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I feel your pain, but I don't have time to make the long, compassionate response I would like to... But I do have a recommendation. Have you read Carol Adams' book Living Among Meat Eaters? It explores these issues in depth and offers practical ideas on how to handle social interactions with meat eaters, including spouses, while being true to your values. I found it inspiring, grounding, and useful.
 

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I agree with some things you say. Comparing meat eating to slavery really is extreme and I really do see it as off-base. I DO, however, understand you obviously feel very strongly about veganism and animal welfare.

Consider this though, we are part of the animal kingdom - we are by design - omnivores. To see the consumption of animals as cruelty is to call every omnivore and carnivore on this planet just as cruel, and I just can't say that makes any sense (I'm sure there's a great intellectual argument against that, but I am speaking from a purely biological standpoint).

I do sympathize with you though
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You're about to bring a new life into this world and you want to raise her purely and with good intentions! This issue clearly resonates deeply with you and I know what it feels like when your partner isn't on the same page on a personal, intense issue.
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Maybe you and your DH will have to decide how much say your LO will have in choosing her own foods when the time comes. And, if your DH maintains his meat eating, it will probably be good for your child to see that meat eaters aren't necessarily evil murderers (you sound extremely passionate about this issue but I don't think you want to raise an extremist vegan with no room for tolerance...).

It sounds like you and your DH could demonstrate beautifully (for your LO) the dance of personal integrity, acceptance of others and healthy boundaries.

I hope you find some peace MrsKatie
 

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Sadly, it is an eat or be eaten world. And, if the coyotes didn't eat the bunnies, there would be too many bunnies and they would all die of starvation.

However, in the natural world there is no torture and it's not the strong, healthy ones that die. It is the weak or stupid that are eaten. Our animal farming has nothing to do with the natural order of things. It is an abhorrent aberration.

I do see your analogy to slavery. However, I think you won't get very far sharing that one with most people. They'll just see you as over-dramatic.

I am the wrong person to give advice on how to share your passions with the world. I used to end up offending everyone and ostracizing myself.

The only thing that I found that works well for me is if I just live my life and act as an example to others. That has been successful for me. Getting on my soapbox never worked. For some people it does, not me, though.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deepfeet View Post

Consider this though, we are part of the animal kingdom - we are by design - omnivores. To see the consumption of animals as cruelty is to call every omnivore and carnivore on this planet just as cruel, and I just can't say that makes any sense (I'm sure there's a great intellectual argument against that, but I am speaking from a purely biological standpoint).
I can't agree that we are, by design, omnivores. True carnivores/omnivores chase down prey, tear it to shreds with their own teeth/claws, and relish gorging themselves on everything from raw skin to muscle to blood to bone. Humans are simply not designed for this feat, and we have no taste for raw, bloody flesh. I have no problem with carnivores who practice their eating habits in this way - which is every other carnivore on the planet.

I do appreciate your understanding of where I'm coming from. I don't want to be a fanatic. And I keep quiet for the most part; I am not preaching to other people. If someone brings it up, and WANTS to discuss it, I will sometimes discuss it. Sometimes. But mostly, I avoid it, because I'm too emotional about this issue. But my heart and soul are in turmoil.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
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Originally Posted by SundayCrepes View Post

Sadly, it is an eat or be eaten world. And, if the coyotes didn't eat the bunnies, there would be too many bunnies and they would all die of starvation.

However, in the natural world there is no torture and it's not the strong, healthy ones that die. It is the weak or stupid that are eaten. Our animal farming has nothing to do with the natural order of things. It is an abhorrent aberration.

I do see your analogy to slavery. However, I think you won't get very far sharing that one with most people. They'll just see you as over-dramatic.

I am the wrong person to give advice on how to share your passions with the world. I used to end up offending everyone and ostracizing myself.

The only thing that I found that works well for me is if I just live my life and act as an example to others. That has been successful for me. Getting on my soapbox never worked. For some people it does, not me, though.
Thanks :)

I edited my original post. I still believe what I said, but you're right -- just not worth sharing.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsKatie View Post

I can't agree that we are, by design, omnivores. True carnivores/omnivores chase down prey, tear it to shreds with their own teeth/claws, and relish gorging themselves on everything from raw skin to muscle to blood to bone. Humans are simply not designed for this feat, and we have no taste for raw, bloody flesh. I have no problem with carnivores who practice their eating habits in this way - which is every other carnivore on the planet.

Who says? I know several people who basically throw meat on a grill and take it off, with the middle still completely red. I know people who happily eat raw ground beef. I see it less and less often as the dangers of not "properly" cooking our meat are hammered and hammered at us, but I still see it.

Personally, I think we're obvious omnivores, but if you disagree, it makes no sense to use culturally ingrained values, such as always cooking our meat, to make the point.
I'll bow out, now. I'm not a vegetarian, and really have nothing useful to suggest. I just saw this post under the Nutrition forum at the forum index, and the title caught my eye. I hope you can find a way to cope with the situation.
 

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I think that if we can't agree on the premise that from a biological standpoint we are omnivores (no matter how we catch cook and devour prey - whether we LEARNED over TIME how to preserve our food by drying, salting, or cooking) then I've got no business here either.

Good luck!
 

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I generally stick to the "You catch more flies with honey than vinegar" approach. I make really awesome vegan food, I share it freely. I offer to bake all the birthday cakes anytime we're invited to a party. I do everything I can to get as many people as possible eating vegan meals sometimes, and I let that be enough. It's easier to convince 10 people to eat vegan one meal a day than to convince one to go vegan forever.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
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Originally Posted by catnip View Post

I generally stick to the "You catch more flies with honey than vinegar" approach. I make really awesome vegan food, I share it freely. I offer to bake all the birthday cakes anytime we're invited to a party. I do everything I can to get as many people as possible eating vegan meals sometimes, and I let that be enough. It's easier to convince 10 people to eat vegan one meal a day than to convince one to go vegan forever.
Thank you!

I just wanted some responses like this -- I definitely didn't mean to start something nasty! I just feel very passionate about this issue and thought I had a safe place to be open about it here. I deleted my original post cause I didn't think it was provoking a very positive discussion... :)
 

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Do you listen to Colleen Patrick-Goudreau's podcasts? She talks about this a lot, and it's very inspiring and ... renewing? I guess? I don't know. Give them a shot, they might help you deal with the burnout and frustration.
 
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