world

I agree. I AM an AP mommy but sometimes I do something similar. My baby gets to the point where she's so overly tired and stimulated that she doesn't even want to be held. I put her on her tummy in her crib (she has a crib because she has reflux and has to sleep elevated) and pat her back until she goes to sleep. She fusses, never cries or screams. If it elevates into screaming I pick her up and calm her. Most of the time as soon as I put her in the crib she calms down and closes her eyes and settles into the mattress.

I think a lot of mainstream moms would disagree with letting a baby scream it out for that long or to that degree. I had a friend who just Ferberized and even she would not let her ds cry for more than 10 min. at a time, and would go and pick him up before starting it all over again. Now I have my own opinion about Ferberizing, but at least she didn't let him get to the vomiting point or anything.

Darshani