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<p>Hello :)</p>
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<p>I'm a very recently joined member here, but having been trawling through pages upon pages of the UC part of this forum.</p>
<p>Anyhow, I stumbled upon a thread where someone mentioned Lobelia being unsafe during pregnancy. I have been intending to take Dr Christrophers PreNatal Formula from 34 weeks onwards, and this contains Lobelia. So I was wanting to ask, has anyone here had any experience taking this formula?</p>
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<p>Thank you!</p>
 

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<p>I cannot say directly for the formula you are speaking of, but I can talk about lobelia.  The reason for caution during pregnancy is the same for black and blue cohosh.  Lobelia acts as a relaxant to smooth muscle and is good for use in preparing a rigid cervix, uterus, or perineum, when dosed correctly.  When too little is given it can cause a stimulating effect-causing contractions possibly.  According to Susan Weed's 'Wise Woman Herbal for the Childbearing Year' lobelia can also cause burning of the throat and nausea depending upon dosage and your personal reaction to it.  My guess is that it is used in the formula as a preparatory tonic.  Using it in the last 6 weeks of pregnancy is different than using it in the first, second or early third trimesters.  Many herbal tinctures intended for use in the last 4-6 weeks of pregnancy contain herbs that are contraindicted for use in other times during pregnancy.  Susan Weed has a great website with tons of information and a forum to ask questions on.  Good luck</p>
 

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Discussion Starter #4
<p>Thank you for your replies :)</p>
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<p>I thought I might just add the link about the post I was talking about. It was post number #4</p>
<p><a href="http://www.mothering.com/community/forum/thread/1081052/lobelia-and-placenta-out">http://www.mothering.com/community/forum/thread/1081052/lobelia-and-placenta-out</a></p>
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<p>Although, after doing some reading, it seems very common for babies to have rolling eyes. I don't know. It's doesn't seem uncommon to use lobelia for labour,</p>
 

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Discussion Starter #5
<p>Hey Mamatoabunch, do you mind if I ask. What were your births like? Like what gestation did you birth at, how quick were they, how were the babies after the birth, how was your recovery?</p>
 

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<p>I took it from 35 or 36 weeks on with my 1st babe.  She was born at 40w 3d and it was a pretty easy birth and my labor was about 10 hrs.  I forgot about it this time around and just found a bottle in the medicine cabinet when I was 38 weeks.  I took it for about a week and then had my baby at 39w 4d.  It was a ridiculously easy birth :) with about 2-3 hrs of labor.</p>
 

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<br><br><div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Eloisa</strong> <a href="/community/forum/thread/1281930/dr-christophers-prenatal-formula#post_16080885"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a><br><br><p>Hey Mamatoabunch, do you mind if I ask. What were your births like? Like what gestation did you birth at, how quick were they, how were the babies after the birth, how was your recovery?</p>
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<br><br><p>Third, first labor really, VBAC, 24 hours. Baby born at 39 and 4 days, easy labor, baby was alert after birth, nursed well. Little blood loss, easy recovery.</p>
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<p>Fourth, water broke, 3 hours 45 min labor, 39 weeks, easy labor, easy recovery, baby alert and nursing well after birth, little blood loss.</p>
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<p>Fifth, 3 hours 45 min labor, 39 and 5 days, longest gestation. Easy labor, water broke pushing. Little blood loss, alert baby, nursing well, easy recovery. </p>
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<p>Sixth, 3 hours 45 min labor, 38 and 6. Easy labor, water broke just before pushing. Easy labor, easy recovery, little blood loss.</p>
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<p>Seventh, 12ish hours or more. 37 even. Discovered water broke at 7am, maybe it broke earlier in the night. Little contraxs through the day, maybe every 10 minutes. Labor kicked in later in the day, hard pushing, baby took a long time to come down w/ desire to push. Very alert baby, best nurser, more blood loss.</p>
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<p>Eighth, 2 hours, 39 weeks. Dh barely made it home. Easy labor, easy birth. Water broke upon desire to push. Little blood loss. Pain in back after birth from hard pushing desire, went away the next day. Alert baby, good nurser.</p>
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<p>Ninth, 4 hours, 39 weeks. Biggest baby, moved posterior just before birth. Harder pushing stage. Easy recovery, little blood loss. Very alert baby.</p>
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<p>Tenth, painless contraxs started after possible water leak. Started becoming uncomfortable around 5am, baby born after 8am. Easiest birth, little blood loss, alert baby, good nurser.</p>
 

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<br><br><div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Mamatoabunch</strong> <a href="/community/forum/thread/1281930/dr-christophers-prenatal-formula#post_16083157"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a><br><br><br><br><div class="quote-container"><span>Quote:</span>
<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Eloisa</strong> <a href="/community/forum/thread/1281930/dr-christophers-prenatal-formula#post_16080885"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a><br><br><p>Hey Mamatoabunch, do you mind if I ask. What were your births like? Like what gestation did you birth at, how quick were they, how were the babies after the birth, how was your recovery?</p>
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<br><br><p>Third, first labor really, VBAC, 24 hours. Baby born at 39 and 4 days, easy labor, baby was alert after birth, nursed well. Little blood loss, easy recovery.</p>
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<p>Fourth, water broke, 3 hours 45 min labor, 39 weeks, easy labor, easy recovery, baby alert and nursing well after birth, little blood loss.</p>
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<p>Fifth, 3 hours 45 min labor, 39 and 5 days, longest gestation. Easy labor, water broke pushing. Little blood loss, alert baby, nursing well, easy recovery. </p>
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<p>Sixth, 3 hours 45 min labor, 38 and 6. Easy labor, water broke just before pushing. Easy labor, easy recovery, little blood loss.</p>
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<p>Seventh, 12ish hours or more. 37 even. Discovered water broke at 7am, maybe it broke earlier in the night. Little contraxs through the day, maybe every 10 minutes. Labor kicked in later in the day, hard pushing, baby took a long time to come down w/ desire to push. Very alert baby, best nurser, more blood loss.</p>
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<p>Eighth, 2 hours, 39 weeks. Dh barely made it home. Easy labor, easy birth. Water broke upon desire to push. Little blood loss. Pain in back after birth from hard pushing desire, went away the next day. Alert baby, good nurser.</p>
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<p>Ninth, 4 hours, 39 weeks. Biggest baby, moved posterior just before birth. Harder pushing stage. Easy recovery, little blood loss. Very alert baby.</p>
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<p>Tenth, painless contraxs started after possible water leak. Started becoming uncomfortable around 5am, baby born after 8am. Easiest birth, little blood loss, alert baby, good nurser.</p>
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<br><br><p>Wow!</p>
 

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<p>Mommatoabunch I loved reading your list.  I also love the fact that things can vary even from birth to birth in the same woman!  I had the same thing happen with my babies.  Thanks for taking the time to write it out!</p>
 

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Discussion Starter #10
<p>Wow, thank you Mamatoabunch, for writing that out. I really appreciate it :)</p>
 

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<p>I don't usually watch Dr. Oz, but my mom does and he just had Lobelia as one of the top three supplements he would never take b/c of heart complications (I think)</p>
 

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I wrote the warning post it it could be that in both cases someone made the formula themselves from very fresh herb sources. What I meant by eye rolling is much more specific than just simple wandering eyes, basically seizures, mild but I would say seizures. The first time it happened was in the 80's and I did not think necessarily that it was anything taken or used, but when this mom who is an herbalist and mixed her own stuff up , we'll she had a very fast labor, she would not have said painless it was so fast she could not move, I walked in watched a bit ,she moved from clutching the pool to her side, started pushing, baby's head was born in 1-2 pushes , baby turned on the perineum 360 and came out . Within a minute the baby had rolling eyes, mom looked at me babe in arms what's wrong... He was breathing, did nurse and had 2 maybe 3 more ... I hadn't seen this in 20 years but the memory came right to mind seeing it again, I said to mom, maybe your herbal formula only thing can think in common.. I did nt go into the research I had done where some claim that lobelia acts on neuro ... Well baby was fine mom reported seeing the eye rolling but only breifly in the middle of the night 2 x, after that no more but then mom, a few days later thought that the after pain was still a bit much so took some lobelia tincture by it's self with in an hour eye rolling and the baby stopped. Breathing, she called us on their way to the hospital, we met them there and we talked they recommended a higher level hospital, so we drove there, I said to mom my absolutel suspicions about lobelia, she did not take it again, the baby and her spent the night in the hospital they ran tons of tests and could not find anything, he hasn't had another episode since and he is a big kid now...<br>
I have hear loads of everything fine stories with the formula the only other problems we had Was when women started taking it too early and there was a run of several preterm labors....seeing this 2 times was convincing enugh for me to not recommend it.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
<p>MWherbs, thank you so much for explaining further :) Would you mind if I asked a few more questions.</p>
<p>With the women in the two cases you mention were taking tinctures of the herbs? Or tea/powders?</p>
<p>When you talk about issues with preterm labour, did these women actually go into prem labour, or just show signs of it? What indicated preterm labour, and did these indications disappear shortly after stopping the herbs.</p>
<p>Also, have you personally seen any other women through pregnancies/birth, who were on the formula, and did you notice a difference in there labour/birthings?</p>
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<p>Hope that's not too many questions!</p>
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<p>Thank you :)</p>
 

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The gal in the 80's was a combo of teas and caps, this more recent gal used very little tea for this combo, capped up most of the formula, and in the post partum she used the lobelia as tincture.<br>
The pre term births were births, and was rather striking cuz we rarely see women with ptl. We took the ptb as warnings and started telling everyone and so there were some threatened ptl but no more early births. What else had happened was a switch to fresher herbs capped up rather than pre capped from an mlm. I found out that another midwife who I was working with off and on back then changed the formula because of problems she felt were coming from the mix she still recommends an increasing does formula. And I think that long before vitamins/food supplements were invented people were using herbs for qualities they had to support wellbeing. So besides increasing certain nutrients there are qualities that herbs have like toning or a combo of tone and relaxant.<br>
Probably the most clear difference I see if women use a combo, minus the lobelia is less prodromal labor , so I do think that there is some type of toning occurring but I also think that selective formulating a combo for an individual is more effective. But people do what they will, many don't use herbs or will drink raspberry tea. I am more concerned with trying to increase women's dietary habits around vitamin K foods, they have an impact on life long health from helping to prevent hardening of the arteries ,avoiding osteoporosis , metabolic syndrome and blood sugar management, acquired protein S deficency (lupus like symptoms) not just the clotting factor issues, Ia think that green veggies cooked or raw have more things than just vit k to offer so do not just recommend a supplement, but say 2-3 veg servings a day.
 
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