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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I've seen several posts from moms who do not really believe that formula samples impact a mother's decision to breastfeed.<br><br>
Here are some links with more information.<br><br><br>
This book has references:<br><a href="http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=1595135" target="_blank">http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/art...?artid=1595135</a><br><br><a href="http://www.massbfc.org/factSheetOnBan.html" target="_blank">http://www.massbfc.org/factSheetOnBan.html</a><br><br><a href="http://www.massbfc.org/news/#jointLetter" target="_blank">http://www.massbfc.org/news/#jointLetter</a><br><br><a href="http://www.breastfeeding.com/reading_room/marketing.html" target="_blank">http://www.breastfeeding.com/reading...marketing.html</a><br><br><a href="http://www.mothering.com/articles/new_baby/breastfeeding/formula-profit.html" target="_blank">http://www.mothering.com/articles/ne...la-profit.html</a><br><br><a href="http://www.banthebags.org/" target="_blank">http://www.banthebags.org/</a><br><br><a href="http://banthebags.org/?p=22" target="_blank">http://banthebags.org/?p=22</a>
 

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To everyone who actual thinks the samples don't impact breastfeeding:<br><br>
DO you actually think formula companies would spend this kind of cash if the return to them wasn't 10 fold or more???? They do it because it <i>works</i>.
 

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Oh, I definitely think they impact breastfeeding rates. However, it really depends on the person they are being given to. If a formula sample alone is going to undermine their breastfeeding relationship, there's a very good chance that it was on it's way to being undermined anyhow.
 

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The only way to combat this is with one on one support, education and empowerment. We have to show each other that we do not NEED formula. Free samples or not, formula is so easy to obtain. It irritates me that you can now buy it in the 'baby aisles'. Once upon a time, it was in the pharmacy section where it belonged.
 

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ooh, this reminds me, from today's NYTimes:<br><a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/13/opinion/nyregionopinions/13CIzajfe.html" target="_blank">http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/13/op...13CIzajfe.html</a><br><br>
She says hospitals aren't being "mom-friendly" when they ban samples!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>pumpkinhead</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/8110548"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Oh, I definitely think they impact breastfeeding rates. However, it really depends on the person they are being given to. If a formula sample is going to undermine their breastfeeding relationship, there's a very good chance that it was on it's way to being undermined anyhow.</div>
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I disagree because I have been there. I was devestated when I lost my milk supply the first time around. I wanted to bf, my mom did it, I thought it was just what you did. I had no idea the formula supplements my hcp's gave and recommended would cause problems. I trusted my doctors and nurses. I was wrong. But I grieved when my milk supply was destroyed.
 

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I live in Scotland where samples of formula are not allowed. Except for "follow on milks" there is no advertising of formula at all on TV or in magazines. Shops are not allowed to sell formula at reduced prices, and in places where you can collect loyalty points on the things you buy formula is excluded. In every doctors surgery there are breastfeeding posters, leaflets and information. One whole session of the free NHS antenatal classes is dedicated to breastfeeding. Breastfeeding is even advertised on TV. But we still have one of the lowest rates of breastfeeding in Europe. Something pathetic like only 30% of babies are breastfed at 6 weeks old. And I don't know if that includes babies who are getting both formula and breastmilk.<br><br>
So here free samples and advertising junk from formula companies aren't affecting breastfeeding rates, but something seriously is.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>pumpkinhead</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/8110548"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Oh, I definitely think they impact breastfeeding rates. However, it really depends on the person they are being given to. If a formula sample is going to undermine their breastfeeding relationship, there's a very good chance that it was on it's way to being undermined anyhow.</div>
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<br>
so formula samples only undermine weak minded people who were going to give up eventually anyhow?
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>pumpkinhead</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/8110548"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Oh, I definitely think they impact breastfeeding rates. However, it really depends on the person they are being given to. If a formula sample is going to undermine their breastfeeding relationship, <b>there's a very good chance that it was on it's way to being undermined anyhow</b>.</div>
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But aren't those the vulnerable relationships we, as a society, need to work hardest at to preserve? You're right die hards will BF no matter what. It's those who live on the margins, who might work outside the home, who have marginal supplies, whose DPs and parents and inlaws denigrate their efforts.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>sarah0404</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/8111001"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I live in Scotland where samples of formula are not allowed. Except for "follow on milks" there is no advertising of formula at all on TV or in magazines. Shops are not allowed to sell formula at reduced prices, and in places where you can collect loyalty points on the things you buy formula is excluded. In every doctors surgery there are breastfeeding posters, leaflets and information. One whole session of the free NHS antenatal classes is dedicated to breastfeeding. Breastfeeding is even advertised on TV. But we still have one of the lowest rates of breastfeeding in Europe. Something pathetic like only 30% of babies are breastfed at 6 weeks old. And I don't know if that includes babies who are getting both formula and breastmilk.<br><br>
So here free samples and advertising junk from formula companies aren't affecting breastfeeding rates, but something seriously is.</div>
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Scotland's rates are rising, and it is being accredited to the baby friendly intiative:<br><br><a href="http://www.babyfriendly.org.uk/items/item_detail.asp?item=57" target="_blank">http://www.babyfriendly.org.uk/items...il.asp?item=57</a><br><br>
Now that was from 2005 but I have read other items on the issue as well which seem to say the same thing.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>inchijen</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/8111033"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">so formula samples only undermine weak minded people who were going to give up eventually anyhow?</div>
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With respect, who said anything about anyone being weakminded? I certianly did not.<br><br>
Formula undermines the undersupported.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>MaryJaneLouise</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/8111034"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">But aren't those the vulnerable relationships we, as a society, need to work hardest at to preserve? You're right die hards will BF no matter what. It's those who live on the margins, who might work outside the home, who have marginal supplies, whose DPs and parents and inlaws denigrate their efforts.</div>
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And these are the people who need our support the most! I challenge that if a mother is given enough help and support even a free life time supply of formula wouldn't deter most.
 

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Like I said before, free formula does undermine breastfeeding relatioship, but not on its own. It's our whole bottle feeding culture and anti-NIP attitudes that do this. Free formula is only a symptom of the disease.
 

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I think cigarette advertisments are a symptom of a problem as well. I believe a lot teen smoking is rooted in other problems. If we fixed those problems, advertisment of cigarettes to kids wouldn't be an issue. However, I realize that fixcing the bigger problem is going to take a while, and, in the mean time, we gotta get rid of the advertisment.<br><br>
I think the same way with formula. The advertisement might mean squat once we are successful in getting more support and education in place. But in the mean time it's gotta be curbed back a little.
 

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nak Well, I can tell you that the only reason I personally didn't use formula was due to the post partum support i recieved with my first. I didn't get any free formula, but I sent Dennis to the drug store a 2 am for a can when Jacob was 8 days old. Before I mixed it up, I got out the bf manual I was given at dyscharge and realized it was probably just a growth spurt. I called public health in the morning, they came to my house, weighed<br>
jacob (he'd gained a pound <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/lol.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="lol">) , observed a feeding and reassured me that I didn't need the formula and I was doing great. That was what kept me from undermining my own bf relationship.
 

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Not everyone is 100% set on breastfeeding like some of us are. There are many women who want to, but get free formula and then begin the downward spiral into weaning. Yet many of these women, if they did not have that free formula to give on those nights when all they want to do is sleep, they may have gone on to nurse for many months once they got over the initial hurdles.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>AlexisT</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/8110691"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">ooh, this reminds me, from today's NYTimes:<br><a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/13/opinion/nyregionopinions/13CIzajfe.html" target="_blank">http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/13/op...13CIzajfe.html</a><br><br>
She says hospitals aren't being "mom-friendly" when they ban samples!!</div>
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*blood boils*<br>
Her milk didn't come in until Day 4? Why don't people actually do their research before writing stuff like this, it's bad enough that people think they are meant to have a full on milk supply right away and if they don't they need formula....Jeez.. Pregnant women reading this are going to think "I'd better go and buy some formula in case my milk isn't in right away"
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>pumpkinhead</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/8111101"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">With respect, who said anything about anyone being weakminded? I certianly did not.<br><br>
Formula undermines the undersupported.</div>
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I said weak minded. When you said "it depends on the PERSON you give it to" i thought you were saying certain people, not situations, were susceptible.<br><br>
formula undermines more than just the undersupported.<br><br>
My friend was 100 % determined to bf. She knew all the info, she had about 5 bfing mommas to call, a partner at home to help, LLL contacts she had spoken to and visited. Then on a sleepless night, she was nursing every hour on the hour....she realized she had a can of formula from the hospital, wanted sleep. Woke her partner up and said "make her a bottle im going to bed". They had bottles from a pump kit. It happened.<br>
then they realized it was "easier" to just give a bottle sometimes and that a formula full baby = four hours sleeping baby.<br>
Baby at 4 months- no bm.<br><br>
it happens in ALL situations. no one should presume to know when formula undermines situations.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>carriebft</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/8111044"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Scotland's rates are rising, and it is being accredited to the baby friendly intiative:<br><br><a href="http://www.babyfriendly.org.uk/items/item_detail.asp?item=57" target="_blank">http://www.babyfriendly.org.uk/items...il.asp?item=57</a><br><br>
Now that was from 2005 but I have read other items on the issue as well which seem to say the same thing.</div>
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I also suspect funding. The NHS in Scotland is better funded than the NHS in England and Wales, where hospital cutbacks have hit breastfeeding support.<br><br>
My hospital is theoretically committed to baby-friendly, but in practice? Not great.
 

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<div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>inchijen</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/8111433"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">it happens in ALL situations. no one should presume to know when formula undermines situations.</div>
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I respectfully disagree that it happens in all situations. And I guess by that same token then no one should presume to know when formula does not undermine a situation.
 
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