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Discussion Starter #1
So as someone who was coerced by anecdotal evidence and unfounded claims, I was wondering what the most ridiculous anti-vax claim you've ever heard was??

I will list a few I've heard over the years:

"You can't get tetanus as long as the wound bleeds"

"Combination shots have never been tested for safety"

"Clean water eradicated polio"

"You have more of a chance of dying from vaccines than you do [insert VPD here]"

"chiropractors can cure anything"

"breastmilk works as good as vaccines"

"my unvaccinated child isn't a threat to yours"


.....I could go on. I just cannot believe I believed that crap!! Anyone else an anti-vax convert?? Idk how I got caught up in the hysteria. I am smart. Educated. Reasonable. I let anecdotes and "natural" doctors persuade me into the anti-vax conspiracy.. yet if you look up credible sources for any of the ^^ statements, they can all be refuted... wtf was I thinking? lol
 

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MDC has a policy of respectful debate - better not to make fun of views espoused by parents who choose not to vaccinate, but rather to faculty refute them (which is often pretty easy I agree).
 

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Discussion Starter #3
MDC has a policy of respectful debate - better not to make fun of views espoused by parents who choose not to vaccinate, but rather to faculty refute them (which is often pretty easy I agree).
I hope my post didn't come across as making fun of anyone, though now re-reading I can see how it would be viewed that way. Not my intention! I am new to the pro-vax movement and just feel empowered (with information and knowing I am doing the right thing. Even though we didn't vax, I def did it out of fear and based on lies/propaganda) and I also feel ashamed at the lies I used to believe :( . Honestly it is embarrassing to think I used to believe things that had no sound evidence or credibility. I think I was just looking to connect with others who were once anti that are now pro and look back and think, "what the heck was I thinking?!"
 

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I've been there. I found some things I had written in the past about vaccines and I was so embarrassed by what I was saying.

It makes sense though. A lot of the stuff that I was reading about was appealing to me because it was the first time I'd ever heard it, and there didn't seem to be as much info out there refuting it as there is now. Being opposed to vaccines kinda fit with my ideology at the time, too.

One of the simplest myths that I think drew me in was the idea of a cover-up. I always thought that some history was really being hidden for nefarious purposes. When I read Arthur Allen's "Vaccine: The controversial story of medicine's greatest lifesaver" that's when I realized that the errors that were made in the past weren't covered up. The history is still there, it's documented, and we have learned from it.
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
I've been there. I found some things I had written in the past about vaccines and I was so embarrassed by what I was saying.

It makes sense though. A lot of the stuff that I was reading about was appealing to me because it was the first time I'd ever heard it, and there didn't seem to be as much info out there refuting it as there is now. Being opposed to vaccines kinda fit with my ideology at the time, too.

One of the simplest myths that I think drew me in was the idea of a cover-up. I always thought that some history was really being hidden for nefarious purposes. When I read Arthur Allen's "Vaccine: The controversial story of medicine's greatest lifesaver" that's when I realized that the errors that were made in the past weren't covered up. The history is still there, it's documented, and we have learned from it.

Yes, yes, yes! I was nodding my head in agreement while reading this. I, too, got sucked into the idea that big pharma was evil and that they are out to make a profit (it is a story line that can be convincing). Add anecdotes and scare tactics, and it had me sold. Fear sold me. I was told to not worry about the diseases, and that many of the VPDs "don't kill" or are "harmless"... Then I started to think about how I got far fewer vaccines as a kid, and bought into the idea that since I survived childhood without vaccines that my kids could too. Insanity. I cannot believe I didn't take into consideration that the year I was born, hundreds of thousands of children were dying from Hib meningitis. Or that the Flu still kills thousands annually. Or that diseases like hep B can be contracted from a toddler biting mine! (So much for the whole "your baby isn't getting a tattoo or sexually active so they don't need a hep B shot"). I also cannot believe I didn't look into the studies that prove and show how combination/multiple vaccines ARE tested for safety before being added/recommended to the vax schedule. I also had no idea how NVIC works. How you don't even have to prove that the vaccine absolutely caused your "reaction" but that instead you just have to prove your symptoms coincided with the time of being vaccinated. And that NVIC was created as a way to compensate those families because there is no way they would ever win if it went to an actual court (outside of "vaccine court", for lack of a better term). My uncle is an attorney and explained this to me recently. He said that there were people who were trying to sue vax manufacturers for every little thing! The cases were getting squashed in court and the families were not winning- this obviously cost vax manufacturers big $$$ because every time they were hit with a bogus lawsuit they had to shell out money to squash it in court. It was costing them so much with the insane lawsuits, that they asked the government to help them by creating the so-called "immunity" from being liable. Otherwise they were going to stop making vaccines due to how costly it is to keep going to court. I used to believe that the government awarded the "immunity" from lawsuits as part of the conspiracy that big pharma is out to get us. I couldn't have been more wrong- it was to help us! If vax manufacturers stop making vaccines, that means more diseases, more people sick, more people dying... so they got the protection from liability so they could continue to help people. And I learned that it is businesses that pay a vaccine tax which goes to award families/patients that have true, ultra-rare reactions (NOT all citizens paying this, like many anti-vaxers so wrongly say) . I had believed the VAERS was the "truth" I needed to see how big pharma is out to get us. LOL. Nope, I had it all wrong! Anyone can report ANY reaction. I read a while ago that as a joke someone reported to VAERS they now have super powers post-vaccination, just to prove that we cannot take all VAERS claims seriously! I looked at the statistics of NVIC payouts (for true, documented reactions) and when you compare it to how many millions of people got vaccinated, it makes me cringe at the fact I used to believe anecdotal fear mongering from anti-vaxers. I believed that vaccines were dangerous. I do have some familial history of vax reactions, and that scared me too. But at the end of the day it wasnt life threatening and at least there is protection from disease!
 

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I also had no idea how NVIC works. How you don't even have to prove that the vaccine absolutely caused your "reaction" but that instead you just have to prove your symptoms coincided with the time of being vaccinated. And that NVIC was created as a way to compensate those families because there is no way they would ever win if it went to an actual court (outside of "vaccine court", for lack of a better term). My uncle is an attorney and explained this to me recently. He said that there were people who were trying to sue vax manufacturers for every little thing! ...
I was confused about a lot of the same things.

Also, I'll point out (and consider how deceptive this is) NVIC is an advocacy organization that can be pretty fairly categorized as anti-vax because they focus on risks, lead people to read VAERS and package inserts, and receive funds&support from Joe Mercola who pushes anti-vax propaganda and sells tons of supplements saying as long as you're healthy, you don't need to be vaccinated.

NVICP is the vaccine court that you're talking about. It might be easier to shorten it to VICP so as not to get it confused with NVIC. The two have nothing to do with each other, except that...

Barbara Loe Fisher, who runs the anti-vax advocacy group NVIC, was part of the advisory panel during the time that the VICP was being formed. Her group at the time was called DPT, or Dissatisfied Parents Together, and they encouraged the lawsuits that almost crippled the vaccine program, because she believed her son had been vax injured. Her group continues to encourage parents with autism and other reactions to file claims through VICP, knowing that they won't be awarded because those are not vax injuries, and now she is lobbying to shut down VICP by arguing that it's a shield for Pharma. The irony is absurd.

Isn't it quite deceptive that her organization NVIC masquerades as some kind of pro-information organization, using an abbreviation that is confusingly similar to the government's injury compensation program?

After I realized that NVIC operates not to inform parents, but to introduce them to more and more extreme anti-vax sentiment, that's when it became clear that so much of their rhetoric is merely propaganda and I was able to start looking elsewhere for information with a different perspective on the issue.
 

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Vaccines aren't tested for safety. one thing that led me to start vaccinating was seeing that when the DPT vaccine was causing reactions they developed the DTaP. When concerns over opv came up they switched to ipv. Etc.
 

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One of NVIC's campaign slogans (it's written on their billboards) is "know the risks & failures." It appeals to the whole cynical suspicion of a coverup.

You can find vaccine risks and efficacy rates on the CDC pages. You don't need NVIC. The difference is that the CDC acknowledges the incredibly important role that vaccines play in eliminating diseases whereas NVIC seems to just want you to know how many people claim something horrible happened after vaccination.

I think VAERS is a very important part of the system, and I have filed a report myself after a fever and *possible* febrile seizure. However, NVIC's emphasis on VAERS and insistence on using the reports there as reliable evidence of vaccine risks is pure deception. They are also responsible for this latest craze about vaccine "shedding" being responsible for recent outbreaks.

Shedding is possible, but it's another one of those things that's so rare that we only have a few documented cases of it ever happening. Wild measles virus infects 90% of people who aren't immune when they come into contact with someone who is contagious. Not only that but it was clear from the viral genetic analysis that it was wild measles and not vaccine strain causing the recent measles outbreak. It's baffling what people will believe.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
One of NVIC's campaign slogans (it's written on their billboards) is "know the risks & failures." It appeals to the whole cynical suspicion of a coverup.

You can find vaccine risks and efficacy rates on the CDC pages. You don't need NVIC. The difference is that the CDC acknowledges the incredibly important role that vaccines play in eliminating diseases whereas NVIC seems to just want you to know how many people claim something horrible happened after vaccination.

I think VAERS is a very important part of the system, and I have filed a report myself after a fever and *possible* febrile seizure. However, NVIC's emphasis on VAERS and insistence on using the reports there as reliable evidence of vaccine risks is pure deception. They are also responsible for this latest craze about vaccine "shedding" being responsible for recent outbreaks.

Shedding is possible, but it's another one of those things that's so rare that we only have a few documented cases of it ever happening. Wild measles virus infects 90% of people who aren't immune when they come into contact with someone who is contagious. Not only that but it was clear from the viral genetic analysis that it was wild measles and not vaccine strain causing the recent measles outbreak. It's baffling what people will believe.

Completely agree w/ everything you said. And embarrassed to admit I used to believe so much of the AV propaganda. *sigh* :serious:
 

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Discussion Starter #12

Omg I totally misinterpreted what you were saying. I thought you were saying you believe they aren't tested for safety... despite me asking people to tell me the most ridiculous thing they've heard. LOL wow can you say blonde moment on my part?! Haha. Sorry.
 

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Omg I totally misinterpreted what you were saying. I thought you were saying you believe they aren't tested for safety... despite me asking people to tell me the most ridiculous thing they've heard. LOL wow can you say blonde moment on my part?! Haha. Sorry.
Lol it's ok!
 
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