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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1) - Cite This Source<br>
per·vert [v. per-vurt; n. pur-vert] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation<br>
–verb (used with object)<br>
1.to affect with perversion.<br>
2.to lead astray morally.<br>
3.to turn away from the right course.<br><b>4.to lead into mental error or false judgment.<br>
5.to turn to an improper use; misapply.</b><br>
6.to misconstrue or misinterpret, esp. deliberately; distort: to pervert someone's statement.<br><b>7.to bring to a less excellent state; vitiate; debase.<br>
8.Pathology. to change to what is unnatural or abnormal.</b><br>
9.to convert or persuade to a religious belief regarded as false or wrong.<br>
–noun<br>
10.a person who practices sexual perversion.<br>
11.Pathology. a person affected with perversion.<br>
12.a person who has been perverted, esp. to a religious belief regarded as erroneous.<br>
[Origin: 1300–50; (v.) ME perverten < L pervertere to overturn, subvert, equiv. to per- per- + vertere to turn; (n.) n. use of obs. pervert perverted]<br><br>
—Related forms<br>
per·vert·er, noun<br>
per·vert·i·ble, adjective<br>
per·vert·i·bil·i·ty, noun<br>
per·vert·i·bly, adverb<br><br>
—Synonyms 2. seduce, corrupt, demoralize. 3. divert. 4. mislead, misguide. 7. pollute, defile; impair, degrade.</td>
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Circumcision perverts the...<br><ul><li>facts</li>
<li>natural form of the penis</li>
<li>use of medicine to 'first do no harm'</li>
<li>mentality of society</li>
<li>perception of human rights</li>
<li>value & respect of children</li>
<li>sex act</li>
</ul><br>
Thoughts?<br><br>
Jen
 

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I totally agree, and the people who are pushing it are perverts, who have way too much interest in the cutting of little boys' penises. It's unhealthy and unnatural.
 

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Agreed.<br><br>
I often think about people who do the circumcisions. How do they sleep their nights? Day after day cutting screaming babies, day after day harming babies..<br><br>
How can they look in the mirror?
 

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Absolutely! It also perverts people's judgement (by seeing the mutilated penis as more attractive than a natural penis).<br><br>
love and peace. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/love.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="love">
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>trmpetplaya</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7958966"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">It also perverts people's judgement.</div>
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<br><br><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/nod.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="nod">
 

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It absolutely is. And I wonder who came up with the thought- let's cut part of a boys sex organ off. You can't tell me THEY didn't have sexual issues. And people who went along with it. It's all very sick.
 

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It makes fierce, angry warriors, imo. If that was important to your Bronze Age society, it got a toehold. Kind of a vestigial meme, though, we can get intact people to push buttons & blow stuff up (for defense purposes only, I'm no foreign interventionist) just fine. No one needs to be a berserker to win a battle anymore (and hey, they were intact, anyway <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/lol.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="lol">. I'm sure they had other painful manhood rites that worked as well. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/wink1.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="wink1">)<br><br>
You can't overestimate the kind of permanent neurological ptsd damage does to a newborn brain. It's not even considred ethical to study it in humans, yet it goes on regardless. Telling.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>momazon4</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7959489"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">It absolutely is. And I wonder who came up with the thought- let's cut part of a boys sex organ off. You can't tell me THEY didn't have sexual issues. And people who went along with it. It's all very sick.</div>
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Yep...ITA!<br><br>
It's rape of a different kind in a lot of ways...a power trip. You notice how circumcision is made common only by performing them on unconsenting infants and young children. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/gloomy.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Gloomy">: It's because grown intact men don't want to slice off the most sensitive parts of their penis.<br><br>
It's really obvious once you know what circumcision does. Sad thing is, most people I talk to in this country still don't know what exactly circumcision removes and even have the concept that it is "errogenous tissue". Seriously, people talk about it like it's clipping off a skin tag. No joke, I've heard people use THAT EXACT comparison! <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/dizzy.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Dizzy">: There is too much ignorance, and people should talk about it.<br><br>
It's one of those things that people like to stay in the closet about in this country. They don't want to talk about it....<br><br>
It's our job to talk about it, inform and educate.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>TigerTail</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7959675"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">You can't overestimate the kind of permanent neurological ptsd damage does to a newborn brain. It's not even considred ethical to study it in humans, yet it goes on regardless. Telling.</div>
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<br>
I have always wondered about this as well...it has already been proven that they are physiologically affected, and likely permanent brain alterations occur because of it.<br><br>
One thing I've wondered is if that is the reason why the men who I have known always seem to be closed off emotionally (who also happen to be circ'd). While, my father and the other two guys I've known who seemed to be more "passionate" personality wise just happen to be intact. Maybe it's just one HUGE coincidence. I don't know.
 

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The first thing I thought of when I saw the title of this thread is Ed Schoen (sp?) the doc who is so enamoured of circ, he wrote a book and composes poetry about it. Now that is perverted.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>quarteralien</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7963281"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">The first thing I thought of when I saw the title of this thread is Ed Schoen (sp?) the doc who is so enamoured of circ, he wrote a book and composes poetry about it. Now that is perverted.</div>
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<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/splat.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="splat"> eeww, how sick!!!
 

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Do we have any antropology-expert here? (I know this goes little bit OT)<br><br>
I've always been interested in why circumcision perversion only 'bloomished' in certain cultures? Why in Northern Africa? Why in Australia(natives)? Why in certain cultures in pacific?<br><br>
Why wasn't it practised among Vikings or Inuits?<br><br>
Why were some cultures obsessed by genitals? Why did they become perverted?<br>
As far as I have understood, it has been mostly a-coming-to-age-ritual? And also in some cultures a 'pity practise' - Some Aboriginals did it to sympathize with women's menstrual pains and bleedings(they did circumcision and subincision-a splitting open of the underside of the penis and the urethra).<br><br>
Was it all connected to tabus? The more sex was tabu in culture, the more likely genitals were cut? Does anyone know?<br><br>
I'm thinking of Roman&Greek cultures where sex morals were very free...same here in North among Vikings and Finno-Ugrians. Does anyone know if circumcision was practised by any native Americans?(north or south).
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>kxsiven</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7966145"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Does anyone know if circumcision was practised by any native Americans?(north or south).</div>
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I know of no tribes that circumcise. I'm Abenaki myself, and the Abenaki tribe doesn't do it.
 

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Kia, I believe that there is only one group of aboriginals in North America who practice circumcision. They live along the Yukon River, and I do not remember the name of the tribe. Come to that I do not remember where I read this. As far as I am aware , none of the inuit and none of the other "indians" are circumcised. Of course, I am sure a few have been mutilated by some pervert white doctor.
 

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Quoted by Phatchisty: "One thing I've wondered is if that is the reason why the men who I have known always seem to be closed off emotionally (who also happen to be circ'd). While, my father and the other two guys I've known who seemed to be more "passionate" personality wise just happen to be intact. Maybe it's just one HUGE coincidence. I don't know"<br><br>
Christy, I really think you are onto something here. This whole subject of how circumcision affects a person's psyche needs to be studied in great detail. I feel that a lot of questions might be answered.
 

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<a href="http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/2007-01-18/news/brown-power/" target="_blank">http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/2007-...s/brown-power/</a><br><br>
"The 1968 book Medicine in Mexico — From Aztec Herbs to Betatrons says Mexico's indigenous peoples practiced circumcision until the Spaniards arrived, at which point the uncut conquistadors "swiftly stamped out circumcision" in the Americas. "They themselves did not practice it," author Gordon Schendel wrote, "and the Catholic clergy then condemned any attention paid to genitalia as a barbaric and sinful obsession with sex. As a consequence, circumcision is not the custom today in Mexico, or in other Latin American countries."<br><br>
A friend's response (which avoids mentioning the 'Medicine in Mexico' author's pobable cultural bias, not to mention that it is badly outdated):<br><br>
"Not all the indigenous peoples of Mexico were Aztecs. And they were not monolithic. Cultures that cut were much fewer than those that did not cut. Without agreeing that the Aztecs did cut, it could be that the Spanish would have stopped it.<br><br>
The Roman Catholic Church had then and has to this day strict doctrinal prohibitions against medically unnecessary amputations of the human body; unfortunately it is all but ignored when it comes to medically unnecessary circumcisions in the US.<br><br>
And what is your source for implying there is substantial circumcision in Mexico today, and saying the Mexican's intact penis has nothing to do with giving his woman more pleasure from sex?<br><br>
(He uses the alleged 54% rate among Mexicans in the US as the basis for<br>
implying there is substantial circumcision in Mexico. Typical use of a Red<br>
Herring device. I don't believe it's even that high in the US. Despite some<br>
limited usefulness to intactivism, the Lauman article is essentially a<br>
pro-circumcision screed.)"<br><br>
Also, the Maya did not circumcise: blood-letting from the foreskin was one of their religious rituals, hard to do if you do not have a foreskin. Thanks to CAC regular Ron, who backs it up with cites. He sent them to the author of 'Ask Mexican', & hasn't heard a thing since (to the best to my knowledge). Want to guess if poor Mr Arellano was cut? <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/greensad.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="greensad">
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Nodtveidt</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7967390"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I know of no tribes that circumcise. I'm Abenaki myself, and the Abenaki tribe doesn't do it.</div>
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I have a Navajo online friend from AZ and he's intact, as are all males on the Reservation. They're all Mormons. They're strict by-the-book Mormons (arranged, anti-gay), and he's gay AND has an arranged marriage in a girl despite his social outcast status a self-outed gay 19yo.<br><br>
I have an intact Cree friend from Northern-Alberta and the mostly Native community he's from don't practice circumcision, either.<br><br>
Oddly enough, my first interaction with Aboriginals was back in grade 6 when a Native boy in my class was peeing at the urinals and I noticed he was circumcised (I don't think he looked retracted?). This was rather jarring for me and I took it as something they just do. How gladly wrong I was!
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Microsoap</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7972416"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">They're all Mormons. They're strict by-the-book Mormons (arranged, anti-gay)</div>
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<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/offtopic.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="offtopic"><br><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/headscratch.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="headscratch"> Am I understanding correctly that you're saying arranged marriage is part of being Mormon?
 

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I wonder again if sex as a tabu has something to do with cutting habbits.<br><br>
What has to go wrong with human brain that it start to accept the idea of cutting babies and children. Make it to systematical abuse and it becomes culture...<br><br>
Hey, and please. this is very interesting thread so please please please keep religion out of it!
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>kxsiven</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7976191"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Hey, and please. this is very interesting thread so please please please keep religion out of it!</div>
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Sorry, but I had just wanted to clarify that arranged marriage is not in any way shape or form a part of the Mormon/LDS religion, that's all.
 
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