[agentofchaos]

I didn't so much run away from the other post as realize that my question would probably always be considered disingenuous.

It wasn't. I was actually curious about -exactly- what I asked about.

My skin's certainly not tough enough to participate in that forum, but I thought I could handle asking a honestly-meant, straightforward question, but it appears that if you're a vaccine supporter honest questions are not seen as such. I dislike that, but hey, it's the mood of the community, and it's not really my place to argue for changing it just because it doesn't suit me.

Anyway, I'm not as big a coward as I seem, but I don't particularly like getting "called out" so to speak for daring to ask a question.

So. Posting this here, to kind of defend myself, without having to dive back into the shark tank.

 

[mamabear0314]

I didn't so much run away from the other post as realize that my question would probably always be considered disingenuous.

It wasn't. I was actually curious about -exactly- what I asked about.

My skin's certainly not tough enough to participate in that forum, but I thought I could handle asking a honestly-meant, straightforward question, but it appears that if you're a vaccine supporter honest questions are not seen as such. I dislike that, but hey, it's the mood of the community, and it's not really my place to argue for changing it just because it doesn't suit me.

Anyway, I'm not as big a coward as I seem, but I don't particularly like getting "called out" so to speak for daring to ask a question.

So. Posting this here, to kind of defend myself, without having to dive back into the shark tank.

I rarely post in the main forum for the same reason. What happened to you always happens. You say something and they will pick a couple words to focus on or change the focus completely or accuse you of ulterior motives. Some people will never ever go with mainstream medicine, even if a vaccine is totally safe and effective. If you delay or don't do every vaccine you can also post on the sel/del forum which is where I post mostly because it has more traffic.

 

[agentofchaos]

I don't have kids at this point (life has a way of throwing you curveballs), but I am an LC and work with moms and babies on a daily basis, which means I need to make sure I am both current on this stuff, and understand all POV.

I'm kind of sad. I figured if I phrased it carefully enough, I could get some honest discussion about something that's really confused me. I DON'T think that it's that out there a question. I don't think it's that complicated, either. I don't believe you have to know every element of a debate to answer something as simple as "how good would be good enough? How bad would be bad enough?"

Anyway, it is what it is, but I did want to say I was only running away because I was a bit surprised. Which is odd, considering how long I've been lurking. It should have been expected.

 

[Jessica765]

I didn't so much run away from the other post as realize that my question would probably always be considered disingenuous.

It wasn't. I was actually curious about -exactly- what I asked about.

My skin's certainly not tough enough to participate in that forum, but I thought I could handle asking a honestly-meant, straightforward question, but it appears that if you're a vaccine supporter honest questions are not seen as such. I dislike that, but hey, it's the mood of the community, and it's not really my place to argue for changing it just because it doesn't suit me.

Anyway, I'm not as big a coward as I seem, but I don't particularly like getting "called out" so to speak for daring to ask a question.

So. Posting this here, to kind of defend myself, without having to dive back into the shark tank.

It was a good question, and you are not a coward. I quit the main forum cold turkey at the end of July. I enjoyed the debate part of it, and I love to talk science, and I think I have a thick skin for discussing issues. But the overall vibe just seemed so personal and negative, with the call-outs directed toward specific posters or groups of posters, and the bumping of threads, and the frequent straw men arguments generalizations about "pro-vaxxers" and "the pro-vax position," and the constant sarcasm.

It's not that it was everyone, and not that I never participated in the negative behavior, but it was just a toxic environment for me, especially being in the small minority. I wish it were otherwise, because many people there are interesting to have discussions with, but oh well. I have much admiration for those pro-vaxxers who stick it out.

As to your main question in the forum, my impression is that efficacy isn't a motivating factor for most people who don't vaccinate--it's usually just an extra argument tacked on to criticize vaccines or policies related to vaccines. But I could be wrong.

 

[sciencemum]

Yeah I don't blame you either. I've posted before - on that board I could comment on how cute kittens are and several no vaxers would disagree with me.

I have a couple people blocked as they've been so toxic in the past.

I agree the bumping and sarcasm is getting annoying lately.

Honestly I'm not sure why I stick it out. Probably better for me to quit too.

I'd love this board to be more active. I get a sense of a lot of provax mums around, just not interested in engaging with no vaxers. I though it was a real shame when mdc decided to split this group off from the delayed and selective group.

 

[agentofchaos]

....wow. I didn't realize things posted on this forum were fair game over there too.

This is not s place I want to participate in, but since there is good info I'm not done lurking. But I know better than to post now.

For the record, I didn't want to know why people don't vaccinste I'm aware of those reasons. I literally wanted to know how effective s vaccine would have to be before it was acceptable.

S couple people answered that question so overall I'm content..

 

[mamabear0314]

Who's the mod for this board?

 

[teacozy]

Welcome to MDC! Sorry to hear you don't want to stick around (not that I blame you) since I'd love for there to be more of a pro-vaccine presence for people lurking and wanting information (unfortunately, a lot of misinformation gets posted there without rebuttal because there simply isn't time to respond to everything with the balance of pro to non vaccinating posters being so off there ) . I think there are a lot more "crunchy" pro-vaccine moms here than people think!

The discussion board can get pretty nasty as I'm sure you're more than aware if you've lurked

As general advice for pro-vax lurkers who may be wanting to post, you'll typically have better luck stating your intentions right off the bat before asking questions. Just since I've been here, there have been several cases where someone "just asking questions" later turned around and wrote nasty articles, blog posts, etc even specifically naming the non-vaccine posters in them. Fairly recently, for example, someone wrote an allegedly (haven't actually read it myself) not very nice college paper about non-vaxers and the members here were specifically mentioned and named and the paper was posted online. I think the person who wrote it had also been asking questions on the discussion board if I remember correctly. Point is, they are going to be suspicious of any new pro-vaxer posting "just questions" because of these past experiences. I think if you had said something like "Hi! I'm a lactation consultant and want to ask some questions so I can better understand the point of view of some of the moms I work with. This is not for any kind of article, paper, blog, or study. I hope you can help!" the responses may have been a bit less suspicious in nature.

Having said all that, I don't think any of us would be too happy with one of the non-vaccinating members starting a thread talking specifically about the pro-vaccine members here or their posting behavior in a forum where we couldn't defend ourselves or respond. Well it would bug me at least I'm not trying to attack or criticize anyone here, just trying to put myself in their position.

Maybe it could make for an interesting topic : What should the support forums be there for?

Anyway, sorry to hear you don't plan on posting in the discussion section, but hope you feel you can still contribute and post here in the vaccinating on schedule section at least!

 

[teacozy]

It was a good question, and you are not a coward. I quit the main forum cold turkey at the end of July. I enjoyed the debate part of it, and I love to talk science, and I think I have a thick skin for discussing issues.

Miss your contributions over on the discussion board Hope you come back!

 

[Jessica765]

Miss your contributions over on the discussion board Hope you come back!

Thanks! It seems unlikely, but I won't say it will never happen.

I hope you and @prosciencemum stick around there for a long time, and I hope someday you're joined by lots of others.

As to the question of whether it's appropriate here to discuss things from the main forum here: I think it's fair to discuss topics, or to discuss issues/frustrations with the forum in general, but it's probably not fair to mention specific names or reference specific posts. If non-vaxxers want to hang out in INV complaining about pro-vax posters' behavior generally, I don't know, and I don't care. (Though as the number of pro-vax posters gets smaller, there ceases to be much difference between talking bout "pro-vax posters" and talking about specific posters specifically.)

 

[Jessica765]

I'd love this board to be more active. I get a sense of a lot of provax mums around, just not interested in engaging with no vaxers. I though it was a real shame when mdc decided to split this group off from the delayed and selective group.

I didn't know they used to be together. That definitely sounds more interesting. I think when you restrict a forum to people purely vaccinating on schedule, talking to other people purely vaccinating on schedule, it's hard to find enough topics to keep the forum really active.

ETA: There's a thread in S/D about FluMist vs. the flu shot. I'm making that decision this week, but I can't participate in that thread. Frustrating.

 

[mamabear0314]

I post in both forums, I admit it would be easier if it was one big forum for sel/del + vos.

 

[sciencemum]

There's some discussion of the change buried on the board - if you can find it. I opposed it at the time, but c'est la vie!

Just wanted to make a shout out to what I think are some amazing posts (and patience) from @pers on the main board right now.

 

[Dakotacakes]

I also have pulled back because of the personal nature. I answered a hypothetical question and was repeatedly attacked and interrogated over it and just pulled back. I will post from time to time but it is clear that my thought are not respected, so there just doesn't seem to be a reason.

I do worry that the strength of the non=vaccinating parent may scare some people away from gentle parenting in general. Because it seems that gentle parenting is so strongly associated with not vaccinating. Not just online but in real life parenting groups. The sad thing is that it only takes one or two and it completely takes over the vibe of an entire group.