Dissapointing/ infuriating visit from friend

Adaline'sMama · Nov 21, 2010

So, I have been friends with this girl for about 3 years. During this time, Ive known her to be pretty judgemental about a lot of other people's actions. Usually, I was on the same page with her and agreed with the things she found appaling or offensive. She has been traveling for the past 6 months and I havent gotten to see much of her, so I was totally excited to find out that she has settled back down into a new house in the city (an hour away) where we used to live. She is living in a house with a few roomates, including a couple who have a 4 month old.
 
I hosted an event for a non profit this weekend, and invited several of my friends. When our friends visit us from the "city" it is pretty much normal that they spend the night. Usually we have an event with the people who live here in the small town and after they all leave, my longtime friends (and people way closer to my age) stay and hang out late into the night, often drinking, playing cards, having a bonfire, ect. So, she and two other friends came to visit and spent the night.
 
During the 16 hours she was here at my house she offended with her "ideals" of parenting on multiple occasions. Ill list a few below:
 
~~She stated that plastic toys would "never, ever, be allowed" in her house, even if she "had to cut all ties with the relatives that chose to give those toys". That she would "throw them in the garbage, because no child deserves to be exposed to plastic toys" as opposed to giving them to goodwill. (This was in response to my child crying and then being pacified once given a plastic toy. I told her that we had tried the no plastic rule, but after a few months, we broke.)
 
~~She asked my why I was choosing to have DD in diapers (her roomates EC). When I explained to her that I am a WAHM: running a landscaping business, the retail business which we also live in, and being a personal chef for a couple that live 1/2 mile away. I didnt feel like I had the time to do EC the right way, and that this works for us. She went on talking to me about EC, as though I MUST not understand what it was, bc if I understood the concepts, there is no way I would make my child wear diapers.
 
~~After a good friend of mine who has a 20 month old was changing her kids diaper her child was fighting putting her pants pack on. The mom held the kid down and put her pants on her, and then said to me , "Im sorry, but its really time for us to go ".My visiting friend brought this up (after the mom had left) and said that she was offended that the mom had been so authoritarian and made her child get dressed. (the kid was fighting sleep and it was almost 9 pm, they had a 30 minute drive home. My visiting friend said that she felt like the mom was putting herself before her kid, and that that was "never ok, under any circumstances".
 
 
SO, if youve made it this far, thanks. I think its mainly thearputic to type it out. But what I want to know is, how do i tell her that I think she should keep her "parenting" advice to herself because she doesnt understand other peoples situations. I am the oldest child of 5 , and have had plenty of advice/opinions based on that, so I dont want to pull the whole "you dont know until you are acutally a parent" card, because in some ways that is not true. Id like to find a nice way to say, "I like hanging out with you, but now that you have a roomate with a baby, you are f--ing annoying and I cant really stand to hear your opinions." Thanks pass the bean dip didnt really work.
 
 
Also, I didnt really tell her that her comments offended me, does anyone think I should email/call her, or should I just let it go and make a plan for next time (dec 11).
 
TIA!! Sorry so long.
 
edited for correction

sapphire_chan · Nov 21, 2010

Your friend doesn't have kids, am I right? And I also wouldn't be surprised to find out she's younger than 25.
 
What I'd do is start responding, "I hope that works for you, however, your personal choices do not give you the right to dictate to me/anyone else what to do."
 
It's pretty sad that she's trying to give parenting advice when she doesn't even know that 23 month olds often get in moods where they'd say "NO!" to a cookie.
 
(By the way, what is "UC" in this context? EC=elimination communication and most people who do EC also use diapers. I haven't heard of a "UC" that involves not using diapers.)

2xshy · Nov 21, 2010

if there is one thing more irritating than mainstream parenting advice it's someone who has no idea about what actual parenting entails trying to teach me about AP or a more "crunchy" type of parenting.
 
her opinions sound really oppressive, i would probably tell her that.

Adaline'sMama · Nov 21, 2010

<div class="quote-container">Quote:
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by sapphire_chan <a href="/community/forum/thread/1280810/dissapointing-infuriating-visit-from-friend#post_16062381"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a> Your friend doesn't have kids, am I right? And I also wouldn't be surprised to find out she's younger than 25.
 
What I'd do is start responding, "I hope that works for you, however, your personal choices do not give you the right to dictate to me/anyone else what to do."
 
It's pretty sad that she's trying to give parenting advice when she doesn't even know that 23 month olds often get in moods where they'd say "NO!" to a cookie.
 
(By the way, what is "UC" in this context? EC=elimination communication and most people who do EC also use diapers. I haven't heard of a "UC" that involves not using diapers.)
 
 
 
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A_Random_Phrase · Nov 21, 2010

To tell you the truth I (my personality coming into play) would let it slide and just spend less and less time with her.
 
I had a friend who drove me nuts, but I never said anything to her. Finally she got pregnant with her second child and turned into a real person. What a relief!

Oceanone · Nov 21, 2010

I'd be inclined to ignore it, or give a quick "thanks for that". Hopefully when your friend does have her family she will realize how offensive she was and be mortified....

NiteNicole · Nov 21, 2010

My standard line is, "I was a perfect parent too - before I had kids" and if she doesn't like it she can learn to keep her opinions to herself.

LynnS6 · Nov 21, 2010

Send her this link:
 
<a href="http://www.bigbluewave.ca/2010/09/video-why-i-dont-have-mom-friends.html" target="_blank">http://www.bigbluewave.ca/2010/09/video-why-i-dont-have-mom-friends.html</a>

stardogs · Nov 21, 2010

Offering another perspective here, this time from someone without a child but lots of interest in birth/childrearing.

Can you just bluntly ask her if she realizes that she's being annoying? It could be that she's fascinated by all topics baby/kid right now and that's bleeding over into any interaction she has with people with children. I know that I have to mentally check my research at the door when I talk to pregnant friends or risk overwhelming them and having them thinking that I'm insane. I'm finally comfortable mentioning it casually to see if they'd like the results of my research without worrying that my offer could be misinterpreted; maybe she just needs to realize that keeping her opinions to herself would result in less grief in the long run?

FarrenSquare · Nov 21, 2010

<div class="quote-container">Quote:
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by 2xshy <a href="/community/forum/thread/1280810/dissapointing-infuriating-visit-from-friend#post_16062422"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a> 
her opinions sound really oppressive, i would probably tell her that.
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 This. I wouldn't call her or email her just to tell her, but if she ever tried to push her opinions on you again, I would just let her know.
 
I hate to say it, but you do mention that you both set up a relationship in which you passed judgments on other people, so she is honestly just continuing on with how the relationship has been established.

thefreckledmama · Nov 21, 2010

In the future, I would just brush off any other comments like those by saying something like, "oh well, you can only do the best you can, and it's up to each parent to make that determination for themselves."
 
Then just sit back until one day when she has her own kids, and you can (lovingly) recall all the preconceived ideas she had, and how different it is when you're the one making the choices.

P.J. · Nov 21, 2010

Frankly, she sounds like a total jerk. I could not and would not maintain a friendship with someone like that.
 
I did have a good friend many years ago who I had such a good time with and loved many of her qualities. But she was incredibly judgemental, and after some years I couldn't stand it anymore. It also hurt when, on a few occasions, I was under her judgey lens. Luckily, I left the country to travel and we never lived in the same city again so it was easy to break the relationship.
 
I would guess that this woman will at some point, if she hasn't already, offend other of your friends. It reflects poorly on you when you have someone like that around other friends. It leaves them like: WTH??
 
And I would pull the 'you have no experience as a parent believe me some of your ideas will change when you have your own kid' card. I was never like this woman, but I can tell you I used to have all sorts of idealistic AP ideas of what I would do, and therefore that others should do, and so many of those ideals are just not practical for whatever reasons. I had to go through the experience of becoming a mother and finding out what it's really like to manage a family in order to see what actually works for me or not. I am much more compassionate and less judgemental of other moms now that I'm on this side of the fence. Your friend simply cannot know what she'd do as a mom until she's in it. If she doesn't get that and stubbornly insists she's right and all the mothers are wrong, then I would really just dump her. Either that or set very firm limits with her, let her know in no uncertain terms when she's being judgemental and how it offends you (and others?), and if she can't rein it in then let her go.
 
Just my <img alt="2cents.gif" src="http://files.mothering.com/images/smilies//2cents.gif">

sahli29 · Nov 21, 2010

I gave ny friend of 7 advice while I was in college and watched her kid PT.
 
LOL, years later she still kids me about my advice now that I have my own kids.
 
I would let it go.An email will probably result in less to no contact from her...but if that is what you want go for it.
 
Maybe she will stick with her stuff when she has kids and maybe not. I know now to keep many things to myself and simply parent my kids my way,and let go of what others do.If they judge me constantly I cut contact and move on.

Italiamom · Nov 21, 2010

<div class="quote-container">Quote:
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by NiteNicole <a href="/community/forum/thread/1280810/dissapointing-infuriating-visit-from-friend#post_16062617"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a> My standard line is, "I was a perfect parent too - before I had kids" and if she doesn't like it she can learn to keep her opinions to herself.
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 I would almost keep this woman as a friend just to watch her eat her words once the reality of being a mother sets in (should she actually ever have her own children). I'm not sure if I would say something...
 
On another note, being around a person like this, even if you're a super confident mama, can really shake a person. From the sounds of it, you're doing a good job. Compromising on minute details (like plastic toys) doesn't make us bad mothers, or lesser mothers. It means that we are real mothers living real and complex lives. Before you do anything else, remind yourself that it's okay not to sweat the small stuff, and that you're probably doing a darn good job

mumkimum · Nov 21, 2010

<div class="quote-container">Quote:
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by Oceanone <a href="/community/forum/thread/1280810/dissapointing-infuriating-visit-from-friend#post_16062586"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a> I'd be inclined to ignore it, or give a quick "thanks for that". Hopefully when your friend does have her family she will realize how offensive she was and be mortified....
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 I'd do this too. I'd also probably take to disengaging from talking with her about parenting - so if she were to ask something like "why are you using diapers" I'd say "because I am" and just not let it go into a discussion. OR I suppose, when in the situation, 'hey, I'm a grownup too - don't tell me what I'm supposed to be doing please'.

limabean · Nov 21, 2010

<div class="quote-container">Quote:
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by Adaline'sMama <a href="/community/forum/thread/1280810/dissapointing-infuriating-visit-from-friend#post_16062356"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a> 
~~She asked my why I was choosing to have DD in diapers (her roomates EC). When I explained to her that I am a WAHM: running a landscaping business, the retail business which we also live in, and being a personal chef for a couple that live 1/2 mile away. I didnt feel like I had the time to do EC the right way, and that this works for us. She went on talking to me about EC, as though I MUST not understand what it was, bc if I understood the concepts, there is no way I would make my child wear diapers.</div>
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This part stuck out to me. One thing I never do with people like this is justify/explain my parenting decisions. Just confidently say, "Because I'm the mom and that's what I decided" with a smile. When you say it's because of your job and your lack of time and all that, it gives the impression that you agree with her that EC is the better choice, but you just aren't able to do it.

ramama · Nov 21, 2010

I'd say something along the lines of "It sounds like you've done some research and observation, and that's good. A lot of people don't think a whole heck of a lot about parenting before they're parents. But I think you should research other options as well, because I can think of an equally valid counterpoint to all the ones you've made. At the end of the day, I think it is important for mothers to support each other on this long and often difficult journey, rather than nit-picking every single parenting decision they make and how I would have done it differently." If she is interested in your counter-points, offer then. If not, at least, maybe, she'll think before criticizing in the future.

Tigerchild · Nov 22, 2010

I would share with her my experience about EVERY unkind, uncompassionate, snotty, Oh-I-NEVER! comment I ever was arrogant enough to verbalize about other parents (especially the ones I said to other people's face) coming back to bite me in the butt. Seriously. Karmic retribution sucks. I would not consider myself a friend if I didn't at least warn them that they way they were running their mouth they were likely to find they'd lodged their foot so far down their gullet their big toe was tickling their rectal sphincter.
 
That said, perhaps not everyone need to be beaten over the head with a clue by four by the Universe as I do. But. Maybe by keeping that in mind, you can keep your sense of humor. Sometimes seeing people being inexperientially arrogant can be really funny if you don't take it personally. Just be prepared to hug her a lot when she finally does have her own kid, she'll probably need it.

sapphire_chan · Nov 22, 2010

<div class="quote-container">Quote:
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by limabean <a href="/community/forum/thread/1280810/dissapointing-infuriating-visit-from-friend#post_16063306"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a> <div class="quote-container">Quote:
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by Adaline'sMama <a href="/community/forum/thread/1280810/dissapointing-infuriating-visit-from-friend#post_16062356"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a> 
~~She asked my why I was choosing to have DD in diapers (her roomates EC). When I explained to her that I am a WAHM: running a landscaping business, the retail business which we also live in, and being a personal chef for a couple that live 1/2 mile away. I didnt feel like I had the time to do EC the right way, and that this works for us. She went on talking to me about EC, as though I MUST not understand what it was, bc if I understood the concepts, there is no way I would make my child wear diapers.</div>
</div>
 

This part stuck out to me. One thing I never do with people like this is justify/explain my parenting decisions. Just confidently say, "Because I'm the mom and that's what I decided" with a smile. When you say it's because of your job and your lack of time and all that, it gives the impression that you agree with her that EC is the better choice, but you just aren't able to do it. 
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Except her friend's reaction was to keep explaining EC like she thought the OP didn't get it. "Because that's what I decided" would make the friend think she just needs to explain the other option.
 
Y'know, the more I think about that, the more I think you need to drop this friend, Adaline's Mama. She doesn't even respect you enough to believe you when you say that you do actually know and understand an idea?

limabean · Nov 22, 2010

<div class="quote-container">Quote:
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by sapphire_chan <a href="/community/forum/thread/1280810/dissapointing-infuriating-visit-from-friend#post_16064155"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a> 
Except her friend's reaction was to keep explaining EC like she thought the OP didn't get it. "Because that's what I decided" would make the friend think she just needs to explain the other option.</div>
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Even so, I just don't engage in the whole explain/justify thing. If she started to tell me what EC was I'd say, "Yes, I've read up on EC but we're happy with our decision not to use it."

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