forum crossover: special needs adoption/unschooling

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Yep! And I see you there in all three!

Although *I* am the one in the family with SN, I still lurk there because I find it interesting and I'd like to work in the field if I ever end up going back to work.

For advice.. uhm... ?? Tough call. Follow your gut... Not sure if that helps!

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Hmm. As you know, I hang out in special needs and adoptive/foster parenting. We homeschool, but are currently in love with Montessori (doing what we can at our home). So we don't really unschool. That said, one of the things we *love* about Montessori is that it provides children with a lot of freedom in their education (and the ability to learn self-initiation and self-regulation) but that it has a structure to support all that.

What we take from unschooling is a total commitment to following our kids' interests and helping them access educational opportunities (especially when we are out and about in the community) that match those interests. For example, ds (just turning 4 yrs. old) started asking a lot of questions about plumbing a few months back. He became very curious about systems of pipes. With our encouragement, he's since asked a plumber relative to explain some things to him and to even let him "shadow" this relative while the relative does some simple plumbing jobs in his own home. We're not sure yet if scheduling is going to work out, but I've got my fingers crossed. That's the stuff I'd really like to see us continue to develop as a family.

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For what it is worth, when I was doing therapeutic care, I did my fair share of extended school suspension days with my kids (during which I decided to take my own approach to their education). None of my kids did particularly well with low structure.

In fact, they all seemed to really thrive (and relax) the more structured I made things. I really had to shift what I thought was ideal, and that was hard. I didn't want to use tools I'd rejected, but the kids needed them.

They especially seemed to enjoy, as much as they silmultaneously resisted it, all the educational focus and attention I gave them. My kids who struggled the most in school, academically and behaviorally, needed a different approach than the one in school, but didn't do well at all with its polar oppossite.

A lot of times I was able to use the extra time with them on days they were suspended to offer foundational stuff, sometimes through every day work (like requiring them to do a baking project with me so we could work on fractions) but often through more strictly "academic" (though almost always hands-on) activities. I did a lot of patching up. There were huge holes/gaps in the learning they had done to that date...big foundational pieces missing. To patch, I found it was helpful for both of us to keep it fairly strucutured. This also gave us a useful scope and sequence for their learning activities.

But that is a limited sampling of kids, admittedly, and may not be true for others in similar circumstances.

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One of the hardest things about parenting, I've found, is to shift when my discipline style doesn't fit a kid's emotional or other needs. I never would have dreamed of doing a behavioral chart with any of my kids. The idea made me cringe, actually. But one of my longer-term foster kids clearly felt safer with the chart, and it was one of the only tools I had that truly kept us from having the police at our house everyday. I never would have guessed a tool like that could make that kind of a difference. But it did.

That said, I still tend to stick with my natural discipline style and adapt only when needed. That makes it easier on all of us because I don't do well when I am really uncomfortable with a technique.

When I have to make some major changes, I actually have been known to take classes (like Parenting With Love and Logic) to get in the practice of those things which aren't natural to me. As soon as it isn't needed, I find I revert pretty easily back to my more natural style.

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It's hard to know which came first, the chicken or the egg, or to know exactly what made a difference in any given situation because raising our kids isn't a controlled experiment: there are multiple factors at play at all times.

I'm sure you are making a difference for the kido in your care. Please don't think I am saying otherwise. I just know that with some of my foster kids, occassionally I've said about former foster parents, "I can't believe they did _____," and then find myself needing to do a similar kind of thing six months or a year down the line. It's easier to think that our style will be healing than someone else's. That said, it's nice when it works out that our style is in fact healing . I guess I am just saying to be flexible.

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One thing we've always done with all our kids is weekly "family meetings." We take a really big "team approach" to these meetings (everyone brings agenda items, everyone participates in solutions from the point of trying to find and articulate shared goals, etc.). Even if our more every day style has to be a little more directive, I've found having some introductory experiences to "being on the same team, with similar goals" is useful to help work slowly, slowly toward that approach on a more daily basis.

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In my experience, yes. Absolutely!

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I'd say that it is unfair and unethical to go in with such rigid expectations either way that we can't face when our expectations don't match a situation. I think it is unfair and unethical to try to shape our kids around our ideals of how we "should" raise them. I think it is unfair and unethical to be non-responsive to our kid's histories.

But honestly, you are asking these questions. That doesn't seem much of a danger. I think you'll feel your way through it as the kids grow with you. I think as Whistler said, you should experiment with just trusting your gut. Generally I too have found that the most useful thing to do!

Our bio and adopted children are typical (and still just 3 and 8 months.) We are on the unschooling spectrum. I let my 3 year old son experiment in the fridge until the mess gets too big. I do not let him play with weapon toys and have to stay away from homeschool/unschool park days because I'm not going to just let him pick up a toy gun just because he wants to and I don't want the other kids teaching him about weapon play.

So, that may give you a flavor for where we are on the spectrum.

We will be using learning guides as a way to feel comfortable that our son is more or less staying up with other kids his age. There may be skills that are considered relevant for his age that we don't feel are that important and we won't worry about it if he hasn't picked up those skills. But there may be other skills that we do think he should have so we can introduce them in a way that is enjoyable to him.

Perhaps you could buy one of these learning guides to see if they may assist your path. Give you ideas for subjects to introduce to your kids without doing a really structured program--sort of an inbetween grounds.

http://www.fun-books.com/homeschooling.htm

Here is the blurb about them. They are near the bottom of the page, though there is a link at the top that will take you straight down to the learning guides.

Living is Learning Curriculum Guides by Nancy Plent

These guides are put together by Nancy Plent, founder of the Unschoolers Network in New Jersey and a long-time homeschooler. She reviewed the scope and sequence charts and curriculum guides of dozens of schools in various states, then combined the highest standards of elements from each to create these guides. Why purchase these curriculum guides? 1) They may help you to fulfill your state's legal requirement to provide an educational plan 2) They allow you to see some of the highest standards for schools at various grade levels, just in case you are curious about what the schools expect or are anxious about what you are doing 3) They provide record-keeping space that can help organize a portfolio.

Besides providing a checklist under each subject, Nancy offers suggestions on how to translate real-life experience into curricula goals. She also lists resources from a variety of companies. Each guide covers two or more grade levels. The first four are in comb binding, while the high school guide is in a 3-ring binder.

My adopted DS is 8 and had some mild attachment issues when he joined our family 3.5 years ago. At the time, we homeschooled and although I didn't consider myself an unschooler, I was definitely on the relaxed end of the spectrum. I found that I needed to change my parenting behaviors significantly when DS2 joined our family. DS2 was adopted from Ethiopia, so we had communication difficulties to deal with as well as attachement issues and issues resulting from his time in an institutional setting.

Quite honestly, when he first came to us, DS2 didn't have any interests of his own. He was suffering from a severe lack of imagination. If left to his own devices, he would literally sit in a chair and stare at a wall. I was constantly working to find things for him to do, and his playtime mostly consisted of his mimicing his siblings' play. It took a couple of months before he was able to become more self-directed. So while it went against my previous parenting practices, I became the kind of mom who told her kids what and how to play. I had to work hard to involve DS2 into play, as well as involve him in regular family activities like making lunch or doing laundry. DS2 didn't care that people in families help each other with household tasks, he just wasn't interested and wouldn't participate unless asked (or sometimes required to help).

Over time, DS2 has come out of his shell. He's blossomed, has developed (or feels free to express) his own interests, likes, and dislikes. He can entertain himself. He's creative and enjoys drawing. He still is more of a loner than my other kids. He still has to be asked to participate in family activities more times than not. I still don't know how much of this is personality and how much is still working out issues related to his adoption.

The other thing that has changed is that all of my kids have been in school for about a year. DS2 has benefitted from his time in school more than his siblings. It is a charter school and very responsive to each student as an individual. DS2 is thriving in school in a way that he never thrived when he HSed. He does so well in a structured environment. He feels much less pressured when he has teachers telling him what to learn, as opposed to the stress he felt when I asked him what he wanted to learn about. Even in school, DS2 has a hard time picking which activities he prefers during free-choice time. He sticks with what he has done before.

I'm active in the SN and Adoption forums and a lurker in US. I think the main thing that I have learned in our journey is the huge difference between what I expected/wanted to happen in regards to the AP/GD/US family dynamic and what became the best situation for dd and us. So, I guess my biggest piece of advice is to be extremely open to every possibility. You're not going to become a "mainstreamer" just because it's best for your kiddo/s to go to school and have set expectations, etc. You're bringing that perspective with you and it will most certainly influence how you interpret and facilitate their needs.

I think it's so so important for those of us with deep philosophical beliefs about parenting to be very careful and aware of how our adherence to those beliefs actually can end up being just as strident, and, even, sometimes, limiting to our children. And that's certainly not the point, right? I mean, we don't get any more brownie points in "parenting heaven" (or whatever) because we make these decisions; these decisions are (should be) always subservient to the needs of our children.

All that said, I think trying US approaches, while at home and in tandem with their regular school stuff, can't hurt, and maybe the gradualness of their exposure to US will prepare them to fully embrace it once it's a real option.

Lots of s!!!

I think this might be one of those situations you just kind of have to go with the flow, use what works, if it doesnt work then do something else.

As was mentioned, there needs to be a strong foundation of trust for unschooling to work well....the child needs to trust the parent, the parent needs to trust the child. I trusted that my son was not "addicted" to a new computer game he was engrossed in, and that he would learn what he needed to know when he needed to know it...and he trusted me that if i suggested getting outside to play, that i knew him well and was offering good advice. And that if i told him "dont worry you will learn to read when you are ready" that it was really true.

With a new child, who has trouble trusting a parent, who has been let down (and worse) time and again by a parent, there would probably be less "working together" and more looking out for himself, because he is the only person he feels he can rely on. There would probably also be alot of testing, kind of like "deschooling" in major overdrive. And many kids would feel very unsafe and unloved by the loose freedom unschooling offers...my kid knows he can eat what he wants, sleep when he wants, watch as much tv/computer/videogames etc as he wants, because i trust him and he knows i am actively involved in his life. A new kid might feel that i just didnt care, that i wasnt "mothering" him, yknow?

Common advice seems to be to have more structure at first, and gradually allow more freedom as the child learns to handle it. But we are VERY "free" here and i think it would be a hard adjustment (for me).

I think the big thing would just to be flexible and openminded, and it sounds like that is something you can definitely do!

Katherine

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Well said.

I'm drifting more and more towards the RU end of things as my kids get older, and I've learned to trust that they are solid kids, and make pretty good choices for themselves most of the time (with the exception of never eating any vegetables! we're working on that... ). Things like weapon play and watching or playing fantasy violence don't define or affect who they are, and I've learned to relax about them. I find that the things my kids have the most freedom with are the things they are best able to self-regulate, and the things that I've tried to control are the things we've had struggles with. wish I had known that from the beginning!

With the kids you'll be bringing home, I would tend to think you might find yourself in a position where, if you want to work towards self-regulation and self-sufficiency, it might take a lot of 'guided freedom' if that makes sense. Just spending a lot of time in close contact, doing what they want to do, talking a lot about different choices they can make, etc. letting them know that with you, they do have unconditional love (even if you have to fake it at times ) but that you are there to help them make good decisions and navigate family life. I really like the 'family team' approach -- my bio son seems to have a very hard time believing that we are 'on his side' and really bristles (to put it mildly) at any attempt on our part to control his behavior. He may have done better with more structure as a very little guy, but whenever we tried to really clamp down on his crazy behavior, it only got worse, and we realized that we really needed to earn his trust and truly help him through life, rather than try to control him.

I think that when you take a kid who is used to a lot of structure, whether they are your typical north american kid in any school setting or a child from an orphanage, and give them the freedom to do what they want, they are often at a loss, and don't know how to be, which can be scary and lead to negative interactions. my kids have always had the freedom to do whatever they want (within the natural boundaries of human and social interaction, of course) so they don't seem to need any guiding to find something to do -- which doesn't mean I don't suggest things I think they might like from time to time, whether it's a trip to the museum or playing a math game -- but kids who aren't used to that freedom often do have a hard time at first, and you might find that to be the case with your kiddos, as I'm sure you know .

What I find the most useful about RU is the concept that we're all different, and have different needs -- my son may have needed more structure as a young child (according to the experts, anyway) but that's not the family he got, and without the structure, he has learned to let go of a lot of his need to control everyone and everything, which may not have happened if we had really developed a regimented routine -- lots of kids with controlling personalities get so caught up in the routine, rules and regulations that they lose a certain amount of flexibility I think. We may have had a rougher time keeping things free and easy and dealing with his issues in a more RU way, but in the end, he is doing just fine, and has developed the ability to be flexible and more easy-going. So I'm not sure "structure" is ALWAYS the answer, even if it makes things easier in the short term -- I guess what I'm saying is, I don't believe in one approach being any better than any other approach, and you can give any child what they need by just paying close attention to what they need and working with that -- if they really like the idea of a chart or a more defined schedule, etc, then you can give it to them while also helping them adjust to a more natural style of living together cooperatively. Obviously with kids who have more severe trauma, FAS, RAD, etc, it's an entirely different ballgame altogether, but in the absence of those things, you do what works for each kid, within the framework of your family structure.

very interested to see how things go!

Sorry I haven't been back to reply. LittleGuy came (6YO), and we are settling in. All is well, but I may not get much computer time in the next little while. Thanks for interesting thoughts, and I hope to get back soon!

hope everything goes well!! keep us posted!

Has anyone else here marveled at the things that seemed so important pre-kids (I'm thinking decisions like what brand of stroller to choose), then found that once you are really involved in the day-to-day business of parenting that those questions are the easy ones? The rough stuff is how to handle the moment, each and every moment, for the rest of your life!!

I am waxing philosophical this evening, as I sit here, with the kids working a jigsaw puzzle on the kitchen floor behind me, and hoping to get through bedtime in the next few minutes. My new LittleGuy was in a hellish foster home, the type that will make the news if the story gets out, just a few days ago. I can't talk about it due to the ongoing investigation, but the contrast between his recent past, and playing here with his bio-sister (in my care all along) takes my breath away. I cannot begin to imagine the pain and the damage LittleGuy has been through in the last 2 years in "care", on top of all the abuse and neglect these kids knew from birth.

And I can hardly imagine that last week I was thinking about the deep ethical questions of educational philosophy, but just for tonight, just for right now, it is enough to offer them a safe haven, a snuggle and a story at bedtime, and the promise of a smile in the morning.

I think that is such an important lesson to hold onto forever, but yes, especially poignant at the beginning of his time with you. so glad he's with you now!

I'm an adoptive mom and lurk in unschooling but we're not quite there yet -- I just made the decision to pull DS out of public school and I think it'll be awhile before I can do the unschool thing, but...
you sound like you will make this situation work. I think it's terrific you are willing to work with these kids and have obviously given it so much thought and energy. I think they will thrive in your care.