[Zuri'smom]

Hi Everyone,
I thought I was doing child-led weaning when my daughter stopped being interested in nursing as frequently. See, she was nursing four to five times a day (including night nursings), and then all of a sudden she quit nursing in the morning and quit nursing before her nap so now she is nursing before bed and during the night. Well, I got to kind of like nursing her less and I started not enouraging her. I practiced "don't ask-don't refuse", which I thought was child-led weaning. My dh, bless his heart, searched on this sight and found an informative page that really explains child-led weaning and the beneifts of nursing until at least two.

the problem? My milk-supply is now low. Is there hope for me and my daughter to increase the supply through increase nursing frequency? Did I mention I'm also training for a marathon?

I am struggling right now because I feel bad I was not as well informed regarding the intracacies (spelling?)of child-led weaning, but I guess it's all part of the learning. Honestly, I was happy she was nursing less. I'm a full-time graduate student, although I'm only taking one class this summer. And it was nice to not need to nurse during the day anymore. It felt great to me.

But, after having read the information, I have been rethinking the don't ask-don't refuse thing and would like to nurse dd more often now.

ANy ideas?

Zuri's mom

 

[MamaPear]

The best way that I can think to increase supply is to nurse. Try offering the breast to your DD more often and see if that works.

Good luck to you Mama!

 

[Zuri'smom]

I forgot to explain that my DD has just turned 12 months. I nursed her exclusively for the first 7 months.

I already started nursing her more today! It felt good to give her what she needs. I decided to not worry about my milk supply - it'll just take time.

thanks for your support, Mama Pear!

 

[GeemiesMommie]

My baby is almost a year. When my milk supply seems to be getting low, I start pumping twice a day for 15 minutes each time, which is about 5 minutes or so after I'm pumped dry. In just a few days, my supply is back up.

Good luck!

 

[Embee]

As a CLW mom myself, I have to say here that it sounds as if you are simply following your DD's cues. And that's really the most important part of any nursing relationship, CLW or otherwise. If it was she who initiated the drops in nursing, and she is otherwise happy, healthy and on the move then you're a-OK. I do believe that don't offer-don't refuse can have its place in CLW, so long as its used with your child's cues in mind. We had "given" times for nursing, say before bedtime when it was clear it was expected so when during the day, he wasn't asking and was happy, I wasn't pushing. OTOH, we had times when he was asking all the time and although exhausting and a change from previous disinterest, I slowed down and our nursing relationship picked up again.

Kids this age, just becoming mobile, is a VERY common time for their first big drop in nursing. My son went through a time at about 9 to 13 months, where he just wasn't interested during the day (crawling, walking who has time?

). He was on the move and would not be deterred. Nighttime was a completely different story ALWAYS and no matter how much LESS he was nursing in the day, there was no way he was going to give up nighttime nursing... too attached to that little ritual. The good news is, that your supply stays in tune with their demand. If the relationship ebbs and flows, so does your milk. And if you're enjoying a little time out from frequent nursing? That's a-ok too. That first year is tough and you have a lot on your plate.

The one thing I would mention here is that on the journey of CLW, look for your nursing relationship to change, and perhaps change often. DS went through bouts of frequent nursing (growth spurts, both physical and emotional) on and off until he was almost 4. I was always sort of taken aback, particularly if he'd backed off for sometime... but we just went with it and after a time, the nursing need would decrease again and we'd be nursing less than before. It was a gradual journey of 3 step forward, 2 steps back, just as it should be. Periods of LOTS of nursing, periods of nursing just a night, etc. One thing I had to acknowledge over the time however, was never to assume that if a particular nursing was dropped, that it wouldn't be reinstated at some point with VIGOR.

And also, that NEW nursings might be initiated at some point. DS was NEVER a first thing in the morning nurser until over age 2 and this ended up being *THE* nursing that was the last to go at age 4. And when their appetite for nursing increases, they will nurse more and your supply will go up. Ah, nature. 'Tis a beautiful thing.

The best and you're doing great!

Em

 

[TiredX2]

Em---

While I agree with you in many ways, I think it is just not optimal for a 12 month old infant to only be nursing twice daily. At that age they should still be getting 50-75+% of their calories from bmilk and that is going to be hard indeed only nursing twice. Additionally, if the OPs goal is to go at least two years (the minimum recommended by the WHO and other assorted organizations) I would really want to be nursing a lot more than that at one year, kwim?

 

[kavamamakava]

She's at that age where mine weren't very interested in nursing. The interest came back around 16 months. My oldest CLW around 3 yrs 9 months and my 2nd is still nursing. Her 3rd birthday is on July 1st. Some days, she nurses like 10 times a day. Other days she only nurses once. I seem to keep up with her just fine (but I've always been nursing two at a time since she was born).

 

[Zuri'smom]

I really appreciate your personal experiences and opinions! I have enjoyed reading the responses and have found your words wise and helpful. I liked kwim's talk about how varied her CLW experiences have been throughout her children's lives. I LOVE that you were responding to them even though it wasn't a 'linear' process. Now that I'm writing that, it's such a Western concept to expect a linear, downward decrease in the amount of nursing, isn't it? I think it's much more natural and normal to expect waxing and waning, circles, if you will, rather than lines.

My DD has just slept through the night two times in a row!!!! Considering that last night's sleeping through makes the total number of times she has slept through the night up to five, you can imagine my surprise that she did it twice in a row. I'm so grateful for the extra sleep. That may or may not have anything to do with nursing since I"ve always nursed her through the night no matter what, but I'm open to the idea that she will still nurse at night and some nights she won't - that's just how it'll be.

Since the original post, I've been offering DD to nurse in the morning and before lunch and each time she has gotten REALLY excited, came over to me smiling broadly, can't wait to get up on my lap to nurse. I can't tell you how good it feels to BF her now. I was feeling good not nursing her, especially when I thought it wasn't what she needed, but now that I'm offering it to her and she wants it, it feels GREAT.

I wanted to put the links up to the websites that my DH found regarding what CLW is and stuff. In my case, DD may have indeed picked up on nursing again at a later age since she also was NOT interested in giving up her nighttime nursing (before bed), but I don't know if I would have been able to respond positively to that change before posting and reading the replies.
Now, I know I"ll be able to be open to her needs changing as she changes physically and emotionally.

http://www.kellymom.com/bf/weaning/babyselfwean.html
http://www.kellymom.com/bf/bfextended/ebf-benefits.html
Thanks again, mamas!

Zuri'smom

 

[TiredX2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zuri'smom Since the original post, I've been offering DD to nurse in the morning and before lunch and each time she has gotten REALLY excited, came over to me smiling broadly, can't wait to get up on my lap to nurse. I can't tell you how good it feels to BF her now. I was feeling good not nursing her, especially when I thought it wasn't what she needed, but now that I'm offering it to her and she wants it, it feels GREAT.

Sounds like things are going well.

Look forward to seeing you for months/years more

 

[richella]

Anybody else concerned about the marathon training? Running a marathon takes SO MUCH out of a person. I think it really depletes stores of all kinds of nutrients, etc. I feel that nursing takes so much of me, I wouldn't dream of running a marathon at this time. (dd is only 7 mos, not eating much solids yet, in contrast to yours.)

Any experts have any wisdom on this question?

 

[TiredX2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by richella Anybody else concerned about the marathon training? Running a marathon takes SO MUCH out of a person. I think it really depletes stores of all kinds of nutrients, etc. I feel that nursing takes so much of me, I wouldn't dream of running a marathon at this time. (dd is only 7 mos, not eating much solids yet, in contrast to yours.) Any experts have any wisdom on this question?

I'm not really concerned because I've known three women who ran marathons while nursing. Two *were* just half marathons, but their children were under a year. The other seriously trained between #1& #2 (they are 3.5 years apart) and since #1 nursed until almost 5 it didn't seem to effect *him.* She used to be virtually veggie, though, and ended up eating a LOT of meat, but I think that woudl have happened anyway because her son was alergic to virtually everything and she was on a really restrictive elimination diet for a couple years (then a less strict one as he got more tolerant)--- once you've eliminated all dairy, all wheat and several fruits & veggies, though, you just don't have *that* many choices.

 

[Zuri'smom]

Hey Mamas!
Thanks for your concern/support regarding the marathon training! This is my fifth marathon, first since my baby. I train REALLY slowly, it takes me over five months to train whereas most training programs are 3 and a half to 4 months. I made up my training based on all my previous marathon experiences, so it really works for me. So far, it's going great. I only run 4 miles a day during the week and then have a long run on the weekends. DH has been really supportive. The only issue is on the long run days I am definately low energy. I have to eat a lot to recover, etc. Now that I've upped my nursing again, I'm going to be eating more in general and that should help both nursing AND training!

I also know an anecdote that both me and my DH keep in mind. A friend of mine was cheering on someone at the Boston marathon - very prestigious, because you have to qualify to get in - and she watched a woman breastfeed her child at the finish line! Her DH brought her the babe and she went ahead and BF right there at the finish. If she can do it, I can!

 

[Embee]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TiredX2 Em--- While I agree with you in many ways, I think it is just not optimal for a 12 month old infant to only be nursing twice daily. At that age they should still be getting 50-75+% of their calories from bmilk and that is going to be hard indeed only nursing twice. Additionally, if the OPs goal is to go at least two years (the minimum recommended by the WHO and other assorted organizations) I would really want to be nursing a lot more than that at one year, kwim?

I hear ya, I do. The only thing I can really offer here is what I've gathered from my own experience and I just wanted to share in case anything was helpful to the OP.

I got the impression from the OP that the babe was nursing before bedtime and I took "during the night" to mean on and off throughout the night. When DS wasn't interested during the day, he SURELY made up for things at night--a common occurance. Also, I just wanted to point out that while offering is great, "pushing" can be stressful for both mom and babe. And then, that it may just be a temporary decline. Until DS was nearly 4, he often went through times when nursing declined rather abruptly only to have the regular/frequent nursings return. The time around one year is really common for this as babes are newly mobile and very excited to be walking about. Once DS got used to his upright status, his nursing returned and if memory serves, he nursed a ton from about 14 to 18 months, dropped way off again, and then resumed wholeheartedly at 2 to 2 1/2, dropped off, etc., etc... until he weaned a couple of months ago at 4 and 3 months. *sigh*

I hope this helps to make my original post more clear.

Em

 

[Zuri'smom]

hi Em,
Your original reply to my post was clear! And I DID mean that DD was nursing throughout the night and before bedtime. You read that right. DD nursed two to three times per night. She just very recently stopped waking up at night. But who knows if that will last or not! Every babe is different, so we'll see. Since she isn't waking up at night now, though, and since my OP, I have been nursing her throughout the day - at least four times. My milk supply is already better after just a day and a half!

Thanks again for all the help!
zuri'smom

 

[Embee]

Great News Zuri's Mom! I'm glad to hear your finding a way to work things out and if she's sleeping through the night, that must be so helpful to your training! I'm so relieved I didn't misunderstand your post. After reading Tired's mention of my post I was worried I might have gone off topic in a big way. I think my main intent was just to be supportive and reassuring. CLW is an "on the job" learning experience for sure and in keeping that all babes and moms are different in their approach, there is a huge variety of circumstances. Its hard to to really stand in anyone else's shoes, kwim? The only thing I can offer is what I've experienced and for us, don't offer-don't refuse was more of DS's way of saying, "hey mom, I'll let ya know!" That and the fact that we always maintained the "given" nursings of nap and bedtime, and his asking during the night, etc., our nursing relationship was varied, but steady in many ways. In all, its about knowing your babe. For me, even though he wasn't always nursing frequently, it was easy to sense that nursing was a very important force in his life. (Well, up until a couple of months ago when he more or less, dropped me like a hot potato).

Good going on your training btw! DH wishes he would have trained in such a way for his last marathon... he'd tried to "fast track" and it wasn't NOT a pleasant experience. And I love the story about the woman nursing at the finish line. DH will love that one too, so I'll be sure to let him know!

Good luck!

Em

 

[Zuri'smom]

Hi Embee,
Your original reply to me was VERY helpful and VERY supportive. i learned a lot and I found a lot of positive encouragement to continue nursing DD. So thanks!

I'm glad the marathon training stuff helps, too! I heard from a lot of people who train on the fast track that they end up hating to run by the end and dreading the marathon, so your DH is not alone. I, too, loved the nursing mom story...I'll be remembering her throughout my training!

THanks again, friend,
zuri'smom

 

[Embee]