[jacksmama]

I'm having a conflict within myself and I need to hear others thoughts and opinions other than dh.

Ds will be 11 mos in a week. He is still not crawling. He isn't even getting on all fours. He is, however, reaching for things, can pivot on his butt, can roll from tummy to back and he's physically strong.

I mentioned to my ped that I was concerned he wasn't crawling. She said that she thought it was still in the range of normal but referred us to a physical therapist for an assessment - just for the heck of it. We brought ds in. The PT said that ds was perfectly normal and very strong, great muscle tone and fine motor, but that he did need work on some gross motor stuff, mostly being shown how to move into "mobile positions" ie: how to get from a sitting position to a belly position (when they lunge forward and end up in a crawling position), how to get from lying down to sitting up etc. She said that he was not getting himself into position for mobility. I was told I should work with him every day, showing him how to do these things. Her sense was that ds is a laid back guy and that he doesn't do for himself, in part, because I do for him.

Here's why I'm writing. Ds hates tummy time. He can lunge forward and end up on his tummy, but he gets pretty distressed. I've been told by dh and others that I should allow him to become a little more frustrated with his surroundings, to make him motivated to move. Part of me feels they might be right, but I don't listen to them all the same. The PT seemed to agree with them. She said that ds wants to move and seems like he's just so eager to explore; if I work with him the first two weeks will be tough for him but that in the end it will be better. She said crawling is important and that ds would be less frustrated if he could crawl. During the PT session he cried most of the time. I steeled my heart and distanced myself a bit from my emotions -- because if I picked him up it would have ruined the session. He had tears streaming down his little face while they worked with him and he was screaming, "Mamamamama" while looking at me.

That night ds had a horrible night. I had to walk the house with him and rub his back, singing. I heard myself say to him..."I know, you've had a rough day." Part of it is teething but that night as I was lying in bed, next to ds, I also sensed that he was freaked out from crying. The PT is not a monster. She struck me as a healthy, smart, kind person who really had the best interests of my ds in mind.

So here I am, it's 1:30 am and I wondering...What the heck am I doing to my ds? I know that anytime I find myself distancing myself from my feelings about my son (ie: blocking out his signals, like crying or fussing) - that is exactly the time to reassess and re-prioritize! Can it be that there is such a thing as constructive crying? We have an appt next week and PT wants to see us every week for the next few months. Part of me wants to see ds succeed and move. But the other part of says, "Jiminy Cricket, this all bull

." I'm just wondering what your thoughts are on this.

 

[flminivanmama]

is she making the sessions fun for him? we went through a few PTs - first one was okay but then we switched insurances... first one we got with the new provider was horrible - the boys (I have preemie twins) cried all the time. we switched right away and got an amazing PT but then she left the agency. the replacement was pretty bad so we switched to go to Easter Seals where the great PT had gone LOL

I think when you find the right one you'll know. if you are not happy again after the next session I say try another PT. is it in your home or a center? does she work with him with you there? or take him alone?

 

[jacksmama]

Those are all good questions! She tries to make the sessions fun. There are actually two PTs. One is a student and the other is the actual PT. Both take out toys, try distraction and try to make this fun for ds. The therapy practice is in a center - they practice pediatric pt only - so they have lots of toys and mats, etc. They work with me there. They said the prefer the parents to be there and encouraged my dh to come as well.

I think your advice is good..to give it another session and then listen to my gut and to ds. I do think ds does really need some help getting moving - so I don't want to just knee-jerk, pick him up and run.

Thanks for reading my looong post. Sometimes you just need to feel heard by someone who parents similarly, KWIM?

 

[flminivanmama]

oh yes I know! I'm glad I caught the post - I never go into this forum but my four year old was snoring loudly in my ear last night and I got up at 3:30 am and couldn't go back to sleep

anyway it's good that you are in there and if you practice with him between sessions it will be even better. as he gets used to her it should get better too - this is all new to him! but do go with your gut - if he hates it next week either reevaluate the situation or try to find a new PT

 

[Erin Pavlina]

We just took our son, 10 months old, to a PT yesterday for his first appointment.

He has gross motor delays similar to what you describe. He does not crawl, doesn't roll over (though he can get onto his side very easily) and he doesn't bear weight on his legs or arms.

Our PT was a young woman and she was extremely friendly and caring. When my son started to fuss she backed off what she was doing. And one time when he started crying she told me to hold him until he was feeling better. I never once felt like she would let him cry or fuss much. And I really appreciated that.

I understand why they want you to put him on his tummy and let him be a little frustrated. I was doing a bit too much for him too. But in the last month or two I realized (with DH's help) that frustration is a part of learning. So I started letting him fuss a little on his tummy, but I was right there rubbing his back, singing to him, making it fun, putting toys in front of him, etc and he warmed up to the whole tummy time procedure in a just a few days! REally... it was amazing. Now he doesn't mind tummy time.

So, my point is.. yes, it's frustrating for them, but you don't have to make it devastating... you dont' have to ignore the cries, just do gentle little periods that last 30 seconds, then move up to a minute, and so on until you can put your baby on his tummy and he likes it.

I do think it's important to their development to get them going in all sort of positions.

I think you should find a different PT though. One who is more friendly. Sounds like the one you went to was more interested in getting the job done than helping and being kind in the process.

Anyway, I hope I was helpful. We are going through the exact same thing right now. It's strange and new for us.

 

[jacksmama]

flminivanmama & Erin: Thanks for your responses. I was thinking of giving up working with him - but have now decided to keep at it. As I said before, in my heart, I really know that he needs to do this. I just need to make sure this particular PT is the right one to help us. It may be something as simple as ds getting used to her or we may have to change PT's. I feel fortunate to have insurance so there are more options for us, in terms of changing therapists or practices. We'll see next week. I'll see how ds does. Although I am going to be a little more communicative to the PT that ds needs to re-group often. I must be more vigilant with my ds's needs...I am the mama after all. I was just so overwhelmed at that first visit. Sometimes I am amazed at how sheep-like I get around doctors or medical personnel. I guess I've been trained to obey so very well.

I can't afford to be like that when it comes to my little boy!

Erin: This all does take some getting used to. I know that I fluctuate between being worried about ds and telling myself that it's OK to accept ds excactly where he is. And that no matter if this is something temporary or something that we will have to work with long term - that I will, of course, love him just as much as I do right now. So nothing changes. All the same I do let my head spin!

 

[clynnr]

Hi there!

I have a little bit of experience in the field of PT/OT/ST (I am NOT an expert by any means), and I just wanted to share a few thoughts.

The first one is that it can be fun, and a good PT will make it fun! Just because he's learning how to crawl doesn't mean that all you do is crawl from one end of the room to the other. Crawl towards a favorite toy, crawl to music, make up songs about crawling, crawl on the kitchen floor filled with shaving cream--whatever your ds likes, use it--and tell the PT about it! If she's good, she'll want to know about his likes/dislikes.

Second, for me it has always helped if everyone else in the room is doing the same thing as your child. Then he doesn't feel so alone and stared at! For example, I worked with a little boy and took him to therapy. When it was time to practice jumping, we all jumped! We took turns, we played games, etc. When it was time to go on the swing, we all got on the swing! (which is quite funny if you imagine 2-3 adults and one small child on a little therapy swing

)

Third, it might help if you "go" first. With the little boy (who was 3-4yo BTW) I had to go on the swing first. I had to put my feet in the shaving cream first. I had to jump on the dots first. Once he saw that I was okay and liked what I was doing, he would try it.

Last, your ds will pick up your attitude. If you aren't sure, he won't be sure. If you don't like what's going on, he won't like what's going on. If you stay upbeat and positive, he will be too! Basically, you have to be very involved in the actual therapy. Don't sit back and watch the PT, get in and do it too! If she is doing something, learn how to do it so you can practice at home. The more involved you are, the easier it will be for your ds.

Please keep in mind I don't have any kids yet (I'm a mama-to-be!) but I have spent a lot of time working with children in therapy, and these are just my observations. Take them with a grain of salt. (which I'm sure you will)

You have to go with your gut, because you know your child better than me or any PT.

 

[Erin Pavlina]

Jacksmama: Yes, I started out being very upset, then I calmed down. My pediatrician was talking brain damage, MRIs, "he may never walk", etc. I had to just give it all time to sink in and realized that we don't know anything right now. It could be nothing, it could be brain damage.

But I kinda said to myself... "He can smile, he can laugh. As long as he can do that, he will have a great life."

I'm already seeing good things. He's putting some weight on his legs now. He wasn't doing that at all a week ago.

 

[mommymoose]

hi all,
I couldn't resist replying to this thread from "the other side".... I am a physical therapist myslef in early intervention, and i wanted to make sure you checking into that program in your state. I am almost positive that it is provided in every state, at either low or no cost to parents, and is In home, family centered... I have worked with many babies, many of whome may cry in the PT session, becasue of the new person, unfamiliar surroundings (if not in your home), and general flow of the session. yes, it should be fun, but as long as I can teach a family to casually elicit certain skills, such as crawling, i dont force a child to do it while i am there-- actually, most kids do better during the week or weeks while i am away. So, Don't give up, but don't feel like you have to let your babe cry the whole time. You have every right to ask your therapist to just teach you different ways to try this at home, and to not stress the little one out. Torticollis (tight neck muscles ) is a different situation, adn the baby will cry at first, but it is just becasue babies hate to be stretched!! anyway, Tummy time can be as short as a few seconds at first, and built up in time. if a baby learns to hate tummy time, they will be so much harder to teach to crawl, etc... Try sitting in a semi reclining position and putting baby on your chest, sort of semi-tummy time. Also, play with him or her on your lap, helping them to move from position to position.... You know you are most comforting to them!! PT does not have to stand for pain and torture, which is often how parents feel after leaving a tough session.... I'm excited about becoming a parent (33 weeks down....) so i can's yet speak from experience int hat dept. but i do know that babies who crawl at 11 months or those who crawl at 11.5 months are not dramatically different, so try to lay back a little and trust that it will happen. if your doc doesn't see any major red flags, dont stress, babies can feel stress and will be more upset if you let them know it upsets you that they aren't doing it "as the books say'.... the best advice i can give is to have fun playing with them, and before youknow it, they'll be on the move!!! hope that helps....

Holly

 

[chrfath]

I am going to share from a slightly different point of view too.

Our DD has services/therapy through Early intervention - she has Down syndrome. She is doing all that your son is doing but is 14 months old. We have therapists come to the house. She is a bit unhappy - wimpering with the strangers interacting sometimes. But she bounces back quickly. It is because she is doing something new with a stranger too.

If she is screaming we absolutely stop.

My two cents - if your Dr doesn't see any real problem and he is okay otherwise I would just take it easy. Like everyone tells me with Veronica and her delays in moving - You never see an adult with Down syndrome crawling or in a wheel chair. Everyone has their own schedule/time table for development. That is why there is such a wide spread for skills on developmental charts.

Sorry for yammering on. I have been thinking about you guys and just wanted to share.

 

[sea island mama]

I don't want to tell you not to continue the PT, but if it doesn't get any better I would hold off for a while. A friend of dd's (almost 4) never crawled. She just sat there until, at 14 mo, she got up & walked! She is a pretty normal kid. If your ds seems strong (not floppy), I wouldn't worry too much for a while yet.
Also, he might not be a "crawler". My kids are both "scooters". They hated tummy time & once they started sitting up, they never looked back. They scoot(ed) on their bums instead of crawling.

 

[jacksmama]

I'm sorry it took me so long to reply. For some reason this June has been one non stop activity. Just last month I had NO LIFE and suddenly I'm overbooked! I've sat down twice to write back but then ds wakes from nap or phone or doorbell rings... etc.

Well, I did bring ds to one more PT shortly after I last posted. I decided to give it a shot and see what happens. He cried off and on through out the whole thing. We did take rests and I picked him up and held him when he started getting really upset. Still, though, by the end of the hour he and I were spent. The amazing thing is that when we got home within 24 hours he was actually putting into practice all the things the therapist had worked with him on. He didn't seem to be paying attention to what PT was doing during the session as he was either busy playing or being upset. I guess he just absorbed it? Anyway, it was amazing! He would position himself in the exact same ways she put him in. He's so little, I had no idea babies could learn things like that. Then six days after his session...he was sitting on the floor asking me to come get him (Mamamama!) and I said, "Well, come here. You can do it!" and he just started crawling toward me. I almost fainted right there. Now it wasn't the prettiest crawl you've ever seen, but we're not looking for anything grand - movement of any kind is great!

Then PT calls to let us know she just had a home visit slot open and did we want to take the slot. YES! On the 3rd session it was muuuuch better than the first two. There were a few times that he cried. I did pick him up and comforted him when he crossed from just crying from being in a new position, to being really upset and needing me. But overall, the session went so much better. Ds was more comfortable and so was I. I found myself really participating in the therapy. I was also better able to quietly step in to comfort ds when needed, because I was directly part of about 65% of the therapy. That played a huge part in making ds comfortable.

We still have a short way to go to get ds to a strong gross motor level, but I am seeing such improvement. I also see that he is so delighted at moving. I'm joyed by his joy. He's doing this weird one legged crawl thing all over the house now. It's so funny! Now my next issue is...keeping him OUT of the dog's water dish. That seems to be his newest fascination!

Thank you all for your support, comments and opinions. I was really upset when I posted. I read each reply and really considered all your advice. I'm sort of out here on my own in real life and I value your voices!

 

[flminivanmama]

that's great!!

 

[neveryoumindthere]

sorry to steal the thread, this is OT :Erin have they given u any new info on ur ds?
the way u describe him sounds like my dd. when u get a chance would u PM me?
thanks

 

[Erin Pavlina]

Neveryoumindthere (and anyone else interested in an update)

Our son is doing a lot better. The PT is awesome. She's gotten him to the point of being able to stand with just us holding him for balance but not weight. This is huge for him.

I also put him in his bed the other night and a few minutes later heard him crying frantically. Went in to find him on his tummy! Must have shocked the heck out of him. So we know he is capable of rolling over.

He's so proud of his little self when he stands up. It's just precious! I can't wait until the day I see him do this all on his own.

 

[ILuvMyBaby]

My son has a problem that has to be corrected by 15 months at the absolute latest. We have physical therapy in our house two days a week. During the sessions sometimes he cries or fusses, but I know it is not a painful cry, it is more like a dont touch me or this is uncomfortable cry. Honestly, I feel horrible, but I know he needs it and he is not responding to other therapies. You can always try a different therapist and see what they think.