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Dd1 is almost 13 (September), but while she seems fine babysitting ddw (6), she is a ditz. She is also ignoring every rule we have. Whether she has some issue mentally or is just not caring we don't know.<br><br>
The latest - she was playing outside yesterday with a neighbour's 8yo, who was being babysat by her grandmother next door. Nothing unusual about that - her friends on the street are all 8 - 9 years old, which she seems fine with - she calls on them, never calls her school friends.<br><br>
So she and 8yo were playing truth or dare, because they were bored. C. (the grandma, our nice next door neighbour) heard dd1 ask "who do you want to have sex with, A or B" - TO AN 8 YEAR OLD!! She sent dd1 home for it. Dd1 says she apologized at the time.<br><br>
Well, she told us she said "make out with". It was hours later when dh asked her again and she fessed up. We are extremely angry - she has been specifically told not to play truth or dare - it is not an appropriate game at all, and to ask that of an 8yo!<br><br>
She tried to say that we let dd2 talk about sex, because we are letting her recite her poem in front of people. She doesn't seem to get the difference between asking an 8yo who she wants sex with, and a 6 yo having a poem wondering about future children.<br><br>
So. We are at the point where there is no way we can leave her to babysit. I now need to hire someone for the summer, so I will be working to pay a sitter, which sucks. But I think she is letting us know she is not ready - she verbally says she is, but actions speak louder than words.<br><br>
This is not the only irresponsiblity issue, the rest is stuff like not doing homework, making messes and not cleaning up. Not cleaning her room. Probably normal stuff, but extremely annoying. She's not allowed use the computer without an adult around (she kept downloading stuff without permission), but I keep finding her on the computer.<br><br>
So, wise women, can I have some appropriate punishment (and yes, that is what it is!). Right now, she's off screen time (tv, pc) and not allowed outside for a week. But that is just for one incident - what about the rest of the stuff?
 

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Hey mama,<br><br>
How stressful and frustrating for you. Oh the joys I have to look forward to.<br><br>
So, not having personal experience with my own daughter, but having mucho experience as a 13 yr old myself and with experience with 13 yr olds in a professional atmosphere, I think I might be qualified to offer suggestions <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/wink1.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="wink1"> Maybe.<br><br>
I don't think a 13 yr old would distinguish between language that is appropriate for other 13 yr olds and 8-9 yr olds, espeically if her only friends at home are that age. Unfortunately sex seems to be a curiousity for 10-13 yr old girls. I think I would gently remind her of the difference since she doesn't seem to get it on her own.<br><br>
I do agree that she is telling you through her actions that she may not be ready for sitting on her own.<br><br>
But how can you help her become more responsible? Do you have natural consequences set in place for when she makes the choice not to follow through on her responsibilities?<br><br>
For us (and she is only 6 but I think can be applied to any age) if kailey plays with her toys in the living room (a communal area) and doesn't clean them up when she is done, then she can't play with them in the front room the next day. We also only allow one toy or set of tyos out at a time (which limits her aggrevation with potentially having to clean up hordes of toys). I pick them up and put them in her room (her room is private space and therefor not subject to my cleaning obsession).<br><br>
So, if your daughter makes a mess and doesn't clean it up, perhaps that consequence is that she cannot use that are for a certain amount of time? But, if she is using the area still without your permission- fine her. Charge her a certain amount of money if YOU have to clean up her mess. Afterall maids get paid, right?<br><br>
As for not doing homework-this is kicker for me. kailey is in K and does have little a little bit of homework (working on site words, reading) and I just can't find it in myself to allow her not to do homework. I don't know what consequence would be appropriate. Perhaps having a set homework time and that not doing that homework delays the next activity?<br>
Maybe remind her, "Go o your homework so we can do (?) next."<br><br>
We don't allow Kailey to use the pc without us around and she only has access to certain sites (she has a list that she can type in) and we don't have a television in her bedroom. Can you set the security on your computer for a certain level so some sites and downloads are not allowed? Create a seperate user for her or for you set with a password? We have that set up where the login screen comes up with our different users and they are password protected except kailey's.<br><br>
I just have to reiterate that she is going to experiment with sexual ideas and language that she has heard from others/media/neighbors/school chums, etc and it's something you just have to deal with as it comes.<br><br>
I feel for you though. Being the mom to daughters is tough!
 

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My ds will be turning 13 in September, too. I'm having trouble with him, too. My 5 year old now talks about "humping" because his big brother thought that that was appropriate language to introduce to him! We are also dealing with "forgetting" things- this weekend his bed lost it's lightbulbs because he went away and left them on again(it is an all day occurance and he is not willing to help out with the power bill).<br><br>
No real advice, mama. I'm doing the natural consequence thing and talking for HOURS but I'm not sure I'm not swimming upstream. He is also currently not going to be babysitting because he has shown he is just not up to it right now.<br><br>
Could it be the age? People are constantly telling me how responsible he is at their house. He was way more responsable at home a year ago.
 

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I'm wondering if it may not be the affects of hormones in the body.<br>
I'd hve to actually look into this but are they not having a growth spurt which would cause the mental issues. Just throwing things out.<br><br>
If most 13 yr olds are absent-minded and irresponsible than we have to think that it is a power larger than themselves at work and adjust our parenting to reflect this new chane. Ok, now I am totally interested, brb.
 

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I'm still looking. In my Youth and Adolescent Development text they talk about typical characteristics of 10-14 yr olds so I am trying to find what they say and ways parents and those who care for adolescents can help.<br><br>
It's a great time of strum und grang for them...
 

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Sorry it took me so long to get back. I don't see anything that applies to not being responsible- grrr!<br><br>
I don't think she needs punishment, I think she needs to understand the importance of appropriate language and punishment won't teach her this and it may give her a "taboo" she can use when others aren't around or paying attention to see what she can get away with.
 

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<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/shake.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="shake"> Yuck yuck yuck. Sorry your kiddo is pulling this stuff.<br><br>
What we do when someone is blatantly disobeying explicit rules (like getting on the 'puter after being told not to) is put them on 100% supervision. Lemmee tell ya', this solution is one of those that very definitely hurts parents worse than kids, but it works. A kid on supervision must stay in a room where there is a parent at all times. To take a little of the pressure off of myself, when I badly need a few minutes, I send the supervised kid to his or her room till I can supervise again.<br><br>
When a child of this age is blatantly disregarding rules that I know they're capable of understanding and following, that's a major infraction. So our thinking on making them follow us around is, if you can't follow the rules on your own, you need us to make sure that you do that. It rarely takes longer than 3 days to get things nailed down and the child is very happy to follow rules to get their freedom back!
 

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Uptown~ This seems pretty logical too. If you can't follow the rules and therefor potentially puttin yourself or others in danger then we are here to ensure that you remain safe. Love it!
 

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Ds1 is 11, almost 12 and very absent-minded. When he's supposed to be helping watch the 3yo outside, he has his nose in a book or tunnel-visioned in shooting a basketball or whatever. I know his days are tough, wending through public school personalities of middle school. He's sensitive and his feelings easily hurt. He loves webkinz, even though he realizes he'd be teased mercilessly if he betrayed that knowledge at school. In our case, ds can get along with adults (who are patient) and little kids (who think he's brilliant) and yet has lots of social trouble w/ boys (in particular) his own age.<br><br>
As to the age of sexual awareness, it varies hugely by neighborhood, schools, families, etc. Most of the 10-11yos I work with are truly ignorant of sexual realities (thankfully!). When a child who has been exposed to such realities hit this population, it almost always upsets the proverbial apple cart. I look at it in much the same way as hiding the "truth" about Santa Claus. Bigger kids need to understand cultural boundaries about what they can/cannot talk about with younger folks.<br><br>
Punishment around here is generally a long "discussion" w/ me or dh (kids HATE that on-going conversation/lecture more than losing TV privileges LOL ) and a more structured-observed room cleaning that includes sorting through things I want to convince them to declutter and give away. The worst punishment would be taking away their books-- but I don't believe thats an option b/c I do want them to read.
 

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Having a ds who is the same age (he'll be 13 in December) I can say that some of this is normal exploration. She's very aware that she's becoming a teen, but she's still very much a child. Is your dd in middle school this year? Ds is and it's been a very difficult transition - we're talking a straight A student who got 2 E's on his progress report, the rest were D's! He's irritable at times, debates EVERY house rule of respect and doesn't care about personal hygiene or cleaning his room. He just wants to play his guitar all day (and sometimes all night).<br><br>
You also have a girl and I've made some observations this past year with my 9 yo girl - for some reason, many girls at this age become 'boy crazy'. I don't know why, but its very strange to me. Ds could care less about girls. All he wants to do is hang out with they guys, shoot hoops, skateboard and play guitar.<br><br>
Here are some of my thoughts, try not to be angry and approach your dd with concern and try to find out why she's exploring this. "I'm very concerned that your thinking about sex, can you tell me what it is your thinking about? Do your friends talk about sex at school?" Depending on her answers, you can further explore what she thinks sex would be like at age 12, you may also be able to ask about her friends and what they talk about at lunch.<br><br>
You may want to suggest she write a short apology to the grandmother who heard her and explain that she must have felt very concerned as well.<br><br>
Personally, I wouldn't punish her for this because I think something deeper is going on, at age 12, it sounds like she's mimicking things she's hearing and trying to figure out where she is in this world. pre/early teens is a rough place to be and as a parent, we need to keep trying to get inside and let them know that they can trust us. I doubt she actually wanted to have sex with anyone, but you do need to explore. I suspect she was going for the shock factor.<br><br>
As far as the housework, we do have basic house rules. I can't sit and watch a TV show if I haven't cleaned up my messes, so I expect the same of the kids. They are welcome to watch TV, play on the computer or whatever, but I do expect them to be a part of the whole family and help out. I'm not saying we don't have our struggles - we certainly do! But I let them know that participation in the family is expected and we work around that.
 

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FWIW, 11-12 were the worst years for Rain... 13 was actually better. She really didn't seem able to think things through at those ages, and it was really frustrating.<br><br>
I am wondering, though, why she seems more comfortable with children a few years younger than she is. It <i>is</i> normal for girls this age to start thinking about and talking about sex, with each other, but not with 6-8 year olds. I know Rain played Truth or Dare at that age, too, but with kids her age - I wasn't thrilled but it was generally pretty mild, and no one involved seemed uncomfortable. Do you think maybe something is going on between your daughter and her same-age peers?<br><br>
Dar
 

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Discussion Starter #14
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Potty Diva</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7976877"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I don't think a 13 yr old would distinguish between language that is appropriate for other 13 yr olds and 8-9 yr olds, espeically if her only friends at home are that age. Unfortunately sex seems to be a curiousity for 10-13 yr old girls. I think I would gently remind her of the difference since she doesn't seem to get it on her own.</div>
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We did, I think (hope!) she understands.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Potty Diva</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7976877"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I do agree that she is telling you through her actions that she may not be ready for sitting on her own.</div>
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I agree with you, she doesn't!<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Potty Diva</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7976877"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">But how can you help her become more responsible? Do you have natural consequences set in place for when she makes the choice not to follow through on her responsibilities?<br><br>
So, if your daughter makes a mess and doesn't clean it up, perhaps that consequence is that she cannot use that are for a certain amount of time? But, if she is using the area still without your permission- fine her. Charge her a certain amount of money if YOU have to clean up her mess. Afterall maids get paid, right!</div>
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That's when she loses screen time/pays me for my time spent supervising her cleaning or cleaning after her.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Potty Diva</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7976877"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">As for not doing homework-this is kicker for me. kailey is in K and does have little a little bit of homework (working on site words, reading) and I just can't find it in myself to allow her not to do homework. I don't know what consequence would be appropriate. Perhaps having a set homework time and that not doing that homework delays the next activity?<br>
Maybe remind her, "Go o your homework so we can do (?) next."</div>
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She knows it the first thing to be done when she comes home. She gets sent back to school regularly for stuff she "forgot". If she could do all work orally, she would be fine, it's getting it on paper that is a problem. We are working with the school on this stuff - her teachers this year are awesome!<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Potty Diva</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7976877"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">IWe don't allow Kailey to use the pc without us around and she only has access to certain sites (she has a list that she can type in) and we don't have a television in her bedroom. Can you set the security on your computer for a certain level so some sites and downloads are not allowed? Create a seperate user for her or for you set with a password? We have that set up where the login screen comes up with our different users and they are password protected except kailey's.</div>
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That is going to be done. And we have one tv. When I didn't want them watching, it would break (I'd unplug the cable). Dd2 figured it out last week though - it had worked for months before.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Potty Diva</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7976877"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I just have to reiterate that she is going to experiment with sexual ideas and language that she has heard from others/media/neighbors/school chums, etc and it's something you just have to deal with as it comes.</div>
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But she doesn't seem interested in sex, or boys - she hates me even saying any words related (breasts, for instance). And if she has a crush, she's not saying.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>momazon4</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7979273"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">My ds will be turning 13 in September, too. I'm having trouble with him, too. My 5 year old now talks about "humping" because his big brother thought that that was appropriate language to introduce to him! We are also dealing with "forgetting" things- this weekend his bed lost it's lightbulbs because he went away and left them on again(it is an all day occurance and he is not willing to help out with the power bill).<br><br>
No real advice, mama. I'm doing the natural consequence thing and talking for HOURS but I'm not sure I'm not swimming upstream. He is also currently not going to be babysitting because he has shown he is just not up to it right now.<br><br>
Could it be the age? People are constantly telling me how responsible he is at their house. He was way more responsable at home a year ago.</div>
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Could be the age. And dd2 (6yo) has been singing My Lovely Lady Lumps lately, which SHE got from a different 8 year old on the street.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Potty Diva</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7979384"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I'm wondering if it may not be the affects of hormones in the body.<br>
I'd hve to actually look into this but are they not having a growth spurt which would cause the mental issues. Just throwing things out.<br><br>
If most 13 yr olds are absent-minded and irresponsible than we have to think that it is a power larger than themselves at work and adjust our parenting to reflect this new chane. Ok, now I am totally interested, brb.</div>
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Could be hormones, but there are no visible signs of puberty yet, other than needing to use deodorant.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>fek&fuzz</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7980779"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Do you think that punishment will help her past this?</div>
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Maybe not, but it will show her it is unacceptable. She's been great today, so she is trying.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>UptownZoo</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7980828"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">What we do when someone is blatantly disobeying explicit rules (like getting on the 'puter after being told not to) is put them on 100% supervision. Lemmee tell ya', this solution is one of those that very definitely hurts parents worse than kids, but it works. A kid on supervision must stay in a room where there is a parent at all times. To take a little of the pressure off of myself, when I badly need a few minutes, I send the supervised kid to his or her room till I can supervise again.<br><br>
When a child of this age is blatantly disregarding rules that I know they're capable of understanding and following, that's a major infraction. So our thinking on making them follow us around is, if you can't follow the rules on your own, you need us to make sure that you do that. It rarely takes longer than 3 days to get things nailed down and the child is very happy to follow rules to get their freedom back!</div>
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<br>
Ooh, she'd HATE that. I must try it. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/wink1.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="wink1"><br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>ZenSizzled</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7981061"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Punishment around here is generally a long "discussion" w/ me or dh (kids HATE that on-going conversation/lecture more than losing TV privileges LOL ) and a more structured-observed room cleaning that includes sorting through things I want to convince them to declutter and give away. The worst punishment would be taking away their books-- but I don't believe thats an option b/c I do want them to read.</div>
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Agreed!<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Jacque Savageau</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7981072"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Having a ds who is the same age (he'll be 13 in December) I can say that some of this is normal exploration. She's very aware that she's becoming a teen, but she's still very much a child. Is your dd in middle school this year? Ds is and it's been a very difficult transition - we're talking a straight A student who got 2 E's on his progress report, the rest were D's! He's irritable at times, debates EVERY house rule of respect and doesn't care about personal hygiene or cleaning his room. He just wants to play his guitar all day (and sometimes all night).<br><br>
You also have a girl and I've made some observations this past year with my 9 yo girl - for some reason, many girls at this age become 'boy crazy'. I don't know why, but its very strange to me. Ds could care less about girls. All he wants to do is hang out with they guys, shoot hoops, skateboard and play guitar.</div>
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We don't have middle school - it's JK-8 here. She is definitely NOT boy crazy - she'd rather climb trees.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Jacque Savageau</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7981072"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Here are some of my thoughts, try not to be angry and approach your dd with concern and try to find out why she's exploring this. "I'm very concerned that your thinking about sex, can you tell me what it is your thinking about? Do your friends talk about sex at school?" Depending on her answers, you can further explore what she thinks sex would be like at age 12, you may also be able to ask about her friends and what they talk about at lunch.<br><br>
You may want to suggest she write a short apology to the grandmother who heard her and explain that she must have felt very concerned as well.<br><br>
Personally, I wouldn't punish her for this because I think something deeper is going on, at age 12, it sounds like she's mimicking things she's hearing and trying to figure out where she is in this world. pre/early teens is a rough place to be and as a parent, we need to keep trying to get inside and let them know that they can trust us. I doubt she actually wanted to have sex with anyone, but you do need to explore. I suspect she was going for the shock factor.<br><br>
As far as the housework, we do have basic house rules. I can't sit and watch a TV show if I haven't cleaned up my messes, so I expect the same of the kids. They are welcome to watch TV, play on the computer or whatever, but I do expect them to be a part of the whole family and help out. I'm not saying we don't have our struggles - we certainly do! But I let them know that participation in the family is expected and we work around that.</div>
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The girls she's friends with at school are pretty level headed, and none seem interested in boys. The girls seem to be divided into those that could pass for 18 and are dating, and those that could pass for 10 and want to climb trees. She and her friends are the latter. As far as I can see anyway - and from what I hear of conversations.<br><br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Dar</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7981152"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">FWIW, 11-12 were the worst years for Rain... 13 was actually better. She really didn't seem able to think things through at those ages, and it was really frustrating.<br><br>
I am wondering, though, why she seems more comfortable with children a few years younger than she is. It <i>is</i> normal for girls this age to start thinking about and talking about sex, with each other, but not with 6-8 year olds. I know Rain played Truth or Dare at that age, too, but with kids her age - I wasn't thrilled but it was generally pretty mild, and no one involved seemed uncomfortable. Do you think maybe something is going on between your daughter and her same-age peers?<br><br>
Dar</div>
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I don't think it's that she's more comfortable. There are two girls in her class on the street (C shaped street, they are at the top, we are at the bottom). In the six years we have lived here, they've called on her once. She's not at all bothered by it (and no one else really lives within walking distance. So it's the younger kids or no one. And one of the younger ones (10 in the summer) has older teenage sisters, so is "older" than her age.<br><br>
I'm in school a lot volunteering, and I talk to her teachers regularly, and we do not get the impression there are issues with her peers - at least not with the ones she hangs out with. She was picked on a little last year, but that kid left anyway.<br><br>
Thanks for all the insights, feel free to keep posting!
 

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Well, my dd will be turning 13 in November. She has always been extremely competent and reliable. But there are times......<br><br>
And when these times arise, like leaving things hanging around, not cleaning up after herself, etc. or playing with the "rules of our family", I usually treat her like our toddler when she is acting out. I try to give her more attention. Try some sort of distracting activity that we can share on our own, some mom and daughter time. I always try to look at things like this as a show that she needs something and usually she doesn't quite know what it is. Especially at this age. I know my dd needs a lot of support at times, just knowing that she doesn't have to do everything right all of the time, to know that I've got her back.<br><br>
Perhaps her game was fun because she felt like she had control or power and she was testing it out. In this case maybe power of knowledge? Like she was the one in the know and the 8 year old wasn't.<br><br>
We don't usually take away things, we usually end up with a talk that includes the whole family and can last hours! That is punishment enough <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/lol.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="lol"><br><br>
Stacey
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>sunshinegal</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7989354"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">We don't usually take away things, we usually end up with a talk that includes the whole family and can last hours! That is punishment enough <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/lol.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="lol"><br><br>
Stacey</div>
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Hee, hee! My ds feels the same way!!
 

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(My dd is 13.5)<br><br>
Here's my take on it - not wanting to "grow up" and be sophisticated, not wanting to even hear the word "breasts", needing deodorant but not a bra, etc. are all signs of internal conflict. She hangs around young girls because they are safe, because they won't tease her if she demonstrates a lack of sophistication, becuase she won't be expected to be more mature that she really is -- in other words, she finds them non-threatening as opposed to her peers. Even if she is climbing trees, she is still looking over at the girls who are trying out mascara and who are flirting with boys, and she feels insecure. Typical Judy Blume angst.<br><br>
Talking about sex with an 8 year old (and for her, sex may truly be in the same category as making out) is a non-threatening way to try out that kind of talk. She needs to practice the lines, to practice the feelings associated with the lines, and knows that the younger girl will think she is really big and cool if she says that. I see my dd doing it all the time with her younger sibs and their friends. I say "not appropriate!" but they think she is hot sh*t and she revels in it.<br><br>
Of course she is immature and irresponsible, she's 12. She is right now starting all over from the beginning in terms of development, and during the next few years, she will change both physically and cogntively, way more rapidly than she has during the past few years.<br><br>
I strongly think she does not need to be punished. She needs a heads up (and will continue to need them during this journey of adolescence) but mistakes are opportunities for learning.<br><br>
True, you don't get free babysitting (which she may feel is exploitative anyway), but you will get to keep the lines of communication open and you will get to stay connected in your relationship.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>LookMommy!</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/8010617"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I strongly think she does not need to be punished. She needs a heads up (and will continue to need them during this journey of adolescence) but mistakes are opportunities for learning.<br><br>
True, you don't get free babysitting (which she may feel is exploitative anyway), but you will get to keep the lines of communication open and you will get to stay connected in your relationship.</div>
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I agree with you, very well said!<br><br>
Your situation has me thinking about a part from Peggy's book Natural Family Living that profoundly changed my thinking a few years ago.<br><br>
Page 188 Family Matters, Discipline, It Does Not Teach<br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">"The child who has just been spanked or sent to his room does not think 'Thank God for my father or mother who just punished me. When I grow up I want to be just like them.' Instead, all he thinks is 'revenge.'"</td>
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This really hit a cord with me because I remember VERY clearly sitting in my room plotting to dip my mothers toothbrush in the toilet. I don't even recall what I was being punished for - but I do recall dipping her toothbrush in the toilet.
 
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