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I’m all questions and no answers. I lack the knowledge to defend my position on vaccinations – of course I’ll never satisfy everyone with my explanations anyway. I never thought about defending my position until now. I did enough investigation when DD was born to know that I wasn’t going to alter her immune system by injecting her with God-knows-what. As my daughter gets into more activities I can see that it’s becoming more of an issue. Other parents question and I would like to have a more informed, fact-filled answer.<br><br>
A “discussion” on Gardasil is what prompted me to post this, but my list of questions goes much beyond that. There are so many issues it makes my head spin and I am floored that so many people have so much FAITH in Gardasil and can’t wait to have their daughters injected with it. Not to mention making it mandatory.<br><br>
I try to read this site in my “spare” time, but it moves so quickly I can’t keep up. I’ll post my laundry list of questions/thoughts because I can’t think how else to do it:<br><br>
Is the efficacy of vaccinations a separate issue from the preservative dangers of vaccinations? It just seems to me that most of the people I know are so sure (brainwashed?) that vaccinations have saved their children that they would never consider not vaxing. But they can see how dangerous the preservatives are and that might be more likely to make them explore/think.<br><br>
What are the preservatives that are no longer being used? When did that stop?<br><br>
What preservatives are still being used and what are the effects of those preservatives?<br><br>
What other dangerous ingredients does Gardasil use and what are the effects of those?<br><br>
Is there a place where I can “follow the money” on each vax? Has anyone already done that homework? And what’s the money trail like on Gardasil?<br><br>
Is there any way to measure the toxins in a child’s body left by the vaxes? And is there anything that can be done about it?<br><br>
I’m sure I’m not the first person to think of this, but why isn’t there a Case Against Vaccinations forum? It sure would help people separate information and keep up with the Vaccinations forum.<br><br>
I know this is long and covers many topics, but I would at least like to know where to start. After I feel like I know a little bit I’ll pray for the eloquence so many of you have.
 

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I'm curious to know why you would assume that taking the advice of anonymous strangers on a message board (and, lets face it, we're all anonymous strangers on a message board) would be better than taking the advice of a doctor (or many doctors)? I mean no offense by this, honestly, but... why not do your own research and make up your own mind instead of simply accepting what anyone on either side has to say?<br><br>
It just doesn't make sense to me. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/greensad.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="greensad">
 

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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">Is the efficacy of vaccinations a separate issue from the preservative dangers of vaccinations?</td>
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Yes, I believe so.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">What are the preservatives that are no longer being used? When did that stop?<br><br>
What preservatives are still being used and what are the effects of those preservatives?</td>
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This can't really be answered quickly, but I suspect the one most people have heard about is thimerisol, which has been linked to autism and was removed from some vaccines a few years ago (but <a href="http://www.fda.gov/cber/vaccine/thimerosal.htm#t1" target="_blank">still exist in some</a>, either in trace amounts or more). Your ped's office will probably try to reassure you that vaxes are safe because "we don't use the ones with thimerisol anymore."<br><br>
However, there are many other "gross" and arguably dangerous (and carcinogenic) ingredients in the common vaxes, including formaldahyde, aluminum, etc., and some vaxes are made with strains derived from monkeys, human fetuses and other sources.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">What other dangerous ingredients does Gardasil use and what are the effects of those?</td>
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I don't know.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">Is there a place where I can “follow the money” on each vax? Has anyone already done that homework? And what’s the money trail like on Gardasil?</td>
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I don't know.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">Is there any way to measure the toxins in a child’s body left by the vaxes? And is there anything that can be done about it?</td>
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I believe you can have your child's hair tested for levels of mercury and some other toxins. And there is a procedure called chelation which some people have used to remove toxins, particularly in children with autism (and perhaps other). Again, I don't know very much about this. I've mostly read about it in <a href="http://www.amazon.com/gp/redirect.html?ie=UTF8&linkCode=ur2&camp=1789&creative=9325&tag=motheringhud-20&location=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.amazon.com%2FEvidence-Harm-Vaccines-Epidemic-Controversy%2Fdp%2FB000JU7MQ6%2Fsr%3D8-1%2Fqid%3D1171390974%2Fref%3Dpd_bbs_1%2F102-0187316-5225710%3Fie%3DUTF8%26s%3Dbooks" target="_blank">this book</a>.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">I’m sure I’m not the first person to think of this, but why isn’t there a Case Against Vaccinations forum? It sure would help people separate information and keep up with the Vaccinations forum.</td>
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You will find that this board <i>is</i> largely a Case Against Vaccinations forum, in spirit if not in name, simply because the majority of people who post here are against vaccinations (and many are very well-informed as to why). I am still in the learning mode, but I have found that to be the general tone of this board.<br><br>
Hope that helps a bit. Other people, please let me know if I've misrepresented any of the facts.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>prettypixels</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7288739"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I'm curious to know why you would assume that taking the advice of anonymous strangers on a message board (and, lets face it, we're all anonymous strangers on a message board) would be better than taking the advice of a doctor (or many doctors)? I mean no offense by this, honestly, but... why not do your own research and make up your own mind instead of simply accepting what anyone on either side has to say?<br><br>
It just doesn't make sense to me. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/greensad.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="greensad"></div>
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Well, that doesn't make much sense, either. Why would she take the "advice" of a doctor who has inve$tment$ in the vaccine machine, over her own research?
 

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<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>prettypixels</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7288739"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I'm curious to know why you would assume that taking the advice of anonymous strangers on a message board (and, lets face it, we're all anonymous strangers on a message board) would be better than taking the advice of a doctor (or many doctors)? I mean no offense by this, honestly, but... why not do your own research and make up your own mind instead of simply accepting what anyone on either side has to say?<br><br>
It just doesn't make sense to me. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/greensad.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="greensad"></div>
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It makes sense to me; I didn't know where to start when I was first learning about this, either. I'm sure she doesn't plan to take this board's word as her final answer. Besides, for many, bouncing questions off knowledgeable people is a good start in getting direction for research. My 2 cents. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile">
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>LittleRockstar</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7288502"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">And what’s the money trail like on Gardasil?</div>
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Merck has pushed this vax HARD, in order to get the jump on Glaxo-Smith Kline, who is also set to put out an HPV vax:<br><br><a href="http://mothering.com/discussions/showthread.php?t=600025&highlight=Gardasil" target="_blank">http://mothering.com/discussions/sho...light=Gardasil</a><br><br><br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;"><i>I’m sure I’m not the first person to think of this, but why isn’t there a Case Against Vaccinations forum?</i></td>
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Major can o'worms there. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/dizzy.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Dizzy">:
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>junomama</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7288826"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">for many, bouncing questions off knowledgeable people is a good start in getting direction for research.</div>
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<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/yeahthat.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="yeah that">:<br><br>
And when it comes to vaccines, I don't consider most doctors to be very knowledgeable. They just spew out by rote, what they were taught - "Vaccines have saved the world".
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
<div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>prettypixels</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7288739"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I'm curious to know why you would assume that taking the advice of anonymous strangers on a message board (and, lets face it, we're all anonymous strangers on a message board) would be better than taking the advice of a doctor (or many doctors)? I mean no offense by this, honestly, but... why not do your own research and make up your own mind instead of simply accepting what anyone on either side has to say?<br><br>
It just doesn't make sense to me. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/greensad.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="greensad"></div>
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Who said I assumed the advice of an anonymous stranger would be better than anything? I am interested in what others have to say, their research, and where they got their research. I have done some of my own research and I'm doing more now. I would never take anyone's advice blindly, that doesn't make sense to me either. I consulted my own doctor and the ped I was planning on using before DD was born on the vax issues. I read the many articles they gave me. My doctor advised against vaccinations; the ped advised vaccinations, but his own children aren't fully vaxed. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/headscratch.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="headscratch"><br><br>
I'm not sure what led you to your assumptions, but I am doing my own research and I will always, ALWAYS make up my own mind.
 

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<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>LittleRockstar</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7289064"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">the ped advised vaccinations, but his own children aren't fully vaxed. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/headscratch.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="headscratch"></div>
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Pretty telling, isn't it?<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;"><i>I am doing my own research and I will always, ALWAYS make up my own mind.</i></td>
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<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/clap.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="clap">
 

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Dear Rockstar,more mothers need to be like you and do some digging,i applaud you!<br><br>
Yes there has been a link to "follow the money" on Gardasil;<br><a href="http://healthtruthrevealed.com/full-page.php?id=1535093902&page=article" target="_blank">http://healthtruthrevealed.com/full-...2&page=article</a><br><br>
More on vaccines;<br><a href="http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm" target="_blank">http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm</a><br><a href="http://www.909shot.com" target="_blank">www.909shot.com</a><br><a href="http://www.thinktwice.com" target="_blank">www.thinktwice.com</a><br><a href="http://www.vaclib.org" target="_blank">www.vaclib.org</a><br><a href="http:/vaccine/articles.html" target="_blank">www.*********/vaccine/articles.html</a><br><br>
Read and i'm sure you will see the picture VERRY CLEARLY.<br><br>
Tyler
 

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junomamma,<br><br>
I am not trying to pick on you but I really want accuracy and DON'T want folks to be misled regarding mercury toxicity... determining and testing for mercury toxicity is tough / impossible once the initial period following exposure is over (like 30 days) and multiple smaller gradual exposures will not show in blood or hair testing.. Many many parents are mislead into thinking their kid has no mercury tox when a hair test shows low or no levels of mercury.. this is NOT accurate, nor are blood tests.. mercury tox must be carefully examined thru extrapolation testing of hair minaerals, morphology of blood cells , history of known exposure, symptoms, POSSIBLY a challenge chemet urine capture test.. I will try to dig up some of my old links to determining mercury tox for you guys and how to determine toxicity<br><br>
just wanted to be clear and have accurate info<br><br>
the odd thing is that many/ most autistic kids have very LOW hair Hg at 1 yr old (and these were the kids shot with thimerosal vaxs) how that works is that kids that can't detox teh Hg it will not come out in hair, pee ,poop etc so they have faulty detox pathways so all the hg stays in frying their brains so it does not show in testing KWIM? If a person is really bad in detox pathways and low on minerals even a chemet cahllenge can be neg! which is scarey.<br><br>
I think my point is that to determine mercury tox you really *should* consult a complimentary doc who specializes in that area (DAN doc etc) so they can guide you as to what is rotting your kids brain/ immune system, and how best to remove it
 

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Cutler is a bit of a controversial figure in teh Hg detox world but I have found his counting rules pretty accurate as one of teh tools to use to determine Hg tissue levels<br><br><a href="http://home.earthlink.net/~moriam/HOW_TO_hair_test.html" target="_blank">http://home.earthlink.net/~moriam/HOW_TO_hair_test.html</a>
 

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this one is fairly complete also<br><br><a href="http://www.icnr.com/uam/hgcourse/M7/ToxicityTesting.html" target="_blank">http://www.icnr.com/uam/hgcourse/M7/...tyTesting.html</a>
 

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<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>sorteep</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7291163"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">junomamma,<br><br>
I am not trying to pick on you but I really want accuracy and DON'T want folks to be misled regarding mercury toxicity... determining and testing for mercury toxicity is tough / impossible once the initial period following exposure is over (like 30 days) and multiple smaller gradual exposures will not show in blood or hair testing.. Many many parents are mislead into thinking their kid has no mercury tox when a hair test shows low or no levels of mercury.. this is NOT accurate, nor are blood tests.. mercury tox must be carefully examined thru extrapolation testing of hair minaerals, morphology of blood cells , history of known exposure, symptoms, POSSIBLY a challenge chemet urine capture test.. I will try to dig up some of my old links to determining mercury tox for you guys and how to determine toxicity<br><br>
just wanted to be clear and have accurate info<br><br>
the odd thing is that many/ most autistic kids have very LOW hair Hg at 1 yr old (and these were the kids shot with thimerosal vaxs) how that works is that kids that can't detox teh Hg it will not come out in hair, pee ,poop etc so they have faulty detox pathways so all the hg stays in frying their brains so it does not show in testing KWIM? If a person is really bad in detox pathways and low on minerals even a chemet cahllenge can be neg! which is scarey.<br><br>
I think my point is that to determine mercury tox you really *should* consult a complimentary doc who specializes in that area (DAN doc etc) so they can guide you as to what is rotting your kids brain/ immune system, and how best to remove it</div>
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Good to know ... I really don't know very much about this at all, so I appreciate the clarification and would not want to mislead anybody (including myself).
 

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Let's spend less time focusing on whether or not the poster should post here (as per the <a href="http://www.mothering.com/mdc/mdc_useragreement.html" target="_blank">User Agreement</a>, all posters should feel welcome to post questions on MDC:<br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">Through your direct or indirect participation here you agree to make a personal effort to maintain a comfortable and respectful atmosphere for our guests and members.</td>
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)<br><br>
and more time answering the OPs question. If you would like to start a thread about the wisdom of asking questions on a message board, perhaps TAO would be a good place for that?
 
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