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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I haven't been on here for a while, had kind of made my peace with 2.5 year old ds being unvaxed. But was with a friend and her dd yesterday, who was playing with my ds, and she told me her father has necrosis of his leg after succumbing to pneumoccal meningitis and blood poisoning. She said she was so relieved her dd was vaccinated against it. Now I haven't told her about ds's unvaxed status, I haven't known her long, and I am worried that somehow ds may now be at risk. She has visited her dad in hospital. I am really worried now, not sure how long the bacteria can live outside the body and how contagious it is. Does anyone know? Any thoughts gratefully received for a worried mummy....
 

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Your friend probably does not realize that Prevnar "covers" only serotypes (7) strains:<br><br>
The first pneumococcal conjugate vaccine (PCV7) was licensed in the United States in 2000. It includes purified capsular polysaccharide of <b>seven serotypes of S. pneumoniae (4, 9V, 14, 19F, 23F, 18C, and 6B)</b> conjugated to a nontoxic variant of diphtheria toxin known as CRM197. The serotypes included in PCV7 accounted for 86% of bacteremia, 83% of meningitis, and 65% of acute otitis media <b><span style="text-decoration:underline;">among children younger than 6 years of age</span></b> in the United States during 1978–1994.<br><b><br>
Which strain does your friend's dad have?</b>
 

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Because there are NINETY (90) of them.<br><br><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/lurk.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="lurk">:
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I don't actually think she knows longisland. I kind of tried to ask but she just thought it was one disease. I was just wondering how easy it is to catch really.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>buff</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7351597"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I don't actually think she knows longisland. I kind of tried to ask but she just thought it was one disease. I was just wondering how easy it is to catch really.</div>
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Read this in it's entirety -- it's the Pink Book chapter on pneumococcal: <a href="http://www.cdc.gov/nip/publications/pink/pneumo.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.cdc.gov/nip/publications/pink/pneumo.pdf</a>
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
thanks longisland - i've just had a read. From what it said, there are about 10 strains that cause most of the diseases - hope i've got that right. It said that it is transmissible only from nasal secretions - so assuming ds's little friend isn't carrying it we should be alright. My friend also said that you can pick upthe bacteria anywhere, even in the garden - which doesn't sound quite right - i'm assuming this is what the doctor told her....hmmm. Still worrying of course!
 

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Everyone carries pneumococcal bacteria all of the time. ALL the time. They usually only cause problems when you get sick with a virus first, and then they go nuts and cause "secondary bacterial infections". Like that time you caught "the flu" and then had a "sinus infection" for a week afterwards. It's that kind of thing.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>buff</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7351803"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">thanks longisland - i've just had a read. From what it said, there are about 10 strains that cause most of the diseases - hope i've got that right. It said that it is transmissible only from nasal secretions - so assuming ds's little friend isn't carrying it we should be alright. My friend also said that you can pick upthe bacteria anywhere, even in the garden - which doesn't sound quite right - i'm assuming this is what the doctor told her....hmmm. Still worrying of course!</div>
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You can't catch invasive pneumococcal disease, which is why your friend, who is not vaccinated for it, hasn't succumbed yet. You can catch the bacteria, but they're normal residents of the upper respiratory tract and almost never cause illness. It's kind of like PCP, which is a form of pneumonia usually only contracted by HIV patients. The PCP bacteria live in the lungs and don't cause disease in healthy people. They're pretty harmless, unless you have an immunodeficiency, in which case they can make you pretty sick. Pneumococcal bacteria are <i>kind of</i> the same. Everyone carries the bacteria sometimes. Everyone. You might have it right now. Your son has already been exposed and carried it himself. You just don't catch invasive pneumococcal disease. It's something to do with the host that allows the bacteria to make you sick, not the bacteria itself, which is usually pretty harmless.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
thanks for those mamakay and plummeting - i just wonder why in that case a vaccine has been developed - if most of us are exposed, including under two's, already. Oh well, i'll be glad if i am worrying about nothing - it is just most of the time i see the confidence of parents who have vaccinated children as a false confidence, and occasionally i see it as a real confidence that me and my ds lack. Interestingly, her dad was stung by a jellyfish before developing the blood poisoning, which they say was not related. I wonder.
 

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Hib and diphtheria are the same way, buff. They don't care if <i>most</i> people never have a problem with a bacteria. If at least a few thousand people out there will be affected, they're going to make one and they'll have an easy time selling it. Right now they're working on a vaccine for coxsackievirus, which causes hand-foot-mouth disease. Seriously, have you ever heard of <i>anyone</i> dying or being seriously injured from a bad case of HFM? They'll probably market it by saying that rarely (we're talking VERY rarely) it can cause temporary paralysis and that it's been implicated in juvenile diabetes. We'll see how that pans out.
 

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I think they originally make vaccines just because they can. It's not a matter of the worst diseases always getting vaccines made for them first. (Even though it seems like that because of the way immunization programs have to be marketed).<br><br>
I think the way it usually goes is that some scientist at some university figures out how to make a vaccine for something...a pharma company buys the formula, calls the CDC or the NIH or NIAID or whoever and the gears for the clinical trials and stuff go into motion. By the time the vax is in phase 3 trials, the disease fearmongering is in place via our super-awesome CDC "educating" us all about this "deadly threat" along with the "public service education" from the pharma company who owns it.<br>
Sometimes the CDC even finds "news stories" to give lazy journalists who'll just parrot whatever "exciting story" the CDC gives them.<br>
(you know those media stories about deadly flu outbreaks where the CDC is quoted? That's the CDC calling the news to report something...<i>not</i> the media finding the story and calling the CDC for an official quote...seriously...the CDC openly admits that this is what they do.)<br><br>
Anyway...so that's why we're going to be hearing a lot about meningococcal diseases over the next year or 2.<br>
Never heard of it before?<br>
It's horrible and common and amazing that your kid hasn't died from it yet.<br>
Coz the vaccine for babies is in Phase 3 right now.<br><br>
Also sort of like how the CDC mysteriously discovered that pertussis is endemic in N. America right when Wyeth was completing their phase 3 "pertussis vax for adults" trial.<br><br>
Have I mentioned how much I hate the CDC lately?????
 

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I remember reading something ages ago about coxsackie and a relationship to the OPV?<br><br>
Was I dreaming, or is there something that we know about the origins of coxsackie? <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/headscratch.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="headscratch"> DH had it as a child.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>aira</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7364493"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I remember reading something ages ago about coxsackie and a relationship to the OPV?<br><br>
Was I dreaming, or is there something that we know about the origins of coxsackie? <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/headscratch.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="headscratch"> DH had it as a child.</div>
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They're both enteroviruses, but they aren't the same. Maybe you're thinking of how coxsackievirus could've been confused with polio back in the day, before they changed the definition of polio? Coxsackievirus can cause a paralysis similar to poliomyelitis.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;"><b>Is HFMD serious?</b><br>
Usually not. HFMD caused by coxsackievirus A16 infection is a mild disease and nearly all patients recover without medical treatment in 7 to 10 days. Complications are uncommon. Rarely, the patient with coxsackievirus A16 infection may also develop "aseptic" or viral meningitis, in which the person has fever, headache, stiff neck, or back pain, and may need to be hospitalized for a few days. Another cause of HFMD, EV71 may also cause viral meningitis and, rarely, more serious diseases, such as encephalitis, or a poliomyelitis-like paralysis. EV71 encephalitis may be fatal. Cases of fatal encephalitis occurred during outbreaks of HFMD in Malaysia in 1997 and in Taiwan in 1998.</td>
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<a href="http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dvrd/revb/enterovirus/hfhf.htm" target="_blank">http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dvrd/revb/...virus/hfhf.htm</a><br><br>
I think I need to save that page to hard drive, for the day the vaccine comes out and they change it all to reflect the fact that coxsackievirus is the new "world's most deadly" virus. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/shake.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="shake">
 
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