If she doesn't quit, I'll start bottlefeeding.

Amris · Apr 27, 2007

My 5 month old dd has started yanking off the breast to look around lately. 
It has caused my nipples to become shredded again. I am not fast enough to catch her and smoosh her... so I have no idea how to stop her from doing this. 
Any recommendations? Because it hurts so bad I find myself delaying feeding her until she's crying and so hungry that she won't do that. Then when she starts doing it, I quit feeding her. Before long, she starts crying for food again. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/gloomy.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Gloomy">: 
I really need help, I feel bad making her starving hungry, but my breasts hurt so bad I'm about to go onto a couple days of formula just to give them a break, and I really don't want to do that. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/mecry.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="crying">

quirkylayne · Apr 27, 2007

This is normal 5 month old behavior. The best you can do is nurser her in a quiet, minimally active enviroment. Use some sort of cream on your nips to help them. Giving a bottle will allow her to eat and look around at the same time, and might become a preference. I think you probably know the risks of starting bottles/formula. 
You can do it! You can keep nursing! Sore nipples hurt and distractable babies are hard to deal with but I know you are giving it your best shot <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug">

alegna · Apr 27, 2007

Ouch! I agree- limit distratctions, and personally I would keep a hand on the back of her head all the time to catch it when it happens. 
good luck! 
-Angela

Zwillingsmama · Apr 27, 2007

Mine also do this sometimes. What really helps is to block their sight with either a cloth diaper or I hold my hand in front of their eyes. It helps them stay calm and focused on nursing.

sunnysideup · Apr 27, 2007

It might be worth a try to nurse her in a sling. Some babies this age are easily distracted and the sling helps to block out some stimuli. It also holds the baby in tight, making it harder to pull away.

Momma Aimee · Apr 27, 2007

Theo did this all the time -- still does but now he lets go first. 
I agree with eveyone else -- limit distraction -- quiet place, nuse in carrier, and I always held on to his head when we are at that stage -- 
Know it will get better. she will start to let go before she looks around <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile"> 
also I found talking to him, or singing to him, lots of eye contact -- made his fouce more on me and less on all the so intresting things areound us -- but he'd still do it. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile"> 
You can get though it 
honestly a bottle isn't going to help. you won't be working to correct the behavior, and you will be risking your BF relationship. 
Aimee

gwynthfair · Apr 27, 2007

Mine does this too. I find that patting her butt or back gently is enough of a distraction many times to keep her nursing. Sometimes though I have to take her into a dark room AND swaddle her and then she will finally nurse. 
I'm sorry it hurts so much. Can you try putting some lansinoh on right before she nurses so there's a little more lube when she pulls off?

Amris · Apr 27, 2007

I don't feel like there's much of a "risk" to the BFing relationship, to be honest. 
We don't have a "relationship" such as it is. I breastfeed her, but I hate it. I spent 12 weeks of the last 20 in sheer and complete misery. Just when it FINALLY got to the point where I didn't dread even the THOUGHT of it, this starts up. 
A huge part of me wishes she would prefer a bottle, because 14 weeks out of 22 being immensely painful just isn't what a "relationship" should be like. Right now, I am resentful to the extreme. I am borderline hating her. As soon as I know she's hungry, most of me wants to just leave her here. To just walk away and say to hell with the whole damned thing. 
I fought tooth and nail to get through those first weeks because at least then, I could hold onto the belief that it would get better. Now that illusion is gone, so there's nothing left except another what, maybe 2 years of indentured, agonizing servitude. I feel like nursing is a horrific punishment. 
I'm tired of my breasts being tormented with red hot pokers and razors. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/gloomy.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Gloomy">: 
And without the belief that it will get better, what's left? Oh yeah, it's better for her. Oh yeah, but she'd survive fine without it. It's better for her is losing its appeal really fast. Where do I enter into this? 
Oh yeah, I'm the indentured servant who gets to scream in agony every 3 minutes while nursing. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/mecry.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="crying">: 
I just hate this. I mean, I really hate it. And as for it being a "relationship," if any adult took razors and hot pokers to my breasts every hour and a half, the relationship WOULD bloody well be over. 
Something has to give, and I'm really afraid it will be me. Then I'll hate myself. So I just take the punishment and scream in pain and cry when I know she's hungry. There is NOTHING even REMOTELY "beautiful" about breastfeeding for me. NOTHING.

RachelGS · Apr 27, 2007

Oh, mama. I couldn't read that and not respond. I am so, so sorry you're having such a terrible time. I'm so sad for you that it's interrupting your love and caring instincts toward your baby. Do you have some support from a really good LC? A really good therapist? It's really hard to take care of a baby, and the stuff you're describing makes it just such a sad and lonely venture. Can I do anything to help you right now? <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug"><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug"><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug">

alegna · Apr 27, 2007

Oh hon, you sound so fed up. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug"> 
I've been there with the pain and hating it, though I will admit, mine got better before 12 weeks. 
Could you have thrush? Just an idea.... 
Take it one day, one feeding at a time. 
It DOES get better. I never had the roses and sunshine feelings about nursing that many moms report, but through the months and years it has gotten better. Often I do look at her nursing and smile. 
good luck! 
-Angela

celestialdreamer · Apr 27, 2007

<div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
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<div>Originally Posted by alegna <a href="/community/forum/post/7969097"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Could you have thrush? Just an idea....</div>
</td>
</tr></table></div>
I just wanted to second this possibility... I had thrush when my dd was about 6 months old and didn't realize it until I had been suffering for weeks. Is it possible that she may have a bad latch also? That can cause chronic nipple pain. Also, if you have a LLL leader or group you can talk to for support, I highly recommend it. 
I'm so sorry that you are struggling so badly right now, I have had my own nursing struggles too. I can say that in time and with some work (and after many tears) it did get better. I remember the feelings you are describing and hope you can find a solution soon. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug">

catgrace · Apr 27, 2007

Nursing is not supposed to hurt. There's something wrong, and if you can get help figuring out what it is, the change may well be drastic improvement (the way you describe things, it doesn't seem to be able to get worse). 
In my area, there's one LC who is visited by moms across the whole state, who has helped moms who had believed that their pain was "just normal for them", but was actually thrush, chronic plugged ducts, poor latch, etc. If you can find an expert in your area, then it may be worth whatever expense or distance travelled to get there. 
You shouldn't suffer to breastfeed. You're exhausted, uncomfortable, and you're having a hard time loving your little one. I hope you find help soon. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug">

Amris · Apr 27, 2007

I might have thrush, I don't know. 
I've got blisters all over the nipple, though, and a lot of them are seeping blood. When she pulls off, the skin stretches and several of them pop. That's what hurts the most. 
I've been using lansinoh, I don't want to use another round of difloucan, though, I am JUST starting to get my nethers back into balance from all the drugs. 
Is there a less invasive way to get rid of thrush?

Momma Aimee · Apr 27, 2007

i would contact an LC -- it should not hurt that much. 
I am preggo and it doesn't hurt that much 
A

georgia · Apr 27, 2007

Hot poker descriptor sounds just like thrush, IME. I spent almost a year of nursing my first in excrutiating pain...so I can relate to the pain is just normal thing. I tried everything in the book, and when I finally turned to Dr. Newman's protocol for Diflucan, it worked relatively quickly and nursing became pain-free. It was like a miracle for me. I hope that you can find a quick solution that works for you and your sweet little one <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug">

georgia · Apr 27, 2007

<a href="http://www.mothering.com/articles/new_baby/breastfeeding/breastfeed-thrush.html" target="_blank">http://www.mothering.com/articles/ne...ed-thrush.html</a> 
HTH! 
I should have some other links, gotta go look <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug">

letniaLynne · Apr 27, 2007

<div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by Amris <a href="/community/forum/post/7969508"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I might have thrush, I don't know. 
I've got blisters all over the nipple, though, and a lot of them are seeping blood. When she pulls off, the skin stretches and several of them pop. That's what hurts the most. 
I've been using lansinoh, I don't want to use another round of difloucan, though, I am JUST starting to get my nethers back into balance from all the drugs. 
Is there a less invasive way to get rid of thrush?</div>
</td>
</tr></table></div>
Major hugs! you are an amazing mom for sticking it out this far. I found these links in the thrush support thread here on mothering. <a href="http://www.breastfeeding.com/all_abo...ut_thrush.html" target="_blank">http://www.breastfeeding.com/all_abo...ut_thrush.html</a> <a href="http://www.kellymom.com/bf/concerns/...resources.html" target="_blank">http://www.kellymom.com/bf/concerns/...resources.html</a> many good links listed! <a href="http://www.breastfeeding-basics.com/html/candida.shtml" target="_blank">http://www.breastfeeding-basics.com/html/candida.shtml</a> <a href="http://www.askdrsears.com/html/8/T083100.asp" target="_blank">http://www.askdrsears.com/html/8/T083100.asp</a> 
(info here on nystatin, acidopholis (a probiotic), and gentian violet) <a href="http://www.breastfeedingonline.com/yeast.shtml" target="_blank">http://www.breastfeedingonline.com/yeast.shtml</a> 
specific instructions for each treatment

Phoenix_Rising · Apr 27, 2007

oh, mama, i'm sorry, that sounds REALLY painful! 
no ideas, just wanted to send a <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug">

Amris · Apr 27, 2007

I appreciate all the thrush links. I did have it early on, but it manifested itself differently then, no blisters, so I didn't associate it since it feels very differently. 
I'll try some of the other methods, but it looks like i'll have to take on difloucan again. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/gloomy.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Gloomy">: 
Which means I can give up on sex for another 5 months, I'm sure. Ugh, why does it have to be so hard?!

darwinphish · Apr 27, 2007

Just say no to diflucan! Get thee to a healthfood store and buy some grapeFRUIT seed extract. In a little white bottle with a red cap. Put 10 drops GSE to one ounce water, and swish with a cottonball on your nipples after every feeding/pumping. It eradicated my thrush when every other treatment in the book (diflucan included) had failed. 
Also, put away the lansinoh. You can culture thrush in lansinoh. I have no idea why it's the 'gold standard' nipple cream. Try to find some motherlove nipple cream instead. It has marshmellow which inhibits thrush. 
BTW, if Kira has thrush in her mouth that can cause popping off behavior too. 
I had chronic thrush with Helen and our nursing relationship was much like yours. It still makes me cry sometimes if I think about it too much. 
Anyway, I wanted to say to you: whatever you decide, it's OK. 
If you're too torn up and resentful and angry and frustrated, but you still want to get that liquid gold into Kira, you could switch to exclusively pumping. In fact, it could improve your supply if the pain of nursing is not allowing you multiple let-downs. Not all pumps are created equal - if you can rent a Medela Symphony, it will make pumping easier and faster. And you could always see if there's a chance to start again with nursing down the road. 
Mama - not everyone has a beautiful nursing relationship, and some of us never can or will. Anyone who tells you otherwise is lying. And if you need to pump and get a break, that's what you need to do. You do what is right for YOU. 
You might consider joining MOBI - mothers overcoming breastfeeding issues. <a href="http://www.mobimotherhood.org/MM/default.aspx" target="_blank">http://www.mobimotherhood.org/MM/default.aspx</a>

If she doesn't quit, I'll start bottlefeeding.

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