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My father has been mysteriously silent about homeschooling until my child turned 5 and we were half-way into August, you know, when he was finally magically ready to start learning something. *rolls eyes*

My father does mean well, but he's clueless about homeschooling. And he speaks to my grandmother regularly and they worry themselves into a tizzy together; they are obsessive worriers and I'm seeing now that neither is comfortable with homeschooling.

I've tried to type an email to my Dad to address some of his recent exchanges with me. I can't talk about it on the phone or in person, because he gets very defensive and shuts down. He is extremely sensitive and says that I'm "too direct" and that I lack diplomacy. I was wondering if someone could read my email draft and give me brutally honest feedback on it.

Here is the background. My father knows that we are always taking the kids to museums and such but I don't think he values that as "real learning", rather fluff. He knows nearly nothing about homeschooling, schools, or how kids learn to read. My mother did all that stuff when we were kids. After sending the grandparents a ridiculously detailed email describing our homeschool days (unschooling but with a science curric that my son wants to do), I had a phone call with my father. He asked me if I was doing formal stuff, then asked, "What about the 3 Rs?" When I said that my son was on top of that, he said, "Oh, so he reads pretty well then?" When I said that he was not really reading yet, my father then repeatedly asked me, "Wouldn't you say that, of all 3 Rs,that reading is the most important??". I felt like he was questioning me and it upset me.

The next day when we visited, my mother revealed that he was concerned that I cancelled a co-op meeting based on their religious agenda. We're Christians but my father is really fundamental and I am a flaming liberal. He then asked me about Sunday School and seemed pleased that my son attends, like he was giving out approval or something. He tried to sound out "jigsaw puzzle" with my son, which bugged me because I don't want him undermining what we do or give my son a complex about not reading. He also asked me if my almost 3 year old was still breastfeeding. He tried to ask all this in a diplomatic way but it made me feel as though he was digging into my business to see if it met his approval or not.

So, here's the email...be brutal. I just want my father to know that: 1. everything's Ok, 2. this is how we do homeschooling and 3. it's basically none of his business. He's going to be offended no matter how I word it but I'd like to be as diplomatic as possible. What do you think?

This is long, I know. I'm sorry.

"Dear Dad,

I keep thinking about some of our discussions in recent days regarding homeschooling and I find that I cannot get them out of my head. After I sent a detailed kids update with information on one of our typical homeschooling days, you then asked me the next day if we were doing anything formal. I was confused as to why you were asking me this, when I had just typed a lengthy email detailing what we're doing. At any rate, when you then asked, "What about the 3 R's?", I admit that I felt defensive. It's very obvious that you care very much about the kids and want what's best for them and I sincerely appreciate that.. We made the decision to homeschool four years ago and I have spent those four years reading everything relevant that I could get my hands on. So I wanted to reassure you that I have not made any decisions lightly, rather I have made them after researching lots of information.

You asked me several times if I would agree that reading is the most important of the 3Rs. Just because we're not sitting down with Ben and doing formal reading work does not mean that he will not be a fluent reader one day. Just because teachers are giving kids formal reading work does not mean that they will be fluent readers one day. Also, Ben's reading skills are at level. If you were to look at the end-year goals for kindergarten, you would see that fluent reading is not one of them. From what I have read, the most important things that my kids have going for them in the world of reading is: 1. exposure to extensive vocabulary from birth, 2. living in a house full of books with parents who read frequently, 3. being read to frequently, and 4. having good reading comprehension. There have been various studies related to this. The only thing that is left is "decoding" and that is honestly not difficult to do. I have no concerns about the 3Rs. The lack of a formal or school-like day does not mean that we don't encounter the 3Rs. I, personally, find that it's easier to learn and remember things when they are tied to real-life situations. I have, personally, learned more metric from sewing than I ever did in school. We use fractions in cooking and wood-working (and metric). My kids have been like sponges and I have a lot of confidence that they are learning important things, like the 3Rs, just from living and having an enriching home experience.

I think that many people imagine homeschooling as being school within the home. Most homeschoolers, in my understanding, do not practice that. There are many types of homeschooling philosophies. I don't want to recreate school at home, because I don't think it's particularly wonderful (or else my kids would go to school). While I do keep an eye on grade standards, we're not trying to organize our homeschooling by what the schools do. For example, kindergarten has a big segment on learning to identify money. We're not doing that. I have never met an adult who didn't know what a dime was or how to count money. There are so many "school" things that are learned through simple real-life applications.

Homeschooling frees us up to learn what we need and what interests us. So, Ben is able to learn chemistry that would not be taught until 4th or 5th grade. In simply doing our chemistry stuff, we are dealing with reading, art (he draws the stuff), writing (I help him write words like "molecules"), history, and critical thinking. He does this because he loves it. If he doesn't feel like doing it, we don't do it. I follow his cues and help him feed his interests. In feeding his interests, we often find that we run across many "subject areas". We see interesting things on television, in books, on the Internet and in real life (e.g. Indian cultural festival) that prompt questions, tangents and meaningful discussion. It does not look like school but I would argue that it's as effective or more so. And most importantly, he associates this stuff with "fun" instead of "I have to do it because Ms. Smith says there's a test on it tomorrow." So, he retains a high level of self-motivation and a love of learning that will serve him very well in life.

The school schedule looks so comprehensive and impressive, because there is a lot of input. They teach so many things for many hours of the day. But no one is really on the other side checking the output, to see if the kids are actually retaining what they're being taught in the long-run. In looking at the school schedule, you'll also notice that they repeat many of same things over and over each year, because it's not being learned the first time. So, that's another reason why we're not trying to match the school schedule. To be completely honest with you, dh and I were discussing this last year and he asserted that he has never used anything he learned in K-12 in the work world…except for basic reading and math. I thought about it and I came out with reading/writing, which I would have done in any kind of school environment. To get into college, you take the SAT, which measures basic skills. I honestly did not use what I was taught in K-12 in college, other than basic reading and writing. I would bet $100 that if I pulled 10 random people off the street and gave them an elementary school test across all subjects, that most of those people would not score well. Can you remember the difference between an isthmus and a peninsula? Can you describe what a dangling participle is? Can you manually solve the square root of 3? Can you explain what the Rosetta Stone is and what its historical significance is? Do you remember what happened at the Battle of Thermopylae? And more importantly, have you ever used any of these in the work world? People learn what they need and what is interesting to them. My kids will do both, but not based on an arbitrary school schedule. Again, the input looks impressive but is the output the same? That's a lot of time spent learning stuff that a kid doesn't like and will never use. Instead, we fill our days with real-life learning and with things that are exciting to us.

I want to reassure you that I have read about this for the past 4 years, that I have met many other homeschoolers and asked a lot of questions and that I have put a tremendous amount of thought behind it. I want to reassure you that we're keeping an eye on the kids to make sure that they learn what the need and that they are not at a disadvantage. I wanted to share some of the things we've learned. I wanted to remark that we go to cultural festivals, museums, libraries and a variety of programs on a frequent basis, places that the schools would only give them access to once or twice a year. My kids have had access to a variety of educational toys since toddlerhood, including puzzles, building toys, math manipulatives, and science materials. They have a very enriching home environment in which to learn and they get out in the community frequently as well.

So, it's not school, it doesn't look like school and I'm not doing "school at home". But from four years of reading, I'm confident that it's better than school. I am extremely confident that this is the best thing for my kids and I back that confidence up with lots of research.

With regard to the co-op meeting I skipped, I'm not really interested in a co-op. I entertained attending because Ben wanted some sort of class experience. I am not seeking outside tutoring or co-ops or school substitutes, as a general rule. I just keep my eyes open for things that look like they would be interesting in general. As Mom told you, I was not happy about the co-op teaching from a religious foundation. I want you to try to imagine your child being taught science from the perspective of <insert religion he disagrees with> and then you can imagine my discomfort with someone I don't know teaching my 5 year old religious beliefs that I may not agree with. That is my decision to make, of course.

Also, you asked, "He's not still doing sides, is he?" with regard to Thomas. There's really no diplomatic way to say that "sides" are between me and Tommy, dh and our pediatrician. I don't want to discuss it with anyone else, because it's personal. I mean that it in the nicest possible way, but I just don't to be put on the spot about something so personal. It's not something I would openly discuss outside my immediate family and pediatrician's care.

I would be more than happy to answer any questions that you have about homeschooling. I really mean that. But I don't want to be put in the position of defending our choices (e.g. What about the 3Rs?) or justifying why we're doing stuff in a particular way. This is what we're doing and we feel extremely confident about it. If anyone feels uncomfortable with it, then I respect that, but I'm not seeking approval. "

Thank you so much if you've waded through all this!!
 

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I might try to condense it. I think a mistake a lot of us make (I know I have!) is to overexplain to doubters. I think it rarely ever "converts" them.

I'd also say that unless it's upsetting your son or your dad is getting mad at him, don't stress over him sounding things out with him.
 

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Well, if he's really expressed an interest in learning more about it, your email is lovely. If you just want him to leave you be, it's an open invitation to him to cross-examine you some more!

If the latter is your goal, I suggest something along the lines of:

Dear Dad:

I gather from our recent conversations that you still have reservations about our homeschooling. I understand your concerns, but rest assured that we are confident that this is the right decision for our family. Ben is doing great, and is just where he should be for his age! I would really appreciate it if you would refrain from debating our decision with me or 'testing' Ben, whatever your concerns. I trust that over time you will see what a positive decision this has been for Ben.
 

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I would also add (or begin with) something like "I wanted to let you know how much I truly appreciate the fact that you are concerned about X's educational experience. It means a great deal to me to know that you care about him that much. You certainly did a great job with me, and I respect your opinion a great deal."

And then go on to your good explanation.
 

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If you want to avoid an easy rebuttal, I would drop this line...

If he doesn't feel like doing it, we don't do it.

That is just asking for the standard come back of, "What if he doesn't WANT to learn <insert reading, math, .... here>"

AM
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Thank you!!! I knew I could post this here and get some great advice. I really appreciate your outside perspective and your advice. And now I totally see what you're saying about the letter opening up more opportunities for him to "cross-examine" me. I guess that some child-like part of me still wants his approval.
Isn't that weird? I guess I really want him to understand what we're doing and to think that we're doing a wonderful job and that we're living interesting lives. But I have my mother for that.

I will definitely cut it down to a paragraph or two and just cut to the chase. I don't think he'd change his mind anyway. On the bright side, writing the letter was very therapeutic for me. I think I'll save it for myself.

Thank you once again!!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by warriorprincess
I think it rarely ever "converts" them.

I'd also say that unless it's upsetting your son or your dad is getting mad at him, don't stress over him sounding things out with him.
Agreed on the first point and the second point is well-taken. Thank you. :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by mammastar2
Well, if he's really expressed an interest in learning more about it, your email is lovely. If you just want him to leave you be, it's an open invitation to him to cross-examine you some more!

If the latter is your goal, I suggest something along the lines of:

Dear Dad:

I gather from our recent conversations that you still have reservations about our homeschooling. I understand your concerns, but rest assured that we are confident that this is the right decision for our family. Ben is doing great, and is just where he should be for his age! I would really appreciate it if you would refrain from debating our decision with me or 'testing' Ben, whatever your concerns. I trust that over time you will see what a positive decision this has been for Ben.
Thank you so much for rewriting this for me. I'l going to c&p and save it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by thekimballs
I would also add (or begin with) something like "I wanted to let you know how much I truly appreciate the fact that you are concerned about X's educational experience. It means a great deal to me to know that you care about him that much. You certainly did a great job with me, and I respect your opinion a great deal."

And then go on to your good explanation.
Yes, I will definitely put that in there, for diplomatic purposes. Thank you!
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by amseiler
If you want to avoid an easy rebuttal, I would drop this line...

If he doesn't feel like doing it, we don't do it.

That is just asking for the standard come back of, "What if he doesn't WANT to learn <insert reading, math, .... here>"

AM
I see what you are saying. Thank you for catching that!
 

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I think I would emphasize the bit about how you're keeping an eye on grade levels, and how what they're doing is normal for kids their age. You don't have to go into detail ... he'd probably prefer a vague reassurance that they're learning "normal" stuff. Like, "this is what a normal kindergartner does for pre-reading skills, and he is doing well in these categories." And then mention a couple of other things that sound "schoolish," like "he is also learning some chemistry and history, which most kids wouldn't study until much later."
 

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My mother and I aren't talking right now because she tends to undermind everything I do and right now homeschooling my son (daughter's still in public) is taking first place on her list and I'm tired of it as it's been going on since I took him out of public several years ago. He's a later reader so it looks like I'm not doing anything from her standpoint. As she put it, "I can see you're doing things, you're not doing it enough and he should be further along than he is". I even pointed out last year that he was learning multiplication and she totally disregarded that and said, "what about reading"... Like she wanted to only focus on something he still wasn't "doing". So, as of about a week ago, I've stopped talking to her and haven't let her see my kids. They live across a pasture from us...so...it's a huge impact.

I say all this to say that I realized something yesturday...a few simple words that say all I need to say....it is: ...just because my choices aren't your choices doesn't make them wrong choices...

I also agree with the other poster, telling him more will give him something else to pick apart...that didn't work with my mother either...anything I said, she'd pick apart and say no to...

Understanding,
April
intuitive medium
 

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I've altered things in red. Suggestion: please stop using "thing."

Quote:


Originally Posted by LeftField

"Dear Dad,

I keep thinking about some of our discussions in recent days regarding homeschooling and I find that I cannot get them out of my head. After I sent a detailed update with information on one of our typical homeschooling days, you then asked, "What about the 3 R's?", I admit that I felt defensive. It's very obvious that you care very much about the kids and want what's best for them and I sincerely appreciate that.. We made the decision to homeschool four years ago and I have spent those four years reading everything relevant that I could get my hands on, so I wanted to reassure you that I have not made any decisions lightly; rather, I have made them after much research.

You asked me several times if I would agree that reading is the most important of the 3Rs. Just because we're not sitting down with Ben and doing formal reading work does not mean that he will not be a fluent reader one day. Just because teachers are giving kids formal reading work does not mean that they will be fluent readers one day. What's crucial to note here is that Ben's reading skills are at level. If you were to look at the end-year goals for kindergarten, you would see that fluent reading is not one of them. From what I have read, the most important advantages homeschooling gives my children are the following: 1. exposure to extensive vocabulary from birth, 2. living in a house full of books with parents who read frequently, 3. being read to frequently, and 4. having good reading comprehension. The only skill that remains to be taught is "decoding" and that is honestly not difficult to do. I have no concerns about the 3Rs. The lack of a formal or school-like day does not mean that we don't encounter the 3Rs.

I think that many people imagine homeschooling as being school within the home. I don't want to recreate school at home, because I don't think it's particularly wonderful (or else my kids would go to school). While I do keep an eye on grade standards, we're not trying to organize our homeschooling by what the schools do.

Homeschooling frees us up to learn what we need and what interests us. As a result, Ben is able to learn chemistry that would not be taught until 4th or 5th grade. In simply doing our chemistry, we are dealing with reading, art (he draws to record his observations of the experiments we perform), writing (I help him write words like "molecules"), history, and critical thinking. He is engaged with chemistry because he loves it. If he doesn't feel like doing it, we don't do it. I follow his cues and help him feed his interests. In feeding his interests, we often find that we run across many "subject areas." We see interesting subjects on television, in books, on the Internet and in real life (e.g. the Indian cultural festival) that prompt questions, tangents and meaningful discussion. It does not look like "school" in the common usage, but I would argue that our method is as effective or more so than the factory-based, one-size-fits-all method of education as practiced in public and private schools today. Most importantly, he associates chemistry, history, and experimentation with "fun" instead of obligation, the feeling that, "I have to do it because Ms. Smith says there's a test on it tomorrow." Therefore, he retains a high level of self-motivation and a love of learning that will serve him very well in life.

The school schedule looks comprehensive and impressive, but in many ways, it's a case of style without substance. You'll notice, for example, that schools re-teach the same conceptsover and over each year, because they are not being learned the first time, and one central cause of this failure to learn is the fact that the students are not motivated to learn, as Ben is; the students are not allowed to pursue subjects beyond their grade levels, as Ben is; and students do not learn experientially and thoroughly, as Ben does.

To be completely honest with you, dh and I were discussing this last year and he asserted that he has never used anything he learned in K-12 in the work world except for basic reading and math. I thought about it and I came out with reading and writing, which I would have done in any kind of school environment. I honestly did not use what I was taught in K-12 in college, other than basic reading and writing. I would bet $100 that if I pulled 10 random people off the street and gave them an elementary school test across all subjects, that most of those people would not score well. Can you remember the difference between an isthmus and a peninsula? Can you describe what a dangling participle is? Can you manually solve the square root of 3? Can you explain what the Rosetta Stone is and what its historical significance is? Do you remember what happened at the Battle of Thermopylae?
[Um, danger zone here. I knew most of the answers. I have no idea what the square root of 3 is, and I confess that I looked up Thermopylae to remind myself whether the Spartans lost, but I knew it was the site of a battle in ancient Greece that was fought by the armies of Sparta. In short, I wouldn't go there. ]

And more importantly, have you ever used any of these in the work world? People learn what they need and what is interesting to them. My kids will do both, but not based on an arbitrary school schedule.

I want to reassure you that I have read about homeschooling for the past 4 years, that I have met many other homeschoolers and asked many questions and that I have put a tremendous amount of thought behind our decision. I want to reassure you that we're keeping an eye on the kids to make sure that they learn what the need and that they are not at a disadvantage. I wanted to share some of the knowledge and skills we've learned. I wanted to remark that we go to cultural festivals, museums, libraries and a variety of programs on a frequent basis, places that the schools would only give them access to once or twice a year. My kids have had access to a variety of educational toys since toddlerhood, including puzzles, building toys, math manipulatives, and science materials. They have a very enriching home environment in which to learn and they get out in the community frequently as well.

In short, what we do is not school, it doesn't look like school and I'm not doing "school at home". However, from four years of reading, I'm confident that it's better than school. I am extremely confident that this is the best decision for my kids and I base that confidence on years of research.

If what I have previously said does not convince you, Dad, surely you can't argue that schools are doing an outstanding job at the task of educating America's students. Surely you can't suggest that teachers are highly trained, well-paid, and universally dedicated individuals who have the time, resources, and ability to meet the needs of each student in their classes. Surely you can't argue that a 35:1 teacher-pupil ratio is in any way superior to the 1:1 -- or, on some days, 2:1 -- teacher-pupil ratio offered by homeschooling. If Ben were in school, he would not receive an individual education unless he were under the auspices of an IEP (an individualized education plan). At home, every day is an IEP, tailored to Ben's needs, Ben's interests, and Ben's strengths and weaknesses as a student -- a made-to-order education he could receive nowhere else in the world, not even at the most tony prep school in this country.

With regard to the co-op meeting I skipped, I'm not really interested in a co-op. I entertained the idea of attending one because Ben wanted some sort of class experience; however, as Mom told you, I was not happy about the co-op teaching from a religious foundation. I want you to try to imagine your child being taught science from the perspective of <insert religion he disagrees with> and then you can imagine my discomfort with someone I don't know teaching my 5-year-old religious beliefs that I may not agree with.

Also, you asked, "He's not still doing sides, is he?" with regard to Thomas. There's really no diplomatic way to say that "sides" are between me and Tommy, dh and our pediatrician. I don't want to discuss it with anyone else, because it's personal. I mean that it in the nicest possible way, but I just don't to be put on the spot about something so personal. It's not something I would openly discuss outside my immediate family and pediatrician's care.

I would be more than happy to answer any questions that you have about homeschooling. I really mean that. Just to be clear, however, I will not engage in a discussion defending our choices or justifying our methods. This is what we're doing and we feel extremely confident about it. If anyone feels uncomfortable with it, then I respect that, but I'm not seeking your approval.

Thank you so much if you've waded through all this!!

Hope this helps.
 

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If all else fails, and your dad keep coming at you, you could use my catch-all phrase...

"This is a parental decision, and is not open for debate." And then don't debate it with him, don't even discuss it.

I'm sorry you are going through this. I get it from certain IL's, but they live a nine hour drive away.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by pookel
I think I would emphasize the bit about how you're keeping an eye on grade levels, and how what they're doing is normal for kids their age. You don't have to go into detail ... he'd probably prefer a vague reassurance that they're learning "normal" stuff. Like, "this is what a normal kindergartner does for pre-reading skills, and he is doing well in these categories." And then mention a couple of other things that sound "schoolish," like "he is also learning some chemistry and history, which most kids wouldn't study until much later."
Thank you. :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by AprilDaisy
My mother and I aren't talking right now because she tends to undermind everything I do and right now homeschooling my son (daughter's still in public) is taking first place on her list and I'm tired of it as it's been going on since I took him out of public several years ago. He's a later reader so it looks like I'm not doing anything from her standpoint. As she put it, "I can see you're doing things, you're not doing it enough and he should be further along than he is". I even pointed out last year that he was learning multiplication and she totally disregarded that and said, "what about reading"... Like she wanted to only focus on something he still wasn't "doing". So, as of about a week ago, I've stopped talking to her and haven't let her see my kids. They live across a pasture from us...so...it's a huge impact.

I say all this to say that I realized something yesturday...a few simple words that say all I need to say....it is: ...just because my choices aren't your choices doesn't make them wrong choices...

I also agree with the other poster, telling him more will give him something else to pick apart...that didn't work with my mother either...anything I said, she'd pick apart and say no to...

Understanding,
April
intuitive medium
{{{April}}} That's terrible. I'm sorry that you're dealing with this.
: Thank you for the commiseration and best wishes with dealing with your mother.
 

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I agree that long passionate letters are good for us to write ... for ourselves!
I also agree that a short "we appreciate your concern, however our decision to homeschool is not up for debate". The next time an issue is raised "pass the bean dip"!
And I personally don't see anything wrong with putting a stop to quizzing from grandparents. Its not appropriate.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by Charles Baudelaire
I've altered things in red. Suggestion: please stop using "thing."

Hope this helps.
THANK YOU. I sincerely appreciate your help with writing. I do need to stop using, "thing" so much, in addition to "like" and "thingy". Thank you!
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ann-Marita
If all else fails, and your dad keep coming at you, you could use my catch-all phrase...

"This is a parental decision, and is not open for debate." And then don't debate it with him, don't even discuss it.

I'm sorry you are going through this. I get it from certain IL's, but they live a nine hour drive away.
Yes, I might have to resort to that eventually. When I was expecting my first child, my father harrassed me about the risk of homebirth SO much, that I finally said, "This is not open for discussion." He was so angry at me, but I drew the boundary and he never bothered me about it again.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by callmemama
I agree that long passionate letters are good for us to write ... for ourselves!
I also agree that a short "we appreciate your concern, however our decision to homeschool is not up for debate". The next time an issue is raised "pass the bean dip"!
And I personally don't see anything wrong with putting a stop to quizzing from grandparents. Its not appropriate.
Thank you. :)
 
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