[Mommiska]

I've always known dh and I wouldn't circumcise any of our little boys, as dh is intact and we live in the UK, where it just isn't done. So it's never been an issue for me - just a given that any children we had would be left alone.

But the issue never seemed real to me - didn't impact me - until I had my ds 5 weeks ago. A friend from the States asked if we'd circumcised, and I reacted (internally) with horror - of COURSE we didnt' circumicise. It was just this instinctive, gut reaction that I wouldn't do that to my child.

But I just found an old e-mail I'd sent to a friend back in 1999 when we were both pregnant with our first children. She'd asked what I thought about circumcision, and gone through a lot of the pros and cons before saying that they thought they'd do it for 'conventional/cultural' reasons. (Luckily, she had a girl, so it didnt' happen!).

But my response was just that dh wasnt' circumcised and it wasn't done over here, so we wouldn't do it. But I obviously didn't think anything more about her doing it to her little boy, if she'd had one.

Now, of course, I feel differently. She's planning a third pregnancy soon, and I'm already trying to figure out how to approach this issue with her (first two children were girls).

I can see how my own son's birth has made me emphatically anti-circ, and I was wondering how every one else here has come to be intactivists themselves.

I'm especially interested in how those of you without children became anti-circ...it's such a horrible thing, but I think it probably happens a lot because people just don't think about it. I shudder to think what would have happend if I'd married a circed American and my first child had been a boy...I hope I wouldn't have let anyone cut him, but I can't be sure. I do realise how fortunate I have been.

 

[ljpmom]

For us my DH who is circumcised was on board with having our son intact when we first discussed it. It was more my concern over the same kinds of things your friend has said. However once I began to research it and discuss what the "locker room" is really like it became clear that circumcision is not something that I have the right to do to my son and leaving him how God made him was the only option.

We also found out that my DH's father is intact, my DH did not even know! Really the whole I want my son to be like me arguement flew out the window with that one. How often do a father and son or brothers for that matter stand and compare themselves. Obviously in this case never!

Truthfully the final straw was viewing the actual circumcision done online. I sat and bawled it was horrifying. I have never ever heard a baby cry like that. And my DS who is almost one has never come close to crying that hard. I also credit my Bradley instructor for letting us know the truth about circumcision.

I would recommend sending your friend literature and also have her view a circumcision being done, it may be the thing to change her mind.

Megan

SAHM to
Landon 10-23-02

 

[somemama]

When I studied female genital mutilation, I suddenly realized that FGM and MGM are very similar. Then when I had a boy (intact), that really solidified it for me.

 

[Katambra]

I argued for the circumcision of our first son

but my dh wouldn't hear of it

It wasn't until I was doing some research online trying to figure out how bad it was that my son's foreskin didn't retract yet (at age 4!) Of course I found out there was nothing wrong with that and I also found out all the horrors of circ. I became even more adamantly against it than my dh.

 

[apmomto4]

Our first child was a girl, so we 'dodged the question' in that respect!

When our second child was born, we suspected it was a boy, but we weren't sure. (But his heartrate was always low, so the old wives' tales said it was a boy, so that was what we were counting on).

The OB asked us if we were planning to circ and my husband said yes, because he was circ'd. I think it was a case of 'that's the way it's done, right?'

So anyway...we're in labor, walking the halls in the hospital and we saw our OB go into the nursery and pull all the blinds down. We thought "that's curious", but didn't think much of it....until we heard the most horrible, blood curdling screams coming from the room!!!

We asked one of the nurses what was going on and she said, "It's okay. They're just circ'ing a baby." I thought my husband would pass out!!!! His skin was *sooo* pale!! And he said, "That's it! If it's a boy, we're leaving him alone!!"

And we did!! We now have two intact boys, ages 9 and 4, and I'm soooo glad we didn't circ!! But I'm one of the few moms in my circle of friends who didn't circ.

I wish more people were open to not circ'ing!! When my 1st son was born, the nurses kept coming in, "Are you sure you don't want to circ?" One even asked "Do you *know* what a circ is, honey?" ::sheesh!::

When I had my 2nd son, my OB was like "You don't circ, right?" And I told her "No" and her response was "I am SO glad! I wish more of my parents wouldn't circ. I hate doing them. I know it hurts."

But I live in a rural area and I know we have a high circ rate. It was something like 99% when I had my 1st boy...and it's lower now, but still something like 80%.

 

[Quirky]

I'm embarrassed to say I don't actually remember what I first read that made me sit up and take notice....my dad was circed (as an adult! voluntarily!

), I've never slept with an intact man, and I distinctly remember conversations with my college girlfriends about how circed men were neater and cleaner, and we could never imagine sleeping with an uncirced man.

:

I even remember getting all PC about calling it Female Genital Mutilation rather than Female Circumcision, because a circumcision is really no big deal, doncha know.

:

:

But once I got pregnant with ds and started researching, and learned about what the foreskin actually is and what it does, I became an intactivist pretty darned quickly, thankfully. I look at my son and I cannot imagine taking a knife to his penis. It makes me want to vomit.

 

[Festivus]

DH isn't circumcised - purely by accident. His mom said the doc she had when she birthed him didn't do them. His other brothers are circ'd.

So, that got me thinking, when I was pregnant. THEN I read an article in Men's health about circumcision and it described it all in detail. it was horrifying. I knew then, for certain, that there was no way my sons would be cut.

 

[DesireeH]

I have always thought it was "mean" but didnt realize how anti-circ I was until I was pregnant and doing research. Each thing I learned about how unnecessary it was made me angry that circ is even still being performed. Then when I saw that clip at cirp.org with the circ being performed I was ready to throw up because I was sad for that poor baby and wanted to save him!

Now that I learned that there is a purpose to the foreskin, etc I am very anti-circ. My dh isnt as anti-circ as I am. He says "hon, its their choice" (because I go on and on) but I dont think they should even get that choice, its NOT their penis thats going to be snipped!

 

[TigerTail]

i don't know; as soon as i found out such a thing was done, i was just opposed. it seemed ridiculous to me, and as ludicrous as bottlefeeding when your breasts are hanging there dripping milk.

i just don't get it, never have- mainstream upbringing or not. i am grateful to all of you who grew into your beliefs, as you have a patience with educating people i can never seem to dredge up.

intactivist from birth <g>, suse

 

[Sarah]

I lived in Europe and the USA and had sex with quite a few guys both intact and circumcised. None of the intact guys ever said anything to me, none of the circumcised guys ever said anything to me... but at a certain point it clicked and I understood that the differences I had percieved were not cultural differences (my original assumption) in the way these guys approached lovemaking, but that there was a very real anatomical difference... the cultural difference was that some cultures don't cut off a wonderfully functional and errogenous part of their men's sex organs.

I mentioned something about circumcision (in the context of being glad that he was not circumcised) to a british lover and his reaction was abject horror. he had no idea we do this as a matter of course in the USA. he was apalled. ashen faced. His honest reaction of horror woke me up to how numb I was and the rest of my culture was to accepting something that is utterly unacceptable. I have to say that if there was any "moment" it was seeing his un-anesthatized reaction that turned me into an intactivist.

Love Sarah

 

[jessikate]

Well, I think I started young. I was probably 4 or 5 when I saw some xtian movie on tv (prolly The 10 Commandments w/ C. Heston) and asked my mom about circ when it was mentioned in the movie. She told me that it was when they cut an extra flap of skin off of a boy's penis. Me: "That sounds silly. Why would he be born with it if he didn't need it?"

Never was brought up again.

I remember feeling vaguely cheated when I learned my boyfriend (now my DH) was circ'ed. Sort of the "Oh, now I'll never get to try an intact one" feeling (we were engaged at that point).

When I was pregnant & filling out hospital paperwork, there were checkboxes for breastfeeding and circ'ing. I immediatelt checked the breastfeeding box, but left the circ one because we hadn't discussed it. I was certain I'd be having a girl, so wasn't too concerned, but it made me think. I came in here & read a few threads, followed some links, and called my midwife immediately. Told her to write "NO CIRC" in big print on the paper. She was pleased.

so I've been anti-circ for a long time. just after "meeting" people in this forum did I see myself becoming an intactivist. Now it's just like breastfeeding for me - the obvious thing to do (leaving sons intact).

 

[Mama2Kimmy]

When I had my dd, had she been a boy, unfortunately we would have circ'ed. I was just not as knowledgable at the time, and my husband was circ'ed, so I just thought we'd do it.

After having my daughter I actually took a class on Circ. (given by an intactivist Dr & RN), it was AWESOME, I have been an intactivist ever since. Took a lot of convincing for my husband, his family & my mothers side of the family, but my father, his brothers, & my male cousins on my father's side are intact. I have always wanted to ask my grandma why she went against the grain, but don't know how to. I just thank God she did.

 

[Frankly Speaking]

Quote:

Originally posted by Mama2Kimmy I have always wanted to ask my grandma why she went against the grain, but don't know how to.

Put it in a positive context and ask her. "Grandma, I took my lead from you. You left your sons intact and that very much influenced my decision. How were you able to go against the grain?" I suspect that will flatter her and you may not be able to shut her up!

Frank

 

[Nemmer]

My education about circumcision has come slowly, but has turned me into a definite intactivist. I just wish I had known better when DS was born. I had two friends who I knew would choose not to circumcize if either had given birth to boys. But, we never really got into detailed discussions about it, and it just seemed their reasons were "because it isn't necessary," which just wasn't enough for me at the time. DH has one brother who is intact due to "not having enough foreskin to remove" at birth (the doctor's words). But, during our very brief research about it (we only had a few weeks notice about DS being born) we talked to him and discovered that he felt he would want his own boys circumcized because he had had numerous infections and problems during childhood.

That was probably the testimony that decided things for us. When I did a web search I didn't find ANY of the great info that you guys have since shown me. I didn't find Dr. Fleiss' articles till DS was about 4-5 months old. All I found were articles that were so neutral I honestly thought it was no big deal, and probably a "necessary evil." I believed that an intact penis required special care, because my BIL was taught that it does his whole life. So we thought that while it was very unpleasant to put him through this, he'd thank us later.

Then we witnessed the procedure itself. We knew we didn't want to leave him to suffer it alone, so we stayed there the whole time. DH held the binky in his mouth and I held his hand, stroking it, and we both talked to him, trying to reassure him. It makes me sick to remember... we both felt horrible afterward and I think we knew we had made a horrible mistake, but still didn't have any logic to back up that feeling! So, when I finally started reading information a few months later, it was an easy transition for me to be decidedly anti-circumcision. DH followed pretty quickly, but had to hear the info for himself (I read it to him) -- he wouldn't take my word for it.

So, now we both have taken opportunities to talk to others about it. He has a brother who is currently trying to have children, so we talked to them with the approach of "this is some information that I really wish we had read before DS was born, and I'd hate for you to make a decision like this at the last minute." I haven't heard back what they thought, but they were around and involved while we were making the decision and remember how difficult it was for us, so they were very receptive to the information. I print and send the It's A Boy brochure from circumstitions.com in all the prepaid envelopes from credit card offers that I get. (sort of a twist on the tactic of sending junk mail back to junk-mail-senders) Might not make a huge difference, but hopefully someone will be prompted to think about the issue. Even reading that brochure would have helped me, I'm sure.

Anyway, didn't mean to make this so long, but that's my story.

 

[somemama]

Nemmer, thank you for your post. I'm glad to see another Utah intactivist!!

The other day my dh gave away a copy of What Your Doctor May Not Tell You About Circumcision to a pregnant store clerk (having a boy) with this line, "Some people give away Bibles, but we give away this book." I just love him.

 

[Nemmer]

That's awesome, mamajulie!

 

[Mommiska]

It's been so interesting to read all of the replies. It does seem that having a son can make this issue an important one to many of us. I am just soooo thankful I live in the UK, where circumcision isn't even an issue. I didn't HAVE to be informed on this in order to protect my son...hopefully within the next few years, something similar will happen in the States.

 

[sohj]

Didn't particularly think about it until I had sex with an uncircumcised guy (maaaaaaan, that was a loooooong time ago

: ) and thought it was more fun -- peek-a-boo games and all

.

Then just thought that circumcising was weird.

Then (some years later) had a discussion with my husband about circumcision and told him that I was NOT going to approve of circumcising MY son if I ever were to have one. Told him to look into it and get back to me. Also said I could easily enough make sure I only had a girl. I think that got his attention. He looked into it and decided to agree.

Now, it hasn't come up yet with others. I think I have a pretty "crunchy" crowd of acquaintences.